Larz Posted November 23, 2015 Share Posted November 23, 2015 Really? LOL. You guys are young..... Look up 1986 this season gave me the jets fan syndrome, I should have run away that year, lol Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SAR I Posted November 23, 2015 Share Posted November 23, 2015 Revis was still the best corner in the game coming into this season, he may not have been revis '09 or '10(after he got healthy) but he's still damn good and Cro was good for Ari last year. both gave us HUGE upgrades over last year, Skrine also gave us a huge upgrade. he was now our #3 and better than anyone we had the last couple of years. the career backup QB has played pretty well for us. the AFC is not that difficult, we have more than enough to be a serious playoff contender. First off, let me say I appreciate your loyalty and your fandom. You're a good Jets fan, no question. That said, we made some huge upgrades to last year in spots but by no means does that equate to a +7 game differential to the prior year. And if you look at the scrubs we've beaten and the playoff contenders we've lost to you can see quite clearly we're not a playoff team. In fact, take Ryan Fitzpatrick off the team and we're a cellar dwellar. We go as he goes. He's injured and the OL is a shell of its former self. SAR I Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
prime21 Posted November 23, 2015 Share Posted November 23, 2015 http://espn.go.com/video/clip?id=espn:14203009 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nyjunc Posted November 23, 2015 Share Posted November 23, 2015 First off, let me say I appreciate your loyalty and your fandom. You're a good Jets fan, no question. That said, we made some huge upgrades to last year in spots but by no means does that equate to a +7 game differential to the prior year. And if you look at the scrubs we've beaten and the playoff contenders we've lost to you can see quite clearly we're not a playoff team. In fact, take Ryan Fitzpatrick off the team and we're a cellar dwellar. We go as he goes. He's injured and the OL is a shell of its former self. SAR I we are allowed to disagree, maybe I am overrating our talent. The thing is teams get good(and bad) very quickly in this league. a 4 win team can win 10 the next year, before the season w/ geno I thought we could win around 8 games again but Fitz has played well and given us more than I ever imagined he could. Our problems have been more on D than O. we have so much talent on D and they aren't getting it done. if they were performing like early in the season we'd have 2 more wins and be a playoff favorite. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SAR I Posted November 23, 2015 Share Posted November 23, 2015 If we go 5-11 does Bowles still have his job. Now that's a different story. NFL history has multiple examples where a rookie head coach or interim head coach comes in and is not a good fit, the players do not respond, and the respected core veterans let management know that a change is really necessary. That said, remember that we got Maccagnan and Bowles via recommendations from Ron Wolf and Charlie Casserly, so methinks there won't be a fire sale if we lose out. SAR I Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nyjunc Posted November 23, 2015 Share Posted November 23, 2015 http://espn.go.com/video/clip?id=espn:14203009 I didn't watch the clip but seeing the headline I kind of agree. I wouldn't say we haven't recovered we just haven't played well since that spot. I don't think it was a Pats hangover or anything though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
munchmemory Posted November 23, 2015 Share Posted November 23, 2015 ****, i just remembered i got tickets for that game Bring a portable respirator. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SAR I Posted November 23, 2015 Share Posted November 23, 2015 I said coming into the season revis was still the best, he has slipped but is still one of the best. Cro struggling is still better than anyone we had last year. I was critical of Fitz early in the season, he has played really well for the most part since the Wash game. The problem really isn't so much the secondary as it is our LB's who are dreadfully slow and can't cover anyone. The safeties are too busy pinching in for short passes and/or run stoppage and covering for the LB's shortcomings and are being asked to blitz too. When we get torched deep it tends to be a one on one matchup or safety help that is suspiciously late to the party. This happens to rebuilding teams. We're trying to patch holes with some creative schemes. Rome wasn't built in a day. NFL teams rarely go from 4-12 to 11-5 overnight. SAR I Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
greenwichjetfan Posted November 23, 2015 Share Posted November 23, 2015 Bringing back two slower and older members of the 2009 secondary six years later SAR I Which two? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nyjunc Posted November 23, 2015 Share Posted November 23, 2015 The problem really isn't so much the secondary as it is our LB's who are dreadfully slow and can't cover anyone. The safeties are too busy pinching in for short passes and/or run stoppage and covering for the LB's shortcomings and are being asked to blitz too. When we get torched deep it tends to be a one on one matchup or safety help that is suspiciously late to the party. This happens to rebuilding teams. We're trying to patch holes with some creative schemes. Rome wasn't built in a day. NFL teams rarely go from 4-12 to 11-5 overnight. SAR I teams go from really bad to good all the time. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jeremy2020 Posted November 23, 2015 Share Posted November 23, 2015 LOL @ "meltdown" This team wasn't good to begin with, and there's no "easy part" to the schedule. This...you can't have a 'meltdown' when you have exceeded expectations. Reverting to the mean is not a meltdown. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
munchmemory Posted November 24, 2015 Share Posted November 24, 2015 This...you can't have a 'meltdown' when you have exceeded expectations. Reverting to the mean is not a meltdown. How about we go with sh*t storm instead of meltdown? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jamesr Posted November 25, 2015 Share Posted November 25, 2015 The problem really isn't so much the secondary as it is our LB's who are dreadfully slow and can't cover anyone. The safeties are too busy pinching in for short passes and/or run stoppage and covering for the LB's shortcomings and are being asked to blitz too. When we get torched deep it tends to be a one on one matchup or safety help that is suspiciously late to the party. This happens to rebuilding teams. We're trying to patch holes with some creative schemes. Rome wasn't built in a day. NFL teams rarely go from 4-12 to 11-5 overnight. SAR I Our LB's are built to stop the run, in a league where the pass has become more and more prevalent. We certainly need a serious retool at LB in the coming years. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shadetree Posted November 25, 2015 Share Posted November 25, 2015 This isn't a meltdown. This is an 8-8 team in the process of going 8-8. What's got some all in a tizz is the sequencing. Back in the Summer, most predicted we'd come out of the gate 2-3 as the Colts, Eagles, and Dolphins were all thought to be elite teams in 2015. So when we came out at 4-1 and took the Patriots to the 2-minute warning it looked like this team could be something special, thoughts of Vinny Testaverde 2.0 dancing in our heads. If you sit back now and look to September objectively you see that we had a cupcake schedule, and if you layer into that the injuries to our razor-thin roster it makes complete sense why we are where we are. It's not like we have Brett Favre in the house laying 60 on the Cardinals. It's not like we have a defense and running game coming off of back-to-back AFC Championships. This is a rebuilding team with a rookie head coach that did it's job early but couldn't withstand offensive injuries to this extent mixed with a Rex Ryan defense still programmed for laziness and complacency. It's Year 1 of a Maccagnan rebuild. We'll take 8-8 after 4-12 last year. That's a great season no matter the sequencing that to some make this look like a collapse. SAR I I agree w most of this except the part about this "being a great season no matter the sequencing." This team dropped a potential game -winning TD in foxboro, didn't show up in Oakland or Houston and has looked like a ho-hum defense most of the year after a 4-1 start. While certainly not meltdown worthy (yet), this has been one of the most aggravating seasons I can remember in a long time. This defense is heartless dogsh*t. I'm pissed and in no way will I see this season as a success. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jetster Posted November 25, 2015 Share Posted November 25, 2015 Disagree with everyone that's not disappointed & expected 8-8. With so much parity in the NFL the Jets were in perfect position for a playoff spot @ 4-1 and the players & coaches let us down! Other than the Oakland clusterf*ck every other game was lost by flat out mistakes & bad execution! The terrible special teams tackling on a PERFECTLY placed punt to the sideline that Sproles ran back! How about our highly paid WR Marshall trying to lateral! Then his alligator armed drop trying to tie the game! Let's move onto New England. AGAIN our highly paid WR DROPS an easy TD so instead of being up 8 points forcing the Pats to go 80 yards to score a TD & a 2 point conversion JUST TO TIE the game we get the infamous 3rd & 17 that shouldn't have mattered! Lets go to the Bills game. A combination of player mistakes & coaching mistakes. Bobby April using Devin Smith? I was freaked out seeing that charmin boy back there! FUMBLE! Another one of our highly paid WRs drops a 4th down pass right on his hands! Then Bowles goes total brain dead & shuns a chip shot FG with 3 minutes & 3 timeouts? Really? So you guys can tell yourselves we're just not good enough but based on the parity is this horrible league the players we pay the most money to & the coach we hired failed miserably in key moments! Stop blaming talent! It's supposedly our most talented players that have failed, not the scrubs you guys CLAIM are the reason for the record we have. Jets should at least be 7-3 right now if their highest paid players & the coach didn't flat out f*ck up! Why shouldn't any fan not be upset based on the FACTS of what we all actually witnessed? So they're not a Super Bowl team, they should definitely made the playoffs, that fact is undeniable regardless of how you twist those facts to confirm your feelings before the season actually started. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Charlie Brown Posted November 25, 2015 Share Posted November 25, 2015 Not very high at all. If you looked at this team very objectively at the start of the season this is what should have been observed: - No viable good starting QB - Defense that should be really really good to dominating. - More weapons on O but still no good change of pace back and no TE to speak of. - Awful special teams other than the FG kicker. Thus: A team that should be able to be around 500 or better if things go right and a team that you hope gets into or stays in playoff contention into the last few games. The fact that the team went 4-1 in it's 1st five games did nothing to really change the overall outlook. If the team goes 1-5 or something down the stretch then melt down would be more accurate. Thank you!! Meltdown??? How in the world could anyone have expected the team to be playoff bound with either Smith or Fitz as the starting QB when neither of those individuals has shown that they can play consistently enough for a whole season to produce that result? The other items that you have revealed themselves as the season has progressed and should added onto the question and point above. I still feel many fans are caught in FF gone wild. They think moving players and coaches around is like Madden football when it is not... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SAR I Posted November 25, 2015 Share Posted November 25, 2015 I agree w most of this except the part about this "being a great season no matter the sequencing." This team dropped a potential game -winning TD in foxboro, didn't show up in Oakland or Houston and has looked like a ho-hum defense most of the year after a 4-1 start. While certainly not meltdown worthy (yet), this has been one of the most aggravating seasons I can remember in a long time. This defense is heartless dogsh*t. I'm pissed and in no way will I see this season as a success. I agree with the take on the lack of urgency and lack of heart, it is mind-boggling how this keeps happening from Edwards to Mangini to Ryan to Bowles. It's one thing to get beat and it's quite another to sleepwalk. These are professional athletes, it's inexcusable. SAR I Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nyjunc Posted November 25, 2015 Share Posted November 25, 2015 I agree with the take on the lack of urgency and lack of heart, it is mind-boggling how this keeps happening from Edwards to Mangini to Ryan to Bowles. It's one thing to get beat and it's quite another to sleepwalk. These are professional athletes, it's inexcusable. SAR I it happens to all teams, it happened to us when we had Parcells. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nyjunc Posted November 25, 2015 Share Posted November 25, 2015 Thank you!! Meltdown??? How in the world could anyone have expected the team to be playoff bound with either Smith or Fitz as the starting QB when neither of those individuals has shown that they can play consistently enough for a whole season to produce that result? The other items that you have revealed themselves as the season has progressed and should added onto the question and point above. I still feel many fans are caught in FF gone wild. They think moving players and coaches around is like Madden football when it is not... expectations can change, coming into the season I thought we could win 7-9 games and com pete for a playoff spot but w/ the way the D was playing, the way Marshall and Ivory were playing and being 4-1 I thought we were better than I thought originally. Teams can get good and bad in a hurry in this league. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
UnitedWhofans Posted November 25, 2015 Share Posted November 25, 2015 2008: 8-3 finish 1-4...its approaching that level because even that team didnt defy the odds of starting 4-1 and not making the playoffs. They started 2-2 and got hot middle of the season. At least that year, Favre got injured. This season doesnt have a scapegoat other than incompetence. 2000: that was the worst. We're not their yet. Started off 6-1 that season only to finish 9-7 and miss the playoffs. 2000, 2015, 2008 - that would be my order. I disagree with that. Jets had more injuries this year than that year. I would rank this 3rd of those 3. You also forget 2011. Jets were 8-5 and lost their last 3 games to miss the playoffs,including the Victor Cruz run. I would put this behind that because of pure expectations. Jets were coming off the two AFC championship runs Meltdown to me means late in the season collapse. This "collapse" didnt happen late in the season, it happened in the middle Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SAR I Posted November 25, 2015 Share Posted November 25, 2015 Meltdown to me means late in the season collapse. This "collapse" didnt happen late in the season, it happened in the middle Also keep in mind that in 2009 we had a stretch where we went 1-6 and still advanced to the AFC Championship Game. What's happening now isn't a "meltdown". It is injuries and suspect playcalling that turned two wins into losses (Buffalo, Houston) and this can all be traced back to Ryan Fitzpatrick's stupid non-slide in Oakland which started this whole awful losing streak. Who knows what happens if he doesn't hurt his hand, his stats suck since that moment, SAR I Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nyjunc Posted November 25, 2015 Share Posted November 25, 2015 Also keep in mind that in 2009 we had a stretch where we went 1-6 and still advanced to the AFC Championship Game. What's happening now isn't a "meltdown". It is injuries and suspect playcalling that turned two wins into losses (Buffalo, Houston) and this can all be traced back to Ryan Fitzpatrick's stupid non-slide in Oakland which started this whole awful losing streak. Who knows what happens if he doesn't hurt his hand, his stats suck since that moment, SAR I I think he has played fine since then, his #s are down but how many drops have we had? big drops? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SAR I Posted November 25, 2015 Share Posted November 25, 2015 I think he has played fine since then, his #s are down but how many drops have we had? big drops? The only thing keeping this team from 6-10 was Ryan Fitzpatrick. So when he gets injured in Oakland and our season falls apart you put two and two together and it explains many of the issues. He didn't play well at all in the first halves against Buffalo and Houston, remember that he barely beat the Jaguars too. Add atop that some bad injuries to Mangold, Marshall, Decker, Colon, and Ivory and you've got an offense that's playing at 70% which won't cut it with this rebuilding effort. Defense, no injury excuses, we're deep there and we're talented. Big picture, if at the start of the season we had a 10-6 caliber Defense and a 6-10 caliber Offense and 4-12 caliber Special Teams, it's not a shock we're heading to 8-8 once the injury bug hit and our offensive production ceased. SAR I Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ex-Rex Posted November 25, 2015 Share Posted November 25, 2015 Where does this Jet meltdown rank? You're a regular ray of sunshine ain't ya Dr.Detroit? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nyjunc Posted November 25, 2015 Share Posted November 25, 2015 The only thing keeping this team from 6-10 was Ryan Fitzpatrick. So when he gets injured in Oakland and our season falls apart you put two and two together and it explains many of the issues. He didn't play well at all in the first halves against Buffalo and Houston, remember that he barely beat the Jaguars too. Add atop that some bad injuries to Mangold, Marshall, Decker, Colon, and Ivory and you've got an offense that's playing at 70% which won't cut it with this rebuilding effort. Defense, no injury excuses, we're deep there and we're talented. Big picture, if at the start of the season we had a 10-6 caliber Defense and a 6-10 caliber Offense and 4-12 caliber Special Teams, it's not a shock we're heading to 8-8 once the injury bug hit and our offensive production ceased. SAR I on paper we have a 12-4 caliber D, 9-7 caliber O and 4-12 caliber STs. that should equal playoff spot in a not too strong AFC. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ex-Rex Posted November 25, 2015 Share Posted November 25, 2015 on paper we have a 12-4 caliber D, 9-7 caliber O and 4-12 caliber STs. that should equal playoff spot in a not too strong AFC. You have vastly over rated the defense. They don't tackle well, don't cover RB's or TE's well and have no pass rush skills. They are not 12-4 talent. Our offense is pedestrian at best 8-8 talent there. Our special teams are not special at all. The Jets are right where they ought to be and will finish at 8-8. The problem is that the talent on this team is all over 30, so our next two drafts have got to be really good or this team is toast for the next five years. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jetsfan80 Posted November 25, 2015 Share Posted November 25, 2015 2011 was far worse. We went from 8-5 (coming off an 11-5 season) and in complete control to make the playoffs to 8-8, with infighting and incompetence all over the place. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nyjunc Posted November 25, 2015 Share Posted November 25, 2015 You have vastly over rated the defense. They don't tackle well, don't cover RB's or TE's well and have no pass rush skills. They are not 12-4 talent. Our offense is pedestrian at best 8-8 talent there. Our special teams are not special at all. The Jets are right where they ought to be and will finish at 8-8. The problem is that the talent on this team is all over 30, so our next two drafts have got to be really good or this team is toast for the next five years. our DL and secondary should be dominant. we have average LBs but that is more than made up for that DL and the secondary. We lack an elite pass rusher but we have so many guys that can get to the QB on the DL and some great blitzers and schemes. Our O has big time WRs, very good RBs, decent Ol and decent QB. You underestimate the O. the STs suck as far as coverage/returns. failing w/ that 12 man draft in '14 w/ Idzik really, really, really killed us. that should have been the draft to set us up for years of success. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nyjunc Posted November 25, 2015 Share Posted November 25, 2015 2011 was far worse. We went from 8-5 (coming off an 11-5 season) and in complete control to make the playoffs to 8-8, with infighting and incompetence all over the place. I disagree, that year sucked but all year I never felt that we were that good. the end wasn't a total shock especially w/ as hot as Philly was at the time and knowing NYG wouldn't lose again. 2008 really hurt b/c we had a golden opportunity for rare div title and we had to watch the QB we threw away lead a div rival to the title w/ a team that had won one game the year before. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
UnitedWhofans Posted November 25, 2015 Share Posted November 25, 2015 our DL and secondary should be dominant. we have average LBs but that is more than made up for that DL and the secondary. We lack an elite pass rusher but we have so many guys that can get to the QB on the DL and some great blitzers and schemes. Our O has big time WRs, very good RBs, decent Ol and decent QB. You underestimate the O. the STs suck as far as coverage/returns. failing w/ that 12 man draft in '14 w/ Idzik really, really, really killed us. that should have been the draft to set us up for years of success. Our DL is overrated. The only player who can regularly get to the QB on the line is Richardson, Wilkerson is good but he is nowhere close to the money that he wants. Williams is getting better with playing time. Notice that Richardson did not play this week, and Williams had a good game. He needs regular playing time to improve. ILB, we're pretty solid at, I know few ILBs with speed to cover. Maybe Keuchly, who is the best in the NFL, but other than that, no. OLB they need speed. Mauldin is a good start, and he should get more playing time with Coples now gone. Secondary is very interesting. With Pryor healthy and Gilchrist, we're set at safety. Revis is not the man he once was and can no longer be put on an island (he's still very good though). Cro is shot and Skrine is okay when healthy. Milliner's failing health is a real anchor because when he played enough, he showed that he could play a bit. I would not be surprised if they drafted another corner in the draft, as long as it is not a reach. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shadetree Posted November 26, 2015 Share Posted November 26, 2015 I agree with the take on the lack of urgency and lack of heart, it is mind-boggling how this keeps happening from Edwards to Mangini to Ryan to Bowles. It's one thing to get beat and it's quite another to sleepwalk. These are professional athletes, it's inexcusable. SAR I it's simple. We're cursed. Our season ended in Oakland. Our season ended in Houston. And, at some piont in the next six weeks, our season will end with our 7th loss. So, theoretically, the 2015 team will be the first team in the long, storied history of the NYJ to have their season end three times in one season. #find new ways to lose Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jet Nut Posted November 26, 2015 Share Posted November 26, 2015 If you seriously think this season has been a meltdown you don't know Jets football history Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GREENBEAN Posted November 26, 2015 Share Posted November 26, 2015 Really? LOL. You guys are young..... Look up 1986 This. I was thinking the same thing. When we beat Denver that season to become 10-1 ( I think) everyone was talking Super Bowl. We ended up 10-6 with Pat Ryan replacing Kenny O. Then it was the Cleveland playoff loss no? I'm going off off of the top of my head here which is not a good bet. We were up by 10 with like 3 min left and lost in double over time. The worst!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Powpow Posted November 26, 2015 Share Posted November 26, 2015 Really? LOL. You guys are young..... Look up 1986 Definitely one of the worst meltdowns in sports history. Started 10-1 in dominating fashion then lose last five in blowouts. Win a playoff game vs. Chiefs....next playoff game vs. Browns they snatch defeat from the jaws of victory. With the game in hand, Gastineau gets called for roughing Kosar unnecessarily ....game set match. Probably the most heartbreaking loss in Jet history. There were others equally disheartening but this one really really was excruciating. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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