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Muhammad Wilkerson Windy City Bound?

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To the multiple people who've mentioned Cutler in this thread, you realize that Cutler and Marshall despise each other, right? Cutler will not be wearing green as long as Marshall's here

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10 minutes ago, BroadwayJets said:

To the multiple people who've mentioned Cutler in this thread, you realize that Cutler and Marshall despise each other, right? Cutler will not be wearing green as long as Marshall's here

Good. He sux.

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9 hours ago, SenorGato said:

I'm not rocking my three wolves and the moon tee so prollly not or mayb....

if you ponied up the couple hundey like me and got the tattoo you wouldnt have to worry about being caught without the magic :) 

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37 minutes ago, 32EBoozer said:

At 20.... you're probably looking at a Defensive player again.

Will the Rams take Lynch? If tha's the guy you want, do you risk losing him?

Are they OK maybe getting Cook or Prescott later? 

I don't know...... but I can't wait for the Draft to get here.

Is that so? While on paper that may be the BPA, and Maccagnan says that's what he's going to do, I don't believe any GM purely ignores a team's obvious present and near-future needs. While a big OLB is also a need after QB, I think there's a good chance we take an OT. It's got to really burn him as a GM to pay $15M between them to be our OTs for another season, with the reason being neither position was addressed in his first year here either, or in FA last month.

Just saying that despite his claim he's going pure BPA, I'm starting to think lots of GMs simply say that to help justify any pick they make as also being their BPA. What are they going to say? "Our #1 pick really wasn't the top rated player on our board, and maybe not even one of the top 5 rated players on our board, but we had a temporary need since I was delinquent in my job in filling that need in free agency or in last year's draft. Therefore we took this lower-ranked player." Lol.

So I think GMs just say that a lot so they won't be accused of reaching in the draft. Sometimes you get a Leonard Williams available at #6 overall and it's actually true, where the only rational choices are to take him or trade the pick away. But even Williams could be rationalized as a need, even if not an immediate need, if Mac was sure he'd soon lose Mo, and then probably Sheldon a year or two later depending on if he holds out or not.

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16 minutes ago, Sperm Edwards said:

Is that so? While on paper that may be the BPA, and Maccagnan says that's what he's going to do, I don't believe any GM purely ignores a team's obvious present and near-future needs. While a big OLB is also a need after QB, I think there's a good chance we take an OT. It's got to really burn him as a GM to pay $15M between them to be our OTs for another season, with the reason being neither position was addressed in his first year here either, or in FA last month.

Just saying that despite his claim he's going pure BPA, I'm starting to think lots of GMs simply say that to help justify any pick they make as also being their BPA. What are they going to say? "Our #1 pick really wasn't the top rated player on our board, and maybe not even one of the top 5 rated players on our board, but we had a temporary need since I was delinquent in my job in filling that need in free agency or in last year's draft. Therefore we took this lower-ranked player." Lol.

So I think GMs just say that a lot so they won't be accused of reaching in the draft. Sometimes you get a Leonard Williams available at #6 overall and it's actually true, where the only rational choices are to take him or trade the pick away. But even Williams could be rationalized as a need, even if not an immediate need, if Mac was sure he'd soon lose Mo, and then probably Sheldon a year or two later depending on if he holds out or not.

If the Jets are looking at a QB, OLB, or LT at their first round pick, they'll take the BAP and fill a need. That's easy. It's when the best player on their board isn't a position of immediate need, like a WR or DT, that it gets dicier. If Maccagnan doesn't take one of those first three positions in the first round this year, you'll know he's a dogmatic BAP guy. 

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Peter King weighs in on the Wilkerson rumors:

http://mmqb.si.com/mmqb/2016/04/03/colin-kaepernick-trade-broncos-49ers-titans-jalen-ramsey-nfl-draft

6. I think if you want Muhammad Wilkerson of the Jets, you’d better offer more than a low first-round pick.
This is one of the five best defensive linemen in football, by any measure. He’s 26. Other than the fluky
broken leg suffered at the end of last season, his health is fine. That injury is the only argument any team
could make that Wilkerson is not worth, say, picks in the first and third or fourth round.

7. I think the team that ought to go after Wilkerson is Indianapolis. No question. The Colts have a mediocre
lot (Kendall Langford and Arthur Jones) with strong prospect Henry Anderson in their 3-4 defensive end scheme
now. If I were GM Ryan Grigson, I’d offer the Jets my first-round and fourth-round picks this year
(Nos. 18 and 116 overall) for Wilkerson. The Colts, with $19 million under the cap, have been saving cap room
for the Andrew Luck contract. Wilkerson is the kind of special player that is worth performing major salary-cap surgery.

If Maccagnan pulls the trigger on Wilkerson and then trades down from #20 with DAL we could end up
"controlling" the 2nd - 4th rounds of the draft.  We could really re-stock the roster

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1 hour ago, drdetroit said:

Wilk and the 20 pick for Cutler and 11 otherwise no

Are you nuts? Cutler? The goal is to use your chips to get better,. Not to trade your chips to get a pile of sh*t in return. 

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3 minutes ago, KRL said:

Peter King weighs in on the Wilkerson rumors:

http://mmqb.si.com/mmqb/2016/04/03/colin-kaepernick-trade-broncos-49ers-titans-jalen-ramsey-nfl-draft

6. I think if you want Muhammad Wilkerson of the Jets, you’d better offer more than a low first-round pick.
This is one of the five best defensive linemen in football, by any measure. He’s 26. Other than the fluky
broken leg suffered at the end of last season, his health is fine. That injury is the only argument any team
could make that Wilkerson is not worth, say, picks in the first and third or fourth round.

7. I think the team that ought to go after Wilkerson is Indianapolis. No question. The Colts have a mediocre
lot (Kendall Langford and Arthur Jones) with strong prospect Henry Anderson in their 3-4 defensive end scheme
now. If I were GM Ryan Grigson, I’d offer the Jets my first-round and fourth-round picks this year
(Nos. 18 and 116 overall) for Wilkerson. The Colts, with $19 million under the cap, have been saving cap room
for the Andrew Luck contract. Wilkerson is the kind of special player that is worth performing major salary-cap surgery.

If Maccagnan pulls the trigger on Wilkerson and then trades down from #20 with DAL we could end up
"controlling" the 2nd - 4th rounds of the draft.  We could really re-stock the roster

About damn time Wilk gets some credibility. Some people will actually accept just a 2nd for Wilk and that's mind boggling to me. I would ask for at least a 1st and then some. 

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21 minutes ago, slats said:

If the Jets are looking at a QB, OLB, or LT at their first round pick, they'll take the BAP and fill a need. That's easy. It's when the best player on their board isn't a position of immediate need, like a WR or DT, that it gets dicier. If Maccagnan doesn't take one of those first three positions in the first round this year, you'll know he's a dogmatic BAP guy. 

Maybe.

He could also take a guard; he can take a TE (if he "knows" from the coaches that Amaro isn't going to work out and Enunwa is an emergency not an actual plan); he can rationalize the same with CB and ILB. He could claim we don't have an ideal situation at LT, but we don't have an outright hole there either (otherwise there's no purpose to have Ferguson even being on the roster today), and our situations at CB and ILB.

So I think he's still got enough wiggle room to say it was BAP and a need. I would agree it's a stretch, but technically it could be rationalized.

Regardless, I was saying more that it can be a need without it being an immediate need. 

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25 minutes ago, Ghost said:

About damn time Wilk gets some credibility. Some people will actually accept just a 2nd for Wilk and that's mind boggling to me. I would ask for at least a 1st and then some. 

The same reports that are reporting that Mac is actively shopping Mo are saying a 2nd rounder will do it. It's not him that's not worth the 1st round pick, off talent alone, there's no question he's worth the 1st rounder. It's the price tag that comes with Mo that's swaying teams away from offering a 1st rounder. 

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Love seeing these outsiders like King up the ante.. I have low expectations on what we can aquire for Mo as he is due a huge payday.. multiple picks would be amazing

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10 minutes ago, BroadwayJets said:

The same reports that are reporting that Mac is actively shopping Mo are saying a 2nd rounder will do it. It's not him that's not worth the 1st round pick, off talent alone, there's no question he's worth the 1st rounder. It's the price tag that comes with Mo that's swaying teams away from offering a 1st rounder. 

Jets need to find a team that has some cap room but also think they're a player or two away from being a legitimate contender and in a win-now mode.

A team like that will be willing to part with their 1st simply because the odds of finding someone better is the draft is unlikely..

 

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1 minute ago, FidelioJet said:

Jets need to find a team that has some cap room but also think they're a player or two away from being a legitimate contender and in a win-now mode.

A team like that will be willing to part with their 1st simply because the odds of finding someone better is the draft is unlikely..

 

There are few that fit that mold. My guess is the Colts/Bears. And it'll be their 2nd rounders

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What's going to drive me insane is that people on this board will go nuts saying "mac only got a 2nd/3rd rounder for MO!" "Awful Negotiator!" 

Meanwhile he just effed Fitz' life up by standing firm in his position and not budging.

 

Jets fans.

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Just now, BroadwayJets said:

There are few that fit that mold. My guess is the Colts/Bears. And it'll be their 2nd rounders

agreed - not going to be easy to get a first.  Bears defense was atrocious, a guy like Mo goes a long way.  I imagine that's why we're hearing about them.

One bidder is never good for a negotiation unless the Jets are okay keeping him.  I get the feeling they're going to give him up for the best price.  

Me personally, I would rather pay him than give him up for anything but a 1st..and even then, unless that first (possibly combined with #20) gets them one of the top 2 QB's...

 

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Just now, FidelioJet said:

agreed - not going to be easy to get a first.  Bears defense was atrocious, a guy like Mo goes a long way.  I imagine that's why we're hearing about them.

One bidder is never good for a negotiation unless the Jets are okay keeping him.  I get the feeling they're going to give him up for the best price.  

Me personally, I would rather pay him than give him up for anything but a 1st..and even then, unless that first (possibly combined with #20) gets them one of the top 2 QB's...

 

There's one wildcard that could happen, and that's if we don't trade him and Sheldon gets in trouble again. Then we may see an extension. Longshot though imo. I don't think this regime deems Mo worthy of $16-18 million a year.

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2 hours ago, Ghost said:

If we cannot trade him this year, can't we tag him next season and attempt to trade him again? Sucks his salary will increase but so will our cap space next season 

I think if you tag him again, it goes up by 20%.   So you are looking at....  19.5 for a one year deal?   That's really high.

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26 minutes ago, BroadwayJets said:

What's going to drive me insane is that people on this board will go nuts saying "mac only got a 2nd/3rd rounder for MO!" "Awful Negotiator!" 

Meanwhile he just effed Fitz' life up by standing firm in his position and not budging.

 

Jets fans.

I think it's more Jet fannish to expect such a garbage return (yet again since we've done this twice already with first round pick return in the air - moreso for JAbe than Revis). Mac should absolutely get bashed for basically donating Wilkerson to someone in the name of saving cap space for The Future.

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Just now, SenorGato said:

I think it's more Jet fannish to expect such a garbage return (yet again since we've done this twice already). Mac should absolutely get bashed for basically donating Wilkerson to someome in the name of saving cap space for The Future.

It's about getting a pick this year instead of a comp pick in 2018.

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3 minutes ago, BroadwayJets said:

It's about getting a pick this year instead of a comp pick in 2018.

There's that Jet fannish desperation. 

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3 minutes ago, SenorGato said:

I think it's more Jet fannish to expect such a garbage return (yet again since we've done this twice already with first round pick return in the air - moreso for JAbe than Revis). Mac should absolutely get bashed for basically donating Wilkerson to someone in the name of saving cap space for The Future.

It's my understanding that Wilkerson has had offers on the table. He just doesn't like them. 

Fitzy has offers on the table. He just doesn't like them. 

We have a GM that is holding tight to his valuations, and I like that. He's not over-reacting (Tanny), he's not under-reacting (Idzik), and he's making moves that have bettered our team...at least for one season. 

Theres a time for trigger pulling, and a time for drawing lines in the sand. So far, his patience and professionalism has me believing that if he's not going to over-pay for players, he's also not going to get duped at the trading table.  He sets a value in his head. He holds tight to it. 

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If the Boomer and Carton source is true that there is an agreement in place between the Jets and Ryan Fitzpatrick but a deal cannot be signed until the Jets create some salary cap room, I wonder if that reduces the bargaining position of the Jets on dealing Mo. In order to sign Fitzpatrick, one of a few possibilities would have to transpire.

1. Trade Mo

2. Sign Mo to a long term contract (possibly creating  a small amount of salary cap space this year with a large signing bonus)

3. Cut or force a significant salary cap reduction on another player (Brick, Giacomini, etc)

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2 hours ago, BroadwayJets said:

To the multiple people who've mentioned Cutler in this thread, you realize that Cutler and Marshall despise each other, right? Cutler will not be wearing green as long as Marshall's here

 

2 hours ago, Ken Shroy said:

Good. He sux.

I remember Boomer Esiason firmly and loudly stating the JETS need to go get Cutler. Cutler's talent was undisputed etc....

 

Wonder how he feels now.

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My boss will be pretty happy once Mo and Fitz situation is over with. My efficiency at work will go up by at least 20%. Tired of coming back to the board and seeing nothing has changed.

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1 hour ago, Ghost said:

About damn time Wilk gets some credibility. Some people will actually accept just a 2nd for Wilk and that's mind boggling to me. I would ask for at least a 1st and then some. 

Same people screaming the entire season and offseason to lock up Mo with a $100 million extension now want to trade him for a 5th R's pick just clear cap space for Fitz

 

Mo + Geno >>>> Fitz and a couple mid round picks

 

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I think they will get value for Mo closer to draft day and not with the 49ers.  I wouldn't give up anything for Kaep.  If the Jets want to kick the tires, they can wait to see if he is given his outright release.  49ers are in no position to play hard-ball with anybody for a QB who is nothing more than a reclamation project with poor passing and leadership skills.  They will wind up picking up part of his salary and taking whatever they can get in the way of a draft pick.  Partially cutting their losses is preferable to taking the full on hit.

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Just now, Il Mostro said:

I think they will get value for Mo closer to draft day.  I wouldn't give up anything for Kaep.  If the Jets want to kick the tires, they can wait to see if he is given his outright release.  49ers are in no position to play hard ball with anybody for a QB who is nothing more than a reclamation project with poor passing and leadership skills.  They will wind up picking up part of his salary and taking whatever they can get in the way of a draft pick.

i agree with this.  mccags does not want another potential locker room problem with qbs anyway.  fwiw the jets are showing considerable interest in lynch.

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17 minutes ago, Fibonacci said:

My boss will be pretty happy once Mo and Fitz situation is over with. My efficiency at work will go up by at least 20%. Tired of coming back to the board and seeing nothing has changed.

Sounds like you could be a cap cut

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13 minutes ago, Augustiniak said:

i agree with this.  mccags does not want another potential locker room problem with qbs anyway.  fwiw the jets are showing considerable interest in lynch.

I think that as well. Unless Maccagnan is able to swing something on draft day, with a Goff-to-Jets pick already being official not just "could be" if this or that happens, it's likely we sign Fitz as the stopgap. Good fit for the Jets (if the money isn't just stupid for a guy you ideal want on the bench asap), and it's not like anyone else seems to be breaking his door down with offers of a starting job.

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1 minute ago, Sperm Edwards said:

I think that as well. Unless Maccagnan is able to swing something on draft day, with a Goff-to-Jets pick already being official not just "could be" if this or that happens, it's likely we sign Fitz as the stopgap. Good fit for the Jets (if the money isn't just stupid for a guy you ideal want on the bench asap), and it's not like anyone else seems to be breaking his door down with offers of a starting job.

i think fitz returns.  i also think they wind up trading mo for reasonable value.  i just hope they get a real qb prospect, so we're not discussing geno/fitz/petty a year from now.

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1 minute ago, Augustiniak said:

i think fitz returns.  i also think they wind up trading mo for reasonable value.  i just hope they get a real qb prospect, so we're not discussing geno/fitz/petty a year from now.

Amen to that.

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2 hours ago, Greenseed4 said:

It's my understanding that Wilkerson has had offers on the table. He just doesn't like them. 

Fitzy has offers on the table. He just doesn't like them. 

We have a GM that is holding tight to his valuations, and I like that. He's not over-reacting (Tanny), he's not under-reacting (Idzik), and he's making moves that have bettered our team...at least for one season. 

Theres a time for trigger pulling, and a time for drawing lines in the sand. So far, his patience and professionalism has me believing that if he's not going to over-pay for players, he's also not going to get duped at the trading table.  He sets a value in his head. He holds tight to it. 

Here is what I don't understand, and not to point out Senor Gato, but asking you specifically.  We don't know the full-on behind the scenes story.  Maybe the Jets have tried to sign Mo, but if he refuses to take the offer, what are the Jets suppose to do?  No front-office staff can keep their jobs if they relinquish to every contract demand.  Fitz, by the sounds of it, is being offered $7 million a year.  Maybe he wants $10-12-14 million.  There comes a time when both sides are just too far apart in their respective evaluations.  Maybe the Jets are thinking $12 but would settle at $15.  But what if Mo is thinking $19 but would settle for $15?  that is gap that may not get filled.  And if that is the case, you have to get SOMETHING for Mo.  It just might not be what we hope for.

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17 minutes ago, CanadaSteve said:

Here is what I don't understand, and not to point out Senor Gato, but asking you specifically.  We don't know the full-on behind the scenes story.  Maybe the Jets have tried to sign Mo, but if he refuses to take the offer, what are the Jets suppose to do?  No front-office staff can keep their jobs if they relinquish to every contract demand.  Fitz, by the sounds of it, is being offered $7 million a year.  Maybe he wants $10-12-14 million.  There comes a time when both sides are just too far apart in their respective evaluations.  Maybe the Jets are thinking $12 but would settle at $15.  But what if Mo is thinking $19 but would settle for $15?  that is gap that may not get filled.  And if that is the case, you have to get SOMETHING for Mo.  It just might not be what we hope for.

The Jets are comfortable paying Mo $15.7M this season, hence the tag that was extended.  They would prefer to have him on board for an extended contract but if he's disagreeable they need to find suitable compensation. If they can't, then that's what they get: another season of play from Mo for $15.7M.  And they can tag him again next year if I'm not mistaken.

Either way, we're not the losers some doomsday posters would have you believe we are.  We either pay out the nose for an incredible talent, or get appropriately compensated by another team who's willing to do so. 

Aside from the Cromartie contract (which wasn't even all that bad considering the Bowles-D infusion/lack of proven CBs/his previous year of play),  McCaggs has shown plenty of competence in his negotiations.  

These things require patience and a poker face. 

And coffee, apparently. 

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5 hours ago, drdetroit said:

Thanks Al Jr

Thanks Raiders reportedly re-signing Aldon Smith ( told you so.   Will probably be signing Reggie Nelson to Fs too.    

Those two moves should take them out of any discussion that they are trading for Muhammad Wilkerson. ( like anyone believed that Mckenize would give up picks and pay a player that massive contract too- don't understand the mind set of their Gm).

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