Cap Update: Trimming The Fat

[T0mShane]

Honestly, trading for Holmes was one of Tannenbaum's better moves. Former first round draft pick still under his (dirt cheap) rookie contract, coming off a season with 79 receptions for 1248 yards and in his most recent game was the superbowl MVP. I'd make a move like that with our 5th round pick every single year.

The poison was in re-signing him, not in giving up a 5th rounder for 12 games of Holmes for a non-guaranteed $500K in a contract year.

If you contradict me in front of Max, you'll just embolden him.

[T0mShane]

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[Sperm Edwards]

.

 

Whatever.

[T0mShane]

Whatever.

WHAT

[T0mShane]

Whatever.

WHAT

[Maxman]

Max and T0mShane sitting in a tree, K-I-S-S-I-N-G. First came love, then came gayness ...

 

I am not sure I agree that the love came first.  Usually when Tom is involved he comes first.

[JoeKlecko]

Bingo

 

Funny thing is, right now Tanny is considered a bum.  If the gamble had paid off we would be enshrining him in the HOF.

 

go figure

 

No we wouldn't, at least I wouldn't.  He had a couple of good drafts, got pretty good value in trades (or at least wasn't continually bent over as Bradway was) and early on (before he became GM) was good with contracts, getting players signed and into camp on time, and with the cap.  Once he became GM, even his financial dealings went to sh*t.  The only reason he wasn't one of the worst GMs in team history is because the Jets have had such a sorry history with so many incredibly awful GMs.   With even an above average GM who knew how to evaluate talent, how to put together a competitive football team, and knew value for contracts, the Jets might have already been to, if not won a Lombardi Trophy or two over the last 4 years or so.

 

I never liked him or thought he was qualified to be a GM.  The only way he could get good talent was to trade up.  He rarely got even any quality players in the middle and lower rounds, much less any diamonds in the rough.  He ignored some positions for years, stripped the team of depth and left holes everywhere.  He's so bad, he's not even working in the NFL any more.

[unbanmadmike1]

Bingo

 

Funny thing is, right now Tanny is considered a bum.  If the gamble had paid off we would be enshrining him in the HOF.

 

go figure

The reason it didn't work out was because of his own horrible draft picks and flawed team construction.      

[whodeawhodat]

Not sure about the holmes revolutionist history on this board.  If I think back to that offseason, there were 2 camps on this board.  Bring back either Braylon or Holmes. There was no one else available that year as far as #1 WR.  As a matter of fact, we were not sure if we would be able to bring either back due to our cap issues at the time.  Somehow, Tanny managed to get our #1 WR back and now that it didn't work out, Tanny sucked...I think I started in the BE corner but was talked into joining the Holmes group on this board.  Either way I was happy at the time that we would have our #1 WR back. Too bad it didn't work out...

[SayNoToDMC]

Not sure about the holmes revolutionist history on this board.  If I think back to that offseason, there were 2 camps on this board.  Bring back either Braylon or Holmes. There was no one else available that year as far as #1 WR.  As a matter of fact, we were not sure if we would be able to bring either back due to our cap issues at the time.  Somehow, Tanny managed to get our #1 WR back and now that it didn't work out, Tanny sucked...I think I started in the BE corner but was talked into joining the Holmes group on this board.  Either way I was happy at the time that we would have our #1 WR back. Too bad it didn't work out...

 

9 million a year 24 guaranteed? Who are we bidding against with all these ridiculous deals? I can say I was BE guy but I can't remember if that was mainly due to the fact I wanted to see DLJ's t!ts or not

[whodeawhodat]

9 million a year 24 guaranteed? Who are we bidding against with all these ridiculous deals? I can say I was BE guy but I can't remember if that was mainly due to the fact I wanted to see DLJ's t!ts or not

 

I guess we were bidding against every team that wanted a #1 WR?  I honestly cant recall 1 other WR being out there that year.  Yeah, it should have been structured better but we had zero leverage thanks to our depth and the timing of his hitting FA.  If you remember those debates, what were our other options at the time?  Many of us thought it was impossible to even fit Holmes under our cap if we wanted to.  Maybe that is why there was so much guaranteed?  for cap purposes?

[Bleedin Green]

Not sure about the holmes revolutionist history on this board.  If I think back to that offseason, there were 2 camps on this board.  Bring back either Braylon or Holmes. There was no one else available that year as far as #1 WR.  As a matter of fact, we were not sure if we would be able to bring either back due to our cap issues at the time.  Somehow, Tanny managed to get our #1 WR back and now that it didn't work out, Tanny sucked...I think I started in the BE corner but was talked into joining the Holmes group on this board.  Either way I was happy at the time that we would have our #1 WR back. Too bad it didn't work out...

 

While many supported the idea of bringing Holmes back, there were plenty who were unhappy with that contract as soon as it was signed.  Even if that weren't the case, I'm pretty sure there's more than momentary fan approval to the criteria for successful NFL GMing.  The fans may now have the benefit of hindsight, but we can still give Tanny crap for what has clearly been proven to be an awful move on his part because he was the one getting paid millions of dollars to know better than to do that crap.  If it were an isolated incident than it might be worthy of a free pass, yet it was anything but.

[Sperm Edwards]

I guess we were bidding against every team that wanted a #1 WR?  I honestly cant recall 1 other WR being out there that year.  Yeah, it should have been structured better but we had zero leverage thanks to our depth and the timing of his hitting FA.  If you remember those debates, what were our other options at the time?  Many of us thought it was impossible to even fit Holmes under our cap if we wanted to.  Maybe that is why there was so much guaranteed?  for cap purposes?

 

Rice is the only one I can think of offhand.

[TechJet]

Santonio Holmes is one of the worst acquisitions in Jets history, considering how little he's done on the field and how cancerous he's been off of it. Total scumbag.

I am starting to agree with you!

[SayNoToDMC]

I guess we were bidding against every team that wanted a #1 WR?  I honestly cant recall 1 other WR being out there that year.  Yeah, it should have been structured better but we had zero leverage thanks to our depth and the timing of his hitting FA.  If you remember those debates, what were our other options at the time?  Many of us thought it was impossible to even fit Holmes under our cap if we wanted to.  Maybe that is why there was so much guaranteed?  for cap purposes?

 

First off Holmes was never a real #1 receiver, paying him like one doesn't make it true. People here thought it was a bad contract when it was signed, even most of the people who wanted him. Braylon went on to sign a 1 mil dollar deal with the 49ers that included 0 guaranteed dollars, that's not leverage right there Tanny could have used? A year earlier we where the only team in the league willing to give up a 5th, now he's worth being paid like a top 10 receiver? Dude still has one 1,000+ yard season and has never made a pro bowl.  I said wtf when they signed him to that deal and I wasn't a member of the organization, they also got to spend a year around him personally. You're telling that half a retard was smart enough and a talented enough actor to not show any signs of being a prima donna, malcontent, bitch? If nothing else Braylon at least seemed to enjoy being here even if he was an idiot off the field. I still prefer resigning him and not ever seeing Holmes near the rookie QB, 7.5 million guaranteed dollars and all.

[whodeawhodat]

First off Holmes was never a real #1 receiver, paying him like one doesn't make it true. People here thought it was a bad contract when it was signed, even most of the people who wanted him. Braylon went on to sign a 1 mil dollar deal with the 49ers that included 0 guaranteed dollars, that's not leverage right there Tanny could have used? A year earlier we where the only team in the league willing to give up a 5th, now he's worth being paid like a top 10 receiver? Dude still has one 1,000+ yard season and has never made a pro bowl.  I said wtf when they signed him to that deal and I wasn't a member of the organization, they also got to spend a year around him personally. You're telling that half a retard was smart enough and a talented enough actor to not show any signs of being a prima donna, malcontent, bitch? If nothing else Braylon at least seemed to enjoy being here even if he was an idiot off the field. I still prefer resigning him and not ever seeing Holmes near the rookie QB, 7.5 million guaranteed dollars and all.

 

I see your point.  I also saw him as the only playmaker we had at the time and with FA bare of playmakers we were desperate and had zero leverage.  If Tanny could find a way to resign him, he had to and he did.  LOTS of playmakers are primadonnas, look at meshawn for 1.  yeah, it sucks that he hasn't lived up to his contract but I think we can all agree that he has the skills to be a playmaker in this league. I believe that there have been MANY contributing factors to his underachieving and not all of them rest on him.  I don't like him personally, I think he quit on this team 2 years ago but then again, when sanchez is you QB it might give you a sad too...

[Sperm Edwards]

First off Holmes was never a real #1 receiver, paying him like one doesn't make it true. People here thought it was a bad contract when it was signed, even most of the people who wanted him. Braylon went on to sign a 1 mil dollar deal with the 49ers that included 0 guaranteed dollars, that's not leverage right there Tanny could have used? A year earlier we where the only team in the league willing to give up a 5th, now he's worth being paid like a top 10 receiver? Dude still has one 1,000+ yard season and has never made a pro bowl.  I said wtf when they signed him to that deal and I wasn't a member of the organization, they also got to spend a year around him personally. You're telling that half a retard was smart enough and a talented enough actor to not show any signs of being a prima donna, malcontent, bitch? If nothing else Braylon at least seemed to enjoy being here even if he was an idiot off the field. I still prefer resigning him and not ever seeing Holmes near the rookie QB, 7.5 million guaranteed dollars and all.

 

I don't know where it came from that we were the only team in the league willing to give up a 5th, as that is totally unfounded, but agree on the stupidity of paying Holmes that much.  It stunk to high hell of poor future planning and being "trapped" into grossly overspending on either Holmes or Edwards and choosing between the two.  We chose Holmes.

 

Regarding the cheapness of re-signing Edwards back then:

 

Thing to remember is at the time we signed Holmes, Braylon's asking price wasn't much less. And he really though he'd get it from someone.  Was bragging on Twitter that his services are available and that he was visiting this team or that (Arizona, etc.).  It was only after the whole league passed on Braylon Edwards that he reluctantly signed a fully incentive-laden deal with a run-first team that had Alex Smith at QB.  

[SayNoToDMC]

I don't know where it came from that we were the only team in the league willing to give up a 5th, as that is totally unfounded, but agree on the stupidity of paying Holmes that much.  It stunk to high hell of poor future planning and being "trapped" into grossly overspending on either Holmes or Edwards and choosing between the two.  We chose Holmes.

 

Regarding the cheapness of re-signing Edwards back then:

 

Thing to remember is at the time we signed Holmes, Braylon's asking price wasn't much less. And he really though he'd get it from someone.  Was bragging on Twitter that his services are available and that he was visiting this team or that (Arizona, etc.).  It was only after the whole league passed on Braylon Edwards that he reluctantly signed a fully incentive-laden deal with a run-first team that had Alex Smith at QB.  

 

Compensation being the same I assume they would have rather given him to plenty of other teams being we just came off a season where we were a half away from a SB in their conference with a rookie QB and coach. At the time they didn't know Mark Sanchez wasn't going to get better.

[#27TheDominator]

I understand blasting Tannenbaum.  Ultimately he was a failure, but the whole idea that he was God awful is just ridiculous.  The team got VERY close.  He tried a few things to push them over and they failed.  In the end it basically boiled down to trying to plug all holes in the dyke with your thumb, but if Sanchez didn't blow the team would have been able to overcome the rough spots.  Acting like he is/was "the worst GM in team history" is beyond moronic.

 

For the record I wanted Holmes over Edwards, but didn't want to pay either this much.  I'd have much preferred going with a lesser WR than paying this much. 

[Sperm Edwards]

Compensation being the same I assume they would have rather given him to plenty of other teams being we just came off a season where we were a half away from a SB in their conference with a rookie QB and coach. At the time they didn't know Mark Sanchez wasn't going to get better.

 

Again, it is nothing more than a guess that the Jets were the highest bidder rather than just the first team to say "yes" to a 5th round asking price.  And by "first" team it could mean the first of 10 teams or that we were the very first team they called knowing MT's love of being Trader Mike.

When a team is actively shopping a player it is difficult to keep it out of the media, and when Holmes was traded it was a pretty big media surprise.  Pittsburgh team caught wind that there would be the reopening of some lawsuit against him and they just dumped him to send a message to the rest of their team, not because they thought Holmes was valueless.  

 

The assumption that Pittsburgh called around to all 31 other teams, and the only one to bid higher than a 6th rounder was the Jets, is unsubstantiated. Given that no one even knew Holmes was on the block until a deal was sealed it seems quite unlikely that was the case.

 

I don't have any problem getting Holmes for such a low price, and would advocate making such a deal again every year with our 5th round pick.  I have a big problem with having handed him that stupid megadeal with gobs of guaranteed money to someone with...let's call it severe personality and/or maturity disorders.