The Sanchez Debate

[Smashmouth]

Does he stay or does he go ? Is the topic for the debate.... please try and stick to the format on the debate which I will describe below. 

 

This is not so much about past performance its about moving forward. You can use past performance to make your point but you must keep in mind the stats laid out below. Try not to derail the thread with Sanchez Sucks comments, make your point intelligently.

 

Lets say Sanchez starts the season and has a Good year, not a great one, but a good one.

 

20 TD's Passing 4 TD's rushing 10 Ints 3 fumbles lost 3800 yards and 60% comp percentage and the Jets go 10-6 In this season Mark has seemed to remedy his turnover's and is much more conscious at protecting the football.

 

The Jets make the playoffs and Sanchez plays well but the Jets do not advance to the SB.

 

Do you keep Mark Sanchez ?  When I ask this question it does not mean you automatically keep him as a starter so keep that in mind as well.

[FloridaJetsFan]

At this point - ANY progress at all would seem like a huge leap from what we've seen in his four year tenure, so in my mind, that would indicate the ABILITY for growth, something that I think is highly in doubt at this stage. Therefore, if that were to occur, than yes, I would be in favor of seeing more potential growth.

[slats]

Holy hypotheticals, Batman!

[dbatesman]

Counter-hypothetical: Sanchez grows into a giant, near-invulnerable creature with superhuman strength and green skin. His stamina and physical attributes allow him to gain 6,000+ total yards as a dual-threat QB, even as he racks up more than 100 TFLs as the Jets' new nose tackle and helps derail various villains' plans for world domination. Also, he really cuts down on the turnovers. Do the Jets keep him?

[Smashmouth]

Holy hypotheticals, Batman!

 

Yes its hypothetical but turnovers can be corrected and it is his biggest issue. It has to be the main focus of this offensive coaching staff. Remember when Parcells brought in vinny, he was good for 30 + turnovers a year and he completely turned it around. Will Sanchez have that kind of discipline ? I don't know.... but its certainly not out of the realm of possibility. We already know he can put up TD's and the other real issue is comp percentage and 60 is not that much of a jump either. Keep in mind a jump from 56 percent to 60 percent is 3 completions per game and that should be attainable in a WCO

[Maxman]

Yes. If he has the #s you posted above he will be the starting QB here next year.

[Sperm Edwards]

Does he stay or does he go ? Is the topic for the debate.... please try and stick to the format on the debate which I will describe below. 

 

This is not so much about past performance its about moving forward. You can use past performance to make your point but you must keep in mind the stats laid out below. Try not to derail the thread with Sanchez Sucks comments, make your point intelligently.

 

Lets say Sanchez starts the season and has a Good year, not a great one, but a good one.

 

20 TD's Passing 4 TD's rushing 10 Ints 3 fumbles lost 3800 yards and 60% comp percentage and the Jets go 10-6 In this season Mark has seemed to remedy his turnover's and is much more conscious at protecting the football.

 

The Jets make the playoffs and Sanchez plays well but the Jets do not advance to the SB.

 

Do you keep Mark Sanchez ?  When I ask this question it does not mean you automatically keep him as a starter so keep that in mind as well.

 

In this situation, where there is obvious improvement and he's a top-15 passer (but barely outside the top 10) then you keep him.  The team has a LOT more invested in Sanchez than in Smith.

 

But it will never happen.  You are spouting off theoretical numbers of someone who is an actual QB.  Sanchez is not and this will never happen.

[Gastineau Lives]

Yes its hypothetical but turnovers can be corrected and it is his biggest issue. It has to be the main focus of this offensive coaching staff. Remember when Parcells brought in vinny, he was good for 30 + turnovers a year and he completely turned it around. Will Sanchez have that kind of discipline ? I don't know.... but its certainly not out of the realm of possibility. We already know he can put up TD's and the other real issue is comp percentage and 60 is not that much of a jump either. Keep in mind a jump from 56 percent to 60 percent is 3 completions per game and that should be attainable in a WCO

Sanchez doesn't have nearly the talent in every other aspect of the game that Testaverde had.

[kay_gee]

I don't think this hypothetical is possible. If he were to improve that much? Keep him. But I'd settle for him not turning the ball over so much.

[kay_gee]

double post. my bad.

[richiej95]

Hey guys - first post. Huge Jets fan from England, really can't wait for the new season although no idea what it will hold.

 

My view is that Sanchez holding us back big time now. It is clear he isn't going to make the grade, so having him as starter is pointless.

 

I am not saying Geno is going to be successful in the NFL, but at this point you can't possibly say.

 

There is nothing to lose at the moment - we know Sanchez won't take us to the play-offs so why not try someone else and see what Geno can do. If he sucks, so what he has just done what Sanchez would have done. If he succeeds then we may just be on to something positive for the future.

 

I think at this moment in time our RB situation is more of a problem than QB though which is worrying. Our O-Line looked shocking against Detroit, Ivory has barely seen the field in camp, Goodson is missing, McKnight is still McKnight and Powell is definitely not a No.1 running back.

 

He might have been frustrating at times, but we are going to miss Shonn Greene this year. He might not have been a flashy, big play RB but at least he consistently picked up 3/4 yards without fumbling to keep offence ticking over.

 

Without a run game the pressure is on our QB's even more and can any of them deal with it? I doubt it tbh.

[T0mShane]

Counter-hypothetical: Sanchez grows into a giant, near-invulnerable creature with superhuman strength and green skin. His stamina and physical attributes allow him to gain 6,000+ total yards as a dual-threat QB, even as he racks up more than 100 TFLs as the Jets' new nose tackle and helps derail various villains' plans for world domination. Also, he really cuts down on the turnovers. Do the Jets keep him?

You'd f*ck Mega-Sanchez, marry Mecha-Sanchez, kill Sancheztron.

[Smashmouth]

Sanchez doesn't have nearly the talent in every other aspect of the game that Testaverde had.

 

I understand that but its about cutting down turnovers not a QB comparison

[kay_gee]

You'd f*ck Mega-Sanchez, marry Mecha-Sanchez, kill Sancheztron.

um no. you don't f*ck mega-sanchez. mega-sanchez f*cks you!

[Smashmouth]

I don't think this hypothetical is possible. If he were to improve that much? Keep him. But I'd settle for him not turning the ball over so much.

 

You do realize if he cuts down the turnovers hes fully capable of throwing 20 TD's since hes already thrown 26 and 17 in a season. In a short passing offense hes also fully capable of turning 3 incompletions into completions for a higher percentage. I think the numbers I listed are far from unrealistic. Sure maybe Sanchez sh*ts the bed (more likely than not) and we dump him to the curb but that's not the point of this debate

[slats]

Geno would have to be playing horribly in practice to not be starting by the week after the bye. It's just very hard to imagine Sanchez playing the whole season, no matter how average he miraculously becomes.

[Lizard King]

Counter-hypothetical: Sanchez grows into a giant, near-invulnerable creature with superhuman strength and green skin. His stamina and physical attributes allow him to gain 6,000+ total yards as a dual-threat QB, even as he racks up more than 100 TFLs as the Jets' new nose tackle and helps derail various villains' plans for world domination. Also, he really cuts down on the turnovers. Do the Jets keep him?

The answer is no if you look at recent history. We cut a guy like this last year, he looks ready to fulfill your scenario in Blue and Red in about 45 days. Off the field he is poised and ready to mission in South Boston.

[kay_gee]

he's shown no indication he can improve this much. if he cuts down on INTs, he 1000x less a liability. I'd settle with not spotting tge other team 6-18 points.

[Smashmouth]

IMO I think the numbers I put in for Sanchez are the MINIMUM he needs to put up to keep the starting position. I also feel even if he reaches those numbers we draft the best QB possible in next years draft.

[sourceworx]

You absolutely keep him if he has that kind of season.  If he had that kind of year last year, we'd have been a playoff team.

[DJF71]

Does he stay or does he go ? Is the topic for the debate.... please try and stick to the format on the debate which I will describe below. 

 

This is not so much about past performance its about moving forward. You can use past performance to make your point but you must keep in mind the stats laid out below. Try not to derail the thread with Sanchez Sucks comments, make your point intelligently.

 

Lets say Sanchez starts the season and has a Good year, not a great one, but a good one.

 

20 TD's Passing 4 TD's rushing 10 Ints 3 fumbles lost 3800 yards and 60% comp percentage and the Jets go 10-6 In this season Mark has seemed to remedy his turnover's and is much more conscious at protecting the football.

 

The Jets make the playoffs and Sanchez plays well but the Jets do not advance to the SB.

 

Do you keep Mark Sanchez ?  When I ask this question it does not mean you automatically keep him as a starter so keep that in mind as well.

With those stats, then yes we keep him and he becomes the backup next year to Geno because he can get those stats also and has a chance at much better ones.

[whodeawhodat]

I understand that but its about cutting down turnovers not a QB comparison

 

You have to look at what it takes to actually cut down on turnovers. As you can tell from this TC you cant just say, no more turnovers.  This guy pumps at his intended target drawing all defenders to the target. I said this last year, if they design pump action into every pass play, he will do better but that just makes the problem of him holding the ball too long that much worse.  I would love to see Sanchez morph into a solid QB but I dont think he has what it takes to actually do it.  I think he has the will but that alone cannot bring him up to an acceptable level of play.

 

My $0.02

[peebag]

I would only keep him at a highly reduced cost...if he's not willing to do so, adios muchacho.....

[Smashmouth]

You have to look at what it takes to actually cut down on turnovers. As you can tell from this TC you cant just say, no more turnovers.  This guy pumps at his intended target drawing all defenders to the target. I said this last year, if they design pump action into every pass play, he will do better but that just makes the problem of him holding the ball too long that much worse.  I would love to see Sanchez morph into a solid QB but I dont think he has what it takes to actually do it.  I think he has the will but that alone cannot bring him up to an acceptable level of play.

 

My $0.02

 

So in your scenario the way he stops throwing at least some INT's is to stop pumping when he's undecided. That's a fix, it has nothing to do with talent that's in his head. Cutting down on turnovers has nothing to do with talent it is somewhat a mental issue and throwing the ball away rather than forcing it is one of the simple fixes. I think that's his main problem the guy refuses to throw the ball away he forces his own turnovers and he needs a guy like a Parcells tearing him to shreds  every time he refuses to throw a ball away when nothing is there. The coddling should have been stopped in year 2 . IMO Parcells was 100 % the reason Vinny stopped throwing INT's and started throwing the ball away when nothing was there. that's why I used Vinny as an example

[#27TheDominator]

IMO I think the numbers I put in for Sanchez are the MINIMUM he needs to put up to keep the starting position. I also feel even if he reaches those numbers we draft the best QB possible in next years draft.

 

??If Sanchez has good numbers AND we have Smith to develop we HAVE to draft the best QB in the draft?   WTF?  I don't konw which is more improbable.

[Jetsfan80]

You do realize if he cuts down the turnovers

 

Just stop right here.  We know he is incapable of stopping turning over the ball.  We already saw it in the preseason game with another one of his patented record-setting pick's to a DL that got taken for 6.  This is who Sanchez is and who he'll always be.  The Sanchez you're talking about is one that will never happen.

[Jetsfan80]

So in your scenario the way he stops throwing at least some INT's is to stop pumping when he's undecided.

 

No, he has to stop having dumb brains and suddenly have the ability to slow down a game that is too fast for him.  This is not fixable.

[Smashmouth]

No, he has to stop having dumb brains and suddenly have the ability to slow down a game that is too fast for him.  This is not fixable.

 

Don't pull sentences out of other conversations . post something intelligent for once

[Jetsfan80]

Don't pull sentences out of other conversations . post something intelligent for once

 

Oh, so posting something intelligent means trying to come up with ways to fix something that is a lost cause and come up with fake stats for said lost cause?  Sorry, carry on.

[CTM]

Geno would have to be playing horribly in practice to not be starting by the week after the bye. It's just very hard to imagine Sanchez playing the whole season, no matter how average he miraculously becomes.

 

 

Rex loves him.. it's easy for me to imagine

[Gastineau Lives]

Don't pull sentences out of other conversations . post something intelligent for once

Smash, he fumbles the ball 40% of the time he is sacked. That's an in the moment thing. How is he gonna fix that?

[Integrity28]

I don't care about Sanchez stats, as long as we are winning AND he isn't single-handedly losing close games with his idiot sh*t brain turnovers.

[slats]

Rex loves him.. it's easy for me to imagine

That's a myth that gets perpetuated here thru repetition. Rex loves Sanchez up to and until he has a better option available at QB. In his entire tenure as an NFL head coach, his best QB option has been Mark Sanchez.

He treats him with kid gloves because he knows Sanchez is a delicate flower and -again- he hasn't had any options.

But even if you want to believe that Rex loves himself some Sanchez, Idzik is going to step in at some point and demand that Geno get the start.

[ylekram]

keep him? with those stats, I would extend him

[CTM]

That's a myth that gets perpetuated here thru repetition. Rex loves Sanchez up to and until he has a better option available at QB. In his entire tenure as an NFL head coach, his best QB option has been Mark Sanchez.

He treats him with kid gloves because he knows Sanchez is a delicate flower and -again- he hasn't had any options.

But even if you want to believe that Rex loves himself some Sanchez, Idzik is going to step in at some point and demand that Geno get the start.

 

 

Meh, not so sure .. The tattoo thing confirmed it for me.  the whole there's no better option thing is the myth, Rex never went out and got a better option..