Bowles: Fitz to start Sunday vs. NE

[Sperm Edwards]

3 hours ago, Integrity28 said:

Irrelevant standard to set.

When a player plays as terribly as Fitz, Revis, or Mo Wilk have this season. You sit them down. It's not about giving them job security while pretending that someone needs to jump up and snatch their job away. It's about telling them they are not above demotion. There's a reason everything has digressed this season. These 3 players are prime examples of it. 

There's no accountability.

I don't want to hear about how Petty didn't take Fitz's job, when Fitz has been the worst QB in football... hands-down. It would be different if Fitz was playing marginal football. He's not. 

This is bad coaching in terms of talent/roster evaluation, and bad leadership in terms of setting all the wrong precedents.

+1

He doesn't need to worry about catering to the other veterans on this one. It's as simple as: we're 3-7 and neither Fitz nor those around him were playing so well when he was in there. So if something isn't working you try something else. That's all the public face he needs to put on it. Then he can also throw in, for good measure, that he'll see who rises to the challenge and who uses the QB change as an excuse to coast.

A HC with a backbone would do this. His freaking mentor would do this, even if it was just for spite because he relishes playing the douchebag role. It has its place, though, and does help weed out guys who will only try hardest when they feel it suits them.

[JetBlue]

9 hours ago, FidelioJet said:

 

I honestly don't think the locker room was a major part of this decision.

I think the decision was ultimately a simple one. Petty is terrible (I/we don't know that-but the coaching staff/GM do)


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Was he terrible last week in his first start ever? No he wasn't.  I don't care about practice which I don't get to see, I care about what happens in the games, and he was far from terrible; it would have been nice if Gailey had not handcuffed him so much in the second half.   

[JetBlue]

1 hour ago, phill1c said:

"...if he has no red zone turnovers in this game..."

Seriously, who cares? Unless you think that Fitizpatrick is the answer beyond this year, whatever he does, good or bad, matters little.

Dude, he's statistically among the worst QBs in the league. He's not a long-term answer, and the Jets are going NOWHERE this year. Meanwhile, you have TWO guys who were drafted as possible long-term solutions at the position that you are sacrificing meaningful reps to this piece of garbage.

"When you play from behind at least 2 scores you are susceptible to interceptions."

So, according to your opinion, Fitzpatrick has zero responsibility for the Jets being behind?! Even though he has led virtually NO first-quarter TD drives. and the Jets have the fewest 3rd-quarter points in the league????

and, really WHENVER a QB drops back to throw, he's susceptible to interceptions.

IN all, at best, your opinion seems shortsighted. At its most stupid, it seems to ignore reason and pertinent facts.

Don't waste your time.  This guy has been singing Fitz praises all off season and felt the team insulted him with their initial contract offers.   Nothing you can say will change his mind.  

[Rangers9]

1 hour ago, 56mehl56 said:

The Rams defense is 3x better than the Pats defense . This has nothing to do about confidence, this has everything to do with Todd trying to convince Woody he still cares about this season when no one else does.

Funny their teams puts together Ws. And it's not only the offense. The Rams can't hold NEP's jockstraps. Maybe statistically they are better on defense but as far as winning games they aren't.

[phill1c]

11 minutes ago, JetBlue said:

Don't waste your time.  This guy has been singing Fitz praises all off season and felt the team insulted him with their initial contract offers.   Nothing you can say will change his mind.  

Thanks. That makes sense. People have so much emotional investment in moronic arguments and their 'forum status' that they continually make stupid arguments that don't advance intelligent conversation or make the forum experience worthwhile. I think he's one of them.

[Rangers9]

2 hours ago, phill1c said:

"...if he has no red zone turnovers in this game..."

Seriously, who cares? Unless you think that Fitizpatrick is the answer beyond this year, whatever he does, good or bad, matters little.

Dude, he's statistically among the worst QBs in the league. He's not a long-term answer, and the Jets are going NOWHERE this year. Meanwhile, you have TWO guys who were drafted as possible long-term solutions at the position that you are sacrificing meaningful reps to this piece of garbage.

"When you play from behind at least 2 scores you are susceptible to interceptions."

So, according to your opinion, Fitzpatrick has zero responsibility for the Jets being behind?! Even though he has led virtually NO first-quarter TD drives. and the Jets have the fewest 3rd-quarter points in the league????

and, really WHENVER a QB drops back to throw, he's susceptible to interceptions.

IN all, at best, your opinion seems shortsighted. At its most stupid, it seems to ignore reason and pertinent facts.

Look we had 11 missed points after yesterday and so far this season a good number of Qbs having 4 pick games. Fitz's stats were good last year so you can say he's the worst Qb in the league if you want to. He's had a bad year and he isn't returning. We just have a different POV on the rest of the season. I want to win games and you want to give Qbs tryouts. I think the philosophy of this team has to be go with the best player at each position. You want to build a winning outlook by players and not just tank the season. 

[Beerfish]

4 minutes ago, phill1c said:

Thanks. That makes sense. People have so much emotional investment in moronic arguments and their 'forum status' that they continually make stupid arguments that don't advance intelligent conversation or make the forum experience worthwhile. I think he's one of them.

Horribly foolish post.  If you want to look at overly absurd idiotic posts on this forum the anti fitz brigade out numbers the small pro fitz brigade about 100 to 1.

There are potentially valid reasons for both points of view at this time.  It's actually okay to disagree about a course of action and still have a common goal.  I know this world these days wants to polarize everything and make every discussion an us vs them kind of thing but it's totally counter productive.

[phill1c]

3 minutes ago, Rangers9 said:

Look we had 11 missed points after yesterday and so far this season a good number of Qbs having 4 pick games. Fitz's stats were good last year so you can say he's the worst Qb in the league if you want to. He's had a bad year and he isn't returning. We just have a different POV on the rest of the season. I want to win games and you want to give Qbs tryouts. I think the philosophy of this team has to be go with the best player at each position. You want to build a winning outlook by players and not just tank the season. 

Actually, I'm only saying what THE STATISTICS SAY!!

"Fitz's stats were good last year..."

Which matters, how?

PLAYING THE WORST STATISTICAL PLAYER in the league at his position is Tanking. But it's not just this season, it goes into the offseason and possibly next. Do we really want another "QB Controversy" between the worst statistical QB in the league and someone the team has no NFL film of?

[JetBlue]

6 minutes ago, phill1c said:

Thanks. That makes sense. People have so much emotional investment in moronic arguments and their 'forum status' that they continually make stupid arguments that don't advance intelligent conversation or make the forum experience worthwhile. I think he's one of them.

Excellent observation.  The true measure of emotional maturity is the ability to reevaluate ones' position when new information becomes available.  Unfortunately way too many folks get invested in their "beliefs" and can't admit they might have been mistaken or wrong.  It is as if they believe they are personally diminished by doing so and will come up with every nonsensical reason to continue believing the way they do.   

[phill1c]

1 minute ago, Beerfish said:

Horribly foolish post.  If you want to look at overly absurd idiotic posts on this forum the anti fitz brigade out numbers the small pro fitz brigade about 100 to 1.

There are potentially valid reasons for both points of view at this time.  It's actually okay to disagree about a course of action and still have a common goal.  I know this world these days wants to polarize everything and make every discussion an us vs them kind of thing but it's totally counter productive.

So, I struck I nerve I see...

"pro Fitzpatrick brigade?"

I think it's safe to say that if anyone is still on this Titanic they clearly have way too much emotional investment in the man.

[FidelioJet]

If they thought he was terrible why did they choose to keep 4 Qbs to start the year? You  had a healthy Fitz/Geno. So there was no need to keep Petty around unless they thought he had potential. 

That was their big mistake. And I think they're kicking themselves over that decision.


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[FidelioJet]

Was he terrible last week in his first start ever? No he wasn't.  I don't care about practice which I don't get to see, I care about what happens in the games, and he was far from terrible; it would have been nice if Gailey had not handcuffed him so much in the second half.   

How many points did they score? And yes, he was terrible. From Jet QB standards maybe not but from any objective NFL observer - Petty was awful last week.

It wasn't Gaily. Petty, by his own admission, was afraid to throw and chose to check down.

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[drdetroit]

I hope Fitz enjoys the next 6 starts they are the last of his career

[drdetroit]

Just now, FidelioJet said:

 

How many points did they score. And yes, he was terrible. From Jet QB standards maybe not but from any objective NFL observer - Petty was awful last week.

It wasn't Gaily. Petty, by his own admission, was afraid to throw and chose to check down.



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Your right petty probably is awful but it would be nice to confirm it

[Rangers9]

1 hour ago, phill1c said:

Actually, I'm only saying what THE STATISTICS SAY!!

"Fitz's stats were good last year..."

Which matters, how?

PLAYING THE WORST STATISTICAL PLAYER in the league at his position is Tanking. But it's not just this season, it goes into the offseason and possibly next. Do we really want another "QB Controversy" between the worst statistical QB in the league and someone the team has no NFL film of?

Stats don't tell the whole story with him this season. Bad defense and having to play from behind all the time. Dropped passes. ST mistakes like against the Fins. But no argument he's sucked this year. Not only because of the stats on interceptions (six of those picks were in one game- his average excluding that game not so bad) but not being able to lead the team from behind. And his good stats last year should count for something. The reason they re-signed him. If Petty had a good game against the Rams you'd have a better argument to start him. But saying Fitz is the worst statistical player in the league doesn't mean that he is. 

[joewilly12]

6 minutes ago, drdetroit said:

I hope Fitz enjoys the next 6 starts they are the last of his career

You know it I know it the non believers dont know it.

[drdetroit]

Just now, joewilly12 said:

You know it I know it the non believers dont know it.

What's to believe?  Fitz's' Girl Scout passes?

[FidelioJet]

Your right petty probably is awful but it would be nice to confirm it

I guess that's the difference of our opinions on this. While I agree, as fans, it would be nice to see but it seems the CS has already made up their minds and I like the idea that they're not pandering to the fan base.


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[Jet Nut]

5 hours ago, Integrity28 said:

Irrelevant standard to set.

When a player plays as terribly as Fitz, Revis, or Mo Wilk have this season. You sit them down. It's not about giving them job security while pretending that someone needs to jump up and snatch their job away. It's about telling them they are not above demotion. There's a reason everything has digressed this season. These 3 players are prime examples of it. 

There's no accountability.

I don't want to hear about how Petty didn't take Fitz's job, when Fitz has been the worst QB in football... hands-down. It would be different if Fitz was playing marginal football. He's not. 

This is bad coaching in terms of talent/roster evaluation, and bad leadership in terms of setting all the wrong precedents.

Actually you don't sit players just to sit players.  You sit them and replace them with someone better.  

No matter how pissed we are at Fitz, if Petty isn't ready he doesn't play.  

[joewilly12]

12 minutes ago, Jet Nut said:

Actually you don't sit players just to sit players.  You sit them and replace them with someone better.  

No matter how pissed we are at Fitz, if Petty isn't ready he doesn't play.  

Agree to disagree why did we carry 4 QB's if none of them were any damn good thats a piss poor GM and head coach if this is the case. 

[Jet Nut]

16 minutes ago, joewilly12 said:

Agree to disagree why did we carry 4 QB's if none of them were any damn good thats a piss poor GM and head coach if this is the case. 

So we can develop them?  Who says that none of them are any good or that the GM screwed up.  Have no idea why the HC would be to blame, thats just wrong

He was a 4th round pick from a gimmick offense who has to learn the pro game from scratch.  Its not a if you cant play today you suck world.  I know thats hard for you and the instant gratification people to grasp.

[joewilly12]

14 minutes ago, Jet Nut said:

So we can develop them?  Who says that none of them are any good or that the GM screwed up.  Have no idea why the HC would be to blame, thats just wrong

He was a 4th round pick from a gimmick offense who has to learn the pro game from scratch.  Its not a if you cant play today you suck world.  I know thats hard for you and the instant gratification people to grasp.

When was the last time we developed a QB?   What dont you understand?  We have drafted so many 1st round busts its not even funny and you want this team to develop a QB? 

Funny person you are do you work as a clown. 

[Jet Nut]

4 minutes ago, joewilly12 said:

When was the last time we developed a QB?   What dont you understand?  We have drafted so many 1st round busts its not even funny and you want this team to develop a QB? 

Funny person you are do you work as a clown. 

WTF does that have to do with Petty and Petty being ready?  DONT ask what people do or dont understand.  You have no friggen idea what youre even arguing 

Clown?  Youre just a moron who cant ever think something through, cant come up with an option, cant do anything more than be a jackass.   GFY

[joewilly12]

1 minute ago, Jet Nut said:

WTF does that have to do with Petty and Petty being ready?  DONT ask what people do or dont understand.  You have no friggen idea what youre even arguing 

Clown?  Youre just a moron.   GFY

Bryce Petty the QB on the Jets roster just like Christian Hackenburg what are we collecting QB's for show or go  

You dont get it and are a pacifist who is ok with failure aka Ryan Fitzpatrick 

Go root for a Florida team and GFY I wont call you a moron because thats a personal attack. 

[Jet Nut]

Just now, joewilly12 said:

Bryce Petty the QB on the Jets roster just like Christian Hackenburg what are we collecting QB's for show or go  

You dont get it and are a pacifist who is ok with failure aka Ryan Fitzpatrick 

Go root for a Florida team and GFY I wont call you a moron because thats a personal attack. 

Youre an idiot without an iota of common sense.  You called me a clown, FU baby, grow up already 

[Integrity28]

46 minutes ago, Jet Nut said:

Actually you don't sit players just to sit players.  You sit them and replace them with someone better.  

No matter how pissed we are at Fitz, if Petty isn't ready he doesn't play.  

No, you sit players because they are the worst in the league at their position. Nobody is suggesting you to bench Fitz just "because". There are substantial reasons for him to never take another snap. This isn't a suggestion to bench Aaron Rodgers because he's struggling.

Being around the league longer doesn't = better. It just = less to coach up. Frankly, the coaching staff would have to work harder with Petty in there... so in a way, keeping him on the bench prohibits the coaches from being exposed further.

Every QB across the NFL will tell you that they benefit from reps. If Petty isn't ready, reps get him ready. The notion that he has to "wait in the wings" is naive. He himself said he wants to get back out there, and wants to sling it - aka open it up - aka not be told to hand-off or check-down on every play. 

 

[Jet Nut]

3 minutes ago, Integrity28 said:

No, you sit players because they are the worst in the league at their position. Nobody is suggesting you to bench Fitz just "because". There are substantial reasons for him to never take another snap. This isn't a suggestion to bench Aaron Rodgers because he's struggling.

Being around the league longer doesn't = better. It just = less to coach up. Frankly, the coaching staff would have to work harder with Petty in there... so in a way, keeping him on the bench prohibits the coaches from being exposed further.

Every QB across the NFL will tell you that they benefit from reps. If Petty isn't ready, reps get him ready. The notion that he has to "wait in the wings" is naive. He himself said he wants to get back out there, and wants to sling it - aka open it up - aka not be told to hand-off or check-down on every play. 

 

No, if youre not ready to play QB, youre not ready.  We're not going to agree.  But I dont think you force feed a QB in an NFL game to improve his game.  Just me, but its not naive.  Its actually pretty naive to think all you need to do is play or better yet to coach harder.  Thats naive IMO

[Integrity28]

55 minutes ago, Jet Nut said:

No, if youre not ready to play QB, youre not ready.  We're not going to agree.  But I dont think you force feed a QB in an NFL game to improve his game.  Just me, but its not naive.  Its actually pretty naive to think all you need to do is play or better yet to coach harder.  Thats naive IMO

I think the point I've made, and won't continue to repeat beyond this response, is that you can be un-ready and still be worth starting. Improving as a player is a function of getting reps, or gaining experience. Petty needs experience. It's not about "force feeding", but more about giving a guy a chance to get reps in a season where any growing pains he experiences don't impact our chances of making the playoffs... because that ship has sailed. These aren't throw-away games, but they are "who wants to be on the roster next year games", or at least they should be. There's a lot to play for... but Fitz isn't part of any of that. There's only so much "developing" some guys can do taking backup reps. Some guys thrive when the snaps count. I'd like to see Petty play the position without fear, with the trust of the staff behind him, for a few games to find out what he's made of. The GM and coach, if they plan on being here next year, should want to see that too.

To the bold, I'm not sure what you're talking about. Nobody is making those points.... but I supposed you needed to have a counter-punch to the naive comment.

[Jet Nut]

8 minutes ago, Integrity28 said:

I think the point I've made, and won't continue to repeat beyond this response, is that you can be un-ready and still be worth starting. Improving as a player is a function of getting reps, or gaining experience. Petty needs experience. It's not about "force feeding", but more about giving a guy a chance to get reps in a season where any growing pains he experiences don't impact our chances of making the playoffs... because that ship has sailed. These aren't throw-away games, but they are "who wants to be on the roster next year games", or at least they should be. There's a lot to play for... but Fitz isn't part of any of that. There's only so much "developing" some guys can do taking backup reps. Some guys thrive when the snaps count. I'd like to see Petty play the position without fear, with the trust of the staff behind him, for a few games to find out what he's made of. The GM and coach, if they plan on being here next year, should want to see that too.

To the bold, I'm not sure what you're talking about. Nobody is making those points.... but I supposed you needed to have a counter-punch to the naive comment.

I clearly said I didnt agree.  Wasnt nasty or pompous about it.  Move on already. I dont agree with you on this. Sorry.

And no, I didnt need a counter punch, I think its extremely naive to think you can just coach up a QB prospect by coaching harder.  Thats way to simplistic 

[Integrity28]

Just now, Jet Nut said:

I clearly said I didnt agree.  Wasnt nasty or pompous about it.  Move on already. I dont agree with you on this. Sorry.

You don't agree, and keep replying to let me know... but I have to move on? LOL

[Jet Nut]

3 minutes ago, Integrity28 said:

You don't agree, and keep replying to let me know... but I have to move on? LOL

LOL, ,you just cant not get the last word in.  You answer me every time and then complain that Ive replied?  New to the internet message board?

Move on, twice I nicely said I dont agree.  Thats pisses you off, so be it.  This isnt close to an exact science

 

[JetFaninMI]

He probably thinks if he beats New England he can save his job. Another illusion by a clueless head coach.

[JetBlue]

3 hours ago, FidelioJet said:

How many points did they score? And yes, he was terrible. From Jet QB standards maybe not but from any objective NFL observer - Petty was awful last week.

It wasn't Gaily. Petty, by his own admission, was afraid to throw and chose to check down.

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Petty was not awful. He was playing his first game and you expect a certain about of tentativeness. If you consider that awful, what do you consider Fitz this entire season?? 

[Jetsplayer21]

Just be thankful on this thanksgiving we don't have to watch this horrible qb make the biggest bone head play in NFL history.. 

 

[Integrity28]

4 hours ago, Jet Nut said:

LOL, ,you just cant not get the last word in.  You answer me every time and then complain that Ive replied?  New to the internet message board?

Move on, twice I nicely said I dont agree.  Thats pisses you off, so be it.  This isnt close to an exact science

 

You began the discussion by responding to me. I don't care if you agree. I prefer it when people disagree, then whine when they can't back their argument.

I have no incentive to walk away. It was you're idea. You keep replying, but with directions to walk away instead of a better argument.

Heed your own advice.