Patriots locker room attendant tried to put unapproved ball into AFC final

[CTM]

I explained this in detail in post #141 in this thread. But I will repeat it.

 

Grigson, complained to the league days before the game regarding the patriot footballs being deflated. The colts knew the refs were going to test the balls. All the colts had to do was fill thier footballs outside or in a unheated space like the visitors equipment room and those balls would not suffer any PSI loss due to a change in ambient temp.

the only psi loss that the colts balls would experience is a loss to to the balls becoming wet and the resultant pressure loss due to becoming wet. If the colts filled thier balls to 13psi or more, they would still be over `12.5 at anytime during the game. High school chemistry.

 

 

Ahh, so the Colts engineered this whole situation purposely by giving themselves a competitive disadvantage in the championship game. 

 

Certainly makes a lot more sense then the simpler truth that the scumbag patriots were cheating again.

[patman]

Are you seriously trying to praise the Pats because they released a player who they knew would be in the middle of a murder trial?

Do you homers have any pride?

No, I did not want them to. If they waited a couple of days for the NFL to do it, they would have saved 2.5 mill on the cap.  He goes to jail either way, I rather have the pats have 2.5 mill more cap room. Plus now if he does beat it, the pats will owe him about 6 mill more that they would not have if the NFL suspended him.

[Jet Fan RI]

Again, you are talking about millionaire players who don't carry their own luggage and they are going to put a lock on the thermostat to save 50 bucks in heat for Sunday. Even Charley Finley from the As who charged his players for soda would not do that. These guys probably have guys that wipe down the machines after them for the next guy to use after they work out.  

 

And why is Green Eliis still playing if he is putting the ball on the ground. He would not be playing in NE putting the ball on the ground. And tell me how do you assign a numerical value to a human performance in different circumstances different locations, different run options, different  blockers, injury, it cannot be done and no scientist working at columbia would sign his name to it for any reason other than in abstract.

 

It is simply my opinion that the thermostat is set at a certain value and kept there. If this is not the case, it will come out in the investigation. The point though is that that locker room temperature must be investigated, as far as is feasible.

 

What I said about Greenellis is that he had/has average fumble stats before and after the Pats, and zero fumbles with the Pats, not that his fumbles stood out before and after. What stands out, like a sore thumb, is that zero fumble rate while with the Pats.

 

I think plotting the fumbles for several players will average out the random influences of locations. What won't average out is any bias due to cheating.

[JohnnyLV]

I explained this in detail in post #141 in this thread. But I will repeat it.

 

Grigson, complained to the league days before the game regarding the patriot footballs being deflated. The colts knew the refs were going to test the balls. All the colts had to do was fill thier footballs outside or in a unheated space like the visitors equipment room and those balls would not suffer any PSI loss due to a change in ambient temp.

the only psi loss that the colts balls would experience is a loss to to the balls becoming wet and the resultant pressure loss due to becoming wet. If the colts filled thier balls to 13psi or more, they would still be over `12.5 at anytime during the game. High school chemistry.

 

 

That's the dumbest post I have ever read. Occam's Razor, simplest explanation is almost always correct. Simplest explanation, also backed by statistics....the Patriots intentionally cheated knowing full well deflated balls provide a large advantage in inclement weather and fumble prevention.

[patman]

Ahh, so the Colts engineered this whole situation purposely by giving themselves a competitive disadvantage in the championship game. 

 

Certainly makes a lot more sense then the simpler truth that the scumbag patriots were cheating again.

How do the colts put them selves at a competitive disadvantage. They played with the balls inflated to the same PSI that they normally play with. And it was well proven game time when the pats played with re-inflated footballs played at a much higher level.

[AFCEastFan]

Same here, the colts have had some knuckleheads doing some stupid stuff in the off season. I dont make excuses for them either.

 

Then I take it you believed Dwight Dixon when he said that Marvin Harrison shot him? 

[Jet9]

I nominate patman's parents for Sainthood. There's no other way a person could put up with his utter nonsense.

[CTM]

How do the colts put them selves at a competitive disadvantage. They played with the balls inflated to the same PSI that they normally play with. And it was well proven game time when the pats played with re-inflated footballs played at a much higher level.

 

So now you are saying that deflated balls are a disadvantage, 10th grade science'd

[patman]

It is simply my opinion that the thermostat is set at a certain value and kept there. If this is not the case, it will come out in the investigation. The point though is that that locker room temperature must be investigated, as far as is feasible.

 

What I said about Greenellis is that he had/has average fumble stats before and after the Pats, and zero fumbles with the Pats, not that his fumbles stood out before and after. What stands out, like a sore thumb, is that zero fumble rate while with the Pats.

 

I think plotting the fumbles for several players will average out the random influences of locations. What won't average out is any bias due to cheating.

Yes it sticks out, but it is only conjecture as you can not quantify something that has some many variables. 

 

And no place I know of know has a Thermostat in a set it and forget it mode in a 15,000 sq foot room that is used every day. That is not very green. 

[patman]

So now you are saying that deflated balls are a disadvantage, 10th grade science'd

No, I did not say they were an advantage or a disadvantage, just that the colts Balls were as they "normally" would be at home but just wet.

 

I am pointing out that during that game, it can not be said that playing with a less inflated ball was an advantage when  after playing with a ball at 12.5 yielded better results.

[Jet Fan RI]

Yes it sticks out, but it is only conjecture as you can not quantify something that has some many variables. 

 

And no place I know of know has a Thermostat in a set it and forget it mode in a 15,000 sq foot room that is used every day. That is not very green. 

 

If there are enough players with before-, during-, and after-Pats histories, the variables will indeed average out. And as it turns out, there are also statistical methods that can illustrate exactly how far the variables have indeed averaged out. Statistics is a refined science.

 

I am only talking about the times the facilities are in use during and before a game with respect to thermostat settings. During those times, I think the temperature would be set at a constant value. In any event, the truth should be uncovered in the investigation.

[patman]

I nominate patman's parents for Sainthood. There's no other way a person could put up with his utter nonsense.

Well thank you, but my parents died over 50 years ago.

[CTM]

No, I did not say they were an advantage or a disadvantage, just that the colts Balls were as they "normally" would be at home but just wet.

 

I am pointing out that during that game, it can not be said that playing with a less inflated ball was an advantage when  after playing with a ball at 12.5 yielded better results.

 

it is hard to argue that gaining 3 less yards in the second half unequivocally proves your deflated ball theory

[Jet9]

Well thank you, but my parents died over 50 years ago.

I'm very sorry to hear that. Lost my dad 10 years ago.

To be honest though, I thought you were like 20.

[patman]

it is hard to argue that gaining 3 less yards in the second half unequivocally proves your deflated ball theory

Because scoring is what matters, they scored more with a proper inflated ball, and the pats did put the brakes on some 1/2 way thru the forth.

[patman]

I'm very sorry to hear that. Lost my dad 10 years ago.

To be honest though, I thought you were like 20.

63 and retired, when I was 20 I would have been too busy to be posting this much. First patriot game was 63 at Fenway.

[CTM]

Because scoring is what matters, they scored more with a proper inflated ball, and the pats did put the brakes on some 1/2 way thru the forth.

 

Never mind the Colts turned it over 2 times in the second half and 0 in the first.. and that their longest drive of the second half was 6 plays, that has no impact on Pats scoring

[patman]

Never mind the Colts turned it over 2 times in the second half and 0 in the first.. and that their longest drive of the second half was 6 plays, that has no impact on Pats scoring

Did you watch the game with your eyes? , did the pats play better on offense in the first half or 2nd.  Maybe Collins and Revis catch the ball better when it is inflated to 12.5 lbs and not drop it when it is not fully inflated    . You probaly turned the game off once the pats went ahead and now your looking at a box score like it was a baseball game.

[Jet9]

63 and retired, when I was 20 I would have been too busy to be posting this much. First patriot game was 63 at Fenway.

Pretty cool

[afosomf]

Bullsh*t, another strawman. The pats cut him before the NFL suspended him. Unlike the ravens with Lewis.

U missed point Klondike

 

all data  on Hernandez is circumstantial just like data in deflategate.  Hernandez is guilty just as Pats are in Deflategate

[CTM]

Did you watch the game with your eyes? , did the pats play better on offense in the first half or 2nd.  Maybe Collins and Revis catch the ball better when it is inflated to 12.5 lbs and not drop it when it is not fully inflated    . You probaly turned the game off once the pats went ahead and now your looking at a box score like it was a baseball game.

 

Colts offense played worse in second half 2 TO's, longest drive 6 plays. Pats offense benefited as a result, not to mention the colts were mentally beat in the third quarter. But i still don't understand why you think 5 drives proves a damn thing

[patman]

U missed point Klondike

 

all data  on Hernandez is circumstantial just like data in deflategate.  Hernandez is guilty just as Pats are in Deflategate

oh, so because all cases that rely on circumstantial evidence points to guilt now.  OK got it. thanks.

[afosomf]

oh, so because all cases that rely on circumstantial evidence points to guilt now.  OK got it. thanks.

The Facts your Honor

 

ALL COLTS BALLS PASSED PSI

 

ALL PATS BALLED FAILED PSI

[patman]

If there are enough players with before-, during-, and after-Pats histories, the variables will indeed average out. And as it turns out, there are also statistical methods that can illustrate exactly how far the variables have indeed averaged out. Statistics is a refined science.

 

I am only talking about the times the facilities are in use during and before a game with respect to thermostat settings. During those times, I think the temperature would be set at a constant value. In any event, the truth should be uncovered in the investigation.

Oh yes, they will average out and how many samples would be required to encompass all those variables associated with human endeavor resulting from play outside by different people in different locations, running different patterns, for teams that place different values on ball security=job security, what would you say 200 pieces of data (runners)

[patman]

The Facts your Honor

 

ALL COLTS BALLS PASSED PSI

 

ALL PATS BALLED FAILED PSI

God, you are ignorant, all that is known is that it has been reported that all colt's balls passed. No one on this site knows how many balls failed and by how much. They are various reports from different sources Mort, Rappaport, PFT that all vary in the amount of balls that were out of spec and by how much.

[CTM]

The Facts your Honor

 

ALL COLTS BALLS PASSED PSI

 

ALL PATS BALLED FAILED PSI

 

 

The colts purposely inflated in cold air, knowing that their balls would retain the proper pressure, while NE's would not. They did this for the express purpose of making NE look like cheaters, and weren't concerned with any disadvantage this may have caused them in the AFCC. Their gambit was proven solid, NE was vilified in the press and since NE accumulated -3 more yards in 5 second half drives with full inflated balls (vs 5 first half drives), it is conclusively proven that there is no advantage to under inflation anyway.

[patman]

The colts purposely inflated in cold air, knowing that their balls would retain the proper pressure, while NE's would not. They did this for the express purpose of making NE look like cheaters, and weren't concerned with any disadvantage this may have caused them in the AFCC. Their gambit was proven solid, NE was vilified in the press and since NE accumulated -3 more yards in 5 second half drives with full inflated balls (vs 5 first half drives), it is conclusively proven that there is no advantage to under inflation anyway.

By drives, what kind of data point is that? How many yards can the pats gain when they take over the ball on the colts 13 yard line one time and on the 40 another due to interceptions, The only data point that matters in football is points scored, how many points were scored in the first 30min time period and how many points were scored in the 2nd 30 min period.   

[rillo]

Holy sh*t patman is in his sixties?

[PFSIKH]

The Facts your Honor

 

ALL COLTS BALLS PASSED PSI

 

ALL PATS BALLED FAILED PSI

 

You cannot even get this right.  11 of 12 failed.

[CTM]

By drives, what kind of data point is that? How many yards can the pats gain when they take over the ball on the colts 13 yard line one time and on the 40 another due to interceptions, The only data point that matters in football is points scored, how many points were scored in the first 30min time period and how many points were scored in the 2nd 30 min period.   

 

 

lol.. So you can see the impact of turnovers on yards, but not points? Question, is it more likely for you to score points when starting at opponents 13 or your own?

[Jet Fan RI]

Oh yes, they will average out and how many samples would be required to encompass all those variables associated with human endeavor resulting from play outside by different people in different locations, running different patterns, for teams that place different values on ball security=job security, what would you say 200 pieces of data (runners)

 

I would not want to hazard a guess. And since I am not on the investigative team's payroll, I am not willing to work out the statistical analysis. But I am confident the Columbia guys will do just that.

 

And I truly hope I am not mistaken about that.

[Jet Fan RI]

You cannot even get this right.  11 of 12 failed.

 

 

Actually, the report was that all 12 balls were under inflated. Eleven by 2 psi, the 12th by a lesser amount.

[patman]

Holy sh*t patman is in his sixties?

yep, older than dirt

[patman]

Actually, the report was that all 12 balls were under inflated. Eleven by 2 psi, the 12th by a lesser amount.

Again, we don't know this. Rappaport and PFT said one thing, mort said another. That is why I put it into the "we do not know" column.

[Jet Fan RI]

Again, we don't know this. Rappaport and PFT said one thing, mort said another. That is why I put it into the "we do not know" column.

 

Well, we do know what one of the reports said. And that is all I responding to when it was claimed only 11 of the 12 were under inflated. One of the reports indeed said all 12 were under inflated, so the person who simply pointed that out has no cause for being derided for ignorance.