The Sanchez Debate

[Smashmouth]

Sorry my post earlier on the thread left the format of sticking to the stats on the debate - I just saw the thread title and weighed in with my view before reading the opening post properly....my mistake. That's what I call a fail of a first post so the only way is up for me now - a bit like the Jets!

 

Its no problem at all brother welcome to the forums great to have you here

[slats]

No coach in the history of football was ever forced to start the same under-performing player for four consecutive years...other than Rex Ryan.

Yeah, every other coach would've started Kellen Clemens, 50 year old Mark Brunell, or Tim Tebow.

[Scott Dierking]

Yeah, every other coach would've started Kellen Clemens, 50 year old Mark Brunell, or Tim Tebow.

They probably would have. At least to shake it up and not make it seem that the starting gig was a birth right. Sanchez has never felt like he was in a competition, aside from his rookie year.

 

Rex anointed him, stuck with him, and now will sink with him.

[T0mShane]

Yeah, every other coach would've started Kellen Clemens, 50 year old Mark Brunell, or Tim Tebow.

No other coach would paint himself into a corner with an emo 54% career passer.

[slats]

No other coach would paint himself into a corner with an emo 54% career passer.

During the course of Sanchez' third year, it became clear that the Jets needed to bring in competition for Sanchez, not before. Once they recognized that, Tannenbaum went out and traded for Tebow.

Tannenbaum got fired largely for his creative work at the QB position.

If Idzik had done better at finding a veteran QB, Sanchez might be off the team right now. Instead, the emo 54% career passer still looks like Rex' best option. The man hasn't had much front office help at the position, let's blame him.

[Scott Dierking]

During the course of Sanchez' third year, it became clear that the Jets needed to bring in competition for Sanchez, not before. Once they recognized that, Tannenbaum went out and traded for Tebow.

Tannenbaum got fired largely for his creative work at the QB position.

If Idzik had done better at finding a veteran QB, Sanchez might be off the team right now. Instead, the emo 54% career passer still looks like Rex' best option. The man hasn't had much front office help at the position, let's blame him.

So it wasn't important to have a better back-up for Sanchez year's one and two?

 

Rex's built in mascot in waiting (Brunell) was really adequate?

 

Sometimes fans get what they deserve if we are thinking that Sanchez did not need competition in his first 2 years. 

[JustInFudge]

So it wasn't important to have a better back-up for Sanchez year's one and two?

 

Rex's built in mascot in waiting (Brunell) was really adequate?

 

Sometimes fans get what they deserve if we are thinking that Sanchez did not need competition in his first 2 years. 

 

Considering they were a game from the SB in those seasons, no it wasnt very important.  Considering the only time they needed the back up, that player won the game, no it didnt seem very important. 

[JustInFudge]

No other coach would paint himself into a corner with an emo 54% career passer.

 

At the time, Coughlin did with Manning.  He wasnt doing much hotter from a completion standpoint until after the first SB.

[#27TheDominator]

Sanchez, a 4 year veteran throws 3 picks in a practice, Ryan calls it "disappointing"

 

Geno, a rookie throws 3 picks in a practice, Ryan calls it "brutal"

 

Teacher's pet.

 

You're certainly right.  Rex NEVER criticized Sanchez.

 

 

 

 

When Mark Sanchez took a time out with 1:24 left in the first half, Ryan was angry, already thinking about the Patriots next possession.

Ryan told NBC’s Michele TaFoya that the timeout was the “stupidest play in NFL history.”

http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2011/11/13/stupidest-play-in-football-history-helps-pats-take-lead/

[JustInFudge]

"stupidest play in NFL history" or "brutal"

 

 

hmmmmmmmm....one sounds more damning than the other...just cant figure out which one it is...

[Scott Dierking]

You're certainly right.  Rex NEVER criticized Sanchez.

 

 

http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2011/11/13/stupidest-play-in-football-history-helps-pats-take-lead/

And what do you reward the "stupidest play in NFL history" with........more playing time.

 

this stuff writes itself.

 

EDIT-Rex has also said-"He would never take Mark out of a game"

[slats]

"stupidest play in NFL history" or "brutal"

 

 

hmmmmmmmm....one sounds more damning than the other...just cant figure out which one it is...

 

There's been a disturbance in the echo chamber. 

[#27TheDominator]

And what do you reward the "stupidest play in NFL history" with........more playing time.

 

this stuff writes itself.

 

EDIT-Rex has also said-"He would never take Mark out of a game"

 

I don't know why anybody responds to you anymore.   I should just point and say "Agenda".

[JustInFudge]

I don't know why anybody responds to you anymore.   I should just point and say "Agenda".

 

Its funny how nobody remembers these articles but everyone remembers all the defending of Sanchez. 

 

http://espn.go.com/new-york/nfl/story/_/id/6863427/wanted-fight-coach-rex-ryan

[#27TheDominator]

Its funny how nobody remembers these articles but everyone remembers all the defending of Sanchez. 

 

http://espn.go.com/new-york/nfl/story/_/id/6863427/wanted-fight-coach-rex-ryan

 

Player's coach.

[FloridaJetsFan]

 

During the course of Sanchez' third year, it became clear that the Jets needed to bring in competition for Sanchez, not before. Once they recognized that, Tannenbaum went out and traded for Tebow.

Tannenbaum got fired largely for his creative work at the QB position.

If Idzik had done better at finding a veteran QB, Sanchez might be off the team right now. Instead, the emo 54% career passer still looks like Rex' best option. The man hasn't had much front office help at the position, let's blame him.

 

Couldn't one make an argument that Sanchez's poor play in years 1-3 were more representative of Schotty's complex and ineffective play calling, and that's why they brought Sparano in to simplify things, just to find out that Tony couldn't call more than 4 different plays - again hampering Sanchez's potential? This year, with a "real" OC, is the time to see if Sanchez really is as bad as we think he is. Hey - I'm trying to give our QB situation a little hope ...

[#27TheDominator]

 

 

Couldn't one make an argument that Sanchez's poor play in years 1-3 were more representative of Schotty's complex and ineffective play calling, and that's why they brought Sparano in to simplify things, just to find out that Tony couldn't call more than 4 different plays - again hampering Sanchez's potential? This year, with a "real" OC, is the time to see if Sanchez really is as bad as we think he is. Hey - I'm trying to give our QB situation a little hope ...

 

I don't agree with this, but I think this was the reasoning behind last season.  Years 1 and 2 were a success.  Year 3 they tried to open him up and he did not respond.  The idea with Sparano was presumably to simplify the offense and cut back on turnovers. That didn't work either.  If anything, he regressed.  It's possible that Mornhinweg will be a good influence, but IMO if he didn't suck he wouldn't have stepped back so badly last year. He sure doesn't get a pass.  Friday night didn't start off so great either.

[GenoandtheJets]

Mark Sanchez is a beyond awful quarterback that still makes rookie mistakes in his 5th season. He throws careless picks and overthrows the recievers way to much.

Here comes a 4-6 win season for the Jets. Mark Sanchez is probably going to get the starting nod through default. I have seen enough of this quarterback who desperatley needs to be benched.Well Rex Ryan is indeed getting his way through starting Mark Sanchez. #SameOldJets

[Scott Dierking]

I don't know why anybody responds to you anymore.   I should just point and say "Agenda".

If it smells like failure, and it looks like failure, and it acts like failure, it is probably failure.

 

If you want to call that an "agenda", so be it.

 

http://espn.go.com/new-york/nfl/story/_/id/7275113/new-york-jets-rex-ryan-said-never-envisions-taking-mark-brunell-game

 But the coach quickly added, "I don't see myself ever taking Mark out of a game."

 

Coaches pet

 

EDIT-More classic Ryan:Sometimes Ryan is too honest for his own good. Asked how his motivational ploy can work if Sanchez knows Brunell is no threat to his job, Ryan gave this candid response:

"I don't have any idea."

[cr726]

Mark Sanchez is a beyond awful quarterback that still makes rookie mistakes in his 5th season. He throws careless picks and overthrows the recievers way to much.

Here comes a 4-6 win season for the Jets. Mark Sanchez is probably going to get the starting nod through default. I have seen enough of this quarterback who desperatley needs to be benched.Well Rex Ryan is indeed getting his way through starting Mark Sanchez. #SameOldJets

The ultimate test for either QB could be "who can throw from their back" because if the Jets can't run the ball it's going to be a very very very very very ugly season.

[faba]

When the QB is sio inaccuate I find it hard to blame on the offensive coordinator

[#27TheDominator]

If it smells like failure, and it looks like failure, and it acts like failure, it is probably failure.

 

If you want to call that an "agenda", so be it.

 

http://espn.go.com/new-york/nfl/story/_/id/7275113/new-york-jets-rex-ryan-said-never-envisions-taking-mark-brunell-game

 But the coach quickly added, "I don't see myself ever taking Mark out of a game."

 

Coaches pet

 

^ Agenda

Rex is a big mouth.  He says crazy sh*t all the time.  That is established and admitted, but let's all kill him for sayiing he wouldn't bench Mark.  Never mind that he benched him at the end of last season for a sh*tty 7th rounder from Alabama.  Rex said he won't do it, he'll never do it. Let's kill him for calling  Smith's four (not three) INT practice brutal.  He only said that Sanchez commited the stupidest play in the NFL, so obviously Mark is the teacher's pet and Geno bears the brunt of Ryan's wrath.

[Scott Dierking]

^ Agenda

Rex is a big mouth.  He says crazy sh*t all the time.  That is established and admitted, but let's all kill him for sayiing he wouldn't bench Mark.  Never mind that he benched him at the end of last season for a sh*tty 7th rounder from Alabama.  Rex said he won't do it, he'll never do it. Let's kill him for calling  Smith's four (not three) INT practice brutal.  He only said that Sanchez commited the stupidest play in the NFL, so obviously Mark is the teacher's pet and Geno bears the brunt of Ryan's wrath.

I kill him for his actions-or inactions. He only replaced Sanchez, way after the horse was out of the barn. And then went right back to him. That will teach him.

 

yes Ryan says a lot of stupid things (which you guys seem to lap up up), but I am far more concerned how he treats this football team as his personal clique of haves and have nots. 

[JoeKlecko]

When has Rex ever called out any of his players by name? Or any other coach called out one of his players by name?

 

Effective managers don't publicly admonish their charges. You criticize behind closed doors, never to the media. 

 

I have to assume you're being sarcastic.

[JoeKlecko]

When someone has to make excuses for you, you probably need to be gone. 

 

People need to stop making excuses for Rex. He has made this Sanchez bed, he needs to lie in it.

 

I'm pretty sure that both Rex and his wife already have, maybe both at the same time.

[Klecko73isGod]

^ Agenda

Rex is a big mouth.  He says crazy sh*t all the time.  That is established and admitted, but let's all kill him for sayiing he wouldn't bench Mark.  Never mind that he benched him at the end of last season for a sh*tty 7th rounder from Alabama.  Rex said he won't do it, he'll never do it. Let's kill him for calling  Smith's four (not three) INT practice brutal.  He only said that Sanchez commited the stupidest play in the NFL, so obviously Mark is the teacher's pet and Geno bears the brunt of Ryan's wrath.

 

 

Never let the facts get in the way of a good argument. 

[Scott Dierking]

Never let the facts get in the way of a good argument. 

Never let your poms pons get in the way of seeing what is actually happening

[JoeKlecko]

When the QB is sio inaccuate I find it hard to blame on the offensive coordinator

 

Understandable, but isn't part of the OC's job to fix whatever makes Sanches so inaccurate?

[T0mShane]

Its funny how nobody remembers these articles but everyone remembers all the defending of Sanchez.

http://espn.go.com/new-york/nfl/story/_/id/6863427/wanted-fight-coach-rex-ryan

Yeah, when Rex was wheeling out the worst statistical quarterback in the league for two years in a row until he was afraid to subject him to the home crowd at the end of last year, it was plenty obvious that he had no vested interest in playing that guy. Idiot.

[T0mShane]

What was more pathetic? The Rex Apologia or The Herm Apologia?

[Klecko73isGod]

Its funny how nobody remembers these articles but everyone remembers all the defending of Sanchez. 

 

http://espn.go.com/new-york/nfl/story/_/id/6863427/wanted-fight-coach-rex-ryan

 

 

Nah man, why would anyone remember that. It just directly refutes their BS narrative. 

[Scott Dierking]

What was more pathetic? The Rex Apologia or The Herm Apologia?

I was a part of the Herm mess, and feel dirty.

 

Fool me once, shame on Herm, fool me twice shame on Rex.

[T0mShane]

Nah man, why would anyone remember that. It just directly refutes their BS narrative.

Which BS narrative? That an NFL head coach hung himself by playing a sh*tty quarterback for four years?

[JustInFudge]

Yeah, when Rex was wheeling out the worst statistical quarterback in the league for two years in a row until he was afraid to subject him to the home crowd at the end of last year, it was plenty obvious that he had no vested interest in playing that guy. Idiot.

 

Not sure what that has to do with me clearly proving wrong the "all Rex does is apologize for Sanchez" agenda...but cool story.

 

Which BS narrative? That an NFL head coach hung himself by playing a sh*tty quarterback for four years?

 

Yep!  He hung himself so badly that he's got an overall winning record, only had 1 losing season, has more playoff wins than BB and survived the ushering in of a new GM.  Damn he made that noose tight.  Sooo tight.  

[#27TheDominator]

Which BS narrative? That an NFL head coach hung himself by playing a sh*tty quarterback for four years?

 

First of all, he didn't hang sh*t the first two years.  The team did better than they would have under other coaches the first two years. This goes back to the same bullsh*t debate that you agenda driven hipsters can't fathom.  If Rex is the reason that we never had another QB, then you have a point, but in the opinion of guys like Slats and I, that is on the GM.  It got him fired.  Have the Jets had a QB better than Sanchez on the roster the past 4 years?  Probably not.  Have they cut any QBs better than Sanchez?  Maybe if you like Tebow, but cutting better QBs or keeping better QBs on the bench are the things you can kill him for.  I don't see them here.  Your point about accountability may have some merit, but it is far from a slam dunk, fire the coach mandate, especially under circumstances where Greg McElroy is your only other option.