Tony Sparano - saviour or scapegoat?

[LionelRichie]

I've always thought preseason was meaningless until I saw the abortion that was the Jets offense this year. The Jets didn't show much play-action in preseason and really did run a vanilla offense. Now that the games count I wonder if Sparano was sand-bagging and we will actually see a team that can move the ball?

Schott is no longer around to take the blame for Sanchez and the offense ineptitude. Can Sparano turn this thing around? Or, at a minimum stop the offense from giving up points?

[sh4dy15]

I think the third preseason game was more on par with what we will see this year in play calling from Sparano and I liked what I saw. Granted, the offense didn't execute but with Schotty his play calls and routes seemed ridiculous.

Third preseason game we came out pretty good with some nice mid range passes and deep attempts....now if our WRs can catch we'll be in good shape.

I also think the 'surprise wildcat' were gonna see is going to be different because of where Tebow is lined up. Think we'll see him all over, not just taking direct snaps. Lots of Sanchez Tebow packages where they are both on the field and Tebow will be lined up as running back or even something crazy like TE.

[dbatesman]

He'll be the new Schottenheimer by Week 6.

[#27TheDominator]

He'll be the new Schottenheimer by Week 6.

Easier to spell.

[RutgersJetFan]

Schott sucked and so does Sparano. They're not scapegoats. The Sparano hired was stupid and so was Schottenheimer during that abortion of a second half against Pittburgh. Time doesn't heal all wounds. That BS he pulled on the goal line was unforgivable and he should have been canned on that alone. The Sparano hire meant we were sticking with Sanchez, which is also unforgivable. Bottom line is this entire organization and HC know absolute dick about offense.

[Pac]

once the full ensemble of the Sparano route trees have been deployed, the detractors will be singing a different tune.

[Knix Tix]

[Kleckineau]

_Neither.

_{I firmly believe there isnt an OC in the NFL that wouldnt succeed with a top 10 QB}

_{Think Mike Martz after Warner.}

_{Think Gilbride before Eli.}

_{Real questions?}

_{Would Sparano or Schott look good with the Saints Pats Packers Giants?}

_{Is there any OC that could succeed with #6??????}

[Bleedin Green]

Schott sucked and so does Sparano. They're not scapegoats. The Sparano hired was stupid and so was Schottenheimer during that abortion of a second half against Pittburgh. Time doesn't heal all wounds. That BS he pulled on the goal line was unforgivable and he should have been canned on that alone. The Sparano hire meant we were sticking with Sanchez, which is also unforgivable. Bottom line is this entire organization and HC know absolute dick about offense.

Ugh, so sad but unfortunately so true. I do have a slight shred of optimism about Sparano because, if nothing else, he's not Schottenheimer. I have to imagine his presence will eliminate some of those occasional mind-numbingly stupid plays we'd get out of Schitty that never produced anything positive and I can't imagine anyone else thinking were a good idea. Plus, there's always the chance that Sparano is actually capable of learning from his mistakes, something Schitty showed no ability to do over the course of 6 years.

[Bleedin Green]

_Neither.

_{I firmly believe there isnt an OC in the NFL that wouldnt succeed with a top 10 QB}

_{Think Mike Martz after Warner.}

_{Think Gilbride before Eli.}

_{Real questions?}

_{Would Sparano or Schott look good with the Saints Pats Packers Giants?}

_{Is there any OC that could succeed with #6??????}

Would anyone run a top offense with Sanchez? Of course not. That doesn't suddenly excuse every OC for a team without a top QB from their own failures. It's entirely possible for more than one person to suck at their jobs at the same time.

[LionelRichie]

Would anyone run a top offense with Sanchez? Of course not. That doesn't suddenly excuse every OC for a team without a top QB from their own failures. It's entirely possible for more than one person to suck at their jobs at the same time.

you have kind of a chicken and egg thing going there - is it Sanchez or is it the Jets inability to develop a QB?

if the Jets had drafted Aaron Rodgers in '05 would he be the same Aaron Rodgers you see today or would he have been the next Browning Nagle?

[hoping4ASuperBowl]

_Neither.

_{I firmly believe there isnt an OC in the NFL that wouldnt succeed with a top 10 QB}

_{Think Mike Martz after Warner.}

_{Think Gilbride before Eli.}

_{Real questions?}

_{Would Sparano or Schott look good with the Saints Pats Packers Giants?}

_{Is there any OC that could succeed with #6??????}

Didn't Schotty have Brees for a while when he was in San Diego? How did Bree's do those years?

[Kleckineau]

Would anyone run a top offense with Sanchez? Of course not. That doesn't suddenly excuse every OC for a team without a top QB from their own failures. It's entirely possible for more than one person to suck at their jobs at the same time.

Thats not what I asked.

[stoicsentry]

Ugh, so sad but unfortunately so true. I do have a slight shred of optimism about Sparano because, if nothing else, he's not Schottenheimer.

Sparano will still do stupid crap like running a draw play on every 3rd and 7 when in field goal position.

However, the one way that I like him better is that he WILL go vertical more often. He will take chances between the 20s.

It's tempting to look at this situation and say "Just don't screw it up, Sanchez." But when Shotty did that, notice the kind of stuff that he asked Sanchez to do... 3rd and long and Sanchez is throwing 5 yard outs, throwing across his body and it ends up in a pick 6. Who needs that? Let Sanchez throw 40 yards downfield. If it gets picked, it gets picked, but at least it's not going to get taken to the house by the defender. And this way we actually have a chance of MAKING A DAMN PLAY.

[Bleedin Green]

Thats not what I asked.

Yet you were trying to excuse the performance of OCs because of their QBs when you said "_{I firmly believe there isnt an OC in the NFL that wouldnt succeed with a top 10 QB"}, which is what I was addressing. The question you did ask proves absolutely nothing, because being able to run a competent offense with a top QB doesn't really say a whole lot. The real question is whether those offenses be as successful with Schotty as they are with their current OCs, and I've seen little evidence to suggest they would be. A coaches job is not to magically make the talent he has available to him better, it's a matter of utilizing that talent to the best of their ability. The players will always be the more important piece to the puzzle, but that doesn't excuse a coaches blatant ineptitude.

[Kleckineau]

Didn't Schotty have Brees for a while when he was in San Diego? How did Bree's do those years?

Are you really gonna go there?

Wasnt he the the QB coach not the OC??

If you wanna go there anyway, Brees 3rd year (2004?) he had a passer rating over 100

You can crush Schott all you want. I am not trying to defend him but I will stand firm on my position that it is the QB and not the OC that is the most important component. Take your best OC ever and I say he fails with #6

[Kleckineau]

Yet you were trying to excuse the performance of OCs because of their QBs when you said "_{I firmly believe there isnt an OC in the NFL that wouldnt succeed with a top 10 QB"}, which is what I was addressing. The question you did ask proves absolutely nothing, because being able to run a competent offense with a top QB doesn't really say a whole lot. The real question is whether those offenses be as successful with Schotty as they are with their current OCs, and I've seen little evidence to suggest they would be. A coaches job is not to magically make the talent he has available to him better, it's a matter of utilizing that talent to the best of their ability. The players will always be the more important piece to the puzzle, but that doesn't excuse a coaches blatant ineptitude.

????????

You dont get it.

And Sanchezs best ability was utilized.

Team playbooks all have similar plays. Comes down to execution.

[Better2bgreenthanblue]

Sparano is in a no lose situation here. It's a perfect scenario to experiment with a duel QB offense (playing nice by saying Tebow is a QB rather than TE/FB). Tebow in motion, Tebow for screens, spread option plays by either QB. This offense could cause the same kind of confusion the defense does. All we need is for the confusion to give a step to a playmaker a few times a game. Our O will be ok, maybe even pretty good. Our D if it stays healthy could be almost legendary. My surprise concern is Westies group. I am no fan of Folk. I suspect we are going to need 3 or so FG's a game......

[RSJ]

Are you really gonna go there?

Wasnt he the the QB coach not the OC??

If you wanna go there anyway, Brees 3rd year (2004?) he had a passer rating over 100

You can crush Schott all you want. I am not trying to defend him but I will stand firm on my position that it is the QB and not the OC that is the most important component. Take your best OC ever and I say he fails with #6

Actually 2004 was the 4th year Brees played and he only threw for 3100 yards. His third year QB rating was 67.5. Brees really wasn't considered elite until he played for NO and got away from the Schotty's. Thats when he topped 4000 yards and 30 TDs in a season. There were QB's who had good years under coordinators then turned to crap. Andy Reid has had a few, and so has Mike Homgren. There are others too. Martz was more a product of Vermeil than he was Warner. Otherwise Warner would have had success with Gilbride too.

[bitonti]

_{Is there any OC that could succeed with #6??????}

very good question

[JustInFudge]

When you dont have a franchise QB, the 2 scapegoats for every team is OC and QB. Because if you have a franchise QB, nobody even knows who their OC.

Typically, its starts with the OC because most fans believe in the players until their face has been rubbed in sh*t so much its coming out of their ears (see Sanchez and Pennington) and its a much easier position to replace. QB will always be given too much credit and too much blame.

Is Sparano the savior? Who knows. We sure as **** never will be because his QB is Mark Sanchez.

[RSJ]

When you dont have a franchise QB, the 2 scapegoats for every team is OC and QB. Because if you have a franchise QB, nobody even knows who their OC.

Typically, its starts with the OC because most fans believe in the players until their face has been rubbed in sh*t so much its coming out of their ears (see Sanchez and Pennington) and its a much easier position to replace. QB will always be given too much credit and too much blame.

Is Sparano the savior? Who knows. We sure as **** never will be because his QB is Mark Sanchez.

At one time people thought Testeverde was color blind he played so bad. Michigan couldnt confirm that Brady was better than Drew Henson. Warner backed up rookie Eli, then went to Arizona and went to a Super Bowl. A coordinators job is to put his players in the best position to succeed. Scotty didn't do that. Pennington went to Miami and won more games then he ever did under Schotty. And also, as I said earlier, Andy Reid has won games with Kevin Kolb, AJ Feely, Ty Detmer and Donovan McNabb (who couldnt throw a spiral).

[whodeawhodat]

Since I had a great holiday weekend i am going to look at this team and say that Luigi can work some good out of that side of the ball. Get the run game going, throw in some play action take some shots down the field, give the defense some time on the sidelines to recharge the batteries and allow them to go out and make some plays in the 4th quarter. Good stuff coming this year!

[JustInFudge]

At one time people thought Testeverde was color blind he played so bad. Michigan couldnt confirm that Brady was better than Drew Henson. Warner backed up rookie Eli, then went to Arizona and went to a Super Bowl. A coordinators job is to put his players in the best position to succeed. Scotty didn't do that. Pennington went to Miami and won more games then he ever did under Schotty. And also, as I said earlier, Andy Reid has won games with Kevin Kolb, AJ Feely, Ty Detmer and Donovan McNabb (who couldnt throw a spiral).

Not sure how this really addresses anything I said, but yeah, OC matter to an extent. No doubt. Ability to game plan, play call, scheme and put players in a position to succeed is crucial, but if your trying to sell me that OC's make the QB - then I'll tell you to go kick rocks.

[RSJ]

Not sure how this really addresses anything I said, but yeah, OC matter to an extent. No doubt. Ability to game plan, play call, scheme and put players in a position to succeed is crucial, but if your trying to sell me that OC's make the QB - then I'll tell you to go kick rocks.

They certainly can make a QB look a lot better than they actually are and so can the personnel around the QB.

[Bleedin Green]

????????

You dont get it.

And Sanchezs best ability was utilized.

Team playbooks all have similar plays. Comes down to execution.

No, you are the one who clearly does not get the way football works. If you think the Jets offense was utilized to the best of it's ability, I'd just love to hear the supposed brilliance behind the game plan to call 64 pass plays (excluding those nullified by penalties), in what was a one-score game until right before the very end.

So what's your point, which plays that are chosen out of these similar playbooks at a given time have absolutely no bearing on anything? I find it laughable that some people can't comprehend the simple concept that it is actually possible for there to be more than one item that can influence the outcome of an event at any given time.

Of course it comes down to execution, nobody is saying otherwise, but there are a number of decisions made before the players even have an opportunity to execute that has a bearing on how difficult it is to successfully execute. In theory a team could run the same play every single time and as long as the players all execute perfectly, they'll score a touchdown off of it every time. It's just too bad that's not actually how reality works.

[whodeawhodat]

No, you are the one who clearly does not get the way football works. If you think the Jets offense was utilized to the best of it's ability, I'd just love to hear the supposed brilliance behind the game plan to call 64 pass plays (excluding those nullified by penalties), in what was a one-score game until right before the very end.

So what's your point, which plays that are chosen out of these similar playbooks at a given time have absolutely no bearing on anything? I find it laughable that some people can't comprehend the simple concept that it is actually possible for there to be more than one item that can influence the outcome of an event at any given time.

Of course it comes down to execution, nobody is saying otherwise, but there are a number of decisions made before the players even have an opportunity to execute that has a bearing on how difficult it is to successfully execute. In theory a team could run the same play every single time and as long as the players all execute perfectly, they'll score a touchdown off of it every time. It's just too bad that's not actually how reality works.

IMO, with us it will come down to taking what the opposing defense is going to give us. If they bring everyone into the box then we MUST have teh personel and play calling to go over the top. It doesnt help us to throw quick outs and slants into the box when it is flooded with opposing players. that is where we could have been better under sh*tty.

[Bleedin Green]

Are you really gonna go there?

Wasnt he the the QB coach not the OC??

If you wanna go there anyway, Brees 3rd year (2004?) he had a passer rating over 100

You can crush Schott all you want. I am not trying to defend him but I will stand firm on my position that it is the QB and not the OC that is the most important component. Take your best OC ever and I say he fails with #6

Who the hell ever said otherwise? If that's your entire argument then you've successfully managed to complete embarrass yourself by putting together one of the most awful arguments I've ever seen, all the while making it against a bunch of people who have never even disagreed with that point. Perhaps what you need to try to get a grasp on is that it is entirely capable for not just one, but both, to suck at their respective jobs.

[JustInFudge]

They certainly can make a QB look a lot better than they actually are and so can the personnel around the QB.

Meh, it happens but at the end of the day, you can only a polish a turd so much before you get sh*t on your hands.

[afosomf]

Schott sucked and so does Sparano. They're not scapegoats. The Sparano hired was stupid and so was Schottenheimer during that abortion of a second half against Pittburgh. Time doesn't heal all wounds. That BS he pulled on the goal line was unforgivable and he should have been canned on that alone. The Sparano hire meant we were sticking with Sanchez, which is also unforgivable. Bottom line is this entire organization and HC know absolute dick about offense.

so if schott turns around bradford, he will get no credit, right? it will all go to Fisher

[bitonti]

At one time people thought Testeverde was color blind he played so bad

Vinny actually is color blind.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vinny_Testaverde

[hoping4ASuperBowl]

Are you really gonna go there?

Wasnt he the the QB coach not the OC??

If you wanna go there anyway, Brees 3rd year (2004?) he had a passer rating over 100

You can crush Schott all you want. I am not trying to defend him but I will stand firm on my position that it is the QB and not the OC that is the most important component. Take your best OC ever and I say he fails with #6

I think you make a great point, a good QB will generally take you further then a good OC working with a mediocre/poor QB, but then what about instances like Dilfer winning a SB or more recently Alex Smith bringing his team within one game of a SB? Couldn't you make an argument that it can work both ways?

[RSJ]

Meh, it happens but at the end of the day, you can only a polish a turd so much before you get sh*t on your hands.

It happens and it happens a lot.

[RSJ]

Vinny actually is color blind.

http://en.wikipedia....inny_Testaverde

Wasn't sure if it was true or not. Still it is amazing how that didnt matter when he had a good coach and team around him.

[Kleckineau]

Who the hell ever said otherwise? If that's your entire argument then you've successfully managed to complete embarrass yourself by putting together one of the most awful arguments I've ever seen, all the while making it against a bunch of people who have never even disagreed with that point. Perhaps what you need to try to get a grasp on is that it is entirely capable for not just one, but both, to suck at their respective jobs.

Now you want to quote my response to another posters proposition as if it was meant as a response to your post??

WTF kinda nonsense sh!t is that??

I am done with your Shott is the devil and Sanchez is a good OC away from an MVP trophy drivel. Good day sir.