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Fitzpatrick, Jets Stuck in Tough Spot


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On May 30, 2016 at 6:24 PM, JetsFanatic said:

It's not what I say, its fact, look at his career. Mac, nor any other competent GM, is not going to overpay for a player that no other team in the league is bidding on. As far as a one year contract, I'm not sure Fitz would go for that.

GOOD POINT-  with no other team interested the stalemate will on to training camp, he is really not in a position

to bargain unless another team steps up, he has always had good stretches for a few games before imploding

all over himself, beggers can't be choosers, I say let Petty back up Geno.  Fitz is comes with a guarantee and that

included a long losing streak every year, and with our schedule it is going to be a long ugly season if he's back.

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14 minutes ago, 77DRAFT said:

GOOD POINT-  with no other team interested the stalemate will on to training camp, he is really not in a position

to bargain unless another team steps up, he has always had good stretches for a few games before imploding

all over himself, beggers can't be choosers, I say let Petty back up Geno.  Fitz is comes with a guarantee and that

included a long losing streak every year, and with our schedule it is going to be a long ugly season if he's back.

Agreed. I say get in camp by Monday or GTFO.

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18 hours ago, ylekram said:

that's if the jets stand pat with their offer. its a stupid contract in fitz's eyes. if they decide to start hack in 2017, where does that leave fitz? basically ends his career. a 1 year deal makes more sense to him than the jets 3 year deal. but to answer your question. where does that leave fitz in year 2? probably out on the street. but he can still try to find another starting gig

And why would the Jets decide to start Hack in year 2?  If Fitz doesn't play well enough to solidify keeping the starting job.  The contract whispers according to Yahoo are 3/24 with incentives up to 36m.  If Fitz shows that he can play as well as he did last year he'll have likely earned a good chunk of those incentives.  He just doesn't want to have to prove he's worth the money because history has shown he's not. 

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51 minutes ago, Snell41 said:

And why would the Jets decide to start Hack in year 2?  If Fitz doesn't play well enough to solidify keeping the starting job.  The contract whispers according to Yahoo are 3/24 with incentives up to 36m.  If Fitz shows that he can play as well as he did last year he'll have likely earned a good chunk of those incentives.  He just doesn't want to have to prove he's worth the money because history has shown he's not. 

not at all. the way the contract is, its basically saying we want you to start in year 1 and be a backup year 2 and 3. kind of fits into the jets plans of starting a younger guy year 2, no? i ffitzpatrick plays well in 2016 and the jets feel that one of the younger guys are not ready, then yes, Fitzpatrick could get another year as a starter and earn incentives. but what if Fitzpatrick plays well in 2016 and the jets feel one of the younger guys are ready, he would be forced into a back up role, with no leverage or options, at no fault of his own.

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1 minute ago, ylekram said:

not at all. the way the contract is, its basically saying we want you to start in year 1 and be a backup year 2 and 3. kind of fits into the jets plans of starting a younger guy year 2, no? i ffitzpatrick plays well in 2016 and the jets feel that one of the younger guys are not ready, then yes, Fitzpatrick could get another year as a starter and earn incentives. but what if Fitzpatrick plays well in 2016 and the jets feel one of the younger guys are ready, he would be forced into a back up role, with no leverage or options, at no fault of his own.

The Jets aren't going to force Hack or anyone into the starting role if Fitz plays very well this year.  They may keep Fitz on a short leash in 2017 if they feel their young guy/guys are ready, but they won't just pull Fitz's job out from under him just for the sake of starting a young guy if Fitz played very well in 2016.  If Fitz plays avg or subpar then sure, I agree.  They're not giving him big money over multiple year simply because Fitz's history shows he's not worth it personally and history shows players similar to Fitz don't generally play at such a high level for multiple years at his age.  The last one to do it was Gannon.  In fact I argued that Fitz's season last year was very Gannon-esque, but there's no guarantee Fitz trends upwards.  In fact history generally proves otherwise, including with Fitz himself when he signed the BUF deal.   

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1 minute ago, Snell41 said:

The Jets aren't going to force Hack or anyone into the starting role if Fitz plays very well this year.  They may keep Fitz on a short leash in 2017 if they feel their young guy/guys are ready, but they won't just pull Fitz's job out from under him just for the sake of starting a young guy if Fitz played very well in 2016.  If Fitz plays avg or subpar then sure, I agree.  They're not giving him big money over multiple year simply because Fitz's history shows he's not worth it personally and history shows players similar to Fitz don't generally play at such a high level for multiple years at his age.  The last one to do it was Gannon.  In fact I argued that Fitz's season last year was very Gannon-esque, but there's no guarantee Fitz trends upwards.  In fact history generally proves otherwise, including with Fitz himself when he signed the BUF deal.   

anyway you want to slice it, the jets offer to fitz gets bad year 2 and 3. obviously they drafted hackenburg because they feel he has a shot at being an nfl qb. if hack learns quickly, why wouldn't they start hack next year? and if they do, where does that leave fitz? regardless of what we think of fitz, i am sure fitz thinks he can still start in this league. on top of that, we really don't know what the incentives are. i was reading about what the incentives could be and article stated that the incentives would have to top what he did last year, which is a tall order considering it was his best season to date. i am all for signing fitz to the cheapest deal the jets can get away with. but i also see why fitz wont sign it. year 2 and 3 very well could shoehorn fitz into a backup role to no fault of himself. i don't see any player doing that

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2 minutes ago, ylekram said:

anyway you want to slice it, the jets offer to fitz gets bad year 2 and 3. obviously they drafted hackenburg because they feel he has a shot at being an nfl qb. if hack learns quickly, why wouldn't they start hack next year? and if they do, where does that leave fitz? regardless of what we think of fitz, i am sure fitz thinks he can still start in this league. on top of that, we really don't know what the incentives are. i was reading about what the incentives could be and article stated that the incentives would have to top what he did last year, which is a tall order considering it was his best season to date. i am all for signing fitz to the cheapest deal the jets can get away with. but i also see why fitz wont sign it. year 2 and 3 very well could shoehorn fitz into a backup role to no fault of himself. i don't see any player doing that

True, but the bad 2 and 3 are compensation for being overpaid in year one.  While the SB gives him 12m in year one, the cap hit will likely be 6-8m tops year one.  If Fitz were looking for a 1 year deal , that's likely the figure.  I'm fine with giving him 6-8 on a one year deal.

As for the incentives....you know he's not as good as he played last year, I know it, and hell Fitz even knows it or he'd take the chance to hit those incentives.  Let's be realistic he had a decent year.  The fact it was statistically one of the best Jet QB years ever is an indictment on the Jets more than a commending of Fitz. 

I don't expect him to play well enough to solidify his job in 2017.  In fact I don't necessarily expect him to play well enough to solidify his job all the way through 2016.  I'm sure if Fitz was that confident he'd play that well again he'd take a 6-8m 1 year deal and cash it in the following offseason. 

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1 minute ago, Snell41 said:

True, but the bad 2 and 3 are compensation for being overpaid in year one.  While the SB gives him 12m in year one, the cap hit will likely be 6-8m tops year one.  If Fitz were looking for a 1 year deal , that's likely the figure.  I'm fine with giving him 6-8 on a one year deal.

As for the incentives....you know he's not as good as he played last year, I know it, and hell Fitz even knows it or he'd take the chance to hit those incentives.  Let's be realistic he had a decent year.  The fact it was statistically one of the best Jet QB years ever is an indictment on the Jets more than a commending of Fitz. 

I don't expect him to play well enough to solidify his job in 2017.  In fact I don't necessarily expect him to play well enough to solidify his job all the way through 2016.  I'm sure if Fitz was that confident he'd play that well again he'd take a 6-8m 1 year deal and cash it in the following offseason. 

1.the year 1 part of the deal is in the ballpark. its not being vastly overpaid. we would all like to see it a little lower, what player would sign a contract that pays a little more in the first year( regardless of what you think of the player, is extremely low for a starting qb) and then agree to take half for the next 2  years? the jets are basically saying that we want you to start year 1 and be a backup year 2 and 3. if they decide to start a younger guy in 2017, fitz's career is over because he is locked into a backup role with no recourse

2.which i am sure he is considering after looking at the jets offer. i guess time will tell.

3. fitz knows he is not that good because he wont accept a deal that requires incentives? until we know what those incentives are, there is no point

bottom line is, the jets don't have to up their offer in money, but if the structure stays the same,imo, fitz wont sign it. and i don't blame him. and this is me saying this while i think the 12m is on the high side

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5 minutes ago, ylekram said:

1.the year 1 part of the deal is in the ballpark. its not being vastly overpaid. we would all like to see it a little lower, what player would sign a contract that pays a little more in the first year( regardless of what you think of the player, is extremely low for a starting qb) and then agree to take half for the next 2  years? the jets are basically saying that we want you to start year 1 and be a backup year 2 and 3. if they decide to start a younger guy in 2017, fitz's career is over because he is locked into a backup role with no recourse

2.which i am sure he is considering after looking at the jets offer. i guess time will tell.

3. fitz knows he is not that good because he wont accept a deal that requires incentives? until we know what those incentives are, there is no point

bottom line is, the jets don't have to up their offer in money, but if the structure stays the same,imo, fitz wont sign it. and i don't blame him. and this is me saying this while i think the 12m is on the high side

We're essentially getting to the same place on different paths.  And frankly I'm enjoying the debate with you, so let's take it now from Fitz's angle entirely and go with the notion he is not accepting this offer and the Jets are not sweetening the deal.  What does he do?

1-Sign a backup offer somewhere else assuming it's still even on the table

2-Retire

3-Sign a 1 yr deal with the Jets at a lower amount

4-Wait it out for a starter to go down in TC somewhere, and pray that team doesn't have a backup they'd rather just plug in than pay Fitz?  (my personal feeling s no team is going to pay Fitz 12m in the even their starter goes down).  At the risk of ending up sitting out the entire year

 

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3 hours ago, ylekram said:

not at all. the way the contract is, its basically saying we want you to start in year 1 and be a backup year 2 and 3. kind of fits into the jets plans of starting a younger guy year 2, no? i ffitzpatrick plays well in 2016 and the jets feel that one of the younger guys are not ready, then yes, Fitzpatrick could get another year as a starter and earn incentives. but what if Fitzpatrick plays well in 2016 and the jets feel one of the younger guys are ready, he would be forced into a back up role, with no leverage or options, at no fault of his own.

This would have to happen in an alternative universe, Fitz will be at fault, and it will be ugly, we have a tough schedule and

will have an excellent early first round draft choice courtesy Fitz if he's back.

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45 minutes ago, 77DRAFT said:

This would have to happen in an alternative universe, Fitz will be at fault, and it will be ugly, we have a tough schedule and

will have an excellent early first round draft choice courtesy Fitz if he's back.

very intelligent response

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3 hours ago, Snell41 said:

We're essentially getting to the same place on different paths.  And frankly I'm enjoying the debate with you, so let's take it now from Fitz's angle entirely and go with the notion he is not accepting this offer and the Jets are not sweetening the deal.  What does he do?

1-Sign a backup offer somewhere else assuming it's still even on the table

2-Retire

3-Sign a 1 yr deal with the Jets at a lower amount

4-Wait it out for a starter to go down in TC somewhere, and pray that team doesn't have a backup they'd rather just plug in than pay Fitz?  (my personal feeling s no team is going to pay Fitz 12m in the even their starter goes down).  At the risk of ending up sitting out the entire year

 

obviously, its either option #1 or #3. I don't believe #2 even crossed fitz's mind and #4 is o much of a long shot, its not even worth discussing.

option #1- I believe Denver had interest in fitz until they heard the numbers come out of his mouth. they then politely told fitz "good luck with that, if it doesn't work out, we would be interested in x amount for 1 year. you can compete with sanchez for the starting job"

option #3- I personally would like to see this happen.i would like to see it cheaper, but wont cry a tear if it stays at 12m. it gets the team a starter for year 1. I would worry about year 2 or 3 in year 2 or 3. if fitz plays well and the rooks aren't ready, you can offer him another 1 year deal. if he doesn't play well, adios fitz, its been nice knowing ya. if fitz plays well but the jets feel one of the rooks is ready to step up, adios fitz, I am sure you will find another job somewhere.

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obviously, its either option #1 or #3. I don't believe #2 even crossed fitz's mind and #4 is o much of a long shot, its not even worth discussing.

option #1- I believe Denver had interest in fitz until they heard the numbers come out of his mouth. they then politely told fitz "good luck with that, if it doesn't work out, we would be interested in x amount for 1 year. you can compete with sanchez for the starting job"

option #3- I personally would like to see this happen.i would like to see it cheaper, but wont cry a tear if it stays at 12m. it gets the team a starter for year 1. I would worry about year 2 or 3 in year 2 or 3. if fitz plays well and the rooks aren't ready, you can offer him another 1 year deal. if he doesn't play well, adios fitz, its been nice knowing ya. if fitz plays well but the jets feel one of the rooks is ready to step up, adios fitz, I am sure you will find another job somewhere.

I prefer option 3 as well, but would much rather see 6-8m. I think the only reason they offered 12 in year 1 was to spread the cap hit over 3 years. I think a 1 year deal would be less

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