eboozer Posted March 18, 2014 Share Posted March 18, 2014 I posted this in another thread. However, because I'm awesome, I decided to make it into a thread on its own. Every successful team can pick out a few key signings. Which is why Decker and Giacommini are nothing to spit at. Those are good signings. So was the trade for Chris Ivory. But you don't just say "We have needs/wants at 8 positions. We'll fill those with 6 or 7 free agents and call it a day" like the Browns or Raiders are doing. They're trying to win with other people's players because they failed so miserably at drafting their own talent. Look at the Seahawks starters and you tell me if it looks like the type of roster Idzik is looking to build: [NOTE: For our purposes, I am assuming Sidney Rice is headed elsewhere. If he doesn't, he takes Lockette's spot on the depth chart] QB: Russell Wilson (3rd round pick) RB: Marshawn Lynch (trade: 2011 4th round pick, 2012 conditional pick) WR: Doug Baldwin (UDFA) WR: Percy Harvin (trade: 1st and 7th rounder) WR: Ricardo Lockette (UDFA) TE: Zach Miller (Signed 2011 to 5-year deal) LT: Russell Okung (Top 10 pick) LG: James Carpenter (1st rounder) C: Max Unger (2nd rounder) RG: JR Sweezy (7th rounder) RT: Michael Bowie (7th rounder) LDE: Michael Bennett (UDFA) DT: Brandon Mebane (3rd rounder) DT: Tony McDaniel (UDFA, bounced between Jaguars and Dolphins, signed in 2013) RDE: Cliff Avrill (Signed as RFA in 2011) OLB: Malcolm Smith (7th rounder) MLB: Bobby Wagner (2nd rounder) OLB: Bruce Irvin (1st rounder) CB: Richard Sherman (5th rounder) CB: Byron Maxwell (6th rounder) FS: Earl Thomas (1st rounder) SS: Kam Chancellor (5th rounder) Of all Seattle's starters on offense, only 1, Zach Miller, was a free agent signing. Much like the Jets traded a 4th rounder for Chris Ivory, the Seahawks did the same to get Marshawn Lynch. Harvin was a pickup via trade as well, but his health has prevented him from making any impact on a team that won the Super Bowl largely without him. Of their starters on defense, only one, Cliff Avrill, was a significant free agent signing. McDaniel was a scrap-heap pickup that worked out. The rest they found via the draft. The Seahawks entire back 7 was found via the draft. Their entire offensive line was drafted. That's impressive stuff. You cannot even come close to arguing that this Seattle roster depended on free agents. They depend on the draft. Period. If the Seahawks are the model we're looking to duplicate, Idzik is right on target so far. He's accumulating talent via the draft, filling a few needs where he can via free agency. And he's also, when the timing is right, making trades with those draft picks. I imagine that he might make a deal or 2 with some of our 12 draft picks when the 2014 draft rolls around, too. This is how you build a winner. The Seahawks have had 4 consecutive very good drafts. They won at the perfect time, because many of their star players are being lost to FA this yr. and next yr. have several more becoming FA. They can't keep them all... let's see how they do re-supplying those positions. 2015 free agents Cliff Avril Earl Thomas Jeron Johnson James Carpenter Anthony McCoy Tarvaris Jackson Heath Farwell Lemuel Jeanpierre Michael Robinson Clint Gresham Travis Beckum Michael Morgan KJ Wright D'Anthony Smith Taylor Price Richard Sherman Byron Maxwell Malcolm Smith We have very little, young quality talent, as the team now stands Apart from the DL Big three, Ivory & Kerley. We have several questionable talents that could play a big role moving forward with Geno, Milliner, D.Davis, Allen and Winters. We also have Harris, Mangold and D'Brick aging quickly. We need 3 consecutive quality drafts in 2014; 2015; 2016 to get to Seattle/ Denver/ SF level of talent if you're mostly building through the Draft. I would have preferred we added some high end FA talent @ CB, OL. Added some quality at Safety, WR (achieved) and TE and vet. QB. Go into the draft with 4 picks in the 1st 5 rounds and kill it. We'd have young talent, established solid veteran players and being competitive for an AFC title/wild card. Seems like a lost season in 2014 IMO Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gastineau Lives Posted March 18, 2014 Share Posted March 18, 2014 I honestly thought your post was tongue-in-cheek, hence the rolling laughter emotive. I was not calling you an idiot and am sorry for offending you. No, I understand, I worded it weird and you usually don't see people honestly asking for others opinions like that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GREENBEAN Posted March 18, 2014 Share Posted March 18, 2014 Beautifully done Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Maxman Posted March 18, 2014 Share Posted March 18, 2014 I posted this in another thread. However, because I'm awesome, I decided to make it into a thread on its own. Every successful team can pick out a few key signings. Which is why Decker and Giacommini are nothing to spit at. Those are good signings. So was the trade for Chris Ivory. But you don't just say "We have needs/wants at 8 positions. We'll fill those with 6 or 7 free agents and call it a day" like the Browns or Raiders are doing. They're trying to win with other people's players because they failed so miserably at drafting their own talent. Look at the Seahawks starters and you tell me if it looks like the type of roster Idzik is looking to build: [NOTE: For our purposes, I am assuming Sidney Rice is headed elsewhere. If he doesn't, he takes Lockette's spot on the depth chart] QB: Russell Wilson (3rd round pick) RB: Marshawn Lynch (trade: 2011 4th round pick, 2012 conditional pick) WR: Doug Baldwin (UDFA) WR: Percy Harvin (trade: 1st and 7th rounder) WR: Ricardo Lockette (UDFA) TE: Zach Miller (Signed 2011 to 5-year deal) LT: Russell Okung (Top 10 pick) LG: James Carpenter (1st rounder) C: Max Unger (2nd rounder) RG: JR Sweezy (7th rounder) RT: Michael Bowie (7th rounder) LDE: Michael Bennett (UDFA) DT: Brandon Mebane (3rd rounder) DT: Tony McDaniel (UDFA, bounced between Jaguars and Dolphins, signed in 2013) RDE: Cliff Avrill (Signed as RFA in 2011) OLB: Malcolm Smith (7th rounder) MLB: Bobby Wagner (2nd rounder) OLB: Bruce Irvin (1st rounder) CB: Richard Sherman (5th rounder) CB: Byron Maxwell (6th rounder) FS: Earl Thomas (1st rounder) SS: Kam Chancellor (5th rounder) Of all Seattle's starters on offense, only 1, Zach Miller, was a free agent signing. Much like the Jets traded a 4th rounder for Chris Ivory, the Seahawks did the same to get Marshawn Lynch. Harvin was a pickup via trade as well, but his health has prevented him from making any impact on a team that won the Super Bowl largely without him. Of their starters on defense, only one, Cliff Avrill, was a significant free agent signing. McDaniel was a scrap-heap pickup that worked out. The rest they found via the draft. The Seahawks entire back 7 was found via the draft. Their entire offensive line was drafted. That's impressive stuff. You cannot even come close to arguing that this Seattle roster depended on free agents. They depend on the draft. Period. If the Seahawks are the model we're looking to duplicate, Idzik is right on target so far. He's accumulating talent via the draft, filling a few needs where he can via free agency. And he's also, when the timing is right, making trades with those draft picks. I imagine that he might make a deal or 2 with some of our 12 draft picks when the 2014 draft rolls around, too. This is how you build a winner. This blew up on Facebook and Twitter. You also made the front page of YES Network.com as well. Thanks. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Larz Posted March 18, 2014 Share Posted March 18, 2014 but that guy in my office is a giants fan and I told him a month ago the jets were gonna rule free agency and now I look like a tool damn you idzik !!!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Maxman Posted March 18, 2014 Share Posted March 18, 2014 Well, when you post something in earnest and someone calls you an idiot, it requires a response. Are you calling me an idiot? j\K. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gastineau Lives Posted March 18, 2014 Share Posted March 18, 2014 Draft incredibly well and win, got it. Make it happen, Idzy! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Villain The Foe Posted March 18, 2014 Share Posted March 18, 2014 What's funny here is that using the link to this story earlier, Gastineau Lives acted as if it was irrelevant because they werent talking directly about Idzik and his "scouting acumen". It's not hard to tell that the man isn't overly involved with the free agent market given that while these free agents are being gobbled up Idzik is attending pro days. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Villain The Foe Posted March 19, 2014 Share Posted March 19, 2014 Here's another one for you to Google: Teams that consistently stayed 30 million dollars under the salary cap and consistently won. Here's one to Google. Team with 30 million in cap in mid march. seriously dude? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gastineau Lives Posted March 19, 2014 Share Posted March 19, 2014 Here's one to Google. Team with 30 million in cap in mid march. seriously dude? Actually its going to be more after cutting Sanchez. The 30 million wasn't me using an actual figure. It was just better than writing "alot of money under the cap". Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cyberjet Posted March 19, 2014 Share Posted March 19, 2014 What's funny here is that using the link to this story earlier, Gastineau Lives acted as if it was irrelevant because they werent talking directly about Idzik and his "scouting acumen". It's not hard to tell that the man isn't overly involved with the free agent market given that while these free agents are being gobbled up Idzik is attending pro days. I disagree - he was very involved in the free agent market, specifically the evaluation of the free agents. He and scouts even Rex made their assessment of who can help the team AT THE RIGHT PRICE. That is not compromising future signings/ extensions and allowing for flexibility for signing training camp cuts and the draft. Only they know who they really wanted - not these blow hard best writers and certainly not any of us. We can guess - DECKER WAS A DEFINITE. He knew that Howard had a good chance of walking thus had a very good back up plan with the Big G. Some of the others were on the list but not an absolute priority and thus would only be a Jet on his terms so as not to compromise their future short term and long term flexibility. His only concern is the Jets and building the best short term and long term team not worrying what the Giants or patriots are doing. You gotta want to be a Jet. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gastineau Lives Posted March 19, 2014 Share Posted March 19, 2014 What's funny here is that using the link to this story earlier, Gastineau Lives acted as if it was irrelevant because they werent talking directly about Idzik and his "scouting acumen". It's not hard to tell that the man isn't overly involved with the free agent market given that while these free agents are being gobbled up Idzik is attending pro days. No, that was you acting like he built the Seahawks. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AVM Posted March 19, 2014 Share Posted March 19, 2014 This blew up on Facebook and Twitter. You also made the front page of YES Network.com as well. Thanks. Has to make you proud as a webmaster. I still remember the scouting report on 80. Boy were they wrong. JetsFan80: Pro's Shows a lot of moxie and poise. Strong intangibles -- Hard working, won't be out-posted. High motor, high volume poster. Relentless. Great understanding of meme's. Con's No posting experience at the college level outside of intramural message boards, will it translate? Lacks elite "zip" on his posts. Questionable time in the words per minute. Average speed at best. Doesn't have crisp topic focus. Tends to stray and lose focus at times, often posting meme's for the sake of posting meme's. Comparisons: Jetsfan80 doesn't match up with conventional big time message board posters. Evaluation: Non-impact poster, banned from the board in 2-3 years tops. Certainly won't be as unbannable as PatsfanTx. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gastineau Lives Posted March 19, 2014 Share Posted March 19, 2014 Has to make you proud as a webmaster. I still remember the scouting report on 80. Boy were they wrong. JetsFan80: Pro's Shows a lot of moxie and poise. Strong intangibles -- Hard working, won't be out-posted. High motor, high volume poster. Relentless. Great understanding of meme's. Con's No posting experience at the college level outside of intramural message boards, will it translate? Lacks elite "zip" on his posts. Questionable time in the words per minute. Average speed at best. Doesn't have crisp topic focus. Tends to stray and lose focus at times, often posting meme's for the sake of posting meme's. Comparisons: Jetsfan80 doesn't match up with conventional big time message board posters. Evaluation: Non-impact poster, banned from the board in 2-3 years tops. Certainly won't be as unbannable as PatsfanTx. LOL Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jetsfan80 Posted March 19, 2014 Author Share Posted March 19, 2014 This blew up on Facebook and Twitter. You also made the front page of YES Network.com as well. Thanks. <3 you Has to make you proud as a webmaster. I still remember the scouting report on 80. Boy were they wrong. JetsFan80: Pro's Shows a lot of moxie and poise. Strong intangibles -- Hard working, won't be out-posted. High motor, high volume poster. Relentless. Great understanding of meme's. Con's No posting experience at the college level outside of intramural message boards, will it translate? Lacks elite "zip" on his posts. Questionable time in the words per minute. Average speed at best. Doesn't have crisp topic focus. Tends to stray and lose focus at times, often posting meme's for the sake of posting meme's. Comparisons: Jetsfan80 doesn't match up with conventional big time message board posters. Evaluation: Non-impact poster, banned from the board in 2-3 years tops. Certainly won't be as unbannable as PatsfanTx. <3 you too. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Villain The Foe Posted March 19, 2014 Share Posted March 19, 2014 Actually its going to be more after cutting Sanchez. The 30 million wasn't me using an actual figure. It was just better than writing "alot of money under the cap". We're not cutting Sanchez lol Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gastineau Lives Posted March 19, 2014 Share Posted March 19, 2014 We're not cutting Sanchez lol You're really trying to hurt my feelings, aren't ya? lol Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Villain The Foe Posted March 19, 2014 Share Posted March 19, 2014 I disagree - he was very involved in the free agent market, specifically the evaluation of the free agents. He and scouts even Rex made their assessment of who can help the team AT THE RIGHT PRICE. That is not compromising future signings/ extensions and allowing for flexibility for signing training camp cuts and the draft. Only they know who they really wanted - not these blow hard best writers and certainly not any of us. We can guess - DECKER WAS A DEFINITE. He knew that Howard had a good chance of walking thus had a very good back up plan with the Big G. Some of the others were on the list but not an absolute priority and thus would only be a Jet on his terms so as not to compromise their future short term and long term flexibility. His only concern is the Jets and building the best short term and long term team not worrying what the Giants or patriots are doing. You gotta want to be a Jet. you're not disagreeing with me, you just misunderstood me. I don't feel like typing all of what I want to say from my phone, but we are in agreement. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Villain The Foe Posted March 19, 2014 Share Posted March 19, 2014 No, that was you acting like he built the Seahawks. No, I specifically said that this is where he comes from. You acted as if you weren't able to follow that. The rest of the board does so it's cool. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gastineau Lives Posted March 19, 2014 Share Posted March 19, 2014 No, I specifically said that this is where he comes from. You acted as if you weren't able to follow that. The rest of the board does so it's cool. You linked me to an article that doesn't mention Idzik, dude. I know where he comes from, there are tons of people in the organization that I wouldn't want running the team. And no, I'm not saying I don't want Idzik running the team, I'm just saying that your article doesn't prove anything. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jetsfan80 Posted March 19, 2014 Author Share Posted March 19, 2014 You linked me to an article that doesn't mention Idzik, dude. I know where he comes from, there are tons of people in the organization that I wouldn't want running the team. And no, I'm not saying I don't want Idzik running the team, I'm just saying that your article doesn't prove anything. Even if Idzik wasn't really that important when it comes to Seattle's championship, it's hard to argue he isn't modeling their approach here. So the points people are making about him are more than relevant. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Villain The Foe Posted March 19, 2014 Share Posted March 19, 2014 You're really trying to hurt my feelings, aren't ya? lol Ive been trying all throughout free agency lol Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gastineau Lives Posted March 19, 2014 Share Posted March 19, 2014 Even if Idzik wasn't really that important when it comes to Seattle's championship, it's hard to argue he isn't modeling their approach here. So the points people are making about him are more than relevant. Which approach, 80? Draft well? I'm so glad they invented that. I'm tired of dancing with you today. Pick someone else, will ya? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gastineau Lives Posted March 19, 2014 Share Posted March 19, 2014 Ive been trying all throughout free agency lol Well all my feelings are gone. You've sapped my will to live, you jerk. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GimmeShelter Posted March 19, 2014 Share Posted March 19, 2014 I love how, every season, the way to "build a winner" changes based on who won the Superbowl. Denver plays up to the level that they are capable of in the Superbowl, and we're looking at a very different discussion. But the Broncos had a bad game, therefore, Seattle knows the only way to build a roster. By the way, when was John Idzik the GM of the Seahawks? I couldn't find that in his resume. Reminds me of the days when Mangini was automatically going to be the next BB and the division was soon to be ours year in and year out. Mangini was after all just like BB. The mantra here used to be you had to have an elite QB to win a SB. Now since we employ a former Seahawk non decision maker the recipe for success has changed. We have no clue on what Idzik is yet good or bad and we shouldn't make the same pre-mature mistake as when we labeled a certain HC as a genius based on which coaching tree he fell from. Idzik's first draft was ok and it is still too early to judge it completely....see his CB and QB selections. His 2014 FA period is much of the same. Nothing to kill him over and nothing to jump for joy over. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gastineau Lives Posted March 19, 2014 Share Posted March 19, 2014 Reminds me of the days when Mangini was automatically going to be the next BB and the division was soon to be ours year in and year out. Mangini was after all just like BB. The mantra here used to be you had to have an elite QB to win a SB. Now since we employ a former Seahawk non decision maker the recipe for success has changed. We have no clue on what Idzik is yet good or bad and we shouldn't make the same pre-mature mistake as when we labeled a certain HC as a genius based on which coaching tree he fell from. Idzik's first draft was ok and it is still too early to judge it completely....see his CB and QB selections. His 2014 FA period is much of the same. Nothing to kill him over and nothing to jump for joy over. I like you. Can we be friends? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jetsfan80 Posted March 19, 2014 Author Share Posted March 19, 2014 Which approach, 80? Draft well? I'm so glad they invented that. I'm tired of dancing with you today. Pick someone else, will ya? The way this board has operated over the last week, it would seem that the offseason is already over and we don't have 12 draft picks. I've felt like I'm taking crazy pills. So if you have accidentally been a target of my chagrin, my apologies. With these matters there is always collateral damage. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Villain The Foe Posted March 19, 2014 Share Posted March 19, 2014 You linked me to an article that doesn't mention Idzik, dude. I know where he comes from, there are tons of people in the organization that I wouldn't want running the team. And no, I'm not saying I don't want Idzik running the team, I'm just saying that your article doesn't prove anything. I linked you to a article based on where he came from. That was the point my friend Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gastineau Lives Posted March 19, 2014 Share Posted March 19, 2014 The way this board has operated over the last week, it would seem that the offseason is already over and we don't have 12 draft picks. I've felt like I'm taking crazy pills. So if you have accidentally been a target of my chagrin, my apologies. With these matters there is always collateral damage. I understand where you're coming from, I do. I am concerned that we are putting an awful lot of faith in Idzik's ability to draft. He did well with Richardson and it seems that Milliner will turn out to be a very good player as well. The rest is an incomplete and I felt it wouldn't be breaking the bank to try and sign a CB, especially with the cap going up by about 17 mil over the next two years. That's the root of my disappointment, not getting a known commodity when there were such available. I could give a rat's ass about Pettigrew or anyone else we were "interested" in. I also don't like the idea of having to draft a CB now. I thought we were drafting BPA, but that smells a little bit like drafting for need. That's all. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gastineau Lives Posted March 19, 2014 Share Posted March 19, 2014 I linked you to a article based on where he came from. That was the point my friend Bubbe, I know where he came from. I've even been there. It's lovely. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Villain The Foe Posted March 19, 2014 Share Posted March 19, 2014 Well all my feelings are gone. You've sapped my will to live, you jerk. The fresh scent of success Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gastineau Lives Posted March 19, 2014 Share Posted March 19, 2014 Are you calling me an idiot? j\K. We're fighting. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Villain The Foe Posted March 19, 2014 Share Posted March 19, 2014 Bubbe, I know where he came from. I've even been there. It's lovely. Then you were just trying to be difficult. I'm the only jerk here ok!lol Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jetsfan80 Posted March 19, 2014 Author Share Posted March 19, 2014 I understand where you're coming from, I do. I am concerned that we are putting an awful lot of faith in Idzik's ability to draft. He did well with Richardson and it seems that Milliner will turn out to be a very good player as well. The rest is an incomplete and I felt it wouldn't be breaking the bank to try and sign a CB, especially with the cap going up by about 17 mil over the next two years. That's the root of my disappointment, not getting a known commodity when there were such available. I could give a rat's ass about Pettigrew or anyone else we were "interested" in. I also don't like the idea of having to draft a CB now. I thought we were drafting BPA, but that smells a little bit like drafting for need. That's all. We have nothing else we CAN do but put our faith in Idzik's ability to draft. That is the backbone of our entire franchise right now. Since he brought us the DROY, and Geno/Milliner/Winters all made strides in the final 4 games of their first seasons.....I'm going to trust in him for now. I also really think the Ivory pickup was big. People say "well he can't catch passes". Does it matter? There are plenty of fine RB's in the league who can't catch passes worth a lick. That's where, hopefully, Mike Goodson will come in handy for us next season. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Il Mostro Posted March 19, 2014 Share Posted March 19, 2014 We have nothing else we CAN do but put our faith in Idzik's ability to draft. That is the backbone of our entire franchise right now. Since he brought us the DROY, and Geno/Milliner/Winters all made strides in the final 4 games of their first seasons.....I'm going to trust in him for now. I also really think the Ivory pickup was big. People say "well he can't catch passes". Does it matter? There are plenty of fine RB's in the league who can't catch passes worth a lick. That's where, hopefully, Mike Goodson will come in handy for us next season. What's the deal with Goodson? Is he fully recovered from his surgery? Is he prison bound? I haven't seen or heard anything about his future with the team recently. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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