We cant start Geno with this group of WR's...

[JustInFudge]

I find it funny that this WR group is suddenly not good enough.

 

Ive been saying this for years yet get ripped because in reference to Sanchez this group suddenly becomes just fine. Hypocritical if you ask me.

 

FWIW - this WR group and TE group is probably bottom 5 in the NFL and yes no QB should have to endure this crap but once again been saying this for years.

 

Difference is, Sanchez had weaponz and still sucked. 

 

Got no prob with competition....and if Geno wins out, which he might....god help him though, its going to be ugly.

 

I coudlnt care less about Sanchez's confidence at this point..he's done. I just dont see any reason to ruin Geno...because if he fails as a passer this year....it wont be his fault.

 

I think the whole "ruin" thingy, is stupid.  You either got it or you dont.  Plenty of QB's have thrived with less than stellar talent and it doesnt hurt their mental.  These dudes shouldnt be that soft. 

 

And if Geno doesnt completely sh*t the bed with the crap surrounding him, how much better will he be when he is surrounded by real talent? 

[SenorGato]

The single most overblown problem of the offseason, but there is that need to find something.

In creating an offense a QB and OL >>>>>>>>>>>> Weaponz

Aaron Rodgers just lost probably his best WR in Jennings. When it comes to playing, guess how many ****s he plans to give?

[Matt39]

The single most overblown problem of the offseason, but there is that need to find something.

In creating an offense a QB and OL >>>>>>>>>>>> Weaponz

Aaron Rodgers just lost probably his best WR in Jennings. When it comes to playing, guess how many ****s he plans to give?

 

Aaron Rodgers also sat on the bench for 4 years.

[Matt39]

I cant believe people can still watch the NFL playoffs and make the "lol weaponzzzz" argument.

 

You need players that can make plays by themselves. Geno played in an offense in college that was predicated on that. But yeah lets throw him to the wolves with Jeremy Kerley, a WR who cant get off press coverage and can only run one route and some rugby player. That's gonna work out swimmingly.

[slats]

If Geno Smith can't outplay Mark Sanchez in practice, then the Jets need to be thinking franchise QB again next offseason.

If Geno does outplay Sanchez in practice, he then needs to get into games to see if he might have what it takes to be a franchise QB. If he doesn't, then the Jets need to be thinking franchise QB again next offseason.

Weapons or not, the Jets need some answers at QB this year.

[SayNoToDMC]

The single most overblown problem of the offseason, but there is that need to find something.

In creating an offense a QB and OL >>>>>>>>>>>> Weaponz

Aaron Rodgers just lost probably his best WR in Jennings. When it comes to playing, guess how many ****s he plans to give?

 

 

Aaron Rodgers is perfect example of a QB who benefited from not needing to be rushed into the starting lineup. He had time to completely rework his bad mechanics from college

[T0mShane]

There is zero downside to keeping Geno on the bench for half a season. Zero.

[T0mShane]

Aaron Rodgers is perfect example of a QB who benefited from not needing to be rushed into the starting lineup. He had time to completely rework his bad mechanics from college

Likewise, Rodgers came out of a fake passing system that does little to prepare QBs for the pro game.

[JustInFudge]

Aaron Rodgers also sat on the bench for 4 years.

 

He didnt have Mark Sanchez in front of him.

 

I cant believe people can still watch the NFL playoffs and make the "lol weaponzzzz" argument.

 

You need players that can make plays by themselves. Geno played in an offense in college that was predicated on that. But yeah lets throw him to the wolves with Jeremy Kerley, a WR who cant get off press coverage and can only run one route and some rugby player. That's gonna work out swimmingly.

 

I dont think anyone is "lol weaponzzzzzzz".  Everyone knows you need skills players to score.  We're all scratching out head about who's scoring TD's for the Jets this season.  Its just a silly argument when looking at Sanchez because he sucks, even when he had weaponz.  And weaponz, dont prevent butt fumbles.

 

The problem with your logic of "throwing him to the wolves", is that the Jets dont really have a choice.  They need to figure out the QB position.  Especially if they land with a top 3 pick next season and the potential players who could be had.  If Geno beats out Sanchez, you dont bench him because he doesnt have weaponz and worry about his psyche.  You see what he can do with what he has, if he shows potential, you build around him.  If he looks like Mark, you draft Teddy Bridgewater next year.  

[Matt39]

He didnt have Mark Sanchez in front of him.

 

 

I dont think anyone is "lol weaponzzzzzzz".  Everyone knows you need skills players to score.  We're all scratching out head about who's scoring TD's for the Jets this season.  Its just a silly argument when looking at Sanchez because he sucks, even when he had weaponz.  And weaponz, dont prevent butt fumbles.

 

The problem with your logic of "throwing him to the wolves", is that the Jets dont really have a choice.  They need to figure out the QB position.  Especially if they land with a top 3 pick next season and the potential players who could be had.  If Geno beats out Sanchez, you dont bench him because he doesnt have weaponz and worry about his psyche.  You see what he can do with what he has, if he shows potential, you build around him.  If he looks like Mark, you draft Teddy Bridgewater next year.  

 

Im not advocating for Sanchez...I said from the beginning the Garrard injury hurts big time....

 

Letting Geno go out there from day one we're just not going to get a real read on him and what he can do.

[JustInFudge]

Im not advocating for Sanchez...I said from the beginning the Garrard injury hurts big time....

 

Letting Geno go out there from day one we're just not going to get a real read on him and what he can do.

 

Well, I just disagree.  There are tons of aspects of his game that you can get a great read on that has nothing to do with his weaponz, that can give you a look into what type of QB he'll be in the future. 

[Matt39]

Well, I just disagree.  There are tons of aspects of his game that you can get a great read on that has nothing to do with his weaponz, that can give you a look into what type of QB he'll be in the future. 

 

Confidence is a big part of it....there's no confidence building happening next season with this group of pass catchers(as bad as I've ever seen). I dont think I'd risk starting him game 1.

 

Insane the Jets came back again with a WR/TE group looking like this....you cant start a rookie with no help.

[JustInFudge]

Confidence is a big part of it....there's no confidence building happening next season with this group of pass catchers(as bad as I've ever seen). I dont think I'd risk starting him game 1.

 

Insane the Jets came back again with a WR/TE group looking like this....you cant start a rookie with no help.

 

You cant not start him if he wins the job.  Its contradicts everything Idzik is claiming he's about.  Not a good way to start his career with the Jets.

 

If he's the best man of the job, you start him, regardless of his weaponz.  

[JerryK]

I don't have time to watch last season's games over again...

 

Did the OL give receivers time to run their routes? 

Will a better line help?

[flgreen]

Looks like McElroy has the job sewn up.

 

He only threw one pass yesterday, and hit an OL in the back of the head, but he was still better then the other two

[Stonehands]

There is zero downside to keeping Geno on the bench for half a season. Zero.

 

There is also zero upside to doing it, too.  If you can play in this league struggling for 6 weeks before you start to figure things out isn't going to kill you.  The David Carr's and Chris Weinke's of the world weren't going to make it no matter how long they sat and Aaron Rodgers would have been Aaron Rodgers a few years sooner if Mr. Pecker Pic wasn't on the team.

[SayNoToDMC]

There is also zero upside to doing it, too.  If you can play in this league struggling for 6 weeks before you start to figure things out isn't going to kill you.  The David Carr's and Chris Weinke's of the world weren't going to make it no matter how long they sat and Aaron Rodgers would have been Aaron Rodgers a few years sooner if Mr. Pecker Pic wasn't on the team.

 

The David Carr's of the world never got to work on the holes in their game because the Texans had to start him from day one, then you've got an Aaron Rodgers who credits that time on the bench and fixing his mechanics in his success now. If you all honestly think there is no difference in the likelihood of success between how David Carr's situation was handled and how Aaron Rodgers was handled you're clueless.

[kelticwizard]

So stop moaning about how you don't have playmakers in the receiver corps and sign Braylon already.  Now.  So he starts the season fully reacquainted and integrated with the offense.

[jetsjetsjetss]

its funny on here we still need le weaponz and every other outside writer on the jets say a WR group of hill,kerley and holmes looks good.

 

i dont know how holmes is gonna get back on the field but if we sign  braylon still wouldnt be bad

[JoeKlecko]

He didnt have Mark Sanchez in front of him.

 

 

I dont think anyone is "lol weaponzzzzzzz".  Everyone knows you need skills players to score.  We're all scratching out head about who's scoring TD's for the Jets this season.  Its just a silly argument when looking at Sanchez because he sucks, even when he had weaponz.  And weaponz, dont prevent butt fumbles.

 

The problem with your logic of "throwing him to the wolves", is that the Jets dont really have a choice.  They need to figure out the QB position.  Especially if they land with a top 3 pick next season and the potential players who could be had.  If Geno beats out Sanchez, you dont bench him because he doesnt have weaponz and worry about his psyche.  You see what he can do with what he has, if he shows potential, you build around him.  If he looks like Mark, you draft Teddy Bridgewater next year.  

 

The point could fairly be made that even if Geno beats out Sanchez and plays pretty well, if Bridgewater is the top-rated player on their board and either the top-rated QB or one of the top 2 QBs and he's sitting there at the Jets' first pick next year, they should take him anyway.  You never have enough QBs.  With it being the most important position on the team and competition being Idzik's mantra, it would make the most sense.  If Geno just needs competition to make him better, competing against he likes of Sanchez, McElroy and Simms isn't going to do it.  If they draft Bridgewater, and both Geno and he prove to be topnotch QBs, for once the Jets would be in a position of power.  They'd have insurance in case the starter got hurt, and could always trade one of them to a QB needy team for a boatload of picks or proven veterans.

[JoeKlecko]

There is also zero upside to doing it, too.  If you can play in this league struggling for 6 weeks before you start to figure things out isn't going to kill you.  The David Carr's and Chris Weinke's of the world weren't going to make it no matter how long they sat and Aaron Rodgers would have been Aaron Rodgers a few years sooner if Mr. Pecker Pic wasn't on the team.

 

Dude, sorry, but if you really and truly believe that, you're clueless when it comes to players developing.  You may be a genius in other aspects of the game, but on this critically important part of the game, you're clueless.

[SenorGato]

Aaron Rodgers is perfect example of a QB who benefited from not needing to be rushed into the starting lineup. He had time to completely rework his bad mechanics from college

He had time due to a HOFer starting in front of him. Smith doesn't have that luxury and if anything Rodgers (and RG3) helps prove how dumb it's gotten to knock a QB with NFL physical skills for playing in a non-mainstream system.

[slats]

The David Carr's of the world never got to work on the holes in their game because the Texans had to start him from day one, then you've got an Aaron Rodgers who credits that time on the bench and fixing his mechanics in his success now. If you all honestly think there is no difference in the likelihood of success between how David Carr's situation was handled and how Aaron Rodgers was handled you're clueless.

Every situation is different. David Carr got rushed into service as the #1 pick on an expansion team. Aaron Rogers sat behind Brett Favre - whether he really thought that was great for him or not. The Jets situation lies somewhere between the two, but, unfortunately, much closer to the expansion team.

Mark Sanchez is terrible, and the fans do not want to see him. That's a major factor. If Geno wins the battle in camp, Geno should play. I can understand maybe sitting him anyway for a few weeks just to let him get his sea legs, but if he's the better QB in practice, he's got to play. The Jets need to have the best QB on the field and they need to know whether Geno is the QB of the future or not. If Geno was a #1 overall type of prospect, it would be a different story. They'd be invested in him long term regardless. But he's not. He's a second rounder, and he's gonna have to demonstrate that he's worth building around. The only way he can do that is by getting out on the field.

[NJ]

[slats]

The point could fairly be made that even if Geno beats out Sanchez and plays pretty well, if Bridgewater is the top-rated player on their board and either the top-rated QB or one of the top 2 QBs and he's sitting there at the Jets' first pick next year, they should take him anyway.

If they really believe that they've found their franchise QB in Geno, they're extremely unlikely to take a QB in the first round next year. The situation you're describing would be a dream situation for Idzik - in that he'd be able to trade that pick for a bounty of picks to help him build around the QB he drafted in 2013. It's true that you can never have enough QBs, and they'd probably take one later in the draft.

And really, if Geno plays at the level of franchise QB material, the Jets are unlikely to be in position for Bridgewater, anyway.

[Matt39]

Every situation is different. David Carr got rushed into service as the #1 pick on an expansion team. Aaron Rogers sat behind Brett Favre - whether he really thought that was great for him or not. The Jets situation lies somewhere between the two, but, unfortunately, much closer to the expansion team.

Mark Sanchez is terrible, and the fans do not want to see him. That's a major factor. If Geno wins the battle in camp, Geno should play. I can understand maybe sitting him anyway for a few weeks just to let him get his sea legs, but if he's the better QB in practice, he's got to play. The Jets need to have the best QB on the field and they need to know whether Geno is the QB of the future or not. If Geno was a #1 overall type of prospect, it would be a different story. They'd be invested in him long term regardless. But he's not. He's a second rounder, and he's gonna have to demonstrate that he's worth building around. The only way he can do that is by getting out on the field.

 

No one wants to see Sanchez, I agree. But I think the plan was for Garrard to start the season with Geno watching and ultimately eating Sanchez's contract. Now the Jets are in a pickle....with a QB the fanbase hates and a rookie QB in a no-win situation with a group of skill players that just arent NFL starters.

 

I'd look to make a trade for someone that can just take snaps to begin the year, hand off...and make a few easy passes. Once the season is dead come late October-November- let Geno play with no pressure on him.

[slats]

No one wants to see Sanchez, I agree. But I think the plan was for Garrard to start the season with Geno watching and ultimately eating Sanchez's contract. Now the Jets are in a pickle....with a QB the fanbase hates and a rookie QB in a no-win situation with a group of skill players that just arent NFL starters.

 

I'd look to make a trade for someone that can just take snaps to begin the year, hand off...and make a few easy passes. Once the season is dead come late October-November- let Geno play with no pressure on him.

Who's available? And what would you give up for him? The Jets are in rebuilding mode, I really wouldn't want to see them trade a 2014 draft pick for a QB they plan to chew up and spit out by the halfway mark of the season. I think they just have to hold their nose and trot Sanchez out there for a few weeks if they want to give Geno a little time to ramp up.

[Stonehands]

Dude, sorry, but if you really and truly believe that, you're clueless when it comes to players developing.  You may be a genius in other aspects of the game, but on this critically important part of the game, you're clueless.

 

Let me ask you a question.  Wherever you work, you must bring on new people from time to time.  How long do they apprentice before they are given the reigns to do the job?  Depending on the field, it may range from a month of training to maybe 6 months and even when they are training, they are doing the job.  If this idea that someone learns best by sitting and watching had any merit, why isn't it used in any other sport or any other profession?  Heck, David Carr has been sitting behind a Super Bowl QB for years and is no better or does the "sitting theory" only work at career inception?  How come in basketball a guy needs court time to develop as a player and learn the speed of the game, but in football a QB learns best by holding a clip board. Once the QB learns the plays inside and out and runs through them in practice with the first team, what else is there to learn that isn't better learned by actually experiencing it?  Take a step back and ask yourself what these guys are learning that they can't learn and learn faster while playing.  Oh and if your QB has mechanics issues that require him to sit for 4 years to correct then maybe you got a lemon.  Aaron Rodgers sat because Favre was in front of him.  He could have played much earlier and still been the Rodgers he is today.  Let's take Brady for example, he may have sat another year or two if not for Mo Lewis.  Did Belicheck just miscalculate the maturity date of this great sitting the bench maturation thing?  It is actually quite foolish if you think about it.

[NCJETSFAN]

There is zero downside to keeping Geno on the bench for half a season. Zero.

So next yr when u have the 2nd pick and u don't know what u have what do u do cause if u pick geno and he isn't the guy. U better have ur resume ready!!

[JustInFudge]

Let me ask you a question.  Wherever you work, you must bring on new people from time to time.  How long do they apprentice before they are given the reigns to do the job?  Depending on the field, it may range from a month of training to maybe 6 months and even when they are training, they are doing the job.  If this idea that someone learns best by sitting and watching had any merit, why isn't it used in any other sport or any other profession?  Heck, David Carr has been sitting behind a Super Bowl QB for years and is no better or does the "sitting theory" only work at career inception?  How come in basketball a guy needs court time to develop as a player and learn the speed of the game, but in football a QB learns best by holding a clip board. Once the QB learns the plays inside and out and runs through them in practice with the first team, what else is there to learn that isn't better learned by actually experiencing it?  Take a step back and ask yourself what these guys are learning that they can't learn and learn faster while playing.  Oh and if your QB has mechanics issues that require him to sit for 4 years to correct then maybe you got a lemon.  Aaron Rodgers sat because Favre was in front of him.  He could have played much earlier and still been the Rodgers he is today.  Let's take Brady for example, he may have sat another year or two if not for Mo Lewis.  Did Belicheck just miscalculate the maturity date of this great sitting the bench maturation thing?  It is actually quite foolish if you think about it.

Nothing replaces, live snaps.  Nothing.  Ask any QB and they'll tell you, that you can only learn so much sitting and watching.  Live bullets are a totally different beast.  

Every player develops differently.  Just because so and so sat and watched and are now a good player, doesnt mean its the only way to develop a player.  

[JoeKlecko]

If they really believe that they've found their franchise QB in Geno, they're extremely unlikely to take a QB in the first round next year. The situation you're describing would be a dream situation for Idzik - in that he'd be able to trade that pick for a bounty of picks to help him build around the QB he drafted in 2013. It's true that you can never have enough QBs, and they'd probably take one later in the draft.

And really, if Geno plays at the level of franchise QB material, the Jets are unlikely to be in position for Bridgewater, anyway.

 

I agree both that if Smith plays at the level of a franchise QB this season that the Jets would neither be in the position to draft or would be likely to draft Bridgewater (or whoever the top QB prospect is).  That said, notice that I didn't say that that Geno would play at the level of a franchise QB, but rather "pretty well."  While that can be read several ways, imo, it doesn't suggest that they've definitively found their QB of the future, just that he played at a higher level than which Sanchez is capable.  It would still leave the question open, and particularly if Idzik was telling the truth about his taking BPA.

 

Let say that Sanchez or another vet wind up starting, and Smith becomes the starter by game 6 and plays pretty well, but because of the lack of real weapons around him, Goodson winds up going to jail and/or cut, Ivory gets injured, or for whatever reason, the Jets only win 4-5 games.  The Jets would probably be drafting in the top 2-3 in next year's draft.  If Clowney goes #1, it's not that likely that another position player would be rated ahead of Bridgewater or Manziel unless one or both don't enter the draft or completely fall apart next season (or get seriously injured).  If Idzik sticks to his BPA approach to the draft, then he'd almost have to take the QB or trade the pick for whatever he could get.  If he had any doubts at all about Smith, then I think he would hedge those bets by taking the QB, then if both prove to be the real deal in 2014, he could trade one of them in 2015, about the time the Jets should be primed to start making a serious run at the SB.

[Jacked4JetsFB]

Our receivers are fine, Sanchez is the problem. Geno will start and by the end of the season we will be a top 10 offense in the NFL this year, BANK!

[Sperm Edwards]

If only we had established weapons like Leonard Hankerson and Josh Morgan and Santana Moss and Aldrick Robinson and Darrel Young to pair up with never-healthy Fred Davis & never-healthy Pierre Garcon, then and only then would this be a place where a young QB - whether it's Sanchez or Geno - could thrive and be just about the league's top-rated passer.  Or the stud-rich group out in Seattle, for that matter.

 

Weaponzzz my azzzz

 

If a guy's the goods he'll be the goods even with the sorry-ass bunch they trotted out in Washington & Seattle -- both with rookie QBs.  I'm not saying anyone should expect that type of production out of Geno Smith but if he doesn't perform it won't be because of weapons.  It would certainly make his job easier, and there will be some plays here & there where they'll make a great (positive) play on a throw that wasn't so great.  But if he's going to be good it won't be hidden because of these receivers. 

 

And everyone needs to truly realize how much less productive they all were with the offense-killing combo of Sanchez & Sparano.

[SayNoToDMC]

Our receivers are fine, Sanchez is the problem. Geno will start and by the end of the season we will be a top 10 offense in the NFL this year, BANK!

 

 

Edit: Ninja'd! I was saying top 5 offense but I totally agree. That with the #1 defense and the Lombardi is ours

[SayNoToDMC]

If only we had established weapons like Leonard Hankerson and Josh Morgan and Santana Moss and Aldrick Robinson and Darrel Young to pair up with never-healthy Fred Davis & never-healthy Pierre Garcon, then and only then would this be a place where a young QB - whether it's Sanchez or Geno - could thrive and be just about the league's top-rated passer.  Or the stud-rich group out in Seattle, for that matter.

 

Weaponzzz my azzzz

 

If a guy's the goods he'll be the goods even with the sorry-ass bunch they trotted out in Washington & Seattle -- both with rookie QBs.  I'm not saying anyone should expect that type of production out of Geno Smith but if he doesn't perform it won't be because of weapons.  It would certainly make his job easier, and there will be some plays here & there where they'll make a great (positive) play on a throw that wasn't so great.  But if he's going to be good it won't be hidden because of these receivers. 

 

And everyone needs to truly realize how much less productive they all were with the offense-killing combo of Sanchez & Sparano.

 

 

If we had drafted Russel Wilson or RG III they would have sucked here .last year, They both went to teams that where capable of installing an offense catered to their strengths. Sparano would have seen Russel Wilson as too small to Punt protect and not quite big enough to run his exotic form of the Wildcat.