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over the years the value of the safety position has changed. It used to be a luxury pick like TE. now there were 4 in the round (so far)    the Cardinals at 20 was interesting they traded down and t

Eat a dick.

Who did you want there? Matt Leinart? 

terrible pick by Carolina. They could have taken Lee or Latimer 

don't understand the hate on this guy. he definitely needs some seasoning, but if he learns alittle, he could be the steal of the draft. now I gotta figure out who I bet $50 that Benjamin would go in the 1st and collect my bounty!!!!!!!

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I didn't love the pick, and I still don't. But I do understand why they made it for a number of reasons. And it was far better than taking a corner. Hopefully it works out.

I'm in this boat as well. Like the article posted i really do enjoy his aggression and hard hitting. He plays fast and decisive and has good awareness. He takes some real bad angles playing that fast and misses a few tackles as a result, but at least he has some special element to his game. Plus, our safeties have been dog sh*t for a while now, so he definitely upgrades what is currently there imo. I liked pryor better than clinton dix as well, so if we had to go safety glad it was him.

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I was thinking the same thing. I was praying they didn't take Lee.

It actually works out in the Jets favor. We have some very good receivers going into the 2nd round, where we will most likely be picking. I think we'll be seeing a run on WR's in the 2nd. Hopefully the Jets go either Lee, Matthews or Latimer. 

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Everyone here should click this and read.

 

 

"He had three games in a row where he hit somebody and they did not finish the game," Bedford told the Milwaukee Journal Sentinel. "He doesn’t want to injure anybody, but he brings a certain physicality that if you’re going to throw the ball down the middle of the field, you’re going to pay a price ... Calvin Pryor reminds me of a bigger Mike Brown ... [brown] was a coach on the field ... That’s what makes great players. Understanding the entire defense. Calvin Pryor is a lot like that."

 

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don't understand the hate on this guy. he definitely needs some seasoning, but if he learns alittle, he could be the steal of the draft. now I gotta figure out who I bet $50 that Benjamin would go in the 1st and collect my bounty!!!!!!!

A steal? No. He has potential, I'll agree with that, but this kid needs development and his body control for a guy 6'5 is nothing like Mike Evans....and lets not even talk about Calvin Johnson. He's a guy that in the redzone is a good guy to have, but right now he's very limited and wasn't worth a 1st...especially for a team in need of a WR who can make a difference right now. The WR's that Carolina left on the table to take Benjamin is going to define the pick for sure. His hands aren't something that jumps out at you either. 

Edited by Villain The Foe
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Solid, uninteresting pick, very happy with the pick. I'm surprised they went safety considering rex's history with safeties. But maybe he enjoyed having laron landry and wanted that back

By history if u mean Ed Reed for a decade, the ok.

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I know he's a favorite of a lot of smart people and that should be enough to buoy my dread spirits, and I know that we're in that roster-building stage where you just add as many decent players as you can regardless of position, but I hate the position picked and I don't think Pryor is on that Thomas/Berry level as a talent, personally. This defense worked at an elite capacity with garbage at safety. Does adding a better-than-Leonhard safety make it any better?

Yes. We missed Landry last yr. if u don't have stud CBs, u better have good safeties.

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This is crazy- I don't understand the hate for the pick.  Pryor is a good player and we've needed a Safety for about 18 years now.  So many people preach Best player available-- then when it happens they cry because we didn't draft a WR.  Please.  Our WR situation is already twice as good as it was last year and we still have 11 picks left.  I've got news for you-- our next pick might not be a WR either.  We are taking advantage of the depth at WR.  Marquise Lee, Jordan Matthews, Moncrief, Lattimer, Adams, Robinson, Landry, Bryant, Richardson-- There's not a big difference between Odel Beckham and any of these guys.  Chances are, 2 or 3 of these guys will end up better than him anyway.  The wrong move would have been panicking and trading a  1 and 2 and 4 to move up for Odel Beckham, or picking Cooks at 18.  We don't need another slot WR.  Kerley is one of the few bright spots on our offense and it would make no sense picking Cooks.

 

With Marquise Lee, Kony Ealy, Sef Jenkins and Jace Amaro on the board I hope we package up a 4th and scoop one of these guys early in the second.

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This is crazy- I don't understand the hate for the pick.  Pryor is a good player and we've needed a Safety for about 18 years now.  So many people preach Best player available-- then when it happens they cry because we didn't draft a WR.  Please.  Our WR situation is already twice as good as it was last year and we still have 11 picks left.  I've got news for you-- our next pick might not be a WR either.  We are taking advantage of the depth at WR.  Marquise Lee, Jordan Matthews, Moncrief, Lattimer, Adams, Robinson, Landry, Bryant, Richardson-- There's not a big difference between Odel Beckham and any of these guys.  Chances are, 2 or 3 of these guys will end up better than him anyway.  The wrong move would have been panicking and trading a  1 and 2 and 4 to move up for Odel Beckham, or picking Cooks at 18.  We don't need another slot WR.  Kerley is one of the few bright spots on our offense and it would make no sense picking Cooks.

 

With Marquise Lee, Kony Ealy, Sef Jenkins and Jace Amaro on the board I hope we package up a 4th and scoop one of these guys early in the second.

 

Exactly. 

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Westhoff was on ESPN radio this afternoon, and made a great case for why they should go defense. That's where the value was. The depth at receiver is so good that going for a top defender made more sense. The drop off at DB after the first round was much worse.

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I know he's a favorite of a lot of smart people and that should be enough to buoy my dread spirits, and I know that we're in that roster-building stage where you just add as many decent players as you can regardless of position, but I hate the position picked and I don't think Pryor is on that Thomas/Berry level as a talent, personally. This defense worked at an elite capacity with garbage at safety. Does adding a better-than-Leonhard safety make it any better?

 

So because he's not on the level of a top 5 pick it's a bad move?  Yes he makes us better.  Safety has been a need for years dude. 

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Rex is incapable of coaching up the guys already on the roster.

I know you're just trying to get at me but all I'm wondering is why not target an FS instead? I'm not complaining about the pick I would just like to hear more about why he was the one
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Rex is incapable of coaching up the guys already on the roster.

Oh yeah that's right.  Guys like Jim Leonard, Mike DeVito, Sione Pouha, Brodney Pool, Eric Smith, Marcus Dixon, Garret McIntire, Nick Bellor, Aaron Maybin and Drew Coleman are all such studs.    You do realize those guys were on our team when we went to the AFC Championship twice right?  What an idiotic statement.  We have had one of the least talented teams in the NFL and have done pretty well considering.  One of the worst QB situations in the NFL 5 years running.  Just stop.

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I don't mind the pick but I also don't understand why we needed a run stuffing safety

When he's Sacking QB's, blasting the ball out of a WR's hands over the middle and forcing fumbles you will understand why we drafted him.  Landry makes no plays.  1 sack 1 int no FF in 16 games. 

 

Just because youtube highlights show him knocking the pi$$ of guys doesn't mean he can't cover either.  He'll be the best Safety we've had in 20 years.

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Most of the TEs we looked at for visits are still available and I can see us going there. Based on the number of visits at CB and WR i'd be really surprised if we didn't end up with at least one of each.

We have 11 more picks. We can pick 11 WR's or 11 CB's or 11 OL or 11 QB's or 11 TE's

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Oh yeah that's right. Guys like Jim Leonard, Mike DeVito, Sione Pouha, Brodney Pool, Eric Smith, Marcus Dixon, Garret McIntire, Nick Bellor, Aaron Maybin and Drew Coleman are all such studs. You do realize those guys were on our team when we went to the AFC Championship twice right? What an idiotic statement. We have had one of the least talented teams in the NFL and have done pretty well considering. One of the worst QB situations in the NFL 5 years running. Just stop.

Quoted for all the subtle lulz

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Dead to me

New to this site, been listening to the podcast the last few weeks. Don't know who you are pal but you have quite a reputation. I enjoy the podcast but it would be nice if you guys don't interrupt each other, its like listening to 3 Francesca's except you guys are not rude. I was going to jump off a bridge if the Jets drafted a WR in the first rd, thankfully the Giants did. Worst investment you can make in the 1st rd.  They rarely make pro bowl, first season are busts and we need immediate help, 3 down starters. Well we got one alright so don't hurt yourself to much while I raise my glass to the Jets leader, my man, Johnny boy. No go get us some damm weapons boys and also, OL depth, OLB, CB's and a FREAKING PUNTER

 

Here is a nice article about your WR's

 

http://www.coldhardfootballfacts.com/content/explosive-draft-day-findings/5177/

 

 

Few plays are more exciting than a wide receiver hauling in a long bomb. Conversely, few decisions in football are more likely to bomb than selecting a wide receiver with a first-round draft pick.
 
You can thank the steely nerved Pigskin Bomb Squad called the Cold, Hard Football Facts for igniting the draft-day discussion with some explosive findings.
 
We looked at the past 10 drafts (1996-2005) and discovered that selecting a wide receiver in the first round is the single-worst decision your team can make on draft day. This recent history shows that first-round wide receivers have a shockingly high chance of bombing in the NFL. Just a handful of first-round wideouts over the past 10 years have flourished.
 
Not only does drafting a wide receiver bode poorly for your future, it bodes poorly for your past, too: Struggling teams are more likely than good teams to seek salvation in the form of a fleet-footed wideout (Hello, Matt Millen! – pictured MillenMatt.jpghere with the second of his criminally negligent three consecutive first-round wideouts, Roy Williams). More often than not, all these teams find is continued failure.
 
Interestingly – and really, this is little more than a statistical anomaly – the last five Super Bowl victors all went on to championship glory soon after losing or dumping their most recent No. 1-pick wideout.
 
The routine failure of wide receivers is particularly shocking when you consider, as we reported last week, that they have been drafted more often in the first round than any other position over the past 10 years – 45 times to be exact. Apparently, NFL GMs and coaches continue to refute the obvious lessons of the Cold, Hard Football Facts and cling to the belief that a mesmerizing wide receiver is the key to future success.

We looked back on the careers of the 45 wide receivers selected in the first round since the 1996 draft. We then placed each of them in one of five categories. You'll see in no uncertain terms that the duds far outweigh the studs.

Put another way, 37 of the 45 first-round wide receivers selected since 1996 have failed to live up to expectations. Outright Busts, meanwhile, outnumber Superstars 3 to 1. Sure, there's some room for debate among our classifications, and some observers may move some fringe players up or down into different classifications.
 
But all the manipulation in the world will not change the Cold, Hard Football Fact that wide receivers are a high-risk, low-reward first-round selection, with a tremendous possibility of failure.
 
All-Pro Failures
How incapable have our first-round wideouts been? Well, it would be more than reasonable for a team to assume that their big-money, first-round draft pick might make a Pro Bowl once – just once – in their career. But our 45 wide receivers defy this conventional wisdom.
  • 34 of the 45 have failed to make a single Pro Bowl (Koren Robinson, a No. 1 pick for Seattle in 2001, made his first Pro Bowl last year as a HarrisonMarvin.jpgkick returner in Minnesota. He was not included for our purposes among those who have made a Pro Bowl.)
  • These 45 wide receivers have collectively made just 28 Pro Bowl appearances.
  • The three Superstars on our list account for more than half (16) of those 28 appearances: Marvin Harrison (7, pictured here), Randy Moss (5) and Torry Holt (4).
  • The 42 other wide receivers have made just 12 Pro Bowl appearances among them.
Bad teams, bad decisions
Besides the fact that wide receivers are likely to fail, there's another reason why their selection is a bad sign for your team. Picking a first-round wide receiver is more often than not a sign that your team sucked the previous year.
 
Put most simply, bad teams and bad organizations tend to opt for receivers in the first round more often than good teams. Why bad teams are so thrilled by wide receivers remains a short-lived mystery we will answer next week. But suffice it to say that of the 45 wideouts selected in the first round since 1996:
  • 22 were picked by teams with losing records the previous year
  • 15 were picked by teams with winning records
  • 6 were picked by teams with more than 10 wins
  • 12 were picked by teams with more than 10 losses
In recent years, teams have continued to suck the season AFTER drafting a first-round wide receiver, too.
 
In 2005, six desperate teams selected wideouts in the first round:
  • Five of those six teams sucked the following season (Cleveland, Minnesota, Detroit, Baltimore and Atlanta).
In 2004, seven misguided teams selected wideouts in the first round:
  • Six of those seven teams sucked the following season (Arizona, Detroit, Jacksonville, Buffalo, Tampa and San Francisco).
In 2003, three foolish teams selected wideouts in the first round:
  • All three teams sucked the following season and for years before (Detroit, Houston and Arizona).
  • These three teams are a combined 31-65 (.323) since selecting wide receivers in the first round of the 2003 draft.
And consider this: Just two teams have selected three first-round wide receivers over the past 10 years. These two teams are the worst franchises in football, Detroit and Arizona.
 
Notice a trend? Bad teams make bad draft-day decisions. These bad decisions routinely involve wide receivers.
 
Dump a first-rounder, win a Super Bowl
Of the 45 wide receivers selected in the first round over the past 10 years, only three have won a Super Bowl:
  • Torry Holt caught 52 passes for Super Bowl XXXIV champion St. Louis in 1999.
  • Travis Taylor caught 28 passes for Super Bowl XXXV champion Baltimore in 2000.
  • Keyshawn Johnson caught 76 passes for Super Bowl XXXVII champion Tampa Bay in 2002.
Interestingly, teams are more likely to win a Super Bowl if they DUMP a first-round wide receiver.
 
This year's two Super Bowl participants, Seattle and Pittsburgh, reached the big game immediately after dumping their most recent first-round wideout.
 
Seattle's Koren Robinson, a first round pick in 2001, had been a notorious underachiever. The Seahawks released him before the 2005 season, and he signed with Minnesota. Quarterback Matt Hasselbeck went on to a career season and the team reached the first Super Bowl in franchise history. Robinson and the Vikings tanked.
 
Pittsburgh's Plaxico Burress, a first-round pick in 2000, had also been a notorious underachiever – and a disruptive loudmouth to boot. The Steelers shipped him off to the N.Y. Giants before the 2005 season and proceeded to win their first Super Bowl in 26 years, led by the youngest Super Bowl-winning quarterback in history (Ben Roethlisberger). Burress and the Giants were shut out in a wild-card playoff loss.
 
These are not isolated incidents.
 
St. Louis won its first Super Bowl in 1999, the season after it unloaded Eddie Kennison, a first-round pick in 1996. Kennison has since gone on to have a decent career, but he was a notorious underachiever his first three years in the league with St. Louis, catching just 96 passes and scoring 10 TDs. (Of course, St. Louis made one of the rare great WR decisions of the past 10 years, selecting Superstar Torry Holt in the 1999 draft.)
 
Tampa Bay won its first Super Bowl in 2002, its first year without notorious underachiever Reidel Anthony, a first-round pick in 1997.
 
New England won its first Super Bowl in 2001, a year in which troubled 1996 first-round pick Terry Glenn was benched by coach Bill Belichick. It has since won two more Super Bowls with a receiving corps led by 2nd-round pick Deion Branch, 7th-round pick David Givens and 8th-round pick Troy Brown.
 
The Class of 1996
The failure of first-round wide receivers is even more astonishing when you consider that many of the most successful receivers of the last 10 years came from the Class of 1996. This group included Superstar Marvin Harrison, Big-Time Performers Keyshawn Johnson and Eric Moulds, and solid Journeymen Terry Glenn and Eddie Kennison.
 
The Class of 1996 was, far and away, the best first-round receiving corps of the past 10 years. In fact, it was one of the best in history.
 
But this historic anomaly has been followed by abject, repeated and astonishing failure, starting with the four-man Class of 1997.
 
This ignominious group of goats in 1997 included outright Busts Yatil Green, Reidel Anthony and Rae Carruth, who's currently serving 18 to 24.* The best of the bunch was Scrub Ike Hilliard, who has caught just 403 passes and 28 TDs in his nine-year NFL career. It's not quite what the N.Y. Giants had in mind when they selected the Florida stud with the No. 7 overall pick nine years ago.
 
If we remove the five players from the stellar Class of 1996, we discover that 34 of the 40 first-round wide receivers selected since then have failed to live up to expectations.
(*For the record, we do not count injuries or off-field incidents as an excuse for being a bust. Either you live up to expectations or you don't. If wide receivers seem to get injured or wind up in trouble more often than players at other positions, it merely serves to prove our point that they are poor first-round selections.)
 
So, the Cold, Hard Football Facts prove in no uncertain terms that wide receivers are notoriously poor first-round draft choices. After the draft, we'll tell you why they fail so frequently and show you that there's little correlation between big-name wide receivers and overall team success.

In other words, we'll explain why there's little reason to select a wide receiver with a No. 1 pick.

Edited by sec337
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Westhoff was on ESPN radio this afternoon, and made a great case for why they should go defense. That's where the value was. The depth at receiver is so good that going for a top defender made more sense. The drop off at DB after the first round was much worse.

And the case for that was made when there was a run on safeties after the Jets' pick. They got the player who they thought was the best at the position in the entire draft, and in the second round they will still have a choice between quality WR and TE prospects - without trading up.

Unless they go CB, which would be worth it for the hilarity around here, alone.

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