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Tom Brady Suspended 4 games, Pats forfeit 2016 1st rounder and 2017 4th rounder


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Genius? You think he'd risk crushing his legacy, crushing their franchise, losing his job/career...for what? Softer footballs? After all the sh*t the Pats/Bill have went through in terms of cheating? Please. Give the man a little more credit. He's smarter than that.

 

I could go either way. But we probably will never know for sure.

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You don't believe that the most detail-oriented, meticulous genius HC in the history of the league had any knowledge of what was happening with the team's footballs?

 

Really?

 

I would say it is most likely the reason Brady did not surrender his phone.  not a chance in hell Bellicheat did not know this.  

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Did you see the NFL's Belichick an NFL Life shows?  He cannot program the time in his SUV.  Do you think he can use a cell phone?  Plus, that would leave a data trail.  :)

 

While I do not disagree with your point on Belichick seeking an advantage, the ball is Tom's domain. 

 

As he has said many time over the years, he does things to the ball in order to make practice harder and the team better.

Doesn't it stand to reason that if the man knows how to do things to the ball to make practice harder, that he also has a complete understanding of what to do to a football to make games easier? And having that understanding, would you really put it past him to want to gain that advantage?

And the clock in my car will be one hour off until it's time once again to fall back, but that hasn't stopped me from learning how to text.

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Genius? You think he'd risk crushing his legacy, crushing their franchise, losing his job/career...for what? Softer footballs? After all the sh*t the Pats/Bill have went through in terms of cheating? Please. Give the man a little more credit. He's smarter than that.

Smarts have nothing to do with hubris. This is the guy who kept on spying after being told to cut it out.

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i doubt he knew everything.  do you think he knows the type of shoulder pads his middle linebacker prefers to wear? 

 

i think it was just between the player and the equipment guy.  brady tells him, i like the balls extra soft.  do whatever you need to do to make it happen. 

Does he know waht some special teamer likes? probably not. Does he know what Teddy Breuschi preferred? I'd say there's a good chance he did.

 

We're not talking about pads here. We're talking about the actual game balls. Could there be a competitive advantaged to be gained? I think we all know what BB* thinks of those. You think he didn't realize his team's amazingly low turnover rate?

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He's smart enough to realize he can win championships by gaining a competitive edge while facing relatively small penalties.  In the end it doesn't matter to him that he lost a 1st rounder.  He's still got 4 titles and he isn't losing his job anytime soon.  They've been getting away with stuff for 15 years and have only been penalized twice.  The cost/benefit analysis has told him to keep cheating in any way possible, no matter how small each individual act seems to be in impacting winning games.

 

Don't you think if he was going to cheat and risk all that he'd do it in a better way? Than to soften up footballs? I mean come on. I hate the guy like anyone else does but it just doesn't add up. And again, they checked, the NFL tried to find evidence that he was in on it, they couldn't. They looked for evidence, there was nothing. Did he know about it? It's possible. He's got the track record. But everything we've seen would suggest that he had nothing to do with this. The same way Bowles wouldn't have anything to do or any knowledge of somebody on our team using PED's, a receiver using stickum, whatever. I don't think Bill was in on it. I could be wrong, but I'm 95% sure he had nothing to do with this. And I don't say that because I like him or the Pats, it's just what I believe. I have no reason to defend him or the Pats.

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Don't you think if he was going to cheat and risk all that he'd do it in a better way? Than to soften up footballs? I mean come on. I hate the guy like anyone else does but it just doesn't add up. And again, they checked, the NFL tried to find evidence that he was in on it, they couldn't. They looked for evidence, there was nothing. Did he know about it? It's possible. He's got the track record. But everything we've seen would suggest that he had nothing to do with this. The same way Bowles wouldn't have anything to do or any knowledge of somebody on our team using PED's, a receiver using stickum, whatever. I don't think Bill was in on it. I could be wrong, but I'm 95% sure he had nothing to do with this. And I don't say that because I like him or the Pats, it's just what I believe. I have no reason to defend him or the Pats.

 

What do you mean "cheat in a better way"?  Softening up the footballs prevents turnovers.  That's a pretty damn nice advantage to have.  And when it comes to serial cheaters, it doesn't matter if it's a big or small advantage.  There are a lot of things Belichick continues to cheat that just haven't been exposed yet.  You still get opposing teams coming in to New England complaining about headsets not working.  The ineligible receiver formation wasn't "cheating" but it was yet another way the Pats found a loophole.  There's reasons why the Patriots still seem to know exactly what the opponent is doing, especially during home games.  It's not JUST the deflating of footballs that was giving Belichick's teams an edge lately.  It's just one of many little operations that are part of the "Patriot Way".

 

You're 95 % sure he had nothing to do with this?  Really?  Then why has he been dead silent about it?  Why didn't Brady turn over his phone, or even do Ted Wells' "Plan B", where he and his agent pick and choose which texts to send him? 

 

Belichick knows EXACTLY what is going on with every little aspect of the Patriot Crime Organization, yet was clueless about this?  C'mon.  Quit being naive.

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What do you mean "cheat in a better way"?  Softening up the footballs prevents turnovers.  That's a pretty damn nice advantage to have.  And when it comes to serial cheaters, it doesn't matter if it's a big or small advantage.  There are a lot of things Belichick continues to cheat that just haven't been exposed yet.  You still get opposing teams coming in to New England complaining about headsets not working.  The ineligible receiver formation wasn't "cheating" but it was yet another way the Pats found a loophole.  There's reasons why the Patriots still seem to know exactly what the opponent is doing, especially during home games.  It's not JUST the deflating of footballs that was giving Belichick's teams an edge lately.  It's just one of many little operations that are part of the "Patriot Way".

 

You're 95 % sure he had nothing to do with this?  Really?  Then why has he been dead silent about it?  Why didn't Brady turn over his phone, or even do Ted Wells' "Plan B", where he and his agent pick and choose which texts to send him? 

 

Belichick knows EXACTLY what is going on with every little aspect of the Patriot Crime Organization, yet was clueless about this?  C'mon.  Quit being naive.

 

Patriots do everything they can to get even the tiniest advantage. The football thing is just one of those things getting exposed. There are dozens of other little things they do that we don't know about. Each of these things alone may not seem like a big deal, but they all add up.

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What do you mean "cheat in a better way"?  Softening up the footballs prevents turnovers.  That's a pretty damn nice advantage to have.  And when it comes to serial cheaters, it doesn't matter if it's a big or small advantage.  There are a lot of things Belichick continues to cheat that just haven't been exposed yet.  You still get opposing teams coming in to New England complaining about headsets not working.  The ineligible receiver formation wasn't "cheating" but it was yet another way the Pats found a loophole.  There's reasons why the Patriots still seem to know exactly what the opponent is doing, especially during home games.  It's not JUST the deflating of footballs that was giving Belichick's teams an edge lately.  It's just one of many little operations that are part of the "Patriot Way".

 

You're 95 % sure he had nothing to do with this?  Really?  Then why has he been dead silent about it?  Why didn't Brady turn over his phone, or even do Ted Wells' "Plan B", where he and his agent pick and choose which texts to send him? 

 

Belichick knows EXACTLY what is going on with every little aspect of the Patriot Crime Organization, yet was clueless about this?  C'mon.  Quit being naive.

 

I'm not sure what your point is. What is he supposed to say? And what does that prove? What exactly is your evidence, what exactly is it that makes you think that he was in on it? Except for your hatred towards the Pats and BB? That's not a great argument. What else is there that makes you say he was in on it? He should have known? That's all? When the NFL has tried and failed to come up with evidence that he was tied to it? Everything suggests that he had nothing to do with it. That's what I go by.

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I'm not sure what your point is. What is he supposed to say? And what does that prove? What exactly is your evidence, what exactly is it that makes you think that he was in on it? Except for your hatred towards the Pats and BB? That's not a great argument. What else is there that makes you say he was in on it? He should have known? That's all? When the NFL has tried and failed to come up with evidence that he was tied to it? Everything suggests that he had nothing to do with it. That's what I go by.

 

My evidence?  It's on Brady's phone and he refused to surrender it. 

 

Belichick deserves zero benefit of the doubt.  Spygate, RadioGate, IneligbibleEligibleReceiverGate, and now DeflateGate.  Kraft, Belichick and Brady are all common denominators for institutional cheating.  And that's just the things we KNOW about.  Belichick has spent the last 15 years being a slimy, cheating scumbag both on and off the field (he cheated on his wife too) yet he didn't know about this one.  Yeah, ok.

 

You say he's a very smart guy.  Of course he is.  That's why he didn't get caught on this one. 

 

One final point:  If Belichick wasn't involved, why did the organization get fined $1M and the team lose draft picks?  After all, if this was all just Brady's idea, it should have just been a 6-8 game suspension for Brady and no penalty for the team itself, right?  They penalized the organization because this isn't the first rodeo.  Kraft and Belichick are very much involved in every aspect of the organization.  Even if they didn't engage in the cheating itself, they had awareness of it and were OK with it.

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My evidence?  It's on Brady's phone and he refused to surrender it. 

 

Belichick deserves zero benefit of the doubt.  Spygate, RadioGate, IneligbibleReceiverGate, and now DeflateGate.  Kraft, Belichick and Brady are all common denominators for institutional cheating.  And that's just the things we KNOW about.  Belichick has spent the last 15 years being a slimy, cheating scumbag both on and off the field (he cheated on his wife too) yet he didn't know about this one.  Yeah, ok.

 

Enough with the "gates." Switch it up from time to time. Let's agree to call the current scandal "Ballghazi."

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I don't care if they lower it to one quarter of one game. I just want him suspended. So the label -- cheater -- will always stick.[\b]

Didnt the Wells report do that alone? Especially around here? Ha ha i dont think any suspension in the court in the court public opinions makes any difference
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My evidence?  It's on Brady's phone and he refused to surrender it. 

 

Belichick deserves zero benefit of the doubt.  Spygate, RadioGate, IneligbibleEligibleReceiverGate, and now DeflateGate.  Kraft, Belichick and Brady are all common denominators for institutional cheating.  And that's just the things we KNOW about.  Belichick has spent the last 15 years being a slimy, cheating scumbag both on and off the field (he cheated on his wife too) yet he didn't know about this one.  Yeah, ok.

 

You say he's a very smart guy.  Of course he is.  That's why he didn't get caught on this one. 

 

One final point:  If Belichick wasn't involved, why did the organization get fined $1M and the team lose draft picks?  After all, if this was all just Brady's idea, it should have just been a 6-8 game suspension for Brady and no penalty for the team itself, right?

 

Stop it. We don't know what those other texts say that Brady has and won't give up. And why would he? We all know he's guilty, he's the mastermind behind all this. What does he gain by giving up more evidence? Why would he get himself in even more trouble? He can't prove anymore that he's innocent, so what's the point?

 

And why the Pats got fined I don't know. I said that I don't agree with the fine. It was (IMO) one player, it's not the organization. I guess the NFL went back and looked at the Sean Payton case and considering that the Patriots have been punished already for Spygate the NFL felt like they had to drop the hammer this time. 1 million dollars? That's double the amount they got fined for spygate. For softening up footballs. It doesn't make any sense but this is the NFL, this is Roger Goodell. The man can't get anything right.

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Does he know waht some special teamer likes? probably not. Does he know what Teddy Breuschi preferred? I'd say there's a good chance he did.

 

We're not talking about pads here. We're talking about the actual game balls. Could there be a competitive advantaged to be gained? I think we all know what BB* thinks of those. You think he didn't realize his team's amazingly low turnover rate?

 

so you think brady is the fall guy for a much larger conspiracy? it wasn't just about brady's preference but it was a BB scheme to help with ball security? maybe. i doubt it.

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Stop it. We don't know what those other texts say that Brady has and won't give up. And why would he? We all know he's guilty, he's the mastermind behind all this. What does he gain by giving up more evidence? Why would he get himself in even more trouble? He can't prove anymore that he's innocent, so what's the point?

 

And why the Pats got fined I don't know. I said that I don't agree with the fine. It was (IMO) one player, it's not the organization. I guess the NFL went back and looked at the Sean Payton case and considering that the Patriots have been punished already for Spygate the NFL felt like they had to drop the hammer this time. 1 million dollars? That's double the amount they got fined for spygate. For softening up footballs. It doesn't make any sense but this is the NFL, this is Roger Goodell. The man can't get anything right.

 

They were penalized heavily for having a history of cheating.  Why is this so difficult to grasp?  They continue to flout the rules like they don't apply to them.  Yet you're giving Belichick the benefit of the doubt and saying Goodell shouldn't have given them such a stiff penalty.  Funny stuff.

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Belichick's January 24 discussion of what the Patriots do with the footballs before games.  Yeah, sounds like a guy who has no clue what is going on:

 

 

Belichick explained that the team prepares its footballs over an extended period of time and that footballs used in games have been used in practices. "That preparation process continues right up until the footballs are given to the officials prior to the game," he said. "That’s when they are finalized, if I could use that word."

 

What the Patriots do to their footballs may be unique to them, Belichick said, but the team found this week that the preparation process raises the air pressure in its footballs by about one pound per square inch.

 

"That process," Belichick said, "of creating a tackiness, a texture -- the right feel, whatever that feel is, it’s just a sensation for the quarterback, what’s the right feel -- that process elevates the PSI approximately one pound based on what our study showed, which was multiple footballs, multiple examples in the process, as we would do for a game. It’s not one football."

 

Belichick emphasized that the team's footballs are never prepared in a heated environment. They are prepared only in the team's locker room or "in an area very close to that." He said that the rubbing process likely is what raises the football's PSI in the short-term.

 

"We rub it to get the football to the proper texture," he said when asked if footballs are handled "vigorously" before going to officials for measurement. "Yes, it’s -- I mean, I don’t know what’s vigorous or what isn’t vigorous. We’re not polishing fine china here. We’re trying to get a football to the proper texture the quarterback wants it to grip it. Does that stimulate something inside the football to raise the PSI? I would say yes, it does."

 

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I don't understand how Brady keeps Don Yee as his agent.  Few agents could have done a worse job with a high profile client.

 

Yee kept on negotiating below market deals with the Pats, then gives him advice on the Deflategate investigation (by his own admission) that turned out to be crappy, then he makes Brady look even worse with his post-punishment response.

 

No wonder Brady is using the NFLPA lawyer for his appeal.

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Stop it. We don't know what those other texts say that Brady has and won't give up. And why would he? We all know he's guilty, he's the mastermind behind all this. What does he gain by giving up more evidence? Why would he get himself in even more trouble? He can't prove anymore that he's innocent, so what's the point?

 

And why the Pats got fined I don't know. I said that I don't agree with the fine. It was (IMO) one player, it's not the organization. I guess the NFL went back and looked at the Sean Payton case and considering that the Patriots have been punished already for Spygate the NFL felt like they had to drop the hammer this time. 1 million dollars? That's double the amount they got fined for spygate. For softening up footballs. It doesn't make any sense but this is the NFL, this is Roger Goodell. The man can't get anything right.

He's not refusing to hand over his phone to protect himself, he's refusing to protect others. The investigators have both sides of every text conversation Brady had with the deflators, they don't need Brady's phone to know he was directing them. What on that phone could instead point to who was directing Brady, or who Brady was keeping informed about the whole process. A lot of emphasis was put on Brady's contact with the two deflators after they were exposed, what's on that phone is who else he had scrambling conversations with in an effort to suppress the scandal. We're there calls/texts to Belichick? Kraft, even? I bet there were.

Pats fans here try to downplay the Pats' mathematically unlikely fumble numbers by telling us that Belichick purposely practices with balls doctored specifically to be difficult to handle. Do you think a guy who fully understands how to prepare a football to be difficult to handle doesn't know how to prepare them to be easier to handle? That a guy who's cheated in the past, and continued to circumvent the "spirit of the rules" with his invisible eligible receiver packages against the Ravens in the playoffs, would be averse to a little football deflation?

What's more likely, Tom Brady doing this behind his dictatorial head coach's back? Or coming to him with his plan to give himself and the team a competitive edge?

In an effort to be unbiased, I think you're being näive.

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What do you mean "cheat in a better way"?  Softening up the footballs prevents turnovers.  That's a pretty damn nice advantage to have.  And when it comes to serial cheaters, it doesn't matter if it's a big or small advantage.  There are a lot of things Belichick continues to cheat that just haven't been exposed yet.  You still get opposing teams coming in to New England complaining about headsets not working.  The ineligible receiver formation wasn't "cheating" but it was yet another way the Pats found a loophole.  There's reasons why the Patriots still seem to know exactly what the opponent is doing, especially during home games.  It's not JUST the deflating of footballs that was giving Belichick's teams an edge lately.  It's just one of many little operations that are part of the "Patriot Way".

 

You're 95 % sure he had nothing to do with this?  Really?  Then why has he been dead silent about it?  Why didn't Brady turn over his phone, or even do Ted Wells' "Plan B", where he and his agent pick and choose which texts to send him? 

 

Belichick knows EXACTLY what is going on with every little aspect of the Patriot Crime Organization, yet was clueless about this?  C'mon.  Quit being naive.

I agree though you really can not assess true guilt to Bellicheat without proof.

 

The key is Bellicheat loves when he is called one of the greatest NFL HCs of all time when people say "he is so prepared like no other coach in history", "Patriot Way" and so on when things are going well; and yet, he loves to say he is CLUELESS everytime something goes poorly or folks are doing things like CHEATING on his WATCH!!!

 

You can't have it both ways!! Period!!

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I don't understand how Brady keeps Don Yee as his agent.  Few agents could have done a worse job with a high profile client.

 

Yee kept on negotiating below market deals with the Pats, then gives him advice on the Deflategate investigation (by his own admission) that turned out to be crappy, then he makes Brady look even worse with his post-punishment response.

 

No wonder Brady is using the NFLPA lawyer for his appeal.

It is clear to me Yee has told Brady he will be the bad guy and for Brady to say nothing. 

 

Fine strategy as far as it goes.  the problem is Yee has been AWFULL... He has been worse than bad....

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It is clear to me Yee has told Brady he will be the bad guy and for Brady to say nothing. 

 

Fine strategy as far as it goes.  the problem is Yee has been AWFULL... He has been worse than bad....

I agree.  He can play the bad guy, but he'd done a horrendous job at that.

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They were penalized heavily for having a history of cheating.  Why is this so difficult to grasp?  They continue to flout the rules like they don't apply to them.  Yet you're giving Belichick the benefit of the doubt and saying Goodell shouldn't have given them such a stiff penalty.  Funny stuff.

 

Who is "they"? Last time I checked it was Brady. You wouldn't punish a team if one of their players got popped for PED's or if they cheated any other way.

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Have you heard Bruschi ring on this yet?   Sounds like a guy who knows his loved are not safe if he talks.  LOL

 

Watching him and Queaf Evans squeal like stuck pigs has been a pleasure.  It's obvious their so defiant because to admit any wrong doing would admit that anything they accomplished with the Pats is tainted.

 

Sorry guys...  too late..  

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Who is "they"? Last time I checked it was Brady. You wouldn't punish a team if one of their players got popped for PED's or if they cheated any other way.

 

Yet the NFL DID punish the team.  Hmm, wonder why.  Must be the NFL's ineptitude.  Yep, that's totally the reason.

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It is clear to me Yee has told Brady he will be the bad guy and for Brady to say nothing. 

 

Fine strategy as far as it goes.  the problem is Yee has been AWFULL... He has been worse than bad....

Problem is the media is mostly supporting the Pats.  Most are saying Tom did something but are calling the penalty harsh - and more importantly they really aren't going after Tom and Pats for their ridiculous and continued denials.

 

The report couldn't have been more clear - he did this and any reasonable person would agree - there is no other way to read that report and see anything else.  I would like to hear more in the media come out against the denial non-sense.  It's a joke yet the media continues to discuss this as a "controversy" as if there are really two sides to the story.

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Didnt the Wells report do that alone? Especially around here? Ha ha i dont think any suspension in the court in the court public opinions makes any difference

 

He is guilty, there is no turning back now. :)

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I was watching the NFL Network the night the penalty came down and I saw them march out a procession of former teammates who all said "Tom would never do this.  Not the Tom I know."  What the hell else would they say?  It's kinda like the mom who says about her convicted son, "he would never do this.  He was always such a good boy."

 

Very few guys in the media are willing to speak out against the Pats.  There are a ton of guys in the media who are worried about access more than anything else.  They know how the Patriots operate.  Don't think for a moment that the Pats are not taking note of who is for them and who is against them.  Guys like Peter King don't want their access cut off by getting on the Pats sh*t list.  There is no doubt in my mind that this influences the objectivity of a lot of media members.

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