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I'm not saying it's not a problem, but you have to look at the offenses contribution to the problems. Just look at both the Miami and NE games as the perfect examples. You can bitch about the defense giving up late drives all you want, but in both cases those were the only three points the defense allowed in the entire quarter. Perhaps if the offense ever carried their weight, it wouldn't be such a problem. Instead they get handed the ball in scoring range, lose yards on the drive and come away with a field goal, giving the Pats an opportunity they never should have had in the first place. The defense is faaaaaaar from blameless for that, and it's certainly an issue, but to act as if this even slightly excuses the unacceptable performance we routinely see out of the offense for 4 full quarters is laughable.

What's laughable is that since Rex has been here, the defense has been priority 1,2,3,4 and 5.

Other than drafting Sanchez, this past draft was the first time they drafted a skill position player for the offense above round 3 since Rex got here, in this day and age, unacceptable.

They brought in other teams unwanted garbage as skill position players.

The HC admittedly ignored the offense for most of his first 3 years here.

With all the emphasis being on the defense, it is no wonder we are seeing what we see on offense, this is the direction Rex wanted to take the team.

Sanchez sucks ass, but you have to at least wonder if the coaching staff has anything to do with the lack of development.

The Defense has lost something like 9 fourth quarter leads in the past few years.

In 2010, for as good as the defense was, the offense won 4 games that I can remember in the last minute of the game after the defense blew a late lead, Denver, Detroit, Cleveland and Houston.

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Discuss this exciting new topic. 2 picks 2 fumbles How many batted/tipped passes? 4? 5? 4th consecutive game completing under 50% of his passes. Terrible football player. Terrible

"we need changes!" "we have no continuity!"

So, just for recording purposes, in the interest of keeping the running tally going... We can't blame Sanchez for: Tipped passes. Interceptions. Fumbles. Hurries. Sacks. Bad decisi

The reason I'm still good with Rex is a cursory look at this roster reveals a team that you wouldn't really expect to be better than 3-4. You can't get water from a stone.

And Rex has a direct hand in how that roister is constructed.

I would that at least 1/3 of the other coaching staffs could whip this mess of a roster into something better than what Rex has done with it.

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And Rex has a direct hand in how that roister is constructed.

I would that at least 1/3 of the other coaching staffs could whip this mess of a roster into something better than what Rex has done with it.

I don't know what you'd base the second part of you're post on. It's not like most weeks we lose is because we were outcoached. And even if your point is totally valid, that still leaves Rex just outside the top third of coaches... With this roster, that's not where I'd be complaining.

To the first point, we don't know how much Rex had to do with the roster. We know Rex wants defense, obviously, but he's not a scout or a GM who's responsible for talent evaluation. He's not responsible for what we paid for players or the fact that we've been trading away picks for years, leaving us with limited young talent.

I think you need to bring in a new GM. If that GM feels he can't work with Rex, so be it. But Rex greatly improved the defense in year one, and had won with a terrible QB, so he gets more time as far as I'm concerned. Over his tenure the roster has gotten much worse and I guess I'm just not ready to kill the HC for not doing the GM's job better.

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Yeah, they suck. It's just that of all the players, Sanchez sucks the worst while sucking at the most important position in football. Thus the 90+ page thread.

Bye, Rex!

lol. So Tannenbaum brings in Sanchez and Sanchez sucks, yet Rex should be the first to go. F*** you.

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I don't know what you'd base the second part of you're post on. It's not like most weeks we lose is because we were outcoached. And even if your point is totally valid, that still leaves Rex just outside the top third of coaches... With this roster, that's not where I'd be complaining.

To the first point, we don't know how much Rex had to do with the roster. We know Rex wants defense, obviously, but he's not a scout or a GM who's responsible for talent evaluation. He's not responsible for what we paid for players or the fact that we've been trading away picks for years, leaving us with limited young talent.

I think you need to bring in a new GM. If that GM feels he can't work with Rex, so be it. But Rex greatly improved the defense in year one, and had won with a terrible QB, so he gets more time as far as I'm concerned. Over his tenure the roster has gotten much worse and I guess I'm just not ready to kill the HC for not doing the GM's job better.

First, if you admit this roster has gotten worse, would you agree that in part the coaching staff has not "coached players up"? Rex also has direct input into who gets drafted.

Second, do you want Rex being the one to bring along a young qb?

Lastly, I don't believe that there will be many GM's, if they are worth their salt, that will want work with Rex as their coach.

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And Rex has a direct hand in how that roister is constructed.

I would that at least 1/3 of the other coaching staffs could whip this mess of a roster into something better than what Rex has done with it.

So does Rex sit there week after week watching footage of college players?

Does Rex offer player contracts?

Does Rex pick players during the draft? Clearly not, because he didn't want Hill, and the only documented player Rex has drafted himself is John Conner.

Your anti-Rex agenda disgusts me.

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Yes, he does.

If you don't believe that Rex has a hand in players drafted, you are naive

It's been documented that Rex has minimal say in which players ultimately get drafted. Sure he has input. But the GM and his army of scouts make the decisions, just like every front office.

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Welcome to loserdom Jet fan. You are happy with falling short. Good for you.

Yep, I'm a loser Jet fan. The fact that Rex is already our 2nd or 3rd most successful coach makes me tingly inside. If Rex is as terrible as you believe, I'd ask you to come up with a short list of coaches you want to replace him with.

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link?

In addition, there's no link to this, but in Rex's book "Play Like you Mean it", he talks about how Tannenbaum allows Rex to have one pick in the draft that is 100 % his choice. Hence the Conner pick in 2009. Not sure which picks, if any, were his since then.

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Other than drafting Sanchez, this past draft was the first time they drafted a skill position player for the offense above round 3 since Rex got here, in this day and age, unacceptable.

We spent our 1st, 2nd, 3rd, 4th, and 7th round picks on "offensive skill" positions in 2009 and traded up to #43 for Hill in 2012. Not many teams would trade up for essentially a round 2 RB in year 1 (the #1 pick in round 3 and a lower pick in round 2 is a distinction without a difference), and then draft another one in the first 2 rounds a year or two later without said player showing to be a flop or having serious long-term injury concerns. At TE we had a productive 2008 first round pick still under his rookie contract (and still is through the end of this season). I can't imagine your sore point is that we didn't take another TE in rounds 1-2, only 2 years into Keller's career. So your criticism, ultimately, is that we didn't draft a WR in rounds 1 or 2 in 2010 or 2011.

In 2011, who did you want instead of Wilkerson at the bottom of round 1 who wouldn't have been a massive reach? Titus Young? Lance Kendricks? Perhaps you feel we should have traded up for Mark Ingram? Yeah one or all of those guys may pan out someday but they wouldn't be (or have been) nearly as valuable as Wilkerson.

In 2010, the franchise was dealing with a very real possibility of a Revis holdout into the season (which nearly happened anyway) as well as what I consider an obsession with 3 "starting caliber" corners after Manning picked on our 4th-6th string DBs in the championship game. The next "skill" positions off the board were Jahvid Best, who the Jets never would have touched entering Greene's 2nd season, McCluster and Benn at WR, and Gronk at TE.

Easy - very easy - to say now with Gronk, but after Keller's 2nd season I can't name a franchise (New England included) that would have used its first round pick on a TE who missed the last few games of his junior season plus his entire senior season after back surgery. NE's situation at TE was totally different, as they had no TEs on the roster and the prior years were trotting out Ben Watson and were so desperate they signed Jets castoff Chris Baker. They also have a history of almost always being dead wrong on "offensive skill players" in the first 2 rounds and sometimes (like with Brady in round 6) a team just gets lucky. And they were concerned enough with Gronk's back that they took Hernandez 2 rounds later. Dumb luck for them he worked out also. And don't discount the difference in how productive they've both been with an all-time great QB throwing him the football instead of our sorry excuse for a passer.

To have draft criticism taken seriously you have to name a player you wanted instead of the player we took. Saying we should have drafted some nameless, faceless idea of a player at a skill position in year ____ is an easy cop out.

Oh, and Sanchez sucks.

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In addition, there's no link to this, but in Rex's book "Play Like you Mean it", he talks about how Tannenbaum allows Rex to have one pick in the draft that is 100 % his choice. Hence the Conner pick in 2009. Not sure which picks, if any, were his since then.

He told Coples he would take him if there. Remember?

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We spent our 1st, 2nd, 3rd, 4th, and 7th round picks on "offensive skill" positions in 2009 and traded up to #43 for Hill in 2012. Not many teams would trade up for essentially a round 2 RB in year 1 (the #1 pick in round 3 and a lower pick in round 2 is a distinction without a difference), and then draft another one in the first 2 rounds a year or two later without said player showing to be a flop or having serious long-term injury concerns. At TE we had a productive 2008 first round pick still under his rookie contract (and still is through the end of this season). I can't imagine your sore point is that we didn't take another TE in rounds 1-2, only 2 years into Keller's career. So your criticism, ultimately, is that we didn't draft a WR in rounds 1 or 2 in 2010 or 2011.

In 2011, who did you want instead of Wilkerson at the bottom of round 1 who wouldn't have been a massive reach? Titus Young? Lance Kendricks? Perhaps you feel we should have traded up for Mark Ingram? Yeah one or all of those guys may pan out someday but they wouldn't be (or have been) nearly as valuable as Wilkerson.

In 2010, the franchise was dealing with a very real possibility of a Revis holdout into the season (which nearly happened anyway) as well as what I consider an obsession with 3 "starting caliber" corners after Manning picked on our 4th-6th string DBs in the championship game. The next "skill" positions off the board were Jahvid Best, who the Jets never would have touched entering Greene's 2nd season, McCluster and Benn at WR, and Gronk at TE.

Easy - very easy - to say now with Gronk, but after Keller's 2nd season I can't name a franchise (New England included) that would have used its first round pick on a TE who missed the last few games of his junior season plus his entire senior season after back surgery. NE's situation at TE was totally different, as they had no TEs on the roster and the prior years were trotting out Ben Watson and were so desperate they signed Jets castoff Chris Baker. They also have a history of almost always being dead wrong on "offensive skill players" in the first 2 rounds and sometimes (like with Brady in round 6) a team just gets lucky. And they were concerned enough with Gronk's back that they took Hernandez 2 rounds later. Dumb luck for them he worked out also. And don't discount the difference in how productive they've both been with an all-time great QB throwing him the football instead of our sorry excuse for a passer.

To have draft criticism taken seriously you have to name a player you wanted instead of the player we took. Saying we should have drafted some nameless, faceless idea of a player at a skill position in year ____ is an easy cop out.

Oh, and Sanchez sucks.

Yeah, ok.

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Scott, ultimately, you can't have this both ways. Even if Rex were 100 % in charge of talent evaluation and drafting, you can't say he's bad at those duties AND coaching. One of these statements must be true:

1) He's a very good coach who struggles at evaluating talent, particularly on offense.

2) He's an overrated coach who lucks out by his superior talent evaluation, particularly on defense, where we've enjoyed more consistent success than any team other than the 49ers.

3) He's a very good coach who has been hamstrung for years by Tannenbaum and co.'s poor drafting/contracts, as well as a dogsh*t QB. No other coach could win as many games as Rex with the worst QB in the league.

Since you're unwilling to admit Rex is good at ANYTHING and that he deserves to be fired, it's time to end this argument. Particularly since you couldn't come up with a list of replacements. My agenda is anti-Sanchez/Tannenbaum. Yours is anti-Rex. I get that. But you have MUCH less merit with which to base your claims. I have an army of data which suggests Sanchez/Tannenbaum are much bigger problems than Rex.

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Wow JFat80 is just destroying Scott right now.

Fun to watch.

Jif, I get that you so badly want to blame this all on one player, and if that position is revamped, that the Jets will magically become Super Bowl winners. It is a trait that is admirable, and a little cute. It is also akin to believing in the tooth fairy and Santa Claus.

Hey, I too was once the guy that thought the best fandom was to think of the most simple solution to the problem would be the total elixir. It is a part of fandom-that young, naive approach of pixie dust magic.

That pixie dust allows us to have fogged thinking, that we are alway "just one player away". And if we fix that, the kingdom is ours.

Clear thinking will allow you to understand that this program is rotting from the root up. Poor player selection, bad philosophy, bad contracts, loyalties that were unwarranted, inability to develop personnel. They are all insidious to an eventual ruin that this team is becoming. It is not here yet, but all the trademarks are there.

If you want to sing the mantra of "hey, 2 and 3 years ago, we participated in the AFCCG", and that makes you tingly, and think good times are are around the corner, with a change at QB, have at it. I will not awaken you from your slumber.

The markings are all there.

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We spent our 1st, 2nd, 3rd, 4th, and 7th round picks on "offensive skill" positions in 2009 and traded up to #43 for Hill in 2012. Not many teams would trade up for essentially a round 2 RB in year 1 (the #1 pick in round 3 and a lower pick in round 2 is a distinction without a difference), and then draft another one in the first 2 rounds a year or two later without said player showing to be a flop or having serious long-term injury concerns. At TE we had a productive 2008 first round pick still under his rookie contract (and still is through the end of this season). I can't imagine your sore point is that we didn't take another TE in rounds 1-2, only 2 years into Keller's career. So your criticism, ultimately, is that we didn't draft a WR in rounds 1 or 2 in 2010 or 2011.

In 2011, who did you want instead of Wilkerson at the bottom of round 1 who wouldn't have been a massive reach? Titus Young? Lance Kendricks? Perhaps you feel we should have traded up for Mark Ingram? Yeah one or all of those guys may pan out someday but they wouldn't be (or have been) nearly as valuable as Wilkerson.

In 2010, the franchise was dealing with a very real possibility of a Revis holdout into the season (which nearly happened anyway) as well as what I consider an obsession with 3 "starting caliber" corners after Manning picked on our 4th-6th string DBs in the championship game. The next "skill" positions off the board were Jahvid Best, who the Jets never would have touched entering Greene's 2nd season, McCluster and Benn at WR, and Gronk at TE.

Easy - very easy - to say now with Gronk, but after Keller's 2nd season I can't name a franchise (New England included) that would have used its first round pick on a TE who missed the last few games of his junior season plus his entire senior season after back surgery. NE's situation at TE was totally different, as they had no TEs on the roster and the prior years were trotting out Ben Watson and were so desperate they signed Jets castoff Chris Baker. They also have a history of almost always being dead wrong on "offensive skill players" in the first 2 rounds and sometimes (like with Brady in round 6) a team just gets lucky. And they were concerned enough with Gronk's back that they took Hernandez 2 rounds later. Dumb luck for them he worked out also. And don't discount the difference in how productive they've both been with an all-time great QB throwing him the football instead of our sorry excuse for a passer.

To have draft criticism taken seriously you have to name a player you wanted instead of the player we took. Saying we should have drafted some nameless, faceless idea of a player at a skill position in year ____ is an easy cop out.

Oh, and Sanchez sucks.

You said a whole lot without saying one thing to disprove my post, nice work.

You still ignore the fact that pretty much every other team who drafts a QB high in the draft goes out of there way at some point to acquire a top WR for that QB to develop with, something the Jets have failed to do miserably. The only exception to this is Bradford, who was a much better draft prospect than Sanchez, and so far has just about equally sucked.

And yes, Sanchez sucks. Not sure why I get labeled a Sanchez supporter, the level of hate for Sanchez by you and your cronies is absolutely irrational, all while ignoring or forgiving much other suck with this franchise. If pointing that out makes me a Sanchez supporter, so be it, but I am not.

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Jif, I get that you so badly want to blame this all on one player, and if that position is revamped, that the Jets will magically become Super Bowl winners. It is a trait that is admirable, and a little cute. It is also akin to believing in the tooth fairy and Santa Claus.

Hey, I too was once the guy that thought the best fandom was to think of the most simple solution to the problem would be the total elixir. It is a part of fandom-that young, naive approach of pixie dust magic.

That pixie dust allows us to have fogged thinking, that we are alway "just one player away". And if we fix that, the kingdom is ours.

Clear thinking will allow you to understand that this program is rotting from the root up. Poor player selection, bad philosophy, bad contracts, loyalties that were unwarranted, inability to develop personnel. They are all insidious to an eventual ruin that this team is becoming. It is not here yet, but all the trademarks are there.

If you want to sing the mantra of "hey, 2 and 3 years ago, we participated in the AFCCG", and that makes you tingly, and think good times are are around the corner, with a change at QB, have at it. I will not awaken you from your slumber.

The markings are all there.

Jif is not alone in this asinine assumption, many other Jet fans on this board seem to share that opinion.

There is this irrational thought that Andy Dalton has this team in the SB.

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Jif, I get that you so badly want to blame this all on one player, and if that position is revamped, that the Jets will magically become Super Bowl winners. It is a trait that is admirable, and a little cute. It is also akin to believing in the tooth fairy and Santa Claus.

Hey, I too was once the guy that thought the best fandom was to think of the most simple solution to the problem would be the total elixir. It is a part of fandom-that young, naive approach of pixie dust magic.

That pixie dust allows us to have fogged thinking, that we are alway "just one player away". And if we fix that, the kingdom is ours.

Clear thinking will allow you to understand that this program is rotting from the root up. Poor player selection, bad philosophy, bad contracts, loyalties that were unwarranted, inability to develop personnel. They are all insidious to an eventual ruin that this team is becoming. It is not here yet, but all the trademarks are there.

If you want to sing the mantra of "hey, 2 and 3 years ago, we participated in the AFCCG", and that makes you tingly, and think good times are are around the corner, with a change at QB, have at it. I will not awaken you from your slumber.

The markings are all there.

Haha! Its not all Sanchez, never said it was. But the facts he's the worst QB in the league surely doesnt help...but it does help my position on Rex Ryan.

You want the guy thats responsible for us winning gone. I want the guy responsible for us losing gone. Who's got their priorities straight here?

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You said a whole lot without saying one thing to disprove my post, nice work.

You still ignore the fact that pretty much every other team who drafts a QB high in the draft goes out of there way at some point to acquire a top WR for that QB to develop with, something the Jets have failed to do miserably. The only exception to this is Bradford, who was a much better draft prospect than Sanchez, and so far has just about equally sucked.

And yes, Sanchez sucks. Not sure why I get labeled a Sanchez supporter, the level of hate for Sanchez by you and your cronies is absolutely irrational, all while ignoring or forgiving much other suck with this franchise. If pointing that out makes me a Sanchez supporter, so be it, but I am not.

Or, Rex Ryan would realize that Sanchez is not developing and make a change around who is coaching him. They can't even do that.

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Haha! Its not all Sanchez, never said it was. But the facts he's the worst QB in the league surely doesnt help...but it does help my position on Rex Ryan.

You want the guy thats responsible for us winning gone. I want the guy responsible for us losing gone. Who's got their priorities straight here?

Winning WHAT? What have the Jets won?

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lol. So Tannenbaum brings in Sanchez and Sanchez sucks, yet Rex should be the first to go. F*** you.

Whether you like it or not, Rex has set the direction of this franchise, not Tanny.

Rex came here and wanted to build a dominant defense, and what he called an all weather, ground and pound offense.

IMO that is not a formula to win a SB in this day and age. I do think you can have success meaning solid teams and playoffs with that formula, but it makes it almost impossible to win a SB nowadays. The league and the rules are just not setup for that type of team to have success anymore.

I I also think Rex's teams have been incredibly undisciplined at very bad times.

His time management leaves a lot to be desired.

A HC should never lose the pulse of the locker room, never, which he did, but I will give him credit in that it seems he has gotten that back this year.

A HC should never ignore one side of the ball, never.

Rex is not a HC who has nothing going for him, he has things to work with, but the question I have is whether he will ever learn from his mistakes and be able to take the Jets to the next level.

He seems to have learned a bit this year, but still has a long way to go IMO.

And so many of you Rex Lovers/Sanchez haters want it both ways. You claim Sanchez is the absolute worst QB in the league, and the sole reason this team is not SB caliber, yet Rex starts him week in week out, supported a contract extension, and has done nothing to try to go out and get a new QB.

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Winning WHAT? What have the Jets won?

Exactly, this notion that Rex has won is ludicrous.

He had 2 excellent wins as a Jet, in SD who IMO lost it more than the Jets won it, and against NE, his absolute shining moment as Jets HC.

They lucked into the playoffs in year 1, had a cake schedule which they took advantage of in 2010 with a ton of luck winning 4 games in the last seconds, and were mediocre last year, and are under .500 this year.

zero superbowls

zero divisions won

That is not winning IMO.

Andy Reid is about to get canned in Philly, and has won a ton more than Rex.

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