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Would have liked far more development on the actual shooting, why wasn't more emphasis put on why Farrell was spared by this seemingly psychotic killer who is obviously into some deep pschological sh*t. I also thought more could have been put into Frank's guy getting killed, or at least it could have been done much better as it was a pretty interesting development. 

 

The introduction to even more sleazy characters and more potential sub-plots just seemed unnecessary for now. I mean we get that the Mayor isn't the cleanest guy in the city, but it's cartoonish at this point. That whole scene seemed so bizarre in the context of what's going on. The wide context may pay off huge but it's a lot to take in, especially as a lot of the major characters still feel underdeveloped. The gay dude in particular, who's just becoming annoying at the minute but you feel there's something interesting there. I can't get into McAdams' character at all. I'm only invested in Vaughn and Farrell and even that's generally from previous episodes.  

 

The actual scenes were also pretty poorly done. I wasn't a fan of the spontaneous Fight Club or the amateurish police chase. They were bad enough to ensure this isn't just Wire Season One/Two stuff where you only appreciate it how utterly brilliant it is when it comes together. It was shoddy at best.

 

I'm willing to accept that the story is a completely different format to season one and I don't like comparing the two, but it's sad to think that at this point last season we had the "Monster at the end" of the dream speech, which pretty much meant you couldn't not watch the next episode. As TS pointed out there's just not a huge amount to be invested in and I only know I'm going to watch next week I have nothing else to do on Monday nights. 

 

 

 

I think the entire Mayor/bureaucrat group is meant to be taken as metaphor, the same as in Sin City or something. No way can that whole scene be taken straight. Even the paintings in the Mayor's house were cartoonishly evil looking. I do appreciate the slaps at George Bush Jr, though. I believe that picture (of GWB and the Mayor) has appeared in each episode.  

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I do not think it is meant to be. 

 

IMHO Birdman is more of an ancillary character.  I do not think this season is going to be based around the capture of him/her or a killer.

 

I go back to what Farrell asked of McAdams at the end of E2, something to the effect of why would you select them to lead an investigation?  McAdams who has some deep rooted issues with men and/or sexual deviation..plus she does not exactly hide it.  Farrell a cop on the take that everyone thinks killed his wife's rapist.  Klitsch who is under investigation for getting a BJ from a starlet and did some shady sh*t as a military guy and/or contractor.  Plus, that 4th guy who is shady as fark.  Not exactly a dream team you would want to lead an investigation unless you wanted it to be immediately questionable after coming out.  Or you go the "A few good men" route and you want them to go in a direction that collection of misfits will likely go down.  Farrell discovering some righteousness might be what brings it off the rails.

 

Cui bono?  Vinci vs. State of California seems a little too simplistic.  The Russian mob guy?  A power play from Vaughn's #2?  

 

This is my take on it is well. This season is meant to be more of a critique of LA than anything else.

 

Farrell alluded to the shells being cop shells that he got hit with.

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Would have liked far more development on the actual shooting, why wasn't more emphasis put on why Farrell was spared by this seemingly psychotic killer who is obviously into some deep pschological sh*t. I also thought more could have been put into Frank's guy getting killed, or at least it could have been done much better as it was a pretty interesting development. 

 

The introduction to even more sleazy characters and more potential sub-plots just seemed unnecessary for now. I mean we get that the Mayor isn't the cleanest guy in the city, but it's cartoonish at this point. That whole scene seemed so bizarre in the context of what's going on. The wide context may pay off huge but it's a lot to take in, especially as a lot of the major characters still feel underdeveloped. The gay dude in particular, who's just becoming annoying at the minute but you feel there's something interesting there. I can't get into McAdams' character at all. I'm only invested in Vaughn and Farrell and even that's generally from previous episodes.  

 

The actual scenes were also pretty poorly done. I wasn't a fan of the spontaneous Fight Club or the amateurish police chase. They were bad enough to ensure this isn't just Wire Season One/Two stuff where you only appreciate it how utterly brilliant it is when it comes together. It was shoddy at best.

 

I'm willing to accept that the story is a completely different format to season one and I don't like comparing the two, but it's sad to think that at this point last season we had the "Monster at the end" of the dream speech, which pretty much meant you couldn't not watch the next episode. As TS pointed out there's just not a huge amount to be invested in and I only know I'm going to watch next week I have nothing else to do on Monday nights. 

 

 

Why Farrell was shot and spared was pretty obvious IMO.  In fact Farrell even montioned they were "bullets like cops use in a riot".  By shooting Farrell in that house it allows the Vinci PD to get in there first and "clean the scene" before McAdams and her honest team get in there.  But keeping Farrell's character alive keeps a crooked **** up cop in on the investigation going forward.

 

I agree on the portrayal of the Mayor.  Nothing to argue there it's way over the top.

 

I disagree on McAdams, I actually feel more that way with Vaughn.  I can't buy him at all.  That fight scene was plain stupid.  20 guys standing around, but yeah let's punch this out and have everyone stand by and watch while he pulls teeth out with a pair of pliers?  Pliers that were ever so conveniently provided, as if he knew fat dude with gold teeth would be the lead dissent and that they'd fight and that he would pull his teeth out?  COMMMONNNNN!!!!

 

All in all the show is entertaining, but suffering the fate of comparisons with Woody and Matthew's stellar performance last season. 

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Why Farrell was shot and spared was pretty obvious IMO.  In fact Farrell even montioned they were "bullets like cops use in a riot".  By shooting Farrell in that house it allows the Vinci PD to get in there first and "clean the scene" before McAdams and her honest team get in there.  But keeping Farrell's character alive keeps a crooked **** up cop in on the investigation going forward.

 

I agree on the portrayal of the Mayor.  Nothing to argue there it's way over the top.

 

I disagree on McAdams, I actually feel more that way with Vaughn.  I can't buy him at all.  That fight scene was plain stupid.  20 guys standing around, but yeah let's punch this out and have everyone stand by and watch while he pulls teeth out with a pair of pliers?  Pliers that were ever so conveniently provided, as if he knew fat dude with gold teeth would be the lead dissent and that they'd fight and that he would pull his teeth out?  COMMMONNNNN!!!!

 

All in all the show is entertaining, but suffering the fate of comparisons with Woody and Matthew's stellar performance last season. 

 

Great point.  And his LT would fit the bill.

 

Only actor I think that is not delivering is Kitsch.  Kind of has Ryan Reynolds in him were he is average at best and if not for looks would not even sniff Hollywood.

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Great point.  And his LT would fit the bill.

 

Only actor I think that is not delivering is Kitsch.  Kind of has Ryan Reynolds in him were he is average at best and if not for looks would not even sniff Hollywood.

 

DEADPOOL IS A SAINT SIR, YOU WATCH YOUR MOUTH.

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DEADPOOL IS A SAINT SIR, YOU WATCH YOUR MOUTH.

 

I have no problem with Deadpool.  And I do not really hate Ryan Reynolds.  I liked him Safe House...playing along side Denzel. 

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Had an interesting discussion about this yesterday, consensus is that this show is breaking new ground in one respect:

 

I don't think we've ever had a show that the majority of people genuinely disliked, but keep watching like this. This is normally something reserved for movies (just wait until BvS drops), but for television it's quite different. This is about 8 hours of a person's life. Not to mention the reorganizing it takes in committing every Sunday night for two months to making sure you see each episode when it premiers, (especially with the on-demand option being off the table in 2015, because the Internet will definitely spoil it for you if you go that route).  One has the option to change the program, but they do not, despite the fact that they know they haven't enjoyed the previous episodes, are not enjoying the current one, and probably won't be enjoying the coming episodes.

 

This is not an instance like Game of Thrones, Dexter, or The Sopranos, where there were down seasons but the viewer feels the need to keep watching for the sake of keeping up with the story. There can't be any feeling of that need because there is no continuity. People have the option to stop watching and they know they will not have missed anything should they pick it back up for Season 3, but they don't.

 

So what we essentially have is 8 hours of film, which people hate but still watch, and there doesn't appear to be any reason for this other than the masses not wanting to miss out on being let down, and feeling compelled to share their complaints with other dissatisfied viewers on the Internet on Monday. And while Kevin Smith got at this in Jay and Silent Bob, the fact that this is happening with TV now is pretty impressive.

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Had an interesting discussion about this yesterday, consensus is that this show is breaking new ground in one respect:

 

I don't think we've ever had a show that the majority of people genuinely disliked, but keep watching like this. This is normally something reserved for movies (just wait until BvS drops), but for television it's quite different. This is about 8 hours of a person's life. Not to mention the reorganizing it takes in committing every Sunday night for two months to making sure you see each episode when it premiers, (especially with the on-demand option being off the table in 2015, because the Internet will definitely spoil it for you if you go that route).  One has the option to change the program, but they do not, despite the fact that they know they haven't enjoyed the previous episodes, are not enjoying the current one, and probably won't be enjoying the coming episodes.

 

This is not an instance like Game of Thrones, Dexter, or The Sopranos, where there were down seasons but the viewer feels the need to keep watching for the sake of keeping up with the story. There can't be any feeling of that need because there is no continuity. People have the option to stop watching and they know they will not have missed anything should they pick it back up for Season 3, but they don't.

 

So what we essentially have is 8 hours of film, which people hate but still watch, and there doesn't appear to be any reason for this other than the masses not wanting to miss out, and feeling compelled to share their complaints with other dissatisfied viewers on the Internet on Monday. And while Kevin Smith got at this in Jay and Silent Bob, the fact that this is happening with TV now is pretty impressive.

 

The Walking Dead.

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Had an interesting discussion about this yesterday, consensus is that this show is breaking new ground in one respect:

 

I don't think we've ever had a show that the majority of people genuinely disliked, but keep watching like this. This is normally something reserved for movies (just wait until BvS drops), but for television it's quite different. This is about 8 hours of a person's life. Not to mention the reorganizing it takes in committing every Sunday night for two months to making sure you see each episode when it premiers, (especially with the on-demand option being off the table in 2015, because the Internet will definitely spoil it for you if you go that route).  One has the option to change the program, but they do not, despite the fact that they know they haven't enjoyed the previous episodes, are not enjoying the current one, and probably won't be enjoying the coming episodes.

 

This is not an instance like Game of Thrones, Dexter, or The Sopranos, where there were down seasons but the viewer feels the need to keep watching for the sake of keeping up with the story. There can't be any feeling of that need because there is no continuity. People have the option to stop watching and they know they will not have missed anything should they pick it back up for Season 3, but they don't.

 

So what we essentially have is 8 hours of film, which people hate but still watch, and there doesn't appear to be any reason for this other than the masses not wanting to miss out on being let down, and feeling compelled to share their complaints with other dissatisfied viewers on the Internet on Monday. And while Kevin Smith got at this in Jay and Silent Bob, the fact that this is happening with TV now is pretty impressive.

 

If you're force watching a TV show which you hate, you're legitimately losing at life.

 

I'm enjoying this second season of TD. There are things about it that I have an issue with, but then I also have/had issues with particular scenes in Mad Men, GoT, Breaking Bad, and the Wire. I still enjoyed every single one of those shows and looked forward to each episode. 

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If you're force watching a TV show which you hate, you're legitimately losing at life.

 

I'm enjoying this second season of TD. There are things about it that I have an issue with, but then I also have/had issues with particular scenes in Mad Men, GoT, Breaking Bad, and the Wire. I still enjoyed every single one of those shows and looked forward to each episode. 

 

I can actually get force watching The Walking Dead, just like people did with Dexter. You invest so much time into the first 70% of it or so, and you just need to see how it ends. I get that. I don't think I enjoyed more than 3-4 episodes of Game of Thrones this season, (even though Hardhome is definitely one of the 2-3 best episodes of the series), and I don't have a lot of hope for it going forward now for a bevy of reasons, but I need to see what happens because I have to see how they handle Tyrion and the Whitewalkers and everything else. You get invested in characters over time.

 

But this. This is truly unique. There is nothing to be invested in with True Detective. Look at this thread and the majority of reviews online; sans Farrell, people do not like the characters, the actors, AND the story. They are not invested in any of them and still tune in and put time into analyzing the whole thing. Literally for no reason other than mapping out future complaints. Truly a new precedent here.

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 I've been hate watching TWD for at least 3 years lol

 

I gave up into season 4. I thought the first 3 seasons were so great; that several episode arc they did on the return of The Governor was some of the best stuff I've ever seen. But I just stopped caring. No idea why. Unless it's something that Alex Garland writes, the anthropological consequences of the zombie apocalypse bore me at this point.

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I can actually get force watching The Walking Dead, just like people did with Dexter. You invest so much time into the first 70% of it or so, and you just need to see how it ends. I get that. I don't think I enjoyed more than 3-4 episodes of Game of Thrones this season, (even though Hardhome is definitely one of the 2-3 best episodes of the series), and I don't have a lot of hope for it going forward now for a bevy of reasons, but I need to see what happens because I have to see how they handle Tyrion and the Whitewalkers and everything else. You get invested in characters over time.

 

But this. This is truly unique. There is nothing to be invested in with True Detective. Look at this thread and the majority of reviews online; sans Farrell, people do not like the characters, the actors, AND the story. They are not invested in any of them and still tune in and put time into analyzing the whole thing. Literally for no reason other than mapping out future complaints. Truly a new precedent here.

Most of those people loved season 1 (I didn't) so they aren't giving up yet after 3 episodes, but they soon may. It's early. Plus this show is unique in that it's new actors, new characters, new story. They may even watch season 3 after hating all of season 2 because the series will be starting over again.

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Most of those people loved season 1 (I didn't) so they aren't giving up yet after 3 episodes, but they soon may. It's early. Plus this show is unique in that it's new actors, new characters, new story. They may even watch season 3 after hating all of season 2 because the series will be starting over again.

 

That's my point though. Everyone knows they can stop now and do something better with their Sunday nights. They know they can do this and start watching again next year and they will have missed nothing, yet there they are, 2-3 million per week tuning in (probably more considering the ratings don't factor in streaming). Sure, it's still early, but it's not like anyone that is dissatisfied with the show is expecting it to pull a 180.

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Had an interesting discussion about this yesterday, consensus is that this show is breaking new ground in one respect:

 

I don't think we've ever had a show that the majority of people genuinely disliked, but keep watching like this. This is normally something reserved for movies (just wait until BvS drops), but for television it's quite different. This is about 8 hours of a person's life. Not to mention the reorganizing it takes in committing every Sunday night for two months to making sure you see each episode when it premiers, (especially with the on-demand option being off the table in 2015, because the Internet will definitely spoil it for you if you go that route).  One has the option to change the program, but they do not, despite the fact that they know they haven't enjoyed the previous episodes, are not enjoying the current one, and probably won't be enjoying the coming episodes.

 

This is not an instance like Game of Thrones, Dexter, or The Sopranos, where there were down seasons but the viewer feels the need to keep watching for the sake of keeping up with the story. There can't be any feeling of that need because there is no continuity. People have the option to stop watching and they know they will not have missed anything should they pick it back up for Season 3, but they don't.

 

So what we essentially have is 8 hours of film, which people hate but still watch, and there doesn't appear to be any reason for this other than the masses not wanting to miss out on being let down, and feeling compelled to share their complaints with other dissatisfied viewers on the Internet on Monday. And while Kevin Smith got at this in Jay and Silent Bob, the fact that this is happening with TV now is pretty impressive.

 

 

1. It's a sequel, and people liked the first one, so they'll ride this out like they did with Return of the Jedi. Though obviously not a linear story being told from Season One to S2, it's still the same creative team, it has a similar aesthetic, and it has all of the same nihilistic mumblecore pathos that we all liked. In no way, shape, or form is it its own entity. It's Jeremy Giambi.

 

2. I don't know that people hate it or think it's a bad show in and of itself. I think most people are just annoyed that it's not as good (yet)  as S1, but it's still better than 98% of what's on TV right now. Hannibal is awful TV. The Following is wretched. Alas, people watch that trash. TD is a nice package and ultimately enjoyable as an actor's showcase with a lot of moody light effects. The packaging is glorious.  

 

3. It's a dead-as-**** period on television for the non-moron set, so it's competing only against itself for that viewer. No one is going into work the next day to talk about Real Housewives.

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1. It's a sequel, and people liked the first one, so they'll ride this out like they did with Return of the Jedi. Though obviously not a linear story being told from Season One to S2, it's still the same creative team, it has a similar aesthetic, and it has all of the same nihilistic mumblecore pathos that we all liked. In no way, shape, or form is it its own entity. It's Jeremy Giambi.

 

2. I don't know that people hate it or think it's a bad show in and of itself. I think most people are just annoyed that it's not as good (yet)  as S1, but it's still better than 98% of what's on TV right now. Hannibal is awful TV. The Following is wretched. Alas, people watch that trash. TD is a nice package and ultimately enjoyable as an actor's showcase with a lot of moody light effects. The packaging is glorious.  

 

3. It's a dead-as-**** period on television for the non-moron set, so it's competing only against itself for that viewer. No one is going into work the next day to talk about Real Housewives.

 

I'm not sure what your game is here but if you ever rip Jedi again I will punch you in the throat and stomach.

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Had an interesting discussion about this yesterday, consensus is that this show is breaking new ground in one respect:

I don't think we've ever had a show that the majority of people genuinely disliked, but keep watching like this. This is normally something reserved for movies (just wait until BvS drops), but for television it's quite different. This is about 8 hours of a person's life. Not to mention the reorganizing it takes in committing every Sunday night for two months to making sure you see each episode when it premiers, (especially with the on-demand option being off the table in 2015, because the Internet will definitely spoil it for you if you go that route). One has the option to change the program, but they do not, despite the fact that they know they haven't enjoyed the previous episodes, are not enjoying the current one, and probably won't be enjoying the coming episodes.

This is not an instance like Game of Thrones, Dexter, or The Sopranos, where there were down seasons but the viewer feels the need to keep watching for the sake of keeping up with the story. There can't be any feeling of that need because there is no continuity. People have the option to stop watching and they know they will not have missed anything should they pick it back up for Season 3, but they don't.

So what we essentially have is 8 hours of film, which people hate but still watch, and there doesn't appear to be any reason for this other than the masses not wanting to miss out on being let down, and feeling compelled to share their complaints with other dissatisfied viewers on the Internet on Monday. And while Kevin Smith got at this in Jay and Silent Bob, the fact that this is happening with TV now is pretty impressive.

I've been watching on Demand actually. I've been purposely staying away from this thread until we caught up last night. I seemed to have been able to not catch any spoilers in my regular life. I don't hear people talking about this show unsolicited. I guess I take the other viewpoint, I really don't think anyone in the mainstream cares except people like us who are S1 groupies making time to discuss this show. Now, compare this against Sopranos, or something like American Idol back in the day, or Seinfeld, and I think you have a perspective as to how little this show is really on people's minds right now. Watch someone bring this up to me today though lol.
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IMO, the major problem with this season's story is that nobody really cares who the killer is or if they even catch him, so the entire investment of the viewer hinges on how much you care about what the characters are doing outside of the central plot arc. In S1, even when it lagged and McConaughey/Harrelson started getting a little repetitive, you still wanted to find out who the psycho serial killer was, so it kept your attention. This season, who cares if they catch the guy who killed the perv creep mobbed-up comptroller?

As far as McAdams, if she's going to be one-note, and that note is PMSy prom queen, then it's going to get progressively tougher to watch her opposite Farrell. Hers was the most dubious casting choice, because she's essentially a Neutrogena model that acts in her spare time.

Interesting point about the plot of finding the killer taking a backseat to character development, dialogue etc

I can't put my finger on quite what I'm looking to say, but basically, it's a good show not a great show. It feels like an overproduced pseudo Art Deco. From a design perspective, it's like they purposely took a sh*tty LA suburb, pumped it full of glamorous LA talent, took extraordinary pains to grunge down those glamorous people, and then used the best technology and all that money could buy to produce it. To make an analogy, it's like when Kanye West puts on a performance in Brooklyn, but the 1910 era warehouse he's performing is outfitted by Crate and Barrell, the audience is all from Greenwich, and they're all wearing Urban Outfitters.This show had a touch more authenticity when the camera was doing single shot scenes running around trailer parks, chasing a couple of average guys who made it big on talent, not the other way around. It's totally unfair but wo words that come to mind when I watch this show are "wedding crashers."

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As a standalone show I think it has one issue:

 

Of the 4 main characters, everyone in the audience has an issue with at least one of them.  Go back through this thread, plenty of comments that McAdams is either great or terrible, plenty of comments Vaughn is either great or terrible, Kitsch is great or terrible.  Personally I think Vaughn is way out of his league, and Kitsch bores me to death though I have a feeling his opportunity to shine is coming.  His character is far more effed up than they have completely led on so far.  JMO.  But anyway besides the fact of following up epic performances from Woody and Matthew, the fact is almost every character cast for the show is way out of their usual comfort zone.  I think that's part of the draw as well as the disdain.

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Interesting point about the plot of finding the killer taking a backseat to character development, dialogue etc

I can't put my finger on quite what I'm looking to say, but basically, it's a good show not a great show. It feels like an overproduced pseudo Art Deco. From a design perspective, it's like they purposely took a sh*tty LA suburb, pumped it full of glamorous LA talent, took extraordinary pains to grunge down those glamorous people, and then used the best technology and all that money could buy to produce it. To make an analogy, it's like when Kanye West puts on a performance in Brooklyn, but the 1910 era warehouse he's performing is outfitted by Crate and Barrell, the audience is all from Greenwich, and they're all wearing Urban Outfitters.This show had a touch more authenticity when the camera was doing single shot scenes running around trailer parks, chasing a couple of average guys who made it big on talent, not the other way around. It's totally unfair but wo words that come to mind when I watch this show are "wedding crashers."

 

Welcome to the good life. 

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As a standalone show I think it has one issue:

 

Of the 4 main characters, everyone in the audience has an issue with at least one of them.  Go back through this thread, plenty of comments that McAdams is either great or terrible, plenty of comments Vaughn is either great or terrible, Kitsch is great or terrible.  Personally I think Vaughn is way out of his league, and Kitsch bores me to death though I have a feeling his opportunity to shine is coming.  His character is far more effed up than they have completely led on so far.  JMO.  But anyway besides the fact of following up epic performances from Woody and Matthew, the fact is almost every character cast for the show is way out of their usual comfort zone.  I think that's part of the draw as well as the disdain.

 

I about lost my $hit when he said apoplectic. 

 

His use of big words in the show is the one knock I have for his character.  It might be intentional dialogue to show a flaw in his character, but it is more annoying than developing.

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I about lost my $hit when he said apoplectic. 

 

His use of big words in the show is the one knock I have for his character.  It might be intentional dialogue to show a flaw in his character, but it is more annoying than developing.

 

Oh man that was so bad and sooo forced.  I buy McAdams role.  She's giving it all she's got and frankly I know many hot chicks that are just so self destructive that they look just like her, so I can get past that aspect.  But my god Vaughn..... 

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As a standalone show I think it has one issue:

Of the 4 main characters, everyone in the audience has an issue with at least one of them. Go back through this thread, plenty of comments that McAdams is either great or terrible, plenty of comments Vaughn is either great or terrible, Kitsch is great or terrible. Personally I think Vaughn is way out of his league, and Kitsch bores me to death though I have a feeling his opportunity to shine is coming. His character is far more effed up than they have completely led on so far. JMO. But anyway besides the fact of following up epic performances from Woody and Matthew, the fact is almost every character cast for the show is way out of their usual comfort zone. I think that's part of the draw as well as the disdain.

Farrell and Vaughn are the stars of the show and McAdams and Kitsch are supporting characters. I don't think Vaughn's out of his league I think it's refreshing seeing him play a badass rather than the slapstick comedy schlub role he's been doing over and over last 10 years.

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OK this is a make or break episode…midpoint season one it was obvious the show was destined for greatness….I'm holding out hope but Its starting to feel like Clerks 2.

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I've said all I need about this show, it's an incoherent mess, yadda yadda yadda. I won't continue to repeat all the reasons why I think show is flawed, tonight's episode didn't change that view. With that said, the raid/shootout was pretty dope.

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