no psls Posted March 31, 2016 Share Posted March 31, 2016 Are they out of their minds ???? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ohio State NY Jets fan Posted March 31, 2016 Share Posted March 31, 2016 They are probably on a call with SF this morning Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FidelioJet Posted March 31, 2016 Share Posted March 31, 2016 The right thing to do is shop him. If and what they trade him for is a different question. It always makes sense to see what the market is willing to offer....but don't move him unless you think you're getting at least equal value back. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Irish Jet Posted March 31, 2016 Share Posted March 31, 2016 Is there news on this I'm missing. Desperately hope stays as I just don't see us getting anything close to good value for him. If we trade him for a 2nd I'll be disgusted. **** the cap. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sourceworx Posted March 31, 2016 Share Posted March 31, 2016 If he gets you a QB, you absolutely trade him. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kleckineau Posted March 31, 2016 Share Posted March 31, 2016 Any link for this?? I will take back everything negative I have said about Macc if he works out a deal to to bring an NFL caliber QB here. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
southparkcpa Posted March 31, 2016 Share Posted March 31, 2016 Just now, Kleckineau said: Any link for this?? I will take back everything negative I have said about Macc if he works out a deal to to bring an NFL caliber QB here. As long as it doesnt stink of Woody involvement aka Tebow and Sanchez. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PCP63 Posted March 31, 2016 Share Posted March 31, 2016 I'll get burned at the stake for this, but Mo is overrated. Don't get me wrong, he's still a great player, but people overrated him due to his inflated coverage sacks. He can't speed rush the edge and bend well enough to truly make QBs worry. Again, still a great player, but we need speed rushers. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Irish Jet Posted March 31, 2016 Share Posted March 31, 2016 15 hours ago, PCP63 said: I'll get burned at the stake for this, but Mo is overrated. Don't get me wrong, he's still a great player, but people overrated him due to his inflated coverage sacks. He can't speed rush the edge and bend well enough to truly make QBs worry. Again, still a great player, but we need speed rushers. Ridiculous. He's probably the second best defensive lineman in the league and he absolutely makes QB's worry - Getting hit by him isn't fun and he's very consistent. We were in top 5 in term of pressuring QB's with Mo being the key guy. That shocks a lot of people here because people only focus on the times where the QB actually makes a mistake when giving credit. No one notices when the opposing QB makes a great play under pressure, everyone notices the plays where there's no pressure. Hence lack of pass rush is the most common complaint around the league. Brady played one of the best QB games I've ever seen in the loss against us last season and his stats were mediocre. I'd argue he's the most important player in the team and while we are very fortunate to have two studs on the line regardless, we'll notice his absence for sure. I think we'll have the best line in the league next season if they're playing together because they're all getting better. Speed Rushers are more overrated than a guy like Mo. He's invaluable. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
drsamuel84 Posted March 31, 2016 Share Posted March 31, 2016 While this situation has unfortunately gotten a little out of hand I do think Macc is doing the right thing by not overpaying Mo. I love the guy, he's stayed out of trouble, local guy from Linden, NJ, homegrown talent drafted by the Jets but the fact still remains he's not Von Miller or JJ Watt and it sounds like he's asking for that kind of money (which I don't begrudge him for NFL careers are short with non guaranteed contracts get paid while you can). And with the younger, cheaper talent on the D-Line we just can't put all that cap space into Mo that's not how you build a sustainable winner. I think the market is proving Mo's worth too as no one has given Macc a deal to this point he's willing to pull the trigger on. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Irish Jet Posted March 31, 2016 Share Posted March 31, 2016 Quote Unable to reach a long-term deal with Muhammad Wilkerson, the New York Jets have reportedly elected to use the franchise tag to ensure they will not lose his rights in free agency. While the Jets also have other free agents, such as Damon Harrison, that they could have tagged instead, Wilkerson is by far the best use. The former 30th-overall pick of the 2011 NFL draft quickly developed into one of the best 3-4 defensive ends in the league. Over the past four seasons, Wilkerson has graded among the top five 3-4 DEs three times, with 2013 as the lone exception. Typically, he’s been better in run defense than as a pass rusher, but that does not diminish what he has accomplished as a rusher. In fact, Wilkerson is coming off a 10.7 pass rushing productivity that ranked fifth at his position in 2015, along with 78 total pressures, both of which are career-highs. Although Wilkerson is now tagged, the Jets still have to decisions to make regarding his future. The first of their options is that they can let him play out the 2016 season on his one-year deal. Wilkerson did suffer a broken leg in Week 17 that he is recovering from, although reports are that he is progressing well. But if the team is considering keeping him long-term and wants to see how he plays prior to re-signing him, they do have that option. New York could also still try to re-sign him for the long-term prior to the start of the season. While they would definitely want to keep a player of his caliber, the Jets have already invested a lot into Sheldon Richardson and last year’s first-round pick Leonard Williams. The Jets will have to commit a significant amount of money to a single position group, especially if they also keep NT Damon Williams. It would be unlikely they could—or would—want to keep both players, and will likely have to choose between the two. The last option, which also seems to be the most-rumored, is that the Jets trade him prior to the draft. There should be no shortage of teams interested in Wilkerson. While he’s primarily been an interior defender, he played significantly more as an edge defender last season, and did exceptionally well. He’s also only 26 years old, plenty young enough for another team with cap space to heavily invest in a long-term contract for the All-Pro. A first-round pick (or more) in return for Wilkerson may be a difficult offer to turn down. Regardless of what the Jets decide, the tag will allow New York to either retain the All-Pro or trade for draft picks, as they try to improve upon their 10-6 record heading into their second season under head coach Todd Bowles. Brilliant article from PFF to back up what I'm saying. Games are won and lost on the lines - This is an elite player in a high value position, more valuable than a speed rusher IMO. Keeping Mo ensures the strength of our team will only get better. Guy is the model pro, undoubtedly a huge influence in the locker room too. You don't lose guys like this without noticing, we don't realise this because we don't have too many players like this. It will be an incredible blow. I don't know. Maybe I'm too sentimental for American Sports. I get the logic that we have cover and that we need the cap room but it legit saddens me to see people so prepared to discard one of the best Jets I've seen in my lifetime to make room for a hypothetical pass rusher unlikely to match his production. Sigh... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FidelioJet Posted March 31, 2016 Share Posted March 31, 2016 8 minutes ago, Irish Jet said: Ridiculous. He's probably the second best defensive lineman in the league and he absolutely makes QB's worry - Getting hit by him isn't fun and he's very consistent. We were in top 5 in term of pressuring QB's with Mo being the key guy. That shocks a lot of people here because people only focus on the times where the QB actually makes a mistake when giving credit. No one notices when the opposing QB makes a great play under pressure, everyone notices the plays where there's no pressure. Hence lack of pass rush is the most common complaint around the league. Brady played one of the best QB games I've ever seen in the loss against us last season and his stats were mediocre. I'd argue he's the most important player in the team and while we are very fortunate to have two studs on the line regardless, we'll notice his absence for sure. I think we'll have the best line in the league next season if they're playing together because they're all getting better. Speed Rushers are more overrated than a guy like Mo. He's invaluable. He isn't even the second best lineman on his own team. He's a solid player, but simply not disruptive enough (IMO). I like Mo and would love to keep him, but the reality is we don't need him. He should not be viewed as untouchable. If there's a deal that can help fill holes where the team isn't already stacked I'm all for it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jet Nut Posted March 31, 2016 Share Posted March 31, 2016 27 minutes ago, PCP63 said: I'll get burned at the stake for this, but Mo is overrated. Don't get me wrong, he's still a great player, but people overrated him due to his inflated coverage sacks. He can't speed rush the edge and bend well enough to truly make QBs worry. Again, still a great player, but we need speed rushers. If it's easy to get these "coverage sacks", why is it Mo who gets them? How many sacks from others are coverage sacks? You don't have to be a speed rusher to be a top DL. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Irish Jet Posted March 31, 2016 Share Posted March 31, 2016 15 hours ago, FidelioJet said: He isn't even the second best lineman on his own team. Yeah. Overrated. LOL Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JustInFudge Posted March 31, 2016 Share Posted March 31, 2016 Is this breaking news? Havent we known they've been shopping him? Confused. It's stupid. I agree but hasnt this been happening all offseason? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CrazyCarl40 Posted March 31, 2016 Share Posted March 31, 2016 7 sacks a year is not elite. If they can move him, his massive salary, and big pay day commands for anything that helps make the team as a whole better, then do it. Williams and Richardson are more than enough firepower to make the defensive line above average next season. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dcat Posted March 31, 2016 Share Posted March 31, 2016 14 minutes ago, Irish Jet said: Ridiculous. He's probably the second best defensive lineman in the league Speed Rushers are more overrated than a guy like Mo. He's invaluable. Completely wrong. If you think Mo is more valuable than say a Von Miller, then what can I say? You are crazy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JustInFudge Posted March 31, 2016 Share Posted March 31, 2016 30 minutes ago, PCP63 said: I'll get burned at the stake for this, but Mo is overrated. Don't get me wrong, he's still a great player, but people overrated him due to his inflated coverage sacks. He can't speed rush the edge and bend well enough to truly make QBs worry. Again, still a great player, but we need speed rushers. It amazes me that you got reputation for this. Everyone is entitled to their opinion but it just goes to show that Jets fans have literally zero clue how good Mo is and how little they appreciate his skill set. The dude's only knock, literally, is he's not JJ Watt. lmfao The ******* guy is an absolute monster and this defense will take a significant and I mean, significant drop without him. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JustInFudge Posted March 31, 2016 Share Posted March 31, 2016 Mo isnt elite. WOW! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rangers9 Posted March 31, 2016 Share Posted March 31, 2016 Look the philosophy of some orgs is if they can trade a good player like Wilk after he completes his rookie contract then they've gotten the best years out of the player (and Wilk was injured), won't have to pay them the big bucks and will get something in return like a new player under a rookie deal. So it makes a lot of sense to trade him now plus they have almost no cap space and this would give them a lot of money to operate on. On the other hand Wilk improved this past season, he's still young and there is no player in this draft as good as he is. But to me considering the injury and the smart philosophy of not keeping players too long so you don't have to pay them I'm ok with a deal. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jet Nut Posted March 31, 2016 Share Posted March 31, 2016 2 minutes ago, Dcat said: Completely wrong. If you think Mo is more valuable than say a Von Miller, then what can I say? You are crazy. Why are people even calling Miller a DL? He's a LB.. Two different positions Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JustInFudge Posted March 31, 2016 Share Posted March 31, 2016 This fanbase... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Irish Jet Posted March 31, 2016 Share Posted March 31, 2016 15 hours ago, Dcat said: Completely wrong. If you think Mo is more valuable than say a Von Miller, then what can I say? You are crazy. I never mentioned Von Miller - Haven't seen enough of his game. But it absolutely is a more valuable position. You do realise unless your watching these guys on every play you're just going by stats and highlights - Edge Rushers that is. You don't see the plays where's they're over committing on run plays and being taken out of the game 30 plays at a time. You'd see the one sack on Redzone or gameday and say great performance. Not you in particular by the way, talking about the general opinion on speed rushers. Wilkerson is a force on every single play and a complete nightmare for teams to go up against. His consistency since entering the league is unbelievable. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JustInFudge Posted March 31, 2016 Share Posted March 31, 2016 18 minutes ago, Irish Jet said: Ridiculous. He's probably the second best defensive lineman in the league and he absolutely makes QB's worry - Getting hit by him isn't fun and he's very consistent. We were in top 5 in term of pressuring QB's with Mo being the key guy. That shocks a lot of people here because people only focus on the times where the QB actually makes a mistake when giving credit. No one notices when the opposing QB makes a great play under pressure, everyone notices the plays where there's no pressure. Hence lack of pass rush is the most common complaint around the league. Brady played one of the best QB games I've ever seen in the loss against us last season and his stats were mediocre. I'd argue he's the most important player in the team and while we are very fortunate to have two studs on the line regardless, we'll notice his absence for sure. I think we'll have the best line in the league next season if they're playing together because they're all getting better. Speed Rushers are more overrated than a guy like Mo. He's invaluable. No need to argue it, there is no argument. lol Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jet Nut Posted March 31, 2016 Share Posted March 31, 2016 1 minute ago, JiF said: It amazes me that you got reputation for this. Everyone is entitled to their opinion but it just goes to show that Jets fans have literally zero clue how good Mo is and how little they appreciate his skill set. The dude's only knock, literally, is he's not JJ Watt. lmfao The ******* guy is an absolute monster and this defense will take a significant and I mean, significant drop without him. As soon as someone whines that his 12 sacks are because of the coverage or that he doesn't have enough sacks or isn't disruptive you know it's time to ignore. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JustInFudge Posted March 31, 2016 Share Posted March 31, 2016 Just now, Jet Nut said: As soon as someone whines that his 12 sacks are because of the coverage or that he doesn't have enough sacks or isn't disruptive you know it's time to ignore. My favorite part about shopping him is there is probably a 95% chance, if not higher, the Jets dont get a better player who makes a bigger impact than Mo. But he'll be cheaper, yay!!!!!!!!!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dcat Posted March 31, 2016 Share Posted March 31, 2016 4 minutes ago, Jet Nut said: Why are people even calling Miller a DL? He's a LB.. Two different positions You claimed that edge rushers were overrated compared to DEs (3-4 DEs no less). Von Miller is an edge rusher. And as such, Von Miller is more valuable to defense than a DL. Your post was and still is absurd. Mo isn't even close to being "the #2 DL in the league". Nice player. Borders on elite. Would love to keep him. But in a 3-4 scheme, he's just not as important as a Von Miller type would be. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jet Nut Posted March 31, 2016 Share Posted March 31, 2016 6 minutes ago, Dcat said: You claimed that edge rushers were overrated compared to DEs (3-4 DEs no less). Von Miller is an edge rusher. And as such, Von Miller is more valuable to defense than a DL. Your post was and still is absurd. Mo isn't even close to being "the #2 DL in the league". Nice player. Borders on elite. Would love to keep him. But in a 3-4 scheme, he's just not as important as a Von Miller type would be. I claimed what? I said what about him being the 2nd best DL? You need to wake up, lol, I never said any of this, hard to be absurd. One thing I did say, LB isn't DL. Comparing the 2 is silly and pointless And I do believe Mo was ranked the 3rd best 3-4 DE in the league. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Villain The Foe Posted March 31, 2016 Share Posted March 31, 2016 45 minutes ago, Irish Jet said: Brilliant article from PFF to back up what I'm saying. Games are won and lost on the lines - This is an elite player in a high value position, more valuable than a speed rusher IMO. Keeping Mo ensures the strength of our team will only get better. Guy is the model pro, undoubtedly a huge influence in the locker room too. You don't lose guys like this without noticing, we don't realise this because we don't have too many players like this. It will be an incredible blow. I don't know. Maybe I'm too sentimental for American Sports. I get the logic that we have cover and that we need the cap room but it legit saddens me to see people so prepared to discard one of the best Jets I've seen in my lifetime to make room for a hypothetical pass rusher unlikely to match his production. Sigh... Games are won and lost in the trenches, but paying Mo Wilkerson 100 million dollars over 6 years is insanity. Paying a player 16-18 million dollars a year means that he's elite. It means that you single handedly wreck games of your opponents. Mo Wilkerson has never been that. Jets fans tend to be extreme with their players, either over or undervaluing them depending on the circumstance. Some think that we should get a deal for Wilk similar to what we got for Revis (1st and 4th round picks) though at the time we thought that we should have gotten two 1st round picks for Revis. Atleast in the case of Revis he was the absolute best in the game during his prime, making WR's in their primes, no matter their name, totally irrelevant. Revis totally wrecked offensive passing schemes because he could play anywhere so you couldnt even move your #1 around the field to avoid him (like how they do against Sherman). I've said it before and I'll have to say it again. I cannot ever remember coming away from a game and saying to myself "Mo Wilkerson completely wrecked that team for 60 minutes". You can say that about JJ Watt just about every year, 3 of the last 4 years you could say that about Robert Quinn. Mo Wilkerson is a very good DE and is one of the best but he's not a game changer. You pay that type of money to "game changing" talent, especially when you already have his replacement on the team and he plays a position where you have the deepest talent. There's simply no reason to pay Mo Wilkerson 100+ million dollars for 6 years. You'll keep a very good DE that isnt a game changer meanwhile you'll lose 1, maybe 2 of your younger Dlinemen simply because you cant afford them. And no, we will not be getting a 1st and a 4th for Mo. I strongly believe that we wont even get a 1st. We'd be lucky if we got a 2nd or a 3rd & 4th together. Mo Wilkerson is a very good, very consistent player, but he's not a game changer and he has never single handedly taken over a football game and basically got a win because of his contribution directly. Trade him, which is something we should have done last season...we potentially could have received a 1st last year given the fact that he was still under contract. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PCP63 Posted March 31, 2016 Share Posted March 31, 2016 20 minutes ago, Jet Nut said: If it's easy to get these "coverage sacks", why is it Mo who gets them? How many sacks from others are coverage sacks? You don't have to be a speed rusher to be a top DL. He's far and away our best DL, that's why. But he's not someone OCs have to gameplan around. He really isn't. We need a Von Miller type player. I guy that can force the tackle to widen, and get a good, powerful bend that forces the QB to step up into the pocket (into our big interior guys). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
section314 Posted March 31, 2016 Share Posted March 31, 2016 14 minutes ago, JiF said: My favorite part about shopping him is there is probably a 95% chance, if not higher, the Jets dont get a better player who makes a bigger impact than Mo. But he'll be cheaper, yay!!!!!!!!!!! Only caveat to your argument would be if he lands us a franchise QB. But odds are pretty strong that won't happen, so I pretty much agree with you. I just went back and looked at the 1st round in 2011, of which Mo was pick #30. What a great, great draft! We may never see that much talent in a first round again. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dcat Posted March 31, 2016 Share Posted March 31, 2016 5 minutes ago, Jet Nut said: I claimed what? I said what about him being the 2nd best DL? You need to wake up, lol, I never said any of this, hard to be absurd. One thing I did say, LB isn't DL. Comparing the 2 is silly and pointless And I do believe Mo was ranked the 3rd best 3-4 DE in the league. Not you. Irish Jet. Below is what he said, which is what I was responding to when you interjected. Below is what he said and he was clearly comparing OLB Speed edge rushers with a 3-4 DE. A completely absurd comparison. Which was my point in the first place. So you and I agree. It's Irish Jet that doesn't understand the difference between a 3-4 DE and a 3-4 speed OLB edge rusher. Quote 34 minutes ago, Irish Jet said: Ridiculous. He's probably the second best defensive lineman in the league Speed Rushers are more overrated than a guy like Mo. He's invaluable. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jet Nut Posted March 31, 2016 Share Posted March 31, 2016 3 minutes ago, Dcat said: Not you. Irish Jet. Below is what he said, which is what I was responding to when you interjected. Below is what he said and he was clearly comparing OLB Speed edge rushers with a 3-4 DE. A completely absurd comparison. Which was my point in the first place. So you and I agree. It's Irish Jet that doesn't understand the difference between a 3-4 DE and a 3-4 speed OLB edge rusher. I know he said it. Was joking because you credited me with two statements, neither came from me. I agree, they're two different positions, which was point. Millers great but the position is completely different. It's two different conversations Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PCP63 Posted March 31, 2016 Share Posted March 31, 2016 20 minutes ago, JiF said: My favorite part about shopping him is there is probably a 95% chance, if not higher, the Jets dont get a better player who makes a bigger impact than Mo. But he'll be cheaper, yay!!!!!!!!!!! Sometimes it's better to have a player that may not be as good, but is cheaper. I mean, would you rather have a top 5 player at $20M, or a top 10 player at $10M? Completely made up numbers, of course, just saying that you have to balance talent AND cap. Can't have a team full of Revis's. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
heymangold Posted March 31, 2016 Share Posted March 31, 2016 what would you rather happen? trade Mo for a 2/3? or have him play out the year under a 15M franchise tag and have him walk next season for nothing? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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