Jump to content

Woody - Jets fans should be patient.


PatriotReign37

Recommended Posts

I consider it cherry picking when my original post was about why I don't like Woody, and you single out one of those reasons and harp on it and not only fail to mention the others, but until your latest response, make it seem like I have no right to dislike Woody.  In retrospect, it looks like I may have been wrong about Gamble.  If so, that's fine, I've certainly been wrong before and will be again.  Even if I was wrong about Gamble, it still doesn't mean that ultimately Idzik was the best or right hire for the Jets.  Time will tell.

 

For the record, I'm willing to give Woody credit for anything good he does, it's just that I've seen very little good that he's actually done.  He's willing to spend money on players for the team.  I'll give him that.  My major problem with him has been that he's been too arrogant or stupid to realize how little he knows about the game, and rather than hiring a sound football man to run the franchise, he has hired marketing men and accountants and made one bad move after another.  He has also seemed to care more about selling PSLs than putting a winning team on the field, and doesn't seem to get it that fielding a winning team WILL put fannies in the seats.  I have no need to come up with reasons not to like him.  He provides enough of those on his own.

 

One thing that I give him credit for is hiring the head hunting firm for the GM search and for listening to them.  If Idzik continues to pan out and make good moves, then I'll give him credit for that, but as I said, imo the jury is still out on that.   

 

Gamble wasn't the only candidate I liked for the Jets' GM job.   Yes, now it appears that Gamble might not have been a great GM candidate, but we don't know for sure.  Just because a lot of teams didn't hire him really doesn't mean anything.  Every year NFL teams hire retread coaches and GMs who have sucked everywhere they've been, and ignore some candidates who turn out to be very, very good and successful once they get a chance.  They bring in mediocre players and expect them to turn things around for them.  They miss on players in the draft.  The truth is, we'll never know for certain how things might have panned out if one of those other candidates were hired.

 

If I got "pissy" it was because of the tone of your response to me.  I felt it insulting and demeaning, so I responded in kind.  I would much rather keep things more civil and on a higher level, but don't take crap from anyone.  There's nothing wrong with disagreeing, even strongly, about "opinions" if you don't make it personal.  You made it personal and insulting by accusing me of "whining."  Disagree with my opinion all you want and give the reasons why, but if you come at me personally, I'm likely to come right back at you, even though I try not to resort to that kind of pettiness. Accusing another man of whining is pretty low and doesn't encourage civil discourse.  

 

Holy BG's nephew, Batman. 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • Replies 82
  • Created
  • Last Reply

I consider it cherry picking when my original post was about why I don't like Woody, and you single out one of those reasons and harp on it and not only fail to mention the others, but until your latest response, make it seem like I have no right to dislike Woody.  In retrospect, it looks like I may have been wrong about Gamble.  If so, that's fine, I've certainly been wrong before and will be again.  Even if I was wrong about Gamble, it still doesn't mean that ultimately Idzik was the best or right hire for the Jets.  Time will tell.

 

For the record, I'm willing to give Woody credit for anything good he does, it's just that I've seen very little good that he's actually done.  He's willing to spend money on players for the team.  I'll give him that.  My major problem with him has been that he's been too arrogant or stupid to realize how little he knows about the game, and rather than hiring a sound football man to run the franchise, he has hired marketing men and accountants and made one bad move after another.  He has also seemed to care more about selling PSLs than putting a winning team on the field, and doesn't seem to get it that fielding a winning team WILL put fannies in the seats.  I have no need to come up with reasons not to like him.  He provides enough of those on his own.

 

One thing that I give him credit for is hiring the head hunting firm for the GM search and for listening to them.  If Idzik continues to pan out and make good moves, then I'll give him credit for that, but as I said, imo the jury is still out on that.   

 

Gamble wasn't the only candidate I liked for the Jets' GM job.   Yes, now it appears that Gamble might not have been a great GM candidate, but we don't know for sure.  Just because a lot of teams didn't hire him really doesn't mean anything.  Every year NFL teams hire retread coaches and GMs who have sucked everywhere they've been, and ignore some candidates who turn out to be very, very good and successful once they get a chance.  They bring in mediocre players and expect them to turn things around for them.  They miss on players in the draft.  The truth is, we'll never know for certain how things might have panned out if one of those other candidates were hired.

 

If I got "pissy" it was because of the tone of your response to me.  I felt it insulting and demeaning, so I responded in kind.  I would much rather keep things more civil and on a higher level, but don't take crap from anyone.  There's nothing wrong with disagreeing, even strongly, about "opinions" if you don't make it personal.  You made it personal and insulting by accusing me of "whining."  Disagree with my opinion all you want and give the reasons why, but if you come at me personally, I'm likely to come right back at you, even though I try not to resort to that kind of pettiness. Accusing another man of whining is pretty low and doesn't encourage civil discourse.  

 

When I chimed into this conversation you had been posting about Gamble for multiple posts in a row.  You had shifted the focus of your argument to the Jets' GM search and the only name you mentioned was Gamble.  That's what jumped off the page at me and that is why it's what I responded to.  I wasn't going to go back to figure out what else you were saying however many pages prior to that.  Even if you were saying other things I'd agree with, that wouldn't change that I still disagreed with the entire premise of your GM search argument.

 

Beyond that, sorry that I struck such a nerve, but what I saw was you already telling people off before I made a single post directed towards you in this thread.  Don't get me wrong, it happens to all of us at times, but if you're catching an attitude with people for disagreeing with you, know that you're going to catch crap for it in return.  Welcome to the world of message boards (especially JN).

Link to comment
Share on other sites

When I chimed into this conversation you had been posting about Gamble for multiple posts in a row.  You had shifted the focus of your argument to the Jets' GM search and the only name you mentioned was Gamble.  That's what jumped off the page at me and that is why it's what I responded to.  I wasn't going to go back to figure out what else you were saying however many pages prior to that.  Even if you were saying other things I'd agree with, that wouldn't change that I still disagreed with the entire premise of your GM search argument.

 

Beyond that, sorry that I struck such a nerve, but what I saw was you already telling people off before I made a single post directed towards you in this thread.  Don't get me wrong, it happens to all of us at times, but if you're catching an attitude with people for disagreeing with you, know that you're going to catch crap for it in return.  Welcome to the world of message boards (especially JN).

 

Fair enough.  I have no problem with people disagreeing with me.  I DO have a problem with people who feel like they have to make it personal in order to try to disagree.  Rarely have I seen minds changed on Jets boards (and I've been posting on them since the late 90's).  Thus, I never try to change anyone's mind.  I'm an opinionated old fart and have been watching NFL games since 1963, so I have some confidence in my knowledge and stand up for my position, but I do my best to never make it personal.  Even when someone is rude to me first, I try to ignore it and stick to the facts, but sometimes I fail.

 

The only two things that really gets under my skin on Jets boards is when someone tries to twist my words and misrepresent what I said and when someone tries to squelch discussion because they don't like a thread.  Too often times boards of this type dissolve into pissing matches, and egos get in the way.  We all are passionate Jets fans, or we wouldn't be here.  We all have ideas of what we think are the best steps for the team to take in order to win a SB, and who those players should be.  I think that no one would post if we all agreed.  It would be boring.  One thing I know for certain, is that there are always contrasting viewpoints and different "readings" of what is said and how it was said, and someone always has something to say about it for better or worse. LOL

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Jet fans should be patient. Even if you're pleased as pie about everything Idzik has done so far, the moves he's made are still largely very conservative. He shored up the defense and the running game, but it's still a passing league, and the Jets are still deficient in that department. People are optimistic about Geno, but he went #39 overall (with a few QB needy teams passing on him twice) for a reason. The Jets receivers and TEs are a below average group (being generous here) until someone proves otherwise. The Jets still don't have a clear plan about the future of the coaching staff, and we could see a disconnect between Rex's short term goals, and Idzik's long term goals this year.

Next year is when the full rebuild takes place. Rex proves himself, or he's gone. Sanchez probably doesn't have that much of a chance. The team will have as many as five extra draft picks and as much as $50M in cap space. That's when the team will get built. This year was a little foundation work in preparation for the coming overhaul, that's all.

 

 This is all a hope at this point.   The draft picks might be good, they might be cut after next year.  Who knows.  We hope they wind up pro bowl players.   The running game?  Greene had more experience and yards then the guys they have on this team.   Just because people hope some backup to backups in the NFL & college will be a beast doesn't mean the guy will ever be a legit starting RB.    We all hope Ivory winds up being the next Turner.   But he could be the next guy who gets cut or just never plays.    

 

  Next year is an unknown.  If the draft picks are good, then next years draft picks are a definitely chance to become even better.  If the draft picks suck,  there is no guarantee they'll be any better next year.     And the free agents,  if any of these guys wind up with career seasons, they might be gone after a season or just had that one great year.    Landry was a great pickup, except he's long gone now.  What was the point of a one year guy?  That's not building for the future.  And that is another worry with a lot of these signings.  Especially if the team winds up 5-11 or something.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Fair enough.  I have no problem with people disagreeing with me.  I DO have a problem with people who feel like they have to make it personal in order to try to disagree.  Rarely have I seen minds changed on Jets boards (and I've been posting on them since the late 90's).  Thus, I never try to change anyone's mind.  I'm an opinionated old fart and have been watching NFL games since 1963, so I have some confidence in my knowledge and stand up for my position, but I do my best to never make it personal.  Even when someone is rude to me first, I try to ignore it and stick to the facts, but sometimes I fail.

 

The only two things that really gets under my skin on Jets boards is when someone tries to twist my words and misrepresent what I said and when someone tries to squelch discussion because they don't like a thread.  Too often times boards of this type dissolve into pissing matches, and egos get in the way.  We all are passionate Jets fans, or we wouldn't be here.  We all have ideas of what we think are the best steps for the team to take in order to win a SB, and who those players should be.  I think that no one would post if we all agreed.  It would be boring.  One thing I know for certain, is that there are always contrasting viewpoints and different "readings" of what is said and how it was said, and someone always has something to say about it for better or worse. LOL

 

I hear you man and I'm right there with you on those things.  Let's be honest, we Jets fans are a very, um... interesting group.  If nothing else, we're all quite passionate and yes, you certainly nailed it in that try as we might, none of us are ever going to convince each other of anything.  If nothing else, at least we all get to wallow in the misery of this team together.

 

It's all good.

 

Don't mind me, I wasn't being serious, just making a joke at my own expense.  One of the few things I can do when posting that won't piss other people off. :tongue:

Link to comment
Share on other sites

 This is all a hope at this point.   The draft picks might be good, they might be cut after next year.  Who knows.  We hope they wind up pro bowl players.   The running game?  Greene had more experience and yards then the guys they have on this team.   Just because people hope some backup to backups in the NFL & college will be a beast doesn't mean the guy will ever be a legit starting RB.    We all hope Ivory winds up being the next Turner.   But he could be the next guy who gets cut or just never plays.    

 

  Next year is an unknown.  If the draft picks are good, then next years draft picks are a definitely chance to become even better.  If the draft picks suck,  there is no guarantee they'll be any better next year.     And the free agents,  if any of these guys wind up with career seasons, they might be gone after a season or just had that one great year.    Landry was a great pickup, except he's long gone now.  What was the point of a one year guy?  That's not building for the future.  And that is another worry with a lot of these signings.  Especially if the team winds up 5-11 or something.

I don't even understand the point of this post. Who's suggesting anything is guaranteed next year? And what does it have to do with having a little patience this year?

It's not "hope" that the Jets will have 10+ draft picks next year, or that they'll have an abundance of cap space. And it's no secret that the Jets had a salary cap problem this year, and still have a couple albatross contracts that need to be shed. They just hired a new GM who I hope knows what he's doing with those picks and that money. That doesn't alter the fact that fans should be patient this year, because the roster still kinda sucks and the resources just weren't there to make the necessary improvements.

Next year, those resources will be available. That's not hope, that's a fact. That's the point of a lot of these one year signings. They didn't have the money to offer better players longer term deals, and the one year deals will lead to cap room next season and can potentially lead to comp picks in 2015. This is a foundation year. A lot of demolition is still going on. The structure really starts to get built -for better or worse- next season.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Jet fans should be patient. Even if you're pleased as pie about everything Idzik has done so far, the moves he's made are still largely very conservative. He shored up the defense and the running game, but it's still a passing league, and the Jets are still deficient in that department. People are optimistic about Geno, but he went #39 overall (with a few QB needy teams passing on him twice) for a reason. The Jets receivers and TEs are a below average group (being generous here) until someone proves otherwise. The Jets still don't have a clear plan about the future of the coaching staff, and we could see a disconnect between Rex's short term goals, and Idzik's long term goals this year.

Next year is when the full rebuild takes place. Rex proves himself, or he's gone. Sanchez probably doesn't have that much of a chance. The team will have as many as five extra draft picks and as much as $50M in cap space. That's when the team will get built. This year was a little foundation work in preparation for the coming overhaul, that's all.

After the Tannenbaum Era, this team could use a little conservative. I like that Idzik seems impervious to outside pressure, and just does his job. Though certainly not the first round picks I wanted, I think in three years we'll be pretty pleased with having the players he drafted on this roster.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I hear you man and I'm right there with you on those things.  Let's be honest, we Jets fans are a very, um... interesting group.  If nothing else, we're all quite passionate and yes, you certainly nailed it in that try as we might, none of us are ever going to convince each other of anything.  If nothing else, at least we all get to wallow in the misery of this team together.

 

 

Don't mind me, I wasn't being serious, just making a joke at my own expense.  One of the few things I can do when posting that won't piss other people off. :tongue:

 

Yes, we are an interesting group.  We're all probably masochistic at the very least, and anyone that's been a fan of this team for more than 10-12 years may have been driven crazy to some extent.  lol   That said, I'm not sure we're any worse than fans of any other football team.  Ever see Raiders fans dressed up in their garb?  lol

 

No problem.  I'm glad we were able to sort through it.  I look forward to getting to know you and either rejoicing if things work out well, or crying in our beer if the team's woes continue.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

After the Tannenbaum Era, this team could use a little conservative. I like that Idzik seems impervious to outside pressure, and just does his job. Though certainly not the first round picks I wanted, I think in three years we'll be pretty pleased with having the players he drafted on this roster.

 

I totally agree, Tom.  Well said.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Archived

This topic is now archived and is closed to further replies.


×
×
  • Create New...