I thought I had this figured out, now I am confused

[#27TheDominator]

I know.... but to hear the "Cutler will fix everything sign this beast" crowd talk, it's pretty clear that is their expectation.

 

I am almost in that camp.  I think this team is a mediocre offense from being truly competitive.  Cutler will not make them a juggernaut or an offensive machine, but he will give them a wild card chance and is a bona fide clear upgrade.  Most of the other guys we talk about will probably be legitimate upgrades and give us a shot at an at least average offense, but I don't think they are sure things for it like Cutler.  The problem is the compensation.  I'll take my chances with one of the others before I will pay Cutler, but I will keep my ears open if Cutler is available.

[#27TheDominator]

Shouldn't we first figure out the Jets future offensive philosophy and desired approach, and then get QB's that fit that model?

 

All I have heard in the last 5 years is either "ground and pound" or "we are looking to open things up"

 

 

Please find me all the quotes of Marty Mornhinweg saying "ground and pound"  Idzik seems to look for players, not system guys.  To the extent he looked for systems guys they were lower level FAs like Barnes and Goodson.

[Sperm Edwards]

Shouldn't we first figure out the Jets future offensive philosophy and desired approach, and then get QB's that fit that model?

 

All I have heard in the last 5 years is either "ground and pound" or "we are looking to open things up"

 

Can't we be both?  You can't be looking to open things up in any noticeable way if you don't first start out being ground and pound. Eh?

 

Seriously, though, I don't think there are enough talented QBs to go around that you can be so choosy as to which one fits better.  Get the best one we can get our hands on and build the offense around that QBs strengths.

 

Minimum criteria:

1. Ability to really throw the football accurately (not just in the general vicinity of a receiver, where the DB also is)

2. At least enough strength to throw non-lollipop deep out passes

3. The general on-field, mid-play awareness for the position

 

After that I'm not picky enough to choose which of the 3 the QB has a little more of than the rest.  Missing any of these 3 things and we're not winning.  Get someone with these traits and tailor the offense around this divine creature.

[Scott Dierking]

Please find me all the quotes of Marty Mornhinweg saying "ground and pound"  Idzik seems to look for players, not system guys.  To the extent he looked for systems guys they were lower level FAs like Barnes and Goodson.

Not sure what Marty's system is now(I know what he did in Philly, and that is not what he is doing here).

 

Not sure the Rex influence either.

[Scott Dierking]

Can't we be both?   

You definitely can, but you have to have the right mix of coaches that are adaptable.

[Matt39]

I am almost in that camp. I think this team is a mediocre offense from being truly competitive. Cutler will not make them a juggernaut or an offensive machine, but he will give them a wild card chance and is a bona fide clear upgrade. Most of the other guys we talk about will probably be legitimate upgrades and give us a shot at an at least average offense, but I don't think they are sure things for it like Cutler. The problem is the compensation. I'll take my chances with one of the others before I will pay Cutler, but I will keep my ears open if Cutler is available.

Well see I guess. Personally I think a guy like Cutler, Romo, Stafford(that tier) doesn't have any more than 7 wins with this group on offense.

[Integrity28]

I am almost in that camp.  I think this team is a mediocre offense from being truly competitive.  Cutler will not make them a juggernaut or an offensive machine, but he will give them a wild card chance and is a bona fide clear upgrade.  Most of the other guys we talk about will probably be legitimate upgrades and give us a shot at an at least average offense, but I don't think they are sure things for it like Cutler.  The problem is the compensation.  I'll take my chances with one of the others before I will pay Cutler, but I will keep my ears open if Cutler is available.

 

I agree with your logic here.

 

It comes down to the compensation and who they put around him. I don't see the point of our "rebuild" strategy if we hamstring ourselves with a QB like Cutler who can win, but clearly has limitations otherwise he wouldn't be looking at his 3rd team come 2014. I just don't trust the fact that two franchises will have now let him go.

 

Cutler without any other changes on this offense is a 7-8 win guy. 

[#27TheDominator]

Not sure what Marty's system is now(I know what he did in Philly, and that is not what he is doing here).

 

Not sure the Rex influence either.

 

I'm pretty sure the main influence is the QB.  That is why I like MM.  He is working with what he has.

 

Well see I guess. Personally I think a guy like Cutler, Romo, Stafford(that tier) doesn't have any more than 7 wins with this group on offense.

 

 

I agree with your logic here.

 

It comes down to the compensation and who they put around him. I don't see the point of our "rebuild" strategy if we hamstring ourselves with a QB like Cutler who can win, but clearly has limitations otherwise he wouldn't be looking at his 3rd team come 2014. I just don't trust the fact that two franchises will have now let him go.

 

Cutler without any other changes on this offense is a 7-8 win guy. 

 

LOL

 

You guys are funny.  Cutler is a 7-8 win guy?  Geno Smith with a ton of injuries on O is a 6 win guy with 3 games left.  OF COURSE Cutler is better than that.  I agree that we shouldn't hamstring ourselves money wise so that we can't add other talent, but any upgrade at QB should make this a winning team.

[Matt39]

I'm pretty sure the main influence is the QB. That is why I like MM. He is working with what he has.

LOL

You guys are funny. Cutler is a 7-8 win guy? Geno Smith with a ton of injuries on O is a 6 win guy with 3 games left. OF COURSE Cutler is better than that. I agree that we shouldn't hamstring ourselves money wise so that we can't add other talent, but any upgrade at QB should make this a winning team.

Who would we have beaten with Cutler? Outside the Pats week 2...I don't see anywhere else.

And the season isn't over anyways. Cutlers currently being outplayed by a journeyman with way more talent to work with than he'd have here.

Cutler would have walked off he field weeks ago throwing to Stephen Hill.

[#27TheDominator]

Who would we have beaten with Cutler? Outside the Pats week 2...I don't see anywhere else.

And the season isn't over anyways. Cutlers currently being outplayed by a journeyman with way more talent to work with than he'd have here.

Cutler would have walked off he field weeks ago throwing to Stephen Hill.

 

Not liking Cutler is fair enough.  OTOH just because games were not close, we were not out of them with moderate QB play.  The Bengals and Titans blew them away, but games like the Dolphins, Ravens and Steelers were there and the team eventually folded because they had no hope of moving the ball.  That wears on a team.  The kid has been beyond horrible in most of those games.

[Integrity28]

 

LOL

 

You guys are funny.  Cutler is a 7-8 win guy?  Geno Smith with a ton of injuries on O is a 6 win guy with 3 games left.  OF COURSE Cutler is better than that.  I agree that we shouldn't hamstring ourselves money wise so that we can't add other talent, but any upgrade at QB should make this a winning team.

 

We've had a couple lucky wins this year, you can't make the case that if you swap Cutler out for Geno this year, you can just add X more wins.

 

I'm saying IN GENERAL the best Cutler is going to get you with this rag-tag bunch of street FA's on offense is about .500, maybe a game over with some luck and an improved secondary to get some help from the D... but ultimately, this isn't a championship team missing a QB... this team needs improvement across the board. 

 

I don't think I'm stating anything controversial here. If you can't see that you must be a big dumb faced monkey.

[#27TheDominator]

We've had a couple lucky wins this year, you can't make the case that if you swap Cutler out for Geno this year, you can just add X more wins.

 

I'm saying IN GENERAL the best Cutler is going to get you with this rag-tag bunch of street FA's on offense is about .500, maybe a game over with some luck and an improved secondary to get some help from the D... but ultimately, this isn't a championship team missing a QB... this team needs improvement across the board. 

 

I don't think I'm stating anything controversial here. If you can't see that you must be a big dumb faced monkey.

 

I repeat, they are practically at .500 now with horrific QB play.  If you guys don't think QB play is that important then maybe you should all shut the **** up.

[Scott Dierking]

I repeat, they are practically at .500 now with horrific QB play.  If you guys don't think QB play is that important then maybe you should all shut the **** up.

It's Dom's world and we are just playing in it.

[neckdemon]

Everything you bring up is fine and good, but you're arguing with yourself. Their TD numbers are irrelevant as they do not negate the vast number of interceptions that they threw, which was the premise of my post. Rookie QBs make mistakes and whether you want to admit it or not, there was 25+ times that year where Peyton made a poor decision, unless you're going to stick to only Geno makes poor decisions and the other guys just "bad-lucked" their way into those interceptions.  

 

Is it any surprise that Geno completed 64% of his passes and had his best game in a month once he finally had Kerley, Holmes and Winslow on the field together for the first time since week 4 or 5? No. He may never turn out to be our franchise's QB, but you need to evaluate him once the season is over and not just for a rough three game stretch where he was throwing to a bunch of walk-ons and should-be-practice-squad players.

 

 

no not surprised. oakland is a terrible team, with a bad defense. no i never said the ybad lucked their way into it. but at least peyton balanced out his poor decisions by scoring a hell of alotmore. geno not only makes horrendous decisions, he can barely lead a scoring drive unless he's  playing against other scrubs. and as many poor decisions peyton may have made at least he actually improved alot byt the second half of the season. geno has gotten worse and has shown absolutely no improvement. geno hasn't only had a rough 3 game stretch. it was 7 or 8 games and even in his better games he still looks like sh*t too often.

[whodeawhodat]

^ do you think that he got worse when he lost most of his starting weapons?  Starting weapons that had US ranked as one of the worst teams coming into this year.  3 games left.  This next one is going to have Star Letuiuiueue sh!tting in Winters mouth for much of the afternoon.  MM better have some help for that kid or Geno is not making it through the game...