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Eric Mangini aiming to create 'confusion' with 49ers' D


BurnleyJet

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When exactly was it that Favre "tore a tendon"?  During the season they said he was dinged but going to play through it.  Later on it became this specific thing that happened on some specific date when he started to suck.  Favre was always a streaky dude and other than the Titans and Cards, almost all their damage was done against the bottom of the barrel.  In fact, some of their losses were against the bottom of the barrel - they were dismantled by a mediocre Chargers team and lost to the crappy Raiders before anybody could claim Favre got hurt.

I always thought Favre to be the most selfish player in the NFL. When things did not go his way, there were excuses. Injuries that happened, other people did things wrong. 

 

When the going was good, no one rode the wave like Favre. Adulation was his greatest addiction. 

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Favre was 8-3 pre-injury.  Once he tore a tendon he went right down the sh*tter.  Was Mangini supposed to bench him for Kellen Clemens?  You really think THAT would have given us that playoff push.  Please. 

 

Whether you wanna believe it or not, Mangini was building a heck of a football team.  Yes there were some whiffs in the draft, Gholston and the Boar Hunter, but he also hit some damn good picks as well.  Rex walked in, added Sanchez to the team and ended up in 2 championship games with mostly Mangini guys.  It wasn't until Rex's guys started infiltrating the roster that the team sh*t the bed. 

 

Let me ask you this-given where we were at the time do you think Mangini would have traded up for Mark Sanchez?  I don't. 

 

Rex brought in his two guys to run the defense.  Bart Scott and Jim Leonhard and didn't sit back and wait to get picked apart like Mangini did.  Defense went from 18th to 1st in the NFL and 18th was even a joke.  One of the worst defenses in the league down the stretch in crunch time under Mangini.

 

As far as randomly guessing as to what moves Mangini would have made, it doesn't matter what anyone thinks because they dumped him before he got the chance.

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That's exactly what he should've done. But he was too star struck by Favre, naming his kid after him and sustaining his iron man starting streak. Maybe Clemens could've won more than one game down the stretch, and maybe Favre would've been able to come back stronger after some rest and/or surgery. We'll never know. All we do know is what he chose to do resulted in them completely tanking.

 

I don't think Clemens would have made a lot of different to be honest...Mangini's defense was getting murdered...couldn't stop the run and got beat up by the immortal Shaun Hill.

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Favre was 8-3 pre-injury.  Once he tore a tendon he went right down the sh*tter.  Was Mangini supposed to bench him for Kellen Clemens?  You really think THAT would have given us that playoff push.  Please. 

 

Whether you wanna believe it or not, Mangini was building a heck of a football team.  Yes there were some whiffs in the draft, Gholston and the Boar Hunter, but he also hit some damn good picks as well.  Rex walked in, added Sanchez to the team and ended up in 2 championship games with mostly Mangini guys.  It wasn't until Rex's guys started infiltrating the roster that the team sh*t the bed. 

 

Let me ask you this-given where we were at the time do you think Mangini would have traded up for Mark Sanchez?  I don't. 

 

Why do people keep claiming this even though it isn't true?

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I don't think Clemens would have made a lot of different to be honest...Mangini's defense was getting murdered...couldn't stop the run and got beat up by the immortal Shaun Hill.

People hated Rex's ground & pound nonsense, but forget just how conservative (and boring!) the Jets were on both sides of the ball before landing Favre. And in that last year, they were still ultra-conservative on the defensive side of the ball. I don't see him having any success at all in SF if that's still his philosophy. He just doesn't have the talent to sit back and play that bend but don't break style there. He'll also have to've completely overhauled his personality if he's gonna get thru to them at all.

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I don't think people remember how truly easy the Jets schedule was in 2008.  The Jets needed to beat the Seahawks to get in the playoffs.  The Seahawks finished 4-12, but they were so much worse than that.  Two of their wins came against the hapless Rams (a team we crow about Favre beating during the streak) the others were against sh*tty Niners and the Jets.  They were starting Seneca Wallace.  Maurice Morris ran for like a buck twenty. The Jets should have beat that team without throwing a pass

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I don't think people remember how truly easy the Jets schedule was in 2008.  The Jets needed to beat the Seahawks to get in the playoffs.  The Seahawks finished 4-12, but they were so much worse than that.  Two of their wins came against the hapless Rams (a team we crow about Favre beating during the streak) the others were against sh*tty Niners and the Jets.  They were starting Seneca Wallace.  Maurice Morris ran for like a buck twenty. The Jets should have beat that team without throwing a pass

 

That was one of the more frustrating games I can ever remember.  Wasnt Seattle horrible vs. the run too?  

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Left-handed Brett Favre would still have been the best QB in that division with Brady down.

 

 

Cool "x"

Only problem with that theory is with a healthy Favre we beat the Pats in NE and we're in first place. So you can dismiss the connection but it's there. No one is seriously going to argue that it had nothing to do with the way the season ended.

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Only problem with that theory is with a healthy Favre we beat the Pats in NE and we're in first place. So you can dismiss the connection but it's there. No one is seriously going to argue that it had nothing to do with the way the season ended.

 

So Mangini couldn';t beat Matt Cassell at home in his first start since HS with a healthy Brett Favre at QB, but we should assume he would have been able to beat them at new England against a more experienced Cassell and no home field advantage?

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So Mangini couldn';t beat Matt Cassell at home in his first start since HS with a healthy Brett Favre at QB, but we should assume he would have been able to beat them at new England against a more experienced Cassell and no home field advantage?

Mangini and the 2008 Jets DID beat NE and Matty Cassell in  New England

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Only problem with that theory is with a healthy Favre we beat the Pats in NE and we're in first place. So you can dismiss the connection but it's there. No one is seriously going to argue that it had nothing to do with the way the season ended.

 

Oh..did you mean they "were" in first place?  I apologize, I thought you'd said "we're in first place" as in hypothetically.  Yes, prior to the defense completely collapsing down the stretch, the Jets looked good.  I even took a drive to a bookie the day before the Tenn game and doubled the bet I'd made earlier in the season for the Jets to win the SB. It was a fun ten weeks.

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That was one of the more frustrating games I can ever remember.  Wasnt Seattle horrible vs. the run too?  

 

I had to look.  The Seahawks were pretty bad against the run, but they were the worst in the NFL against the pass.

 

Only problem with that theory is with a healthy Favre we beat the Pats in NE and we're in first place. So you can dismiss the connection but it's there. No one is seriously going to argue that it had nothing to do with the way the season ended.

 

So Mangini couldn';t beat Matt Cassell at home in his first start since HS with a healthy Brett Favre at QB, but we should assume he would have been able to beat them at new England against a more experienced Cassell and no home field advantage?

 

Actually, the main problem with that theory is that Favre was still "healthy" when they played the Pats in NE.  Oh, and the Jets did win.  In OT after they spit up a seven point lead with the ball and 2 minutes left.

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I had to look.  The Seahawks were pretty bad against the run, but they were the worst in the NFL against the pass.

 

 

 

Actually, the main problem with that theory is that Favre was still "healthy" when they played the Pats in NE.  Oh, and the Jets did win.  In OT after they spit up a seven point lead with the ball and 2 minutes left.

 

Yeah, I misinterpreted the comment as if it suggested they would have been in first place if they'd won.  No doubt, that was a fun ten weeks...well, except for the time they lost to Cassell.

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Actually, the main problem with that theory is that Favre was still "healthy" when they played the Pats in NE.  Oh, and the Jets did win.  In OT after they spit up a seven point lead with the ball and 2 minutes left.

That was actually the best game Favre played as a Jet, in my opinion.

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Certainly one of them.  Of course, I don't see how people think the Jets were a super bowl team when they gave up 400 yards passing to Matt ******* Cassel.

That Jet team was as schizophrenic as they come-And that says a lot, when you consider the Jets history.

 

Mangini did not do himself any favors. 

 

BUT, Favre was one of those things (see Tim Tebow), that was thrust upon Mangini, when he wanted no part of that circus. And that is what Favre was, a circus. He was about himself, and showing the Green Bay Packers at that time. And setting more records. If the Jets happened to win after all of those other things, so be it.

 

But to suggest that the jets had a HOF caliber QB in 2008 is a complete misnomer.

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That Jet team was as schizophrenic as they come-And that says a lot, when you consider the Jets history.

 

Mangini did not do himself any favors. 

 

BUT, Favre was one of those things (see Tim Tebow), that was thrust upon Mangini, when he wanted no part of that circus. And that is what Favre was, a circus. He was about himself, and showing the Green Bay Packers at that time. And setting more records. If the Jets happened to win after all of those other things, so be it.

 

But to suggest that the jets had a HOF caliber QB in 2008 is a complete misnomer.

 

Favre just wanted to get to Minnesota.  The only way he could get there was to spend a year in the AFC.  A year dickpicking and ingoring the OC. 

 

EDIT:  Favre was a HOF QB with the Jets in 2008, but Len Dawson was a HOF QB in 2008 too.  Would the Jets have been super bowl favorites with a healthy Len Dawson under center?

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That Jet team was as schizophrenic as they come-And that says a lot, when you consider the Jets history.

 

Mangini did not do himself any favors. 

 

BUT, Favre was one of those things (see Tim Tebow), that was thrust upon Mangini, when he wanted no part of that circus. And that is what Favre was, a circus. He was about himself, and showing the Green Bay Packers at that time. And setting more records. If the Jets happened to win after all of those other things, so be it.

 

But to suggest that the jets had a HOF caliber QB in 2008 is a complete misnomer.

That's just 100% not true. Mangini was a huge part of the wooing process with Favre, promising -and delivering- to name his kid after him if he'd sign.

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That's just 100% not true. Mangini was a huge part of the wooing process with Favre, promising -and delivering- to name his kid after him if he'd sign.

http://espn.go.com/blog/new-york/jets/post/_/id/1373/mangini-finally-comes-clean-on-favre

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  • CommFormer New York Jets coach Eric Mangini is featured in a revealing piece bySeth Wickersham in the current issue of ESPN The Magazine. In the story, Mangini admits he initially wanted no part of Brett Favre in New York. The current Cleveland Browns coach isn't quoted directly, but considering he gave Wickersham five days of behind-the-scenes access, it's a safe bet that he got it from the Man-genius' mouth.

Former New York Jets coach Eric Mangini is featured in a revealing piece bySeth Wickersham in the current issue of ESPN The Magazine. In the story, Mangini admits he initially wanted no part of Brett Favre in New York. The current Cleveland Browns coach isn't quoted directly, but considering he gave Wickersham five days of behind-the-scenes access, it's a safe bet that he got it from the Man-genius' mouth.

When Mangini was fired in January, 2009, after Favre's arm injury (we didn't know about it at the time) led to a late-season collapse, I reported that Mangini wasn't on board with the Favre trade. Publicly, none of the principles confirmed that. Mangini always has talked around it, using his Mangini-speak, but the following passage makes it pretty clear where he stood on Favre.

Here's a couple of graphs from Wickersham's story, describing how GM Mike Tannenbaum and owner Woody Johnson pushed for the trade:

"In August, 2008, the Packers were trying to trade Favre. Mangini didn't want him. He considered Favre a hired gun, and he wanted to develop Kellen Clemens and Brett Ratliff. (My two cents: No mention of Chad Pennington, who still was on the roster.) But Tannenbaum and Jets owner Woody Johnson expressed interest in Favre, while also vowing that Mangini's job was safe, no matter what. And with Favre on the verge of accepting a trade to Tampa, the coach's competitiveness took over.

"'I wanted to win,' he says. So he scheduled a five-minute phone call with Favre for the next morning, then went home and read Hello, He Lied, a book that talks about successfully pitching movies to studio execs in only a few minutes. Mangini developed his selling points: The Jets were better than the Bucs, and New Jersey's hunting and fishing scene was better than Tampa's. Favre, seduced, ended up chatting for an hour ..."

Wickerstam goes on to recount the Jets' collapse, adding, "The one thing Mangini couldn't do was bench a future Hall of Famer for whom he had mortgaged the season. The night he was fired, the coach sat on his couch, thinking, You sold yourself out."

What does this have to do with anything? Let's play what-if: If the Jets didn't make the trade, maybe Mangini doesn't get fired. (Expectations would've been lower.) If he doesn't get fired, the Jets might have missed out on Mark Sanchez in the 2009. Why? The only reason they were able to trade up for Sanchez was because of the sweetheart deal offered by Mangini, then with the Browns, who was willing to take Jets trash (Ratliff, Kenyon ColemanAbe Elam) in a trade.

For what it's worth, my peeps in Cleveland say Mangini has lightened up a bit, especially in dealing with the media. New football czar Mike Holmgrenapparently has had that effect on him; that, and self-preservation.

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That's exactly what he should've done. But he was too star struck by Favre, naming his kid after him and sustaining his iron man starting streak. Maybe Clemens could've won more than one game down the stretch, and maybe Favre would've been able to come back stronger after some rest and/or surgery. We'll never know. All we do know is what he chose to do resulted in them completely tanking.

And you believe that decision was in Mangini's hands?  I don't.

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Why do people keep claiming this even though it isn't true?

Different qb I think like 8 different starters after Mangini left - Sperm the urban legend that Mangini was this amazing drafter who built the 2009 and 2010 teams is never going away.

The 49ers will go 4-12 next year you will still have jets fans swearing up and down Mangini is this great football mind.

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Certainly one of them. Of course, I don't see how people think the Jets were a super bowl team when they gave up 400 yards passing to Matt ******* Cassel.

That's what happens when go into dime zone coverage with 0 pass rush against Matt ***** Cassell.

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And you believe that decision was in Mangini's hands?  I don't.

 

Mangini ran the draft, but he wasn't allowed to decide who played?  Who was going to overrule him?  Schottenheimer?  Tannebaum?  Woody?  I fully believe that Mangini didn't want Favre in the first place. A guy like that undermines his whole team first, do what I say-don't ask why mentality, but he didn't bench him because Favre wasn't so badly hurt and there was no hope of doing anything but a repeat of 2006 (get demolished in the wild card round) without Favre.

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Why do people keep claiming this even though it isn't true?

Rex brought in Jim Leonhard and Bart Scott.  Both nice players in thweir own right, but more importantly they played positions that Rex needed leadership and knowledge to run his D.  Rex and his big talk bluster certainly motivated guys, especially coming away from Mangini's personality.  And the players certainly thrived on his aggression.  But eventually it wore off and became nothing more than words.  But the talent Rex was playing with mostly came from Mangini's team.  And Mangini's team was put together by him, that's plain to see.  Tannenbaum's #1 fault is his lack of knowledge on the player evaluation side of things, and he defers way too much to his coach when it comes time to pick a player.  So it stands to reason all the players that were brought in under Mangini were heavily influenced by him, much as the crap that's been brought in during Rex's tenure were Rex's guys.  Mangini is no super great coach don't get me wrong.  He needs an overhaul on his philosphy and his player handling without a doubt.  But the guy knows football through andf through and has the talent to be a good coach. 

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Bradway was the one who was all over Revis from beginning to end. And once Revis ran at Pitt's pro day the debate between the two ended league wide.

 

Did he jump on the table? Or pound the table?  I always forget which it is.  Maybe he should have jumped on the table instead of pounding it.  We would have had Russell Wilson and TY Hilton instead of Stephen Hill and Demario Davis! 

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Did he jump on the table? Or pound the table?  I always forget which it is.  Maybe he should have jumped on the table instead of pounding it.  We would have had Russell Wilson and TY Hilton instead of Stephen Hill and Demario Davis! 

 

Was Bradway for Hilton too? sh*t man.

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http://espn.go.com/blog/new-york/jets/post/_/id/1373/mangini-finally-comes-clean-on-favre

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  • CommFormer New York Jets coach Eric Mangini is featured in a revealing piece bySeth Wickersham in the current issue of ESPN The Magazine. In the story, Mangini admits he initially wanted no part of Brett Favre in New York. The current Cleveland Browns coach isn't quoted directly, but considering he gave Wickersham five days of behind-the-scenes access, it's a safe bet that he got it from the Man-genius' mouth.

Former New York Jets coach Eric Mangini is featured in a revealing piece bySeth Wickersham in the current issue of ESPN The Magazine. In the story, Mangini admits he initially wanted no part of Brett Favre in New York. The current Cleveland Browns coach isn't quoted directly, but considering he gave Wickersham five days of behind-the-scenes access, it's a safe bet that he got it from the Man-genius' mouth.

When Mangini was fired in January, 2009, after Favre's arm injury (we didn't know about it at the time) led to a late-season collapse, I reported that Mangini wasn't on board with the Favre trade. Publicly, none of the principles confirmed that. Mangini always has talked around it, using his Mangini-speak, but the following passage makes it pretty clear where he stood on Favre.

Here's a couple of graphs from Wickersham's story, describing how GM Mike Tannenbaum and owner Woody Johnson pushed for the trade:

"In August, 2008, the Packers were trying to trade Favre. Mangini didn't want him. He considered Favre a hired gun, and he wanted to develop Kellen Clemens and Brett Ratliff. (My two cents: No mention of Chad Pennington, who still was on the roster.) But Tannenbaum and Jets owner Woody Johnson expressed interest in Favre, while also vowing that Mangini's job was safe, no matter what. And with Favre on the verge of accepting a trade to Tampa, the coach's competitiveness took over.

"'I wanted to win,' he says. So he scheduled a five-minute phone call with Favre for the next morning, then went home and read Hello, He Lied, a book that talks about successfully pitching movies to studio execs in only a few minutes. Mangini developed his selling points: The Jets were better than the Bucs, and New Jersey's hunting and fishing scene was better than Tampa's. Favre, seduced, ended up chatting for an hour ..."

Wickerstam goes on to recount the Jets' collapse, adding, "The one thing Mangini couldn't do was bench a future Hall of Famer for whom he had mortgaged the season. The night he was fired, the coach sat on his couch, thinking, You sold yourself out."

What does this have to do with anything? Let's play what-if: If the Jets didn't make the trade, maybe Mangini doesn't get fired. (Expectations would've been lower.) If he doesn't get fired, the Jets might have missed out on Mark Sanchez in the 2009. Why? The only reason they were able to trade up for Sanchez was because of the sweetheart deal offered by Mangini, then with the Browns, who was willing to take Jets trash (Ratliff, Kenyon ColemanAbe Elam) in a trade.

For what it's worth, my peeps in Cleveland say Mangini has lightened up a bit, especially in dealing with the media. New football czar Mike Holmgrenapparently has had that effect on him; that, and self-preservation.

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So Mangini wanted no part of Favre until he convinced him to accept the trade to the Jets. Got it.

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