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DaBallhawk

By DaBallhawk
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slats

slats

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lol, NOBODY is trading a 4th for Milliner! The guy is coming of an Achilles injury okay and probably won't be ready to start the season. Enough with the Milliner trades.  Can we at least wait until the guy gets back on the field? 

 

Exactly. Milliner is at the bottom of his trade value right now, but his contract is affordable. I'm sure the Jets would like to see Milliner or McDougle displace Cromartie by next season, but you at least want to be able to show that these guys are healed before trying to move one of them. 

 

And as we learned the hard way last year, a surplus of CBs is a good thing to have. 

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DaBallhawk

DaBallhawk

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Our deep threat?

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SenorGato

SenorGato

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Really? What's funny about it?

He faked getting a DUI on April Fool's Day on Twitter. Have you ever seen Twitter reactions to celebrities and athletes when they **** up? Now imagine that crowd finding out all the venom they just sent a stranger was built around a joke on them. What isn't funny about that?

I can imagine the self righteous bullsh*t just thrown at him...ommmggeeeerd how dare you joke about duiiiiiis I know someone me me me this is about me more me hear me. Or the punishments suggested for such a heinous crime. Whether it be a fine, suspension, getting fired, actually getting a DUI, the chair, a car accident, etc....

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JetsRay

JetsRay

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He faked getting a DUI on April Fool's Day on Twitter. Have you ever seen Twitter reactions to celebrities and athletes when they **** up? Now imagine that crowd finding out all the venom they just sent a stranger was built around a joke on them. What isn't funny about that?

I can imagine the self righteous bullsh*t just thrown at him...ommmggeeeerd how dare you joke about duiiiiiis I know someone me me me this is about me more me hear me. Or the punishments suggested for such a heinous crime. Whether it be a fine, suspension, getting fired, actually getting a DUI, the chair, a car accident, etc....

 

At first, my response to the Irvin tweets, was "oooh, that might have been a bad choice," but after reading your response, I was only falling victim of the same PC crowed you are obliterating, I agree with you, Irvin owned everybody, **** them all!

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#27TheDominator

#27TheDominator

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lol, NOBODY is trading a 4th for Milliner! The guy is coming of an Achilles injury okay and probably won't be ready to start the season. Enough with the Milliner trades.  Can we at least wait until the guy gets back on the field? 

 

 

Exactly. Milliner is at the bottom of his trade value right now, but his contract is affordable. I'm sure the Jets would like to see Milliner or McDougle displace Cromartie by next season, but you at least want to be able to show that these guys are healed before trying to move one of them. 

 

And as we learned the hard way last year, a surplus of CBs is a good thing to have. 

 

 

He is at the bottom of his value, but the Dolphins signed Brent Grimes to a $5.5M/year contract coming off his Achilles.  It's not like teams will never take a risk.  Grimes wasn't ready to join the Dolphins off-season conditioning program when he was signed, but he was supposedly getting close.  Milliner might be further behind.  He is supposed to be ready in early summer.

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DaBallhawk

DaBallhawk

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If somebody is willing to give up a 1st for Trent Richardson, if Kiko Alonso can be traded for another young starter then obviously Dee still has a lot of value around the NFL. Is somebody going to offer us a top 5 pick? No. That wouldn't even happen if he was healthy, if he made the Pro Bowl last year. But I don't see why if his agent went around telling teams he can be had for a 2nd round pick nobody would jump on it and tried to make that happen. And to me a 2nd round pick would be enough. We can find a good corner in round 2 if that's what you want. Somebody who isn't made of glass. Or any other position for that matter. The odds of Dee staying healthy for a full season in the next 5-10 years are slim to none. He can't do it. And the more injuries he suffers the less impact he's gonna have and pretty soon he's gonna hang up the cleats. Like a Sidney Rice. All the skill, talent, potential in the world means nothing if you can't stay healthy. So I rather have somebody decent who will play 16 games per year instead of a potential All Pro who spends more time rehabbing than he does actually playing...

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#27TheDominator

#27TheDominator

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But I don't see why if his agent went around telling teams he can be had for a 2nd round pick nobody would jump on it and tried to make that happen.

 

We can find a good corner in round 2 if that's what you want. Somebody who isn't made of glass.

 

Aren't these two statements contradictory?  If you can get a good CB in round 2 that is better to have on the team than Milliner, why wouldn't the other team just draft that 2nd round corner?  I actually disagree with both points.  I don't think you can get a 2nd for Milliner right now AND I don't think you have such a great shot at getting a good corner in round 2. 

 

FWIW, I would rather have the all-pro rehabbing. It's much easier to catch lightning in the playoffs with those guys like the Giants did.  Twice.  Great or injured is good because it is a bonus.  Average is average all the time.  What would you rather have?  Revis for half the games and Walls for the rest or 2013 Antonio Cromartie? 

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Ghost

Ghost

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If somebody is willing to give up a 1st for Trent Richardson, if Kiko Alonso can be traded for another young starter then obviously Dee still has a lot of value around the NFL. Is somebody going to offer us a top 5 pick? No. That wouldn't even happen if he was healthy, if he made the Pro Bowl last year. But I don't see why if his agent went around telling teams he can be had for a 2nd round pick nobody would jump on it and tried to make that happen. And to me a 2nd round pick would be enough. We can find a good corner in round 2 if that's what you want. Somebody who isn't made of glass. Or any other position for that matter. The odds of Dee staying healthy for a full season in the next 5-10 years are slim to none. He can't do it. And the more injuries he suffers the less impact he's gonna have and pretty soon he's gonna hang up the cleats. Like a Sidney Rice. All the skill, talent, potential in the world means nothing if you can't stay healthy. So I rather have somebody decent who will play 16 games per year instead of a potential All Pro who spends more time rehabbing than he does actually playing...

I have to disagree with you on this one. Kiko played good enough to be considered DROY and as bad as Trent is today, he was a monster his rookie season. Those plays at least showed superstar potential. Milliner, on the other hand, can barely stay on the field and when he does manage to stay healthy, his gameplay is very inconsistent.

At this point, I prefer not to trade him. WTF is a 5th round pick? I'd rather keep Dee and just pray he turns it all around.

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DaBallhawk

DaBallhawk

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Aren't these two statements contradictory?  If you can get a good CB in round 2 that is better to have on the team than Milliner, why wouldn't the other team just draft that 2nd round corner?  I actually disagree with both points.  I don't think you can get a 2nd for Milliner right now AND I don't think you have such a great shot at getting a good corner in round 2. 

 

FWIW, I would rather have the all-pro rehabbing. It's much easier to catch lightning in the playoffs with those guys like the Giants did.  Twice.  Great or injured is good because it is a bonus.  Average is average all the time.  What would you rather have?  Revis for half the games and Walls for the rest or 2013 Antonio Cromartie? 

 

Not at all. There is no guarantee that the guy you're picking in round 2 ends up being solid. And teams aren't looking for solid players, they want stars. Dee has the potential to be that, if he can stay healthy. In the end it's up to teams to decide if they want to gamble on Dee being able to stay healthy, then he has a chance to become a star. The odds of you getting that type of player in round 2 are slim to none. While I don't think a trade is going to happen because he just isn't available (I'd assume), a 2nd round pick seems about right for Dee at this point.

 

As for Revis, that comparison doesn't really work. He's not made of glass, he tore his knee once, otherwise he played every game in his career I think. He's about as reliable as it gets. And he was a proven All Pro corner by that point, maybe the best player skillwise this franchise has ever had. Dee is made of glass, and he hasn't proven anything yet. Of course I'd rather have Revis for 8 games instead of Cro for 16 games. That's not what we're talking about here. Would you rather have Dee who is made of glass and could turn out to be a Pro Bowler or a complete bust, over a guy like...let's say Desmond Trufant? Darius Slay? Xavier Rhodes? All of them were drafted the same year, in the 1st round. None of them have the same upside, but they're rock solid at this point. I think I'd rather have one of those instead of Dee. I'm not saying I would try to make that trade happen, I don't mind gambling on Dee, but if those teams came up and offered me either of those 3 I'd probably make that deal. Value wise he should be worth a 2nd rounder. Look at what Kiko Alonso was worth. He barely makes any money. A young Pro Bowl RB with a huge contract included. And linebackers aren't even close to cornerbacks in terms of value

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DaBallhawk

DaBallhawk

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I have to disagree with you on this one. Kiko played good enough to be considered DROY and as bad as Trent is today, he was a monster his rookie season. Those plays at least showed superstar potential. Milliner, on the other hand, can barely stay on the field and when he does manage to stay healthy, his gameplay is very inconsistent.

At this point, I prefer not to trade him. WTF is a 5th round pick? I'd rather keep Dee and just pray he turns it all around.

 

I said 2nd round pick, not 5th round pick. ;-)

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#27TheDominator

#27TheDominator

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Not at all. There is no guarantee that the guy you're picking in round 2 ends up being solid. And teams aren't looking for solid players, they want stars. Dee has the potential to be that, if he can stay healthy. In the end it's up to teams to decide if they want to gamble on Dee being able to stay healthy, then he has a chance to become a star. The odds of you getting that type of player in round 2 are slim to none. While I don't think a trade is going to happen because he just isn't available (I'd assume), a 2nd round pick seems about right for Dee at this point.

 

As for Revis, that comparison doesn't really work. He's not made of glass, he tore his knee once, otherwise he played every game in his career I think. He's about as reliable as it gets. And he was a proven All Pro corner by that point, maybe the best player skillwise this franchise has ever had. Dee is made of glass, and he hasn't proven anything yet. Of course I'd rather have Revis for 8 games instead of Cro for 16 games. That's not what we're talking about here. Would you rather have Dee who is made of glass and could turn out to be a Pro Bowler or a complete bust, over a guy like...let's say Desmond Trufant? Darius Slay? Xavier Rhodes? All of them were drafted the same year, in the 1st round. None of them have the same upside, but they're rock solid at this point. I think I'd rather have one of those instead of Dee. I'm not saying I would try to make that trade happen, I don't mind gambling on Dee, but if those teams came up and offered me either of those 3 I'd probably make that deal. Value wise he should be worth a 2nd rounder. Look at what Kiko Alonso was worth. He barely makes any money. A young Pro Bowl RB with a huge contract included. And linebackers aren't even close to cornerbacks in terms of value

 

It wasn't a comparison.  It was a hypothetical. 

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DaBallhawk

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DaBallhawk

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#27TheDominator

#27TheDominator

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But what does that have to do with the point I made about who I'd rather have?

 

You are talking about specific players and making all kinds of comments.  I was talking about:

 

 

So I rather have somebody decent who will play 16 games per year instead of a potential All Pro who spends more time rehabbing than he does actually playing

Most teams would prefer an all-pro level for a brief time to a lesser player overall.  As I stated, the Giants won the super bowl getting healthy.  Twice.  A guy like Damon Bradshaw carried them for spells through the playoffs, but can't stay healthy. I'm sure they would prefer him to Bilal Powell.  If you want ot talk about why Revis is better than Milliner, that is fine, but not related to my point. Your opinion on Milliner is yours to have, but it does not seem to coincide with him bringing back a second.

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DaBallhawk

DaBallhawk

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I don't know who Damon Bradshaw is. You mean Ahmad? He was a 7th round pick who never even made the Pro Bowl, playing a position that was totally dependant on the guys up front blocking. He never had All Pro potential. His upside was about the same as Bilal's. Give Bilal good blocking, a good passing game and a good defense and odds are he'll put up similar numbers, if not better. They're both basically the same guy, potential and skill wise.

 

I was talking about a potential All Pro player who is always hurt. Blue chip type players. I can't really come up with an example right now. Let's say Dee vs Darius Slay. Who'd you rather have right now on your team? I'd go with Slay. You brought up Revis and Walls later on. And I'm not saying I would try to make that trade happen, but if I had a chance on draft day to make a pick between the two knowing how the next 2 years would look like for both guys, I'd go with Slay. That's all.

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DaBallhawk

DaBallhawk

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Anyway:

 

 

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#27TheDominator

#27TheDominator

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I don't know who Damon Bradshaw is. You mean Ahmad? He was a 7th round pick who never even made the Pro Bowl, playing a position that was totally dependant on the guys up front blocking. He never had All Pro potential. His upside was about the same as Bilal's. Give Bilal good blocking, a good passing game and a good defense and odds are he'll put up similar numbers, if not better. They're both basically the same guy, potential and skill wise.

 

I was talking about a potential All Pro player who is always hurt. Blue chip type players. I can't really come up with an example right now. Let's say Dee vs Darius Slay. Who'd you rather have right now on your team? I'd go with Slay. You brought up Revis and Walls later on. And I'm not saying I would try to make that trade happen, but if I had a chance on draft day to make a pick between the two knowing how the next 2 years would look like for both guys, I'd go with Slay. That's all.

 

Damon Bradshaw was a motocross guy.  I meant Ahmad. 

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slats

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He is at the bottom of his value, but the Dolphins signed Brent Grimes to a $5.5M/year contract coming off his Achilles.  It's not like teams will never take a risk.  Grimes wasn't ready to join the Dolphins off-season conditioning program when he was signed, but he was supposedly getting close.  Milliner might be further behind.  He is supposed to be ready in early summer.

The bold is the bottom line for me regarding trading Milliner. Is it possible that someone will make a crazy offer? Yes, it's possible. I'd also say that it's highly unlikely. If someone wants to make that offer, I'd gladly take it. But this is no time for the Jets to be shopping Milliner. They're better off seeing if he can get/stay healthy and be a useful piece on their team, rather than trading him for pennies on the dollar.

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