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Woody Johnson, Joe Beningo and Being Naive


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On 11/23/2016 at 3:22 PM, Jet Nut said:

Maybe but maybe not.  We don't know that Idzik wanted to fire Rex.  Or that he wasn't allowed to.  Even if he was restricted we don't know that the structure is the same today and that if Macc went to Woody to inform him that he was going to fire Bowles he would ever be told not to. 

No, we don't know for sure. It's pretty safe to guess, though, based on the info that's leaked out. 

When a GM is hired it's usually due to the team doing poorly. A newly hired GM, unless he really knows the incumbent HC, wants to come in and pick his own. It was a pretty poorly kept secret that Woody wanted to give Rex one more year, which turned into one more year after that when their horrible team went 8-8.

If each reports directly to the owner, rather than through a chain of command, it most definitely suggests Bowles only stays or goes if the owner wishes it. The exception might be if Woody is totally on the fence about it, in which case he'd likely go with his GM's desire. 

If it's totally the GM's call, then the HC reports to the GM and there's no need for this silliness. It's that much more ridiculous considering the HC was chosen by hired consultants rather than Woody himself. 

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19 hours ago, Sperm Edwards said:

No, we don't know for sure. It's pretty safe to guess, though, based on the info that's leaked out. 

When a GM is hired it's usually due to the team doing poorly. A newly hired GM, unless he really knows the incumbent HC, wants to come in and pick his own. It was a pretty poorly kept secret that Woody wanted to give Rex one more year, which turned into one more year after that when their horrible team went 8-8.

If each reports directly to the owner, rather than through a chain of command, it most definitely suggests Bowles only stays or goes if the owner wishes it. The exception might be if Woody is totally on the fence about it, in which case he'd likely go with his GM's desire. 

If it's totally the GM's call, then the HC reports to the GM and there's no need for this silliness. It's that much more ridiculous considering the HC was chosen by hired consultants rather than Woody himself. 

Still doesn't suggest anything about the firing process to me.  To me it means if the GM wants to fire the HC he's going to inform the owner first.  I find it hard to believe there are any GMs in this league who would fire the HC without informing the owner first.  That the owner doesn't find out some other way.  So whether Woody or any other owner needs to just know or gives a thumbs up we don't know what would happen.  I just don't see a team set up where it's not going through He ownership first.

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On 11/22/2016 at 8:28 PM, SAR I said:

Let's look at the last 10 years of Woody Johnson's ownership:

2007 4-12
2008 9-7*
2009 9-7*
2010 11-5*
2011 8-8
2012 6-10
2013 8-8
2014 4-12
2015 10-6*
2016 5-11

In a 10 year period, that's 4 winning seasons, 6 non-losing seasons, and 2 playoff appearances which is well above average in the NFL.  So while the 4 losing seasons suck, the other 6 were exciting into December, look at most NFL teams over the last 10 years we actually had it good

And go back to the first 6 years of Woody Johnson's tenure:

2000 9-7
2001 10-6*
2002 9-7*
2003 6-10
2004 10-6*
2005 4-12
2006 10-6*

Over the 17 seasons Woody Johnson has owned the Jets we have 9 winning seasons, 6 non-losing seasons, and 6 playoff appearances which is not only the best stretch in team history, but it's right up there with almost every team in the NFL that has had a bonafide franchise quarterback let alone those that don't.  Find me another team without a quarterback like Brady, Manning, or Brees since 2000 that has had 9 winning seasons and played in 12 playoff games.

We are having a bad stretch.  We are stuck with what Rex Ryan and John Idzik did to this franchise and it's going to take more than 1 fluke Fitzpatrick season against a cupcake schedule to fix it.  Woody Johnson has been a fine owner.  You fans are ridiculous.

SAR I

THIS. In defense of Woody Johnson.

 

Perfectly written.

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10 hours ago, drdetroit said:

Russell Wilson would have been a NY Jet if Woody wasn't obsessed with bringing in Tebowmania.  Just that reason alone shows how horrible an owner this clown is.

True, but the entire league passed on Wilson. Better yet, the majority of fans werent talking about Wilson during that time either. There's only one guy that I remember talking Russell Wilson up on this website at the time...and he doesnt even post here anymore (I think it was @Vicious89x)

 

Nonetheless, the Miami Dolphins also passed on Russell Wilson/a head coach and potentially a superbowl run. Check this out. This article here shows how everyone pretty much f'ed up on Russell Wilson because there were coaches salivating over Russell...and not all of them worked for the NY Jets. 

Conflict over drafting Russell Wilson kept Bret Bielema from Dolphins

 
 
 
USATSI_8221773.jpg
Bret Bielema told the Dolphins he wanted to draft Russell Wilson. (USATSI)

Bret Bielema could have been the head coach of the Miami Dolphins, but talks between the two sides in 2012 fell apart reportedly because the organization did not feel comfortable drafting Russell Wilson in the second round. 

Bielema, now entering his third year as Arkansas' head coach, was interviewing for the Dolphins job after winning the 2011 Big Ten title with Wilson under center at Wisconsin. The former Badgers coach re-told his side of the tale to ESPN.com as part of a feature on the Seattle Seahawks' 2012 draft. 

via ESPN.com

"They all looked at me like, 'You can't say that. That's the difference between college and pro. He's undersized. He can't throw.' I was like, 'OK, all right,' and I honestly, that day, kind of pulled myself out of it."

Bielema says he couldn't work for people he wasn't on the same page with. (Former Miami GM Jeff Ireland, now a scout with New Orleans, was not made available through the Saints for this article.)

Bielema reportedly told the Dolphins he could win a Super Bowl within five years if he could draft Wilson. Miami would go on to hire Joe Philbin for the job while Bielema returned to Madison and won a third straight Big Ten title before leaving for Arkansas. 

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11 hours ago, drdetroit said:

Russell Wilson would have been a NY Jet if Woody wasn't obsessed with bringing in Tebowmania.  Just that reason alone shows how horrible an owner this clown is.

Let's put this myth to bed please.

Russell Wilson was drafted in the 3rd Round of the 2012 NFL Draft.  The Jets had just finished their 3rd year with Mark Sanchez, went to 2 AFC Championship Games, and were sitting at 8-5 and a sure wildcard berth before the defense got destroyed by the Eagles and Giants.

They were not in the market for a quarterback.  They inquired about Manning (like all NFL teams did) and signed Tebow (as a publicity stunt) and were not going to grab a third round nobody as it would not have been an improvement at the position or created fan buzz.

So stop with the ridiculous theories already.

SAR I

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3 hours ago, SAR I said:

Let's put this myth to bed please.

Russell Wilson was drafted in the 3rd Round of the 2012 NFL Draft.  The Jets had just finished their 3rd year with Mark Sanchez, went to 2 AFC Championship Games, and were sitting at 8-5 and a sure wildcard berth before the defense got destroyed by the Eagles and Giants.

They were not in the market for a quarterback.  They inquired about Manning (like all NFL teams did) and signed Tebow (as a publicity stunt) and were not going to grab a third round nobody as it would not have been an improvement at the position or created fan buzz.

So stop with the ridiculous theories already.

SAR I

Sanchez was a liability. If they weren't in the market for a ready replacement, says more about their incompetence.

And what sensible person cares about "buzz"? This is the exact problem with Woody Johnson's ownership. Football is a distant 2nd to bullsheet. 

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17 hours ago, Jet Nut said:

Still doesn't suggest anything about the firing process to me.  To me it means if the GM wants to fire the HC he's going to inform the owner first.  I find it hard to believe there are any GMs in this league who would fire the HC without informing the owner first.  That the owner doesn't find out some other way.  So whether Woody or any other owner needs to just know or gives a thumbs up we don't know what would happen.  I just don't see a team set up where it's not going through He ownership first.

okay, but when both bowles and maccagnan both have equal stature, what then?  mac can go to woody and claim bowles is screwing up the team.  bowles can go to woody and claim mac is screwing up the team.  the whole process relies upon woody having enough football knowledge to determine which guy is spewing the bs.  now if woody said he will consult with guys like parcells or casserly or polian or wolf before canning either bowles or mac then i guess i could live with it.  and here's to hoping he's talking with them right now.  as long as bowles has the locker room things can turn around.

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17 hours ago, Villain The Foe said:

THIS. In defense of Woody Johnson.

 

Perfectly written.

yes that was a really good summary of woody.  in truth, woody has done many good things for the jets.  he built a great practice facility and a new stadium.  okay they still share it with the giants but he did make a real bid for the west side.  imo that would've been a great thing but we all know how the politics in nyc work.  and he hasn't been cheap when it comes to the team or the players.  but he may not know the game as much as he should and relies on bowles and mac.  the worst thing he did was cozy up to kraft early on to get pointers on how to run the team.  kraft would sell out his own mother if he could get a patsie win. 

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14 hours ago, Jet Nut said:

Still doesn't suggest anything about the firing process to me.  To me it means if the GM wants to fire the HC he's going to inform the owner first.  I find it hard to believe there are any GMs in this league who would fire the HC without informing the owner first.  That the owner doesn't find out some other way.  So whether Woody or any other owner needs to just know or gives a thumbs up we don't know what would happen.  I just don't see a team set up where it's not going through He ownership first.

You were not understanding what I said, and by missing the point you are arguing against something different. 

The suggestion is not that other GMs don't bother informing the owner they are firing the HC (as a courtesy) prior to doing so.

The suggestion is that Jets' GMs don't have the authority to fire the HC without the owner's approval.

This is based on the line of power with the Jets, whereby the HC reports directly to the owner (on the Jets) bypassing the GM, rather than first reporting to the GM as a matter of protocol. Bowles should have been hired by, should be reporting to, and should only be subject to firing by, the team's GM. The owner is owed the respect of finding out before the media (which likely means prior to the HC finding out), but nothing more. The owner shouldn't be overruling or creating a power struggle where the HC and GM are on equal footing, each potentially coming to him to kvetch about the other. Not unless said owner had any sense of what is smart and stupid with regard to managing his team's personnel like some type of NFL guru. An owner that, so far, twice in a row needed to bring in 3rd party consultants (one of whom, Casserly, promptly recommended his own friend/protege for the GM position) would not qualify as being such a guru. he should be butting out of everything in terms of the coaches and players, other than shaking their hands and smiling to them now & then.

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3 minutes ago, Sperm Edwards said:

You were not understanding what I said, and by missing the point you are arguing against something different. 

The suggestion is not that other GMs don't bother informing the owner they are firing the HC (as a courtesy) prior to doing so.

The suggestion is that Jets' GMs don't have the authority to fire the HC without the owner's approval.

This is based on the line of power with the Jets, whereby the HC reports directly to the owner (on the Jets) bypassing the GM, rather than first reporting to the GM as a matter of protocol. Bowles should have been hired by, should be reporting to, and should only be subject to firing by, the team's GM. The owner is owed the respect of finding out before the media (which likely means prior to the HC finding out), but nothing more. The owner shouldn't be overruling or creating a power struggle where the HC and GM are on equal footing, each potentially coming to him to kvetch about the other. Not unless said owner had any sense of what is smart and stupid with regard to managing his team's personnel like some type of NFL guru. An owner that, so far, twice in a row needed to bring in 3rd party consultants (one of whom, Casserly, promptly recommended his own friend/protege for the GM position) would not qualify as being such a guru. he should be butting out of everything in terms of the coaches and players, other than shaking their hands and smiling to them now & then.

I got the argument.  I'm saying that just because Macc or any other GM has to inform ownership that he wants to fire a HC before firing him doesn't mean the owner would ever say no, flat out.  He should have the ability to ask why and give his support if he wants to but should never tell the GM that he can't go through with the firing, 

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3 minutes ago, Jet Nut said:

I got the argument.  I'm saying that just because Macc or any other GM has to inform ownership that he wants to fire a HC before firing him doesn't mean the owner would ever say no, flat out.  He should have the ability to ask why and give his support if he wants to but should never tell the GM that he can't go through with the firing, 

Well first, your reply suggested otherwise. Second, there is no reason for the HC to be reporting directly to him, bypassing the GM, unless he is ultimately going to be the one making such major decisions. 

There is no evidence that the Jets' GM has the authority to fire a HC. There is at least circumstantial/rumor evidence that they don't (most notably, with Idzik and Rex), and the lack of any GM candidate with serious experience showing interest in the Jets' GM position. Woody liked Herm. Woody liked - then hated - Mangini. Woody liked Rex. How he feels about Bowles is anyone's guess, but he's clearly had the largest influence over keeping or firing the 3 coaches that preceded him. 

Answer these questions:

1. Who wanted to fire Mangini: Woody or Tannenbaum (or both)?

2. Who wanted to keep Rex on for at least one more season: Woody or Idzik (or both)?

No one following the team would seriously answer anything other than "Woody" to either question, let alone both. 

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2 hours ago, Sperm Edwards said:

Well first, your reply suggested otherwise. Second, there is no reason for the HC to be reporting directly to him, bypassing the GM, unless he is ultimately going to be the one making such major decisions. 

There is no evidence that the Jets' GM has the authority to fire a HC. There is at least circumstantial/rumor evidence that they don't (most notably, with Idzik and Rex), and the lack of any GM candidate with serious experience showing interest in the Jets' GM position. Woody liked Herm. Woody liked - then hated - Mangini. Woody liked Rex. How he feels about Bowles is anyone's guess, but he's clearly had the largest influence over keeping or firing the 3 coaches that preceded him. 

Answer these questions:

1. Who wanted to fire Mangini: Woody or Tannenbaum (or both)?

2. Who wanted to keep Rex on for at least one more season: Woody or Idzik (or both)?

No one following the team would seriously answer anything other than "Woody" to either question, let alone both. 

Don't know the answer to 1.  2, Woofy.  So, doesn't mean that the GM is powerless to fire a HC.  I would assume that any team, any organization, if ownership wants youn fired and a mgr want you to stay, you can be fired.  But if Woody dumped either or both doesn't mean Macc can't fire a HC. 

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1 hour ago, Jet Nut said:

Don't know the answer to 1.  2, Woofy.  So, doesn't mean that the GM is powerless to fire a HC.  I would assume that any team, any organization, if ownership wants youn fired and a mgr want you to stay, you can be fired.  But if Woody dumped either or both doesn't mean Macc can't fire a HC. 

You don't know the answer to 1? It was no secret that Woody fired Mangini. 

And it does mean that Maccagnan can't fire a HC unless Woody also wants to fire him. If Woody doesn't want him fired, then Maccagnan's desire becomes a non-factor.

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3 hours ago, Sperm Edwards said:

You don't know the answer to 1? It was no secret that Woody fired Mangini. 

And it does mean that Maccagnan can't fire a HC unless Woody also wants to fire him. If Woody doesn't want him fired, then Maccagnan's desire becomes a non-factor.

You may be right,  but maybe completely wrong.  None of this means that Macc can't fire someon who he wants to fire.  Just as what Tanny had the power to execute might not be the same as what Macc is allowed to do.  I done see one shred of proof that as of today Macc isn't allowed to fire a HC he wants to fire. 

 

 

 

 

 

 

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16 minutes ago, Jet Nut said:

You may be right,  but maybe completely wrong.  None of this means that Macc can't fire someon who he wants to fire.  Just as what Tanny had the power to execute might not be the same as what Macc is allowed to do.  I done see one shred of proof that as of today Macc isn't allowed to fire a HC he wants to fire. 

 

 

 

 

 

 

With all due respect, Sperm has it 100% correct. And it's not even a question. 

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9 hours ago, Jet Nut said:

I got the argument.  I'm saying that just because Macc or any other GM has to inform ownership that he wants to fire a HC before firing him doesn't mean the owner would ever say no, flat out.  He should have the ability to ask why and give his support if he wants to but should never tell the GM that he can't go through with the firing, 

the fring process is Woody.  That was made plain at the time of the hiring. Neither has sway over the other.

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19 hours ago, Jet Nut said:

You may be right,  but maybe completely wrong.  None of this means that Macc can't fire someon who he wants to fire.  Just as what Tanny had the power to execute might not be the same as what Macc is allowed to do.  I done see one shred of proof that as of today Macc isn't allowed to fire a HC he wants to fire. 

 

Sorry but given past history, the burden of proof is the other way around. Specifically, it would be incumbent upon you (or Woody) to demonstrate that Maccagnan does have such authority, in contrast with past owner-GM history, not for others to prove he doesn't have this authority or that things haven't changed. Particularly in light of the obvious red flag that came to light that Bowles reports to Woody not to Maccagnan.

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On 11/22/2016 at 3:25 PM, bitonti said:

The Saints were on their way out of that town before Katrina 

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Effect_of_Hurricane_Katrina_on_the_New_Orleans_Saints

The Patriots are another example of the league finding a narrative they like, is it just a coincidence that the red white and blue team just happens to win everything during the year of 9-11? They built a dynasty based on cheating and the league let it happen because it was good optics. 

So yeah, the Jets could turn it around, if the league found a compelling storyline. Don't hold your breath, though. 

 

 

So what you are saying is the league is fixed? I have been saying that for years, just in the way the Jets always seem to get screwed at a critical juncture by the refs who have the power to "control the outcome" of games. I have said for a long time - and been shouted down - that the NFL is no more than a WWE 'sport' controlled and regulated by Goodell and his 'sidemen' known as NFL officials. Look at who wins all the time. It's always the Denver's or NE's or the Giants or Indy whoever has a national fan base that will by merchandise anywhere. Jets fans are in New England and New York and New Jersey. You won't find many Jets fans nationwide, so until they get popular in Nebraska and Colorado and Utah, I promise we won't get another championship. Jets won theirs BEFORE the fix was in.

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On 11/22/2016 at 5:08 PM, SAR I said:

Jets fans are spoiled.  Sounds silly to say, but its true.  No, we didn't win a Super Bowl, but we have had more winning seasons and playoff wins than 26 other teams since 1998.  We don't get hats and t-shirts or a parade, but we don't ask our owner to sell the team.

Idiots.

SAR I

Not only have the Jets not even made it to the SuperBowl since the 1968 season when the majority of their fans were not even born, the Jets have won the AFC East exactly TWICE since the NFL-AFL merger in 1970. 

It has been FOURTEEN YEARS since the Jets have hosted a playoff game.  The last TEN have been on the road.

Being the most frequent Wild Card team in the NFL history makes us spoiled?  If you say so, but the reality is this team has not been dominant since 1998.

 

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41 minutes ago, y2k8 said:

Not only have the Jets not even made it to the SuperBowl since the 1968 season when the majority of their fans were not even born, the Jets have won the AFC East exactly TWICE since the NFL-AFL merger in 1970. 

It has been FOURTEEN YEARS since the Jets have hosted a playoff game.  The last TEN have been on the road.

Being the most frequent Wild Card team in the NFL history makes us spoiled?  If you say so, but the reality is this team has not been dominant since 1998.

 

Compared to other teams, we have had it good.

Look at the Bills and Dolphins, for starters.  Look at the Cowboys who haven't won a playoff game in 24 years or the Raiders who haven't made the playoffs for 14 years.  The Seahawks made 1 playoff appearance in a 14 year span with Mike Holmgren and Tom Flores as head coaches, both of whom won Super Bowls and with Dave Krieg and Warren Moon who is a Hall Of Famer. 

I'm not saying this should make us happy.  I'm saying that building a competitive team the right way takes time.  Jets fans can't have it both ways.  Can't say you're tired of the playoff close-calls and then say it's awful we haven't built a team that can stay competitive for long periods of time.  Believe it or not, we've had the most success in our history with these free agent get-rich-quick schemes.  And if this new Maccagnan era is a true rebuild, we'll, we're in Year 2.  It may take 12 more years. 

Some don't realize just how important the 2009 and 2010 AFC Championship Game appearances actually were.  And why Rex Ryan should be shot for blowing the second one so badly.

SAR I

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1 hour ago, Ex-Rex said:

So what you are saying is the league is fixed? I have been saying that for years, just in the way the Jets always seem to get screwed at a critical juncture by the refs who have the power to "control the outcome" of games. I have said for a long time - and been shouted down - that the NFL is no more than a WWE 'sport' controlled and regulated by Goodell and his 'sidemen' known as NFL officials. Look at who wins all the time. It's always the Denver's or NE's or the Giants or Indy whoever has a national fan base that will by merchandise anywhere. Jets fans are in New England and New York and New Jersey. You won't find many Jets fans nationwide, so until they get popular in Nebraska and Colorado and Utah, I promise we won't get another championship. Jets won theirs BEFORE the fix was in.

1

Jets fans are the only fanbase without a majority of fans in any US county. We have no territory therefore who cares if we lose. Just us. the rest of the nation roots against us cause the Jets are the heels.  

I won't go as far to say it's totally fixed like WWE but they have heroes and villians they have narratives they like and they can (and will) put the thumb on the scale to get an outcome they prefer. 

Jets fans have this delusion that it's fair and everyone has the same shot. It's not true. 

The whole thing is set up to sell Tom Brady jerseys in London, like how they used to sell Wayne Rooney jerseys in Asia. 

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27 minutes ago, SAR I said:

 And why Rex Ryan should be shot for blowing the second one so badly.

SAR I

 

that game was on Sanchez. he turned over the ball for a defensive TD and went 3 and out all first half. People blame the defense but forgot how terribad the offense was for a whole half. 

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19 minutes ago, bitonti said:

that game was on Sanchez. he turned over the ball for a defensive TD and went 3 and out all first half. People blame the defense but forgot how terribad the offense was for a whole half. 

Revisionist history at its finest.

The defense couldn't stop a cold.  They let the Steelers take the opening kickoff and take 9 minutes off the clock in a 15 minute drive ending in a touchdown.  Ben Roethlisberger passed for just over 100 measly yards because the Jets defense allowed 166 rushing yards and had let them have the ball for 35 minutes to our 25 minutes.  It was a humiliating beat-down of Rex Ryan's vaunted offense.

Sanchez was strip sacked, you can't put that turnover on him, no one touched Taylor.

Point the finger of blame on whichever player you like, but Rex Ryan let his team get too high after the New England win and didn't control their let down.  He did nothing to get them motivated.  A team that should have been spitting blood after losing the AFCCG the year prior in Indy instead came out like they'd already won something, like they were already victors.  Typical Rex and his bluster, no substance.

SAR I

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8 minutes ago, SAR I said:

Revisionist history at its finest.

Sanchez was strip sacked, you can't put that turnover on him, no one touched Taylor.

1

looking at that play the Steelers rushed 6 for 5 blockers there's definitely someone open. Sanchez couldn't beat the blitz that's on Sanchez. 

You talk about the 9 minute drive ok and what does Sanchez do right after that? Nothing. They couldn't put up points until the 2nd half 

bottom line you can't go to Super Bowl by not using the QB and hiding him. The QB had to make plays and he didn't. 

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14 minutes ago, SAR I said:

Revisionist history at its finest.

The defense couldn't stop a cold.  They let the Steelers take the opening kickoff and take 9 minutes off the clock in a 15 minute drive ending in a touchdown.  Ben Roethlisberger passed for just over 100 measly yards because the Jets defense allowed 166 rushing yards and had let them have the ball for 35 minutes to our 25 minutes.  It was a humiliating beat-down of Rex Ryan's vaunted offense.

Sanchez was strip sacked, you can't put that turnover on him, no one touched Taylor.

Point the finger of blame on whichever player you like, but Rex Ryan let his team get too high after the New England win and didn't control their let down.  He did nothing to get them motivated.  A team that should have been spitting blood after losing the AFCCG the year prior in Indy instead came out like they'd already won something, like they were already victors.  Typical Rex and his bluster, no substance.

SAR I

not to mention it should have been ruled incomplete BUT that play didn't kill us that game.  we have to remember we would have been punting from deep in our territory had it not been ruled a fumble.  It was 17-0 at the time, if we punt Pitt likely gets at least a FG w/ great FP and we are down 20-0 at the half.  after the Td people forget he led us down for a critical FG to cut the deficit to 21 going into the half.  down 20 or 21, that didn't cost us.  the D not being able to get a stop after we pulled w/ in 5 is what cost us that game.

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4 minutes ago, bitonti said:

looking at that play the Steelers rushed 6 for 5 blockers there's definitely someone open. Sanchez couldn't beat the blitz that's on Sanchez. 

You talk about the 9 minute drive ok and what does Sanchez do right after that? Nothing. They couldn't put up points until the 2nd half 

bottom line you can't go to Super Bowl by not using the QB and hiding him. The QB had to make plays and he didn't. 

that QB made plays in every playoff game he played in, he was a major reason we made it as far as we did.  we were a D first time like all the Manning SBs that were led by their Ds and unfortunately our D's didn't show up in the title games but Mark made plays in each postseason game.  he was not why we didn't reach either SB.

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1 hour ago, nyjunc said:

that QB made plays in every playoff game he played in, he was a major reason we made it as far as we did.  we were a D first time like all the Manning SBs that were led by their Ds and unfortunately our D's didn't show up in the title games but Mark made plays in each postseason game.  he was not why we didn't reach either SB.

1

he didn't make plays in the Pit game until they were down by double digits. On the road, that's not enough.  

If there were any doubt about this player, his career post NY should erase any doubt: Mark Sanchez sucks. 

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1 minute ago, bitonti said:

he didn't make plays in the Pit game until they were down by double digits. On the road, that's not enough.  

If there were any doubt about this player, his career post NY should erase any doubt: Mark Sanchez sucks. 

the D allowed Pitt to control the clock all 1st half.  he helped bring us back and put us in a position to win that game.

 

he was really good in Philly 2 years ago, other than that he hasn't really played.  we'd be much better off w/ him than Fitz.

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10 minutes ago, nyjunc said:

the D allowed Pitt to control the clock all 1st half.  he helped bring us back and put us in a position to win that game.

 

he was really good in Philly 2 years ago, other than that he hasn't really played.  we'd be much better off w/ him than Fitz.

 

The steelers go out and score. but Sanchez didn't respond until the second half. You can't go the SB with an offense that doesn't show up. 

As for him being better than Fitz that's wishful thinking. Geno isn't better either. Fitz is hugely flawed but he's a starter and those other guys aren't. 

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