Who gets most of the blame for the loss this week?

[SAR I]

35 minutes ago, The Crusher said:

I guess everyone is upset because they had lofty expectations?  No idea why . 

This happens every "year after" for some Jets fans.  You know, we go 4-12, we make a coaching change, we surprise and get 10 wins, and then the "year after" they are thinking Super Bowl.

It's crazy.

Provide a harder schedule, we were 6-10 last year.  This year with a harder schedule, we'll be 7-9 this year.  Progress as we rebuild.  But, no, you've got people who read way too much into the tea leaves to think this is the year we get 12 wins and topple Tom Brady, it's pretty funny how this goes every time we make a coaching change, have some unexpected success, and then fall apart.

SAR I

[joewilly12]

2 minutes ago, SAR I said:

Perhaps you have me confused with someone else (hard to believe since we've been debating all summer):

1. I am no Ryan Fitzpatrick fan but I understand he's the best available option right now as we rebuild the most important position in the sport, a JAG who can win some games, someone smart who can mentor the kids, someone in his career twilight who will transition from starter to backup very quietly and sportively.

2. I don't have the Jets as a playoff team.  Clearly I'm on the record as saying the postseason longshot is now over since we lost our must-win first game today.

3. I predicted the Jets for 7-9 this season.

If this is more Geno Smith nonsense from you, let me know, I'll end this tangent now.  Fitz is the best option based on last year, based on Petty's inexperience/health, simple as that.

SAR I

I have not mentioned Geno Smith all night go check I dont like Ryan Fitzpatrick he is the worst option in the NFL yet our organization decided to sign him for $12 million you as a season ticket holder are the one paying the price and you have to endure the season I can change the channel. 

Id rather start a rookie like other teams are doing and let them take their lumps and learn from it Fitzpatrick is who I knew who he was as did 6 other teams. 

[T0mShane]

12 minutes ago, SAR I said:

That's the core of players who got us to 10 wins last year, can't say it was a bad haul despite today's disaster.

That said, I am uncertain of better players he could have tapped instead of those at those positions.  Did he whiff at CB or were those best-available at the time?

SAR I

I said it at the time: signing vets is fun, but there's no coherent philosophy behind bringing these guys in with no QB in place, and with no real youth behind them. Winning ten games in Year One is cool, but not if you're dumping those vets in Year Three. look where it got Herm, Mangini, Rex, even Parcells.

[SAR I]

11 minutes ago, jetrider said:

How can anyone forget the FG with :41 left to beat Dallas' third-string QB along with Tom Coughlin's brainflub and Belichick's coinflop that saved Fitz from choking?

Doesn't matter how he got there, Ryan Fitzpatrick stood on the field in must-win conditions against the Cowboys, Giants, and Patriots with minutes left and orchestrated brilliant comebacks to win or tie those games, won the ties in OT.  Compared to Geno Smith's performances in the year's prior, he looked like Joe Montana.

Not to mention, the team believes in him, he's got leadership abilities no QB in New York has had since Joe Namath, the likes of Ken O'Brien didn't have it, Vinny Testaverde didn't have it, Pennington didn't have it, Favre might have but lasted only a season, Sanchez was too young.  It's not just physical capabilities.

Anyway,  I don't have to defend Ryan Fitpatrick as a terrific JAG for a rebuilding team in transition.  There wasn't a better FA available last year or this.

SAR I

[joewilly12]

1 minute ago, SAR I said:

Doesn't matter how he got there, Ryan Fitzpatrick stood on the field in must-win conditions against the Cowboys, Giants, and Patriots with minutes left and orchestrated brilliant comebacks to win or tie those games, won the ties in OT.  Compared to Geno Smith's performances in the year's prior, he looked like Joe Montana.

Not to mention, the team believes in him, he's got leadership abilities no QB in New York has had since Joe Namath, the likes of Ken O'Brien didn't have it, Vinny Testaverde didn't have it, Pennington didn't have it, Favre might have but lasted only a season, Sanchez was too young.  It's not just physical capabilities.

Anyway,  I don't have to defend Ryan Fitpatrick as a terrific JAG for a rebuilding team in transition.  There wasn't a better FA available last year or this.

SAR I

You bought a Fitzpatrick jersey.

[SAR I]

5 minutes ago, joewilly12 said:

I have not mentioned Geno Smith all night go check I dont like Ryan Fitzpatrick he is the worst option in the NFL yet our organization decided to sign him for $12 million you as a season ticket holder are the one paying the price and you have to endure the season I can change the channel. 

Id rather start a rookie like other teams are doing and let them take their lumps and learn from it Fitzpatrick is who I knew who he was as did 6 other teams. 

I don't like spending $12M on a guy that can't win a high-pressure game but if the alternative is Geno Smith I'd have spent $24M.

As a season ticket holder, I support Mike Maccagnan's long-term strategy on rebuilding through youth and the draft, I'm not the impatient one all pissed that we aren't winning a Super Bowl this year because I had no expectations of that, I believe we are a 7-9 team that's headed in the right direction, nothing more.

SAR I

[joewilly12]

Just now, SAR I said:

I don't like spending $12M on a guy that can't win a high-pressure game but if the alternative is Geno Smith I'd have spent $24M.

As a season ticket holder, I support Mike Maccagnan's long-term strategy on rebuilding through youth and the draft, I'm not the impatient one all pissed that we aren't winning a Super Bowl this year because I had no expectations of that, I believe we are a 7-9 team that's headed in the right direction, nothing more.

SAR I

SAR I as a longtime fan I'm pissed that we lose winnable games like we did today 

[T0mShane]

27 minutes ago, RutgersJetFan said:

I just don't know how much to care anymore. By all measures this time around Woody went the right way about the hiring process, and it still looks like we'll be hitting the reset button in 2018. Like, wtf. Don't you have to luck into something eventually?

I'm curious to see if there's a desperation move next offseason: a Brees trade, or a highly-leveraged trade up for a Deshaun Watson. At some point, the bills are going to come due, and Macc is going to have to point to a QB to keep his job. Bowles, along with paying the price for this as well, will also suffer because his teams are boring and conservative. If they're not going to compete for rings, they can't be playing unwatchable .500 football for too much longer,

[dbatesman]

21 minutes ago, T0mShane said:

My concern with Bowles is that he has one plan and one philosophy and it either works or it doesn't. I think that's a diminishing returns proposition, ultimately, and he'll be onto his next job before he realizes that he needs to learn how to throw the change up.

He's done exactly what he should do with the roster he's been given. Nothing more, nothing less. Hand him a franchise-caliber QB and he probably wins a chip at some point. Hand him Fitzpatrick -> Petty -> Hackenberg, and this is how it goes. This thread is going to hit 10+ pages of speculation and poctification, but Bowles is more or less irrelevant to the long-term fortunes of the franchise.

[SAR I]

4 minutes ago, T0mShane said:

I said it at the time: signing vets is fun, but there's no coherent philosophy behind bringing these guys in with no QB in place, and with no real youth behind them. Winning ten games in Year One is cool, but not if you're dumping those vets in Year Three. look where it got Herm, Mangini, Rex, even Parcells.

+1000

Our biggest problem as an organization is we get Go Fever every time we commit to a rebuild and then overachieve by mistake.  We have to get younger.  I'd rather go 4-12 this year in order to get to 12-4 in three years as opposed to going 10-6 this year to go 8-8 in three years. 

Patience people, patience.

SAR I

[SAR I]

2 minutes ago, joewilly12 said:

You bought a Fitzpatrick jersey.

No way.  When one crosses 45 one looks stupid dressing up in a jersey, not a kid anymore, I dress like a coach.

SAR I

[joewilly12]

Just now, SAR I said:

+1000

Our biggest problem as an organization is we get Go Fever every time we commit to a rebuild and then overachieve by mistake.  We have to get younger.  I'd rather go 4-12 this year in order to get to 12-4 in three years as opposed to going 10-6 this year to go 8-8 in three years. 

Patience people, patience.

SAR I

1969

[joewilly12]

Just now, SAR I said:

No way.  When one crosses 45 one looks stupid dressing up in a jersey, not a kid anymore, I dress like a coach.

SAR I

LOL ok coach look on the bright side you got rewards points today and the Jets have a warehouse full of trinkets ready to go to pacify the situation. 

[ZachEY]

3 minutes ago, dbatesman said:

He's done exactly what he should do with the roster he's been given. Nothing more, nothing less. Hand him a franchise-caliber QB and he probably wins a chip at some point. Hand him Fitzpatrick -> Petty -> Hackenberg, and this is how it goes. This thread is going to hit 10+ pages of speculation and poctification, but Bowles is more or less irrelevant to the long-term fortunes of the franchise.

Sadly, this.

[ChuckkieB]

The secondary was awful today.  Very disappointing loss.  Fitz abruptly ending a potential game winning drive before it started was nauseating.

[SAR I]

6 minutes ago, joewilly12 said:

SAR I as a longtime fan I'm pissed that we lose winnable games like we did today 

So am I, but Ryan Fitzpatrick is the least of our problems.

Ask yourself who performed to the best of their abilities today and who to their worst.  Did Ryan Fitzpatrick play like Ryan Fitzpatrick today?  Yes, he did.  Did Darrelle Revis play like we expected him to?  Nope.  Did Brandon Marshall?  Nope.  Did Eric Decker?  Nope.  Did Nick Folk?  Nope.  Skrine?  Gilchrist?  No.  No.

Lots of reasons to be upset about losing today but Fitz is not near the top of his list.  If you own a 1996 VW Passat and it doesn't perform like a 2016 Ferrari you don't blame the car, it's what it is, it's what dad bought you, so you drive it to it's capabilities and you make the best of it.

SAR I

[T0mShane]

2 minutes ago, dbatesman said:

He's done exactly what he should do with the roster he's been given. Nothing more, nothing less. Hand him a franchise-caliber QB and he probably wins a chip at some point. Hand him Fitzpatrick -> Petty -> Hackenberg, and this is how it goes. This thread is going to hit 10+ pages of speculation and poctification, but Bowles is more or less irrelevant to the long-term fortunes of the franchise.

Alright, but here's the thing: if Bowles in any way wanted Fitz back this year, he made his own bed. Given his apparent affinity for near-death vets, I'm guessing he did. The best case scenario this year was to sink or swim with the young QBs, and either come out of the season with a future QB, or suck so bad that you're in position to draft one of the top 2 or three QB prospects next year. Signing Fitz bought them .500, and the right to draft the next RT at Pick #17 in the first round.

[joewilly12]

Just now, SAR I said:

So am I, but Ryan Fitzpatrick is the least of our problems.

Ask yourself who performed to the best of their abilities today and who to their worst.  Did Ryan Fitzpatrick play like Ryan Fitzpatrick today?  Yes, he did.  Did Darrelle Revis play like we expected him to?  Nope.  Did Brandon Marshall?  Nope.  Did Eric Decker?  Nope.  Did Nick Folk?  Nope.

Lots of reasons to be upset about losing today but Fitz is not near the top of his list.  If you own a 1996 VW Passat and it doesn't perform like a 2016 Ferrari you don't blame the car, it's what it is, it's what dad bought you, so you drive it to it's capabilities and you make the best of it.

SAR I

My dad God rest his soul never bought a foreign car in his life. 

[T0mShane]

7 minutes ago, SAR I said:

+1000

Our biggest problem as an organization is we get Go Fever every time we commit to a rebuild and then overachieve by mistake.  We have to get younger.  I'd rather go 4-12 this year in order to get to 12-4 in three years as opposed to going 10-6 this year to go 8-8 in three years. 

Patience people, patience.

SAR I

They went 10-6 and drafted an ILB this past year. 

[dbatesman]

2 minutes ago, T0mShane said:

Alright, but here's the thing: if Bowles in any way wanted Fitz back this year, he made his own bed. Given his apparent affinity for near-death vets, I'm guessing he did. The best case scenario this year was to sink or swim with the young QBs, and either come out of the season with a future QB, or suck so bad that you're in position to draft one of the top 2 or three QB prospects next year. Signing Fitz bought them .500, and the right to draft the next RT at Pick #17 in the first round.

This makes no sense. No coach in the known universe is ever going to choose option A.

[SAR I]

5 minutes ago, joewilly12 said:

1969

You are lamenting today what you've known since 1975-  the Jets don't have a franchise quarterback and need to get one.

So when your not-franchise quarterback doesn't have enough to beat a 12 win AFC North championship team you don't get mad at the quarterback, you get mad at the organization.  Get mad at Leon Hess for dying early.  Get mad at Bill Parcells for retiring early. Get mad at Al Groh for quitting.  Get mad at Herman Edwards for his inexperience.  Get mad at Chad Pennington for his frail body.  Get mad at Brett Favre for concealing his arm injury.  Get mad at Rex Ryan for ignoring the offense.  Get mad at Mike Tannenbaum for the lack of quality targets for Mark Sanchez.  Get mad at John Idzik for a terrible impulse-buy on Geno Smith. 

But don't get mad at Ryan Fitzpatrick.  He's playing exactly like a journeyman quarterback on the wrong side of 30, he's meeting expectations.  The expectations of someone rational, that is.

SAR I

[Larz]

No worries, the 4th string QB has Sanchez intangibles and Tebows arm

[T0mShane]

4 minutes ago, dbatesman said:

This makes no sense. No coach in the known universe is ever going to choose option A.

Option A >>>>>> Fitz's résumé 

[dbatesman]

Just now, T0mShane said:

Option A >>>>>> Fitz's résumé 

No coach in the known universe is ever going to choose option A.

[SAR I]

14 minutes ago, T0mShane said:

I'm curious to see if there's a desperation move next offseason: a Brees trade, or a highly-leveraged trade up for a Deshaun Watson. At some point, the bills are going to come due, and Macc is going to have to point to a QB to keep his job. Bowles, along with paying the price for this as well, will also suffer because his teams are boring and conservative. If they're not going to compete for rings, they can't be playing unwatchable .500 football for too much longer,

Woody Johnson turns 70 in April and funny things happen to owners who turn 70 and realize they don't have much time left to win a championship.

Pity is, when Woody bought the Jets at age 50 he had the time to patiently develop a franchise quarterback, but he never did, always had Go Fever, always contradicting his head coaching changes, always buying all the geezers instead of focusing on youth.  And now that he may have learned that lesson, he's turning 70 and will be tempted to make some Leon Hess-like move, blow the farm to get a Parcells and a Martin if such a combo even exists.  I hope he doesn't.

SAR I

[dbatesman]

1 minute ago, SAR I said:

Woody Johnson turns 70 in April and funny things happen to owners who turn 70 and realize they don't have much time left to win a championship.

Pity is, when Woody bought the Jets at age 50 he had the time to patiently develop a franchise quarterback, but he never did, always had Go Fever, always contradicting his head coaching changes, always buying all the geezers instead of focusing on youth.  And now that he may have learned that lesson, he's turning 70 and will be tempted to make some Leon Hess-like move, blow the farm to get a Parcells and a Martin if such a combo even exists.  I hope he doesn't.

SAR I

Mr. Johnson is much smarter than that.

[joewilly12]

7 sacks 

[T0mShane]

4 minutes ago, dbatesman said:

No coach in the known universe is ever going to choose option A.

If youre the HC, you're taking the Fitzpatrick option? 

[jetrider]

26 minutes ago, SAR I said:

Doesn't matter how he got there, Ryan Fitzpatrick stood on the field in must-win conditions against the Cowboys, Giants, and Patriots with minutes left and orchestrated brilliant comebacks to win or tie those games, won the ties in OT.  Compared to Geno Smith's performances in the year's prior, he looked like Joe Montana.

Not to mention, the team believes in him, he's got leadership abilities no QB in New York has had since Joe Namath, the likes of Ken O'Brien didn't have it, Vinny Testaverde didn't have it, Pennington didn't have it, Favre might have but lasted only a season, Sanchez was too young.  It's not just physical capabilities.

Anyway,  I don't have to defend Ryan Fitpatrick as a terrific JAG for a rebuilding team in transition.  There wasn't a better FA available last year or this.

SAR I

It doesn't matter that he put the team in a hole that required a come-from-behind miracle? Those games shouldn't have been close to begin with. 

[T0mShane]

6 minutes ago, SAR I said:

Woody Johnson turns 70 in April and funny things happen to owners who turn 70 and realize they don't have much time left to win a championship.

Pity is, when Woody bought the Jets at age 50 he had the time to patiently develop a franchise quarterback, but he never did, always had Go Fever, always contradicting his head coaching changes, always buying all the geezers instead of focusing on youth.  And now that he may have learned that lesson, he's turning 70 and will be tempted to make some Leon Hess-like move, blow the farm to get a Parcells and a Martin if such a combo even exists.  I hope he doesn't.

SAR I

If Woody wants to open the checkbook to give the franchise to Harbaugh, I'll ride with that come hell or high water.

[20andOut]

Chan Gailey. One game and I have already seen too much of the empty backfield!

 

[predator_05]

2 minutes ago, T0mShane said:

If Woody wants to open the checkbook to give the franchise to Harbaugh, I'll ride with that come hell or high water.

Harbaugh isn't touching this mess

 

[jetrider]

I like how the OP designed this thread to be a sticky. 

[dbatesman]

9 minutes ago, T0mShane said:

If youre the HC, you're taking the Fitzpatrick option? 

Yes. And so is every other head coach of every team that has ever existed.

[Powpow]

3 hours ago, jetscrazey said:

Bowles, Rodgers, and the Jets secondary get the blame for this loss.  This game was lost on the bubble screen.  1 play the Jets couldn't stop and it gave the Bengals life.  Bengals made the adjustment and the Jets had no answer for it.

I've never seen a team run the same play effectively other than the Green Bay Packers sweep in the early - mid 60's. I mean they ran that play 15 times if they ran it once and it worked every damn time.  Speechless.