ESPN POLL OF NFL EXECS NAMES GENO SMITH "WORST" STARTING QB IN NFL.

[T0mShane]

You're right because you're worse. Pudsteak would be a compliment for you.

Whoa.

[RutgersJetFan]

What, JNers reading mine or Sperm's book-length posts isn't enough for you?

At least you are both self-aware. I'll give you guys that much.

[jgb]

Collision Low Crossers covers literally everything that all of you pudsteaks are debating and speculating on in this thread. First hand.

 

im lost, what's a pudsteak and what's the best way to season one?

[RutgersJetFan]

 

MRW you noticed

 

[Klecko73isGod]

 

I love that that is Peyton Manning's reaction to finding the sh*tty modern country station on satellite radio. 

[use2Jet]

Collision Low Crossers covers literally everything that all of you pudsteaks are debating and speculating on in this thread. First hand.

That's would be Mr Pudsteak to you.

So, which Pudsteak is right?

[Larz]

see kids, if you are a career student, you can learn ways to amaze peeps on the innerwebs

[Sperm Edwards]

Says you.

If you want to blame/credit Rex with having 2% or 88% influence over his roster, it's really besides the point--he did an awful job managing those players once they were here. If you don't think that Rex (or Rex's presence) had any influence in the sea-change in philosophy regarding the type of player that was brought in, and that it was a coincidence that Tannenbaum, CPA, elected to bring every exiled player in the league to the Jets to add to Ryan's swagger collection, that's fine, too. It doesn't change the fact that those players bitch-slapped this franchise under Rex's stewardship. That's on him, unless you think that Tannenbaum was so all-powerful that he was dictating who started at every position every week, despite the fact that all-powerful Tannenbaum was thrown out the door/

This is the Ryan you assume "learned on the job"? That the GM has to intervene in his coach's personal relationships between him and every washed-up veteran that he placated for too long?

I think Tannenbaum, cockroach that he was, did what Woody wanted, and I think it's clear the Woody is snowed by Rex, and that Tannenbaum did what Woody wanted.

What, exactly, has he learned? Literally the only reason you and slats keep banging that drum is because he managed to beat the Browns and Dolphins at the end of the season. Otherwise, the season was a nightmare. Seven losses by double digits, 4 by 20+. They sucked and parity bailed them out at the end.

If Rex never said Word One in regards to acquiring a single player on the roster, you'd still have a difficult case arguing that he deserves to keep his job

More exaggeration to make your point, as usual. There were how many of these awful personalities brought in? 2 or 3 in 5 years? And every one of the 3 was brought in on a 1-year deal. Then Holmes - and only Holmes - gets extended because the GM saw to it that all but 1 WR on the team hit free agency all at the same time, so the best player of the 3 was re-upped. Bill Belichick brings in Albert Haynesworth and is congratulated for it. The Jets bring in the reigning SB MVP for a freaking 5th round pick, and something something retard swagger something something. The rest is nonsense. Plaxico Burress bitch-slapped the franchise? Yeah, maybe the Giants franchise. Perhaps it was Mason who bitch-slapped the franchise. Oh wait, he got shipped off the team a month after signing. Real bitch-slapping. The only one who had the team by the short hairs was Holmes, and you seem to be the only person ignorant to the situation (or more likely, are choosing to ignore it because it makes your argument easy).

And despite the obvious handicap of being gutted, the team beat a little more than the Browns. Hell, if not for Smith being in his 2nd NFL game and throwing 3 picks in the 4th quarter, this crappy roster may have swept the Patriots. They also did a pretty good job against the Saints. Record aside, even Atlanta wasn't a pushover until after we beat them (their 2 stud WRs went down). They were 1-3 entering the game, but the most lopsided loss of the 3 was 30-23 vs NE and they were on NE's 10 with a minute remaining. Sure, they lost, but NE had a hard time with them in Atlanta and St Louis lost in Atlanta. New Orleans and Miami didn't exactly steamroll over them. 1st & goal with a minute to go vs the Saints like with NE, and they were beating Miami until the final minute. It's easy - not to mention lazy - to look at their final record and say that the Atlanta game was an easy one when Atlanta's season was on the line on MNF in their house.

Rookie Smith being rookie Smith made a lot of differences in other games. And the roster was decimated on offense from injuries and poor GMing. The defense was fine except the secondary which had a rookie who missed a lot of that rookie offseason and then got injured. Across from him was an injured Cromartie playing like he was a total scrub. Whatever depth was on the team was tried, but other than a couple of good plays here & there (e.g. Walls) they weren't a lot better anyway.

But of course, coaching that team is totally on the same plane as a healthy one with good to great depth with either an experienced veteran (or a younger player who was far further along than Smith at the same stage) at QB.

What happened to Atlanta when injuries hit them hard? Aw, that doesn't matter, even though they were among the SB favorites. What happened to the Packers last year without Aaron Rodgers? Oh wait, that doesn't count either. How about Denver in the SB - did John Fox coach his team to play above their level? Did he coach them to even play AT their level? Nah, that doesn't count either because Wrecks-Rex swaggerlicious something something. John Harbaugh without Ray Lewis and Anquan Boldin? They special teams coach whose special teams unit nearly got them bounced from the playoffs the year before? What happened to the SB champs in 2013? Doesn't count. And it's the same fate that Carroll will face if Wilson ever gets injured, just like they were losers before Wilson.

But with all these other coaches, it's not their fault when they lose or the team is simply overmatched (particularly when it's from key injuries). With Ryan, not only is it all his fault when they're badly outmatched personnel-wise, but it's also to the credit of everyone else or the letdown of an opponent to blame when the Jets win.

Jets look like they're headed for a 3 or 4 win season in pre-season rankings? Ryan's fault because he's really the GM somehow. That 3 or 4 win roster wins 8 games, and doesn't merely win only vs easy opponents to get there? Well then the roster wasn't that bad after all, and therefore Ryan did nothing but coach them up to their level.

Here's a newsflash: there are no perfect coaches. Ryan has flaws the way even superbowl winning coaches have flaws. And he has others that some don't, just like he has strengths others don't have. People bemoan a dumb challenge the Jets call, even if they go on to win anyway. Sure, it's easy to get pissed off at. Meanwhile Carroll did it in the freaking superbowl before the game got out of hand for Denver and no one remembers it. Belichick is in his own house in a divisional playoff game, and is down by 10 points in the 4th quarter, with Tom Brady and plenty of healthy receiving targets. What does the game's smartest HC gameplan with the whole season on the line? He repeatedly dinks and dunks to Danny Woodhead on an 8 minute drive that ends in a FG - vs the hated Ryan Jets - because he got outsmarted badly by Ryan and had no answers or in-game adjustments to counter it.

Basically I think you just overrate every other head coach in the league.

[Klecko73isGod]

More exaggeration to make your point, as usual. There were how many of these awful personalities brought in? 2 or 3 in 5 years? And every one of the 3 was brought in on a 1-year deal. Then Holmes - and only Holmes - gets extended because the GM saw to it that all but 1 WR on the team hit free agency all at the same time, so the best player of the 3 was re-upped. Bill Belichick brings in Albert Haynesworth and is congratulated for it. The Jets bring in the reigning SB MVP for a freaking 5th round pick, and something something retard swagger something something. The rest is nonsense. Plaxico Burress bitch-slapped the franchise? Yeah, maybe the Giants franchise. Perhaps it was Mason who bitch-slapped the franchise. Oh wait, he got shipped off the team a month after signing. Real bitch-slapping. The only one who had the team by the short hairs was Holmes, and you seem to be the only person ignorant to the situation (or more likely, are choosing to ignore it because it makes your argument easy).

And despite the obvious handicap of being gutted, the team beat a little more than the Browns. Hell, if not for Smith being in his 2nd NFL game and throwing 3 picks in the 4th quarter, this crappy roster may have swept the Patriots. They also did a pretty good job against the Saints. Record aside, even Atlanta wasn't a pushover until after we beat them (their 2 stud WRs went down). They were 1-3 entering the game, but the most lopsided loss of the 3 was 30-23 vs NE and they were on NE's 10 with a minute remaining. Sure, they lost, but NE had a hard time with them in Atlanta and St Louis lost in Atlanta. New Orleans and Miami didn't exactly steamroll over them. 1st & goal with a minute to go vs the Saints like with NE, and they were beating Miami until the final minute. It's easy - not to mention lazy - to look at their final record and say that the Atlanta game was an easy one when Atlanta's season was on the line on MNF in their house.

Rookie Smith being rookie Smith made a lot of differences in other games. And the roster was decimated on offense from injuries and poor GMing. The defense was fine except the secondary which had a rookie who missed a lot of that rookie offseason and then got injured. Across from him was an injured Cromartie playing like he was a total scrub. Whatever depth was on the team was tried, but other than a couple of good plays here & there (e.g. Walls) they weren't a lot better anyway.

But of course, coaching that team is totally on the same plane as a healthy one with good to great depth with either an experienced veteran (or a younger player who was far further along than Smith at the same stage) at QB.

What happened to Atlanta when injuries hit them hard? Aw, that doesn't matter, even though they were among the SB favorites. What happened to the Packers last year without Aaron Rodgers? Oh wait, that doesn't count either. How about Denver in the SB - did John Fox coach his team to play above their level? Did he coach them to even play AT their level? Nah, that doesn't count either because Wrecks-Rex swaggerlicious something something. John Harbaugh without Ray Lewis and Anquan Boldin? They special teams coach whose special teams unit nearly got them bounced from the playoffs the year before? What happened to the SB champs in 2013? Doesn't count. And it's the same fate that Carroll will face if Wilson ever gets injured, just like they were losers before Wilson.

But with all these other coaches, it's not their fault when they lose or the team is simply overmatched (particularly when it's from key injuries). With Ryan, not only is it all his fault when they're badly outmatched personnel-wise, but it's also to the credit of everyone else or the letdown of an opponent to blame when the Jets win.

Jets look like they're headed for a 3 or 4 win season in pre-season rankings? Ryan's fault because he's really the GM somehow. That 3 or 4 win roster wins 8 games, and doesn't merely win only vs easy opponents to get there? Well then the roster wasn't that bad after all, and therefore Ryan did nothing but coach them up to their level.

Here's a newsflash: there are no perfect coaches. Ryan has flaws the way even superbowl winning coaches have flaws. And he has others that some don't, just like he has strengths others don't have. People bemoan a dumb challenge the Jets call, even if they go on to win anyway. Sure, it's easy to get pissed off at. Meanwhile Carroll did it in the freaking superbowl before the game got out of hand for Denver and no one remembers it. Belichick is in his own house in a divisional playoff game, and is down by 10 points in the 4th quarter, with Tom Brady and plenty of healthy receiving targets. What does the game's smartest HC gameplan with the whole season on the line? He repeatedly dinks and dunks to Danny Woodhead on an 8 minute drive that ends in a FG - vs the hated Ryan Jets - because he got outsmarted badly by Ryan and had no answers or in-game adjustments to counter it.

Basically I think you just overrate every other head coach in the league.

 

/End thread. 

[use2Jet]

More exaggeration to make your point, as usual. There were how many of these awful personalities brought in? 2 or 3 in 5 years? And every one of the 3 was brought in on a 1-year deal. Then Holmes - and only Holmes - gets extended because the GM saw to it that all but 1 WR on the team hit free agency all at the same time, so the best player of the 3 was re-upped. Bill Belichick brings in Albert Haynesworth and is congratulated for it. The Jets bring in the reigning SB MVP for a freaking 5th round pick, and something something retard swagger something something. The rest is nonsense. Plaxico Burress bitch-slapped the franchise? Yeah, maybe the Giants franchise. Perhaps it was Mason who bitch-slapped the franchise. Oh wait, he got shipped off the team a month after signing. Real bitch-slapping. The only one who had the team by the short hairs was Holmes, and you seem to be the only person ignorant to the situation (or more likely, are choosing to ignore it because it makes your argument easy).

And despite the obvious handicap of being gutted, the team beat a little more than the Browns. Hell, if not for Smith being in his 2nd NFL game and throwing 3 picks in the 4th quarter, this crappy roster may have swept the Patriots. They also did a pretty good job against the Saints. Record aside, even Atlanta wasn't a pushover until after we beat them (their 2 stud WRs went down). They were 1-3 entering the game, but the most lopsided loss of the 3 was 30-23 vs NE and they were on NE's 10 with a minute remaining. Sure, they lost, but NE had a hard time with them in Atlanta and St Louis lost in Atlanta. New Orleans and Miami didn't exactly steamroll over them. 1st & goal with a minute to go vs the Saints like with NE, and they were beating Miami until the final minute. It's easy - not to mention lazy - to look at their final record and say that the Atlanta game was an easy one when Atlanta's season was on the line on MNF in their house.

Rookie Smith being rookie Smith made a lot of differences in other games. And the roster was decimated on offense from injuries and poor GMing. The defense was fine except the secondary which had a rookie who missed a lot of that rookie offseason and then got injured. Across from him was an injured Cromartie playing like he was a total scrub. Whatever depth was on the team was tried, but other than a couple of good plays here & there (e.g. Walls) they weren't a lot better anyway.

But of course, coaching that team is totally on the same plane as a healthy one with good to great depth with either an experienced veteran (or a younger player who was far further along than Smith at the same stage) at QB.

What happened to Atlanta when injuries hit them hard? Aw, that doesn't matter, even though they were among the SB favorites. What happened to the Packers last year without Aaron Rodgers? Oh wait, that doesn't count either. How about Denver in the SB - did John Fox coach his team to play above their level? Did he coach them to even play AT their level? Nah, that doesn't count either because Wrecks-Rex swaggerlicious something something. John Harbaugh without Ray Lewis and Anquan Boldin? They special teams coach whose special teams unit nearly got them bounced from the playoffs the year before? What happened to the SB champs in 2013? Doesn't count. And it's the same fate that Carroll will face if Wilson ever gets injured, just like they were losers before Wilson.

But with all these other coaches, it's not their fault when they lose or the team is simply overmatched (particularly when it's from key injuries). With Ryan, not only is it all his fault when they're badly outmatched personnel-wise, but it's also to the credit of everyone else or the letdown of an opponent to blame when the Jets win.

Jets look like they're headed for a 3 or 4 win season in pre-season rankings? Ryan's fault because he's really the GM somehow. That 3 or 4 win roster wins 8 games, and doesn't merely win only vs easy opponents to get there? Well then the roster wasn't that bad after all, and therefore Ryan did nothing but coach them up to their level.

Here's a newsflash: there are no perfect coaches. Ryan has flaws the way even superbowl winning coaches have flaws. And he has others that some don't, just like he has strengths others don't have. People bemoan a dumb challenge the Jets call, even if they go on to win anyway. Sure, it's easy to get pissed off at. Meanwhile Carroll did it in the freaking superbowl before the game got out of hand for Denver and no one remembers it. Belichick is in his own house in a divisional playoff game, and is down by 10 points in the 4th quarter, with Tom Brady and plenty of healthy receiving targets. What does the game's smartest HC gameplan with the whole season on the line? He repeatedly dinks and dunks to Danny Woodhead on an 8 minute drive that ends in a FG - vs the hated Ryan Jets - because he got outsmarted badly by Ryan and had no answers or in-game adjustments to counter it.

Basically I think you just overrate every other head coach in the league.

 

Even great HC's are going to have bad games, that does not make Rex great or even good. 

 

I find it staggering how you basically want to point to all NFL success revolving around the QB position, yet you vigorously back a HC who has shown negative ability to identify or manage the QB position. 

 

I think most of what you say about Rex has whiffs of validity, but at the end of the day this is a QB driven league, and you need to be able to maximize the QB position, and lead troops as a HC. Something Rex has shown to be flawed at a minimum at.

 

The learning BS is nonsense, you are either a good leader or your not. I am not talking about individual mistakes which everyone makes, I am talking about overall leadership ability. Rex has some very good qualities, I despise him, but I will objectively admit that. 

 

BUT he has too many fatal flaws to ever be anything better than an average to slightly above average HC.

 

When you need your HC to completely stay away from one side of the ball, that is a fatal flaw. And I know all the High SAT scorers around here will clammer how no HC is an expert on both sides of the ball, and while true, it is a night and day difference from not being an expert, to having to be kept completely away from one side of the ball.

 

I know that the Jets fan base has such bad beaten spouse syndrome that average HC's somehow seem great, and that is sad, but it should not be enough. We need a HC who can maximize the QB position. I don't care how they do it, just that they do it. I don't care if they are boyfriends with the best QB coach or OC in the league and can bring them in, or they can do it themselves, but it needs to be done for the franchise to take the next step.

 

And before you go on and on about Sanchez (your excuse for everything) or rookie Smith, just because they may not have been very good regardless of the situation, does not absolve horrible handling of the situation. If you try to shoot someone and miss, just because they are still alive, it does not make you any better of a person for it.

[use2Jet]

/End thread. 

 

Mr. T likey

[Sperm Edwards]

Even great HC's are going to have bad games, that does not make Rex great or even good. 

 

I find it staggering how you basically want to point to all NFL success revolving around the QB position, yet you vigorously back a HC who has shown negative ability to identify or manage the QB position. 

 

I think most of what you say about Rex has whiffs of validity, but at the end of the day this is a QB driven league, and you need to be able to maximize the QB position, and lead troops as a HC. Something Rex has shown to be flawed at a minimum at.

 

The learning BS is nonsense, you are either a good leader or your not. I am not talking about individual mistakes which everyone makes, I am talking about overall leadership ability. Rex has some very good qualities, I despise him, but I will objectively admit that. 

 

BUT he has too many fatal flaws to ever be anything better than an average to slightly above average HC.

 

When you need your HC to completely stay away from one side of the ball, that is a fatal flaw. And I know all the High SAT scorers around here will clammer how no HC is an expert on both sides of the ball, and while true, it is a night and day difference from not being an expert, to having to be kept completely away from one side of the ball.

 

I know that the Jets fan base has such bad beaten spouse syndrome that average HC's somehow seem great, and that is sad, but it should not be enough. We need a HC who can maximize the QB position. I don't care how they do it, just that they do it. I don't care if they are boyfriends with the best QB coach or OC in the league and can bring them in, or they can do it themselves, but it needs to be done for the franchise to take the next step.

 

And before you go on and on about Sanchez (your excuse for everything) or rookie Smith, just because they may not have been very good regardless of the situation, does not absolve horrible handling of the situation. If you try to shoot someone and miss, just because they are still alive, it does not make you any better of a person for it.

 

lol

 

But then this logic is turned around for someone else.  Like the HC of the current SB champs.

 

If you knew anything about him, which apparently you don't, Carroll was pushed around HARD by his players, particularly in New England. He was total mush, and none of them had any respect for him (except maybe rookies trying to make the roster I suppose).  THAT is the guy you say was "born" as a good leader.

[Klecko73isGod]

 

 

When you need your HC to completely stay away from one side of the ball, that is a fatal flaw.

 

I don't know where this got started but it is the definition of a moronic straw man argument that makes no logical sense whatsoever. 

 

In order to be a good defensive coordinator you not only need to understand offense you need to know it inside and out and every which way. It takes massive amounts of stupidity to believe that Rex Ryan doesn't understand offense. 

[use2Jet]

lol

But then this logic is turned around for someone else. Like the HC of the current SB champs.

If you knew anything about him, which apparently you don't, Carroll was pushed around HARD by his players, particularly in New England. He was total mush, and none of them had any respect for him (except maybe rookies trying to make the roster I suppose). THAT is the guy you say was "born" as a good leader.

Please show me where I said Caroll was a born good leader, I don't recall thinking nor saying it.

[use2Jet]

I don't know where this got started but it is the definition of a moronic straw man argument that makes no logical sense whatsoever.

In order to be a good defensive coordinator you not only need to understand offense you need to know it inside and out and every which way. It takes massive amounts of stupidity to believe that Rex Ryan doesn't understand offense.

It would take massive amounts of stupidity to let him anywhere near an offense given his track record when being allowed near the offense.

Sanchez and Sporano say hi.

[slats]

It would take massive amounts of stupidity to let him anywhere near an offense given his track record when being allowed near the offense.

Sanchez and Sporano say hi.

 

Why did you wait so long to start posting? It wasn't obvious to you that we were short one humorless troll? 

[T0mShane]

More exaggeration to make your point, as usual. There were how many of these awful personalities brought in? 2 or 3 in 5 years? And every one of the 3 was brought in on a 1-year deal. Then Holmes - and only Holmes - gets extended because the GM saw to it that all but 1 WR on the team hit free agency all at the same time, so the best player of the 3 was re-upped. Bill Belichick brings in Albert Haynesworth and is congratulated for it. The Jets bring in the reigning SB MVP for a freaking 5th round pick, and something something retard swagger something something. The rest is nonsense. Plaxico Burress bitch-slapped the franchise? Yeah, maybe the Giants franchise. Perhaps it was Mason who bitch-slapped the franchise. Oh wait, he got shipped off the team a month after signing. Real bitch-slapping. The only one who had the team by the short hairs was Holmes, and you seem to be the only person ignorant to the situation (or more likely, are choosing to ignore it because it makes your argument easy).

And despite the obvious handicap of being gutted, the team beat a little more than the Browns. Hell, if not for Smith being in his 2nd NFL game and throwing 3 picks in the 4th quarter, this crappy roster may have swept the Patriots. They also did a pretty good job against the Saints. Record aside, even Atlanta wasn't a pushover until after we beat them (their 2 stud WRs went down). They were 1-3 entering the game, but the most lopsided loss of the 3 was 30-23 vs NE and they were on NE's 10 with a minute remaining. Sure, they lost, but NE had a hard time with them in Atlanta and St Louis lost in Atlanta. New Orleans and Miami didn't exactly steamroll over them. 1st & goal with a minute to go vs the Saints like with NE, and they were beating Miami until the final minute. It's easy - not to mention lazy - to look at their final record and say that the Atlanta game was an easy one when Atlanta's season was on the line on MNF in their house.

Rookie Smith being rookie Smith made a lot of differences in other games. And the roster was decimated on offense from injuries and poor GMing. The defense was fine except the secondary which had a rookie who missed a lot of that rookie offseason and then got injured. Across from him was an injured Cromartie playing like he was a total scrub. Whatever depth was on the team was tried, but other than a couple of good plays here & there (e.g. Walls) they weren't a lot better anyway.

But of course, coaching that team is totally on the same plane as a healthy one with good to great depth with either an experienced veteran (or a younger player who was far further along than Smith at the same stage) at QB.

What happened to Atlanta when injuries hit them hard? Aw, that doesn't matter, even though they were among the SB favorites. What happened to the Packers last year without Aaron Rodgers? Oh wait, that doesn't count either. How about Denver in the SB - did John Fox coach his team to play above their level? Did he coach them to even play AT their level? Nah, that doesn't count either because Wrecks-Rex swaggerlicious something something. John Harbaugh without Ray Lewis and Anquan Boldin? They special teams coach whose special teams unit nearly got them bounced from the playoffs the year before? What happened to the SB champs in 2013? Doesn't count. And it's the same fate that Carroll will face if Wilson ever gets injured, just like they were losers before Wilson.

But with all these other coaches, it's not their fault when they lose or the team is simply overmatched (particularly when it's from key injuries). With Ryan, not only is it all his fault when they're badly outmatched personnel-wise, but it's also to the credit of everyone else or the letdown of an opponent to blame when the Jets win.

Jets look like they're headed for a 3 or 4 win season in pre-season rankings? Ryan's fault because he's really the GM somehow. That 3 or 4 win roster wins 8 games, and doesn't merely win only vs easy opponents to get there? Well then the roster wasn't that bad after all, and therefore Ryan did nothing but coach them up to their level.

Here's a newsflash: there are no perfect coaches. Ryan has flaws the way even superbowl winning coaches have flaws. And he has others that some don't, just like he has strengths others don't have. People bemoan a dumb challenge the Jets call, even if they go on to win anyway. Sure, it's easy to get pissed off at. Meanwhile Carroll did it in the freaking superbowl before the game got out of hand for Denver and no one remembers it. Belichick is in his own house in a divisional playoff game, and is down by 10 points in the 4th quarter, with Tom Brady and plenty of healthy receiving targets. What does the game's smartest HC gameplan with the whole season on the line? He repeatedly dinks and dunks to Danny Woodhead on an 8 minute drive that ends in a FG - vs the hated Ryan Jets - because he got outsmarted badly by Ryan and had no answers or in-game adjustments to counter it.

Basically I think you just overrate every other head coach in the league.

Quick response here, because, Jesus:

1. Pre-season predictions? The Jets were "picked" to win 3 and the Falcons were "predicted" to win 10, and this is your basis for declaring that beating an eventual 4-12 team was a more substantial achievement than beating a 4-win team. Again, seven losses by double digits; four by 20+. They would have "swept New England" if they got a break in the the first game, but let's forget about the refs citing a rule that had never been called before or since to hand the Jets the prior game.

2. The four games they lost by 20+ were to Andy Dalton, Ryan Tannehill, EJ Manuel, and Jake Locker, each of whom put up 90+ QB ratings in those games.

3. The "four or five" exiled malcontents that were brought in only represented the entire receiving corps and starting running back of the 2011 season. Kudos to Rex for finding out why they were all so readily available, but if you're wondering why there were no receivers on the team from 2011 forward, there's your answer. And the "Super Bowl MVP" was available for a fifth round pick because he's 1. wildly overrated and 2. a giant a$$hole whom isn't allowed back in the Steelers building...but he was named Captain here and never saw a shred of discipline even after embarrassing the franchise vs the Dolphins. No worries, though: Rex fired Henry Ellard for daring to pull Holmes out of that game. Good times.

4. You telling me I'm overrating any coach is LOL territory.

[Matt39]

Preparation is key. With Rex, it seems the Jets always get too high off of wins...come out flat the following week and then use that as motivation the following week. It's draining. Hell it's draining as a fan. 

 

Belichick etc...don't treat wins as super accomplishments- it's just expected. It's not all because they have Tom Brady.

 

Granted, Belly's been a sh*tty drafter....but in season he still runs laps around Rex with regards to week to week prep. The worst I'd ever seen though was Herm. WHo was just lost.

[use2Jet]

Why did you wait so long to start posting? It wasn't obvious to you that we were short one humorless troll?

So pointing out history, and the results that have followed makes me a troll , because you love Rex??

[sourceworx]

More exaggeration to make your point, as usual. There were how many of these awful personalities brought in? 2 or 3 in 5 years? And every one of the 3 was brought in on a 1-year deal. Then Holmes - and only Holmes - gets extended because the GM saw to it that all but 1 WR on the team hit free agency all at the same time, so the best player of the 3 was re-upped. Bill Belichick brings in Albert Haynesworth and is congratulated for it. The Jets bring in the reigning SB MVP for a freaking 5th round pick, and something something retard swagger something something. The rest is nonsense. Plaxico Burress bitch-slapped the franchise? Yeah, maybe the Giants franchise. Perhaps it was Mason who bitch-slapped the franchise. Oh wait, he got shipped off the team a month after signing. Real bitch-slapping. The only one who had the team by the short hairs was Holmes, and you seem to be the only person ignorant to the situation (or more likely, are choosing to ignore it because it makes your argument easy).

And despite the obvious handicap of being gutted, the team beat a little more than the Browns. Hell, if not for Smith being in his 2nd NFL game and throwing 3 picks in the 4th quarter, this crappy roster may have swept the Patriots. They also did a pretty good job against the Saints. Record aside, even Atlanta wasn't a pushover until after we beat them (their 2 stud WRs went down). They were 1-3 entering the game, but the most lopsided loss of the 3 was 30-23 vs NE and they were on NE's 10 with a minute remaining. Sure, they lost, but NE had a hard time with them in Atlanta and St Louis lost in Atlanta. New Orleans and Miami didn't exactly steamroll over them. 1st & goal with a minute to go vs the Saints like with NE, and they were beating Miami until the final minute. It's easy - not to mention lazy - to look at their final record and say that the Atlanta game was an easy one when Atlanta's season was on the line on MNF in their house.

Rookie Smith being rookie Smith made a lot of differences in other games. And the roster was decimated on offense from injuries and poor GMing. The defense was fine except the secondary which had a rookie who missed a lot of that rookie offseason and then got injured. Across from him was an injured Cromartie playing like he was a total scrub. Whatever depth was on the team was tried, but other than a couple of good plays here & there (e.g. Walls) they weren't a lot better anyway.

But of course, coaching that team is totally on the same plane as a healthy one with good to great depth with either an experienced veteran (or a younger player who was far further along than Smith at the same stage) at QB.

What happened to Atlanta when injuries hit them hard? Aw, that doesn't matter, even though they were among the SB favorites. What happened to the Packers last year without Aaron Rodgers? Oh wait, that doesn't count either. How about Denver in the SB - did John Fox coach his team to play above their level? Did he coach them to even play AT their level? Nah, that doesn't count either because Wrecks-Rex swaggerlicious something something. John Harbaugh without Ray Lewis and Anquan Boldin? They special teams coach whose special teams unit nearly got them bounced from the playoffs the year before? What happened to the SB champs in 2013? Doesn't count. And it's the same fate that Carroll will face if Wilson ever gets injured, just like they were losers before Wilson.

But with all these other coaches, it's not their fault when they lose or the team is simply overmatched (particularly when it's from key injuries). With Ryan, not only is it all his fault when they're badly outmatched personnel-wise, but it's also to the credit of everyone else or the letdown of an opponent to blame when the Jets win.

Jets look like they're headed for a 3 or 4 win season in pre-season rankings? Ryan's fault because he's really the GM somehow. That 3 or 4 win roster wins 8 games, and doesn't merely win only vs easy opponents to get there? Well then the roster wasn't that bad after all, and therefore Ryan did nothing but coach them up to their level.

Here's a newsflash: there are no perfect coaches. Ryan has flaws the way even superbowl winning coaches have flaws. And he has others that some don't, just like he has strengths others don't have. People bemoan a dumb challenge the Jets call, even if they go on to win anyway. Sure, it's easy to get pissed off at. Meanwhile Carroll did it in the freaking superbowl before the game got out of hand for Denver and no one remembers it. Belichick is in his own house in a divisional playoff game, and is down by 10 points in the 4th quarter, with Tom Brady and plenty of healthy receiving targets. What does the game's smartest HC gameplan with the whole season on the line? He repeatedly dinks and dunks to Danny Woodhead on an 8 minute drive that ends in a FG - vs the hated Ryan Jets - because he got outsmarted badly by Ryan and had no answers or in-game adjustments to counter it.

Basically I think you just overrate every other head coach in the league.

 

 

Great, great post.

[Sperm Edwards]

Quick response here, because, Jesus:

1. Pre-season predictions? The Jets were "picked" to win 3 and the Falcons were "predicted" to win 10, and this is your basis for declaring that beating an eventual 4-12 team was a more substantial achievement than beating a 4-win team. Again, seven losses by double digits; four by 20+. They would have "swept New England" if they got a break in the the first game, but let's forget about the refs citing a rule that had never been called before or since to hand the Jets the prior game.

2. The four games they lost by 20+ were to Andy Dalton, Ryan Tannehill, EJ Manuel, and Jake Locker, each of whom put up 90+ QB ratings in those games.

3. The "four or five" exiled malcontents that were brought in only represented the entire receiving corps and starting running back of the 2011 season. Kudos to Rex for finding out why they were all so readily available, but if you're wondering why there were no receivers on the team from 2011 forward, there's your answer. And the "Super Bowl MVP" was available for a fifth round pick because he's 1. wildly overrated and 2. a giant a$$hole whom isn't allowed back in the Steelers building...but he was named Captain here and never saw a shred of discipline even after embarrassing the franchise vs the Dolphins. No worries, though: Rex fired Henry Ellard for daring to pull Holmes out of that game. Good times.

4. You telling me I'm overrating any coach is LOL territory.

 

1. No, that is only part of it.  If you read what I actually wrote, you'd see my point is that they weren't exactly a pushover when we played them.  They could have just as easily been at least 3-1 at that point, and not much would have had to change in their games for them to have been 4-0 entering the Jets game. Hey, they didn't, so f*ck 'em, but the team they needed to be (in order to be 4-0) isn't so different from the team they were (at 1-3).  They were a worse team as the season went on, and the game against us was seen as their whole season being on the line (but not for us).

 

2. So what? The team was a poor one.  You must be confusing me with someone who believes otherwise. The secondary was filled with a first-time starter from the 7th round, a stop-gap safety past his prime, a rookie who missed a bunch of camp and then was injured on & off during the season, and a former pro bowler who was good in name alone since he was the 102nd ranked CB in the league by season's end.  Compound that with the other side of the ball: a rookie who wasn't ready to start yet, barely anyone to throw to (and then even those guys all - every one of them - got injured themselves), and an OL that did a mediocre job at best on balance.  Personally I looked at the team they were going forward with and could see in the spring that Idzik had 1 goal in mind for 2013: wipe the slate clean of Tannenbaum's crappy contracts and begin the process of drafting a talented young team nearly from scratch, that didn't require a franchise tag level contract at every starting position.  But year 1 of this process was going to be ugly.  I expected it to be uglier, frankly.

 

3. Rex Ryan is not the GM now.  Rex Ryan was not the GM then.  Rex Ryan was not the head scout or owner or whatever you've conjured up.  He was a coach.  It is solely in a coaching capacity that I have any interest in seeing him on the Jets sideline.

 

4. You have, and you do.  I think I'm pretty even on Ryan and only really respond to those emotionally attached to his firing.  I think he's fine. Or more to the point, good enough if in the right scenario.  I don't think he's great and I don't think he's awful.  I don't think there has been this super scenario for him or anyone really since the drafting of Sanchez, and still we got pretty close a couple of times.  You also make up things from out of the air like inheriting a 9-7 team, and then gloss over the minor points of removing the player on each side of the ball who was seen as the most indispensable, plus a couple other starters on both sides.  But sure, totally the same team.  

[Sperm Edwards]

Preparation is key. With Rex, it seems the Jets always get too high off of wins...come out flat the following week and then use that as motivation the following week. It's draining. Hell it's draining as a fan. 

 

Belichick etc...don't treat wins as super accomplishments- it's just expected. It's not all because they have Tom Brady.

 

Granted, Belly's been a sh*tty drafter....but in season he still runs laps around Rex with regards to week to week prep. The worst I'd ever seen though was Herm. WHo was just lost.

 

Uh, we beat them once in 2 games last year, and only an unready rookie throwing 3 picks in the 4th quarter gave them their one 3-point victory against us.  

 

And you're totally wrong about Belichick anyway.  They had cameras in the locker room after that freaking buttfumble game and he and his team were celebrating like they'd just won the superbowl because of our pass D ranking heading into the game.

 

No argument on Herm.  It's the only reason I have any faith in Ryan in comparison.  I believe he is capable of outsmarting any HC in the game because we've seen it happen already.  Herm was a fool who was good or great at nothing, and ultimately was an empty suit.  An empty clown suit at that.

[Bleedin Green]

Quick response here, because, Jesus:

1. Pre-season predictions? The Jets were "picked" to win 3 and the Falcons were "predicted" to win 10, and this is your basis for declaring that beating an eventual 4-12 team was a more substantial achievement than beating a 4-win team. Again, seven losses by double digits; four by 20+. They would have "swept New England" if they got a break in the the first game, but let's forget about the refs citing a rule that had never been called before or since to hand the Jets the prior game.

2. The four games they lost by 20+ were to Andy Dalton, Ryan Tannehill, EJ Manuel, and Jake Locker, each of whom put up 90+ QB ratings in those games.

3. The "four or five" exiled malcontents that were brought in only represented the entire receiving corps and starting running back of the 2011 season. Kudos to Rex for finding out why they were all so readily available, but if you're wondering why there were no receivers on the team from 2011 forward, there's your answer. And the "Super Bowl MVP" was available for a fifth round pick because he's 1. wildly overrated and 2. a giant a$$hole whom isn't allowed back in the Steelers building...but he was named Captain here and never saw a shred of discipline even after embarrassing the franchise vs the Dolphins. No worries, though: Rex fired Henry Ellard for daring to pull Holmes out of that game. Good times.

4. You telling me I'm overrating any coach is LOL territory.

 

As far as your item #1 goes there, I'm curious, do you also feel it necessary to forget that the refs gave the Patriots a warning for committing the same penalty earlier in the game without calling it and the Patriots opted to do it again anyway?  Or, if we're going to talk about sh*tty officiating, let's talk about the real elephant in the room:  the Jets win that game in regulation if not for that phantom offensive PI call against Hill on his TD catch.  If you want to keep pushing the luck angle, at least stick with the Bucs game, because the Pats game doesn't hold up at all.

[slats]

Quick response here, because, Jesus:

4. You telling me I'm overrating any coach is LOL territory.

 

[CTM]

4. You telling me I'm overrating any coach is LOL territory.

 

No it's really not. Your vilification of Rex is driven by the naivety to think the grass is greener on the other side. You're a bitch who likes bitching and would bitch about any combination of GM/Coach they could put in here

[T0mShane]

No it's really not. Your vilification of Rex is driven by the naivety to think the grass is greener on the other side. You're a bitch who likes bitching and would bitch about any combination of GM/Coach they could put in here

You're a 74-year old WalMart greeter with psoriasis.

[T0mShane]

Admit that watching Rex try to run the program at USC would be the funniest 3 1/2 years of disaster-viewing ever.

[T0mShane]

As far as your item #1 goes there, I'm curious, do you also feel it necessary to forget that the refs gave the Patriots a warning for committing the same penalty earlier in the game without calling it and the Patriots opted to do it again anyway? Or, if we're going to talk about sh*tty officiating, let's talk about the real elephant in the room: the Jets win that game in regulation if not for that phantom offensive PI call against Hill on his TD catch. If you want to keep pushing the luck angle, at least stick with the Bucs game, because the Pats game doesn't hold up at all.

I wasn't making the almost-won/almost-lost argument. In context, I was showing Sperm how useless that mode is.

[T0mShane]

1. No, that is only part of it. If you read what I actually wrote, you'd see my point is that they weren't exactly a pushover when we played them. They could have just as easily been at least 3-1 at that point, and not much would have had to change in their games for them to have been 4-0 entering the Jets game. Hey, they didn't, so f*ck 'em, but the team they needed to be (in order to be 4-0) isn't so different from the team they were (at 1-3). They were a worse team as the season went on, and the game against us was seen as their whole season being on the line (but not for us).

2. So what? The team was a poor one. You must be confusing me with someone who believes otherwise. The secondary was filled with a first-time starter from the 7th round, a stop-gap safety past his prime, a rookie who missed a bunch of camp and then was injured on & off during the season, and a former pro bowler who was good in name alone since he was the 102nd ranked CB in the league by season's end. Compound that with the other side of the ball: a rookie who wasn't ready to start yet, barely anyone to throw to (and then even those guys all - every one of them - got injured themselves), and an OL that did a mediocre job at best on balance. Personally I looked at the team they were going forward with and could see in the spring that Idzik had 1 goal in mind for 2013: wipe the slate clean of Tannenbaum's crappy contracts and begin the process of drafting a talented young team nearly from scratch, that didn't require a franchise tag level contract at every starting position. But year 1 of this process was going to be ugly. I expected it to be uglier, frankly.

3. Rex Ryan is not the GM now. Rex Ryan was not the GM then. Rex Ryan was not the head scout or owner or whatever you've conjured up. He was a coach. It is solely in a coaching capacity that I have any interest in seeing him on the Jets sideline.

4. You have, and you do. I think I'm pretty even on Ryan and only really respond to those emotionally attached to his firing. I think he's fine. Or more to the point, good enough if in the right scenario. I don't think he's great and I don't think he's awful. I don't think there has been this super scenario for him or anyone really since the drafting of Sanchez, and still we got pretty close a couple of times. You also make up things from out of the air like inheriting a 9-7 team, and then gloss over the minor points of removing the player on each side of the ball who was seen as the most indispensable, plus a couple other starters on both sides. But sure, totally the same team.

We're just going to disagree on the extent of Rex's role in his own demise.

[CTM]

You're a 74-year old WalMart greeter with psoriasis.

 

 

How may I help you, Bitch

[slats]

Admit that watching Rex try to run the program at USC would be the funniest 3 1/2 years of disaster-viewing ever.

 

Rex won't have to regroup in the college ranks, but put in a situation like Pete where he's at a school with superior recruiting - it's national championships on a regular basis. 

[T0mShane]

Rex won't have to regroup in the college ranks, but put in a situation like Pete where he's at a school with superior recruiting - it's national championships on a regular basis.

Like Charlie Weis.

[slats]

Like Charlie Weis.

 

No, like a good coach. 

[Bugg]

Admit that watching Rex try to run the program at USC would be the funniest 3 1/2 years of disaster-viewing ever.

Carroll al least recongized his failings and addressed them. 

 

Rex? Stifle laughter here. And on the NCAA level Rex Ryan would on discipline and recruiting make Jimmy Johnson and Barry Switzer look like celibate cloistered monks. 

[ZachEY]

Basically I think you just overrate every other head coach in the league.

 

The build-up was worth it for the final line.