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So Does Penn State's Success Mean That Hackenberg Sucks?


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5 hours ago, SAR I said:

I don't watch college football and I'm not close enough to the sanction situation, just wondering if Hackenberg's removal from the Penn State football program led to their success or if there is another reason.  Would hate to think their quarterback was holding them back and we drafted him.

SAR I

YES

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Penn State's O line is much better than last year. Franklin also was trying to pound a square peg in a round hole with the scheme he was trying to run on offense. This year he has a new coordinator th

No. he sucks cause Jets drafted him. 

It means the sanctions from 2012 are over and they are back to 85 scholarships Lol

I don't think we need to look back to Penn State to draw some conclusions about a guy who came in 4th place in a quarterbacking contest that only included him, Ryan Fitzpatrick, Geno Smith, and Bryce Petty.

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uh oh...spread is Gailey's system


That is true he is known to mold his schemes to the players so maybe he can do something more conventional. He needs to be in more of a pro style scheme. Who knows Gailey might be gone by the time the kid gets a start.
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Fwiw, this guy likes Hack.
 
 


He makes a lot of good points and shows Hack's football IQ which can help him. If they work on his fundamentals and get him comfortable again we might have a QB with abilities above and below the neck which would be nice.
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5 hours ago, win4ever said:

Lol, that's the best offense I've seen from Rutgers this year!!

I wonder why Rutgers can't recruit, there isn't really any competition in the nearby area.  Out of state teams come and raid the talent.  

Rutgers isn't a good party school. If you know what you're doing and above 21 like I was you will have a blast but dumb 18 year old jocks aren't going to have the setup they will have at a USC or other big state schools. Plus Rutgers doesn't pay its players

 

 

Only reason Rutgers had success with Schiano was he was paying players 

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7 hours ago, win4ever said:

The Penn State team is essentially like last year's Jets. 

They got killed by Michigan, lost to Pittsburgh.  

They beat a Michigan State team that was terrible this year, Ohio State was a legit win, and Wisconsin was a great win.  I count two good wins for them, the rest are conference fodder like Rutgers, Maryland, Minnesota, Purdue, Indiana, etc.

Franklin is mainly known for recruiting, and now that the sanctions are off, they will have some players.  The problem is that he never gets over the hump, and reverts back to being bad when facing good teams.  At Vandy, similar feelings happened at the start.  They did better than expected, everyone thought Franklin would make Vandy a legit threat in the SEC, and then they fell apart.  They would beat bad teams, and then struggle vs. good teams.  

I'd wait to see how they do next year against good teams before we commence their big turn around.   

Penn State was a different team after the Michigan game.  Minnesota, Iowa and Indiana were all very solid teams and Penn State beat them all.   Iowa in particular beat Michigan and trounced Nebraska.  Pitt beat #2 Clemson.  Penn State should have won the Pitt game, but at that time the were still coming together as a team.  Not to mentioned that they destroyed Michigan State who the week before lost to Ohio State by one point after a failing on a 2 point conversion as opposed taking the game to overtime with an extra point. 

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1 hour ago, isired said:

Last night McSorley threw 2 or 3 of the best deep balls I've seen this year. That 35 yard back shoulder throw to the TE was unreal.

Sent from my SM-N920V using Tapatalk
 

Great throw and great catch.  Penn State's tight end Gesicki is the real deal.  Fast tall (6'6"), and great hands.   i watched alot of the games and when ever they needed him he answered the call. 

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2 hours ago, drdetroit said:

Rutgers isn't a good party school. If you know what you're doing and above 21 like I was you will have a blast but dumb 18 year old jocks aren't going to have the setup they will have at a USC or other big state schools. Plus Rutgers doesn't pay its players

 

 

Only reason Rutgers had success with Schiano was he was paying players 

You would think it would be, with it's proximity to the city.  

I always figured it was a name recognition thing.  I lived in NY when I grew up, and I'm not even sure if Rutgers was ever on TV.  At these other schools, like Miami or Tennessee, everyone in town knows who you are, so you are privy to a lot of special treatment.  It doesn't exist with Rutgers, or any northeast school for that matter (I guess Penn State was the closest).  

1 hour ago, long suffering jets fan said:

Penn State was a different team after the Michigan game.  Minnesota, Iowa and Indiana were all very solid teams and Penn State beat them all.   Iowa in particular beat Michigan and trounced Nebraska.  Pitt beat #2 Clemson.  Penn State should have won the Pitt game, but at that time the were still coming together as a team.  Not to mentioned that they destroyed Michigan State who the week before lost to Ohio State by one point after a failing on a 2 point conversion as opposed taking the game to overtime with an extra point. 

They seemed to catch a lot of good breaks this season.  Trust me, I didn't have them anywhere close to being good this season, but also get a lot of 2015 Jets vibes from them.  

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Considering how bad his oline and entire team was, Hackenberg still threw 16 TD's to 6 picks last year. His completion % was an abysmal 53% however. Still as others have pointed out this team had no scholarship players, basically college walk ons.

I'd also like to add that after Bill O'brien left, Hack was basically getting free agent treatment from schools, specifically Alabama and could have easily jumped ship but stuck it out anyway. 

Plus the years he took beating after beating behind that oline he stayed in games and never missed any due to injury. So he's physically and mentally tough with a sense of competitive loyalty. Lets hope this kid can put it together. 

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3 hours ago, Adoni Beast said:

Considering how bad his oline and entire team was, Hackenberg still threw 16 TD's to 6 picks last year. His completion % was an abysmal 53% however. Still as others have pointed out this team had no scholarship players, basically college walk ons.

I'd also like to add that after Bill O'brien left, Hack was basically getting free agent treatment from schools, specifically Alabama and could have easily jumped ship but stuck it out anyway. 

Plus the years he took beating after beating behind that oline he stayed in games and never missed any due to injury. So he's physically and mentally tough with a sense of competitive loyalty. Lets hope this kid can put it together. 

Excellent.  That's great news.

SAR I

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9 hours ago, win4ever said:

 

They seemed to catch a lot of good breaks this season.  Trust me, I didn't have them anywhere close to being good this season, but also get a lot of 2015 Jets vibes from them.  

You mean breaks like having their entire linebacking corps decimated by injuries for the Michigan game? Breaks like losing 4 OT that were starters during the season?

Exactly what breaks did they catch?

I was ready to get rid of Franklin when they were 2 and 2. He was making some horrible game decisions. Then, miraculously, the team gelled, and he even got in rhythm coaching.

Again, I will ask you, what breaks they got? They seemed to earn everything they won.

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18 hours ago, JoJoTownsell1 said:

Also you should note that Tennessee won a national title the year after Peyton Manning left. The GREAT Tee Martin was able to do what Peyton couldn't do with virtually the same team. Why? In college, teams change from year to year. Not to  mention that some teams run offenses that are more suitable to mobile QBs. 

I am a huge PSU fan (that's a little upset today) that loves Mcsorley, but he is not a pocket passer. A pure pocket passer like Hack just didn't work in the scheme Franklin wanted to run. Franklin an Hack were never on the same page. I am not sold on Hack, but he has the tools to be a franchise QB. I am willing to see what he can do with a real Head Coach

Please refrain from interjecting common sense into regularly ludicrous conversations. 

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Not shocked people came up with this but it's not relevant.  Penn State is running
a gimmick college offense just like Baylor.  They never huddle, the QB never calls a
play, the whole team looks to the sideline for a "picture" of what to run.  McSorley
is basically doing what Petty did in college.  Hackenberg may never be anything, but
the success he had came in a total pro offense led by O'Brien

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41 minutes ago, KRL said:

Not shocked people came up with this but it's not relevant.  Penn State is running
a gimmick college offense just like Baylor.  They never huddle, the QB never calls a
play, the whole team looks to the sideline for a "picture" of what to run.  McSorley
is basically doing what Petty did in college.  Hackenberg may never be anything, but
the success he had came in a total pro offense led by O'Brien

In any case, we can't have 2 developmental QBs on the roster again next year.  I'm fine w/ Hack as the developmental guy but it's time for Petty to show that he can be useful.  I hope we get eliminated tonight so there's no more excuses for Bowles.  It's time for Petty to get his shot.

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2 hours ago, TuscanyTile2 said:

In any case, we can't have 2 developmental QBs on the roster again next year.  I'm fine w/ Hack as the developmental guy but it's time for Petty to show that he can be useful.  I hope we get eliminated tonight so there's no more excuses for Bowles.  It's time for Petty to get his shot.

I think Petty will be cut if/when they draft another QB in this draft.

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On 12/4/2016 at 1:44 PM, SAR I said:

I don't watch college football and I'm not close enough to the sanction situation, just wondering if Hackenberg's removal from the Penn State football program led to their success or if there is another reason.  Would hate to think their quarterback was holding them back and we drafted him.

SAR I

Tennessee won a National Championship with Tee Martin at QB the year after Peyton Manning graduated. 

If Hackenberg sucks it has nothing to do with what happened at Penn State this year. 

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13 hours ago, Scott Dierking said:

You mean breaks like having their entire linebacking corps decimated by injuries for the Michigan game? Breaks like losing 4 OT that were starters during the season?

Exactly what breaks did they catch?

I was ready to get rid of Franklin when they were 2 and 2. He was making some horrible game decisions. Then, miraculously, the team gelled, and he even got in rhythm coaching.

Again, I will ask you, what breaks they got? They seemed to earn everything they won.

Every team has injuries though, although they did suffer their share.  

2 of the top of my head, beat Ohio State because of a blocked kick returned for a TD, how often does that happen?

Down 3 to Minnesota with like 20 second left, QB runs for about 25 yards on 3rd down to set up a long FG to force OT.

They got a few lucky breaks, much similar to how we won some games last year (Pats coin flip, Giants going for it)

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12 hours ago, win4ever said:

Every team has injuries though, although they did suffer their share.  

2 of the top of my head, beat Ohio State because of a blocked kick returned for a TD, how often does that happen?

Down 3 to Minnesota with like 20 second left, QB runs for about 25 yards on 3rd down to set up a long FG to force OT.

They got a few lucky breaks, much similar to how we won some games last year (Pats coin flip, Giants going for it)

So the other teams gave those opportunities to them, unfettered?

Explain luck? Can it also be determined that PSU made those plays because of talent and preparation? THAT is NOT luck.

There were no coinflips with PSU. 

Maybe you misuderstand luck.

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4 hours ago, Scott Dierking said:

So the other teams gave those opportunities to them, unfettered?

Explain luck? Can it also be determined that PSU made those plays because of talent and preparation? THAT is NOT luck.

There were no coinflips with PSU. 

Maybe you misuderstand luck.

https://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/luck

Definition of luck

:  to prosper or succeed especially through chance or good fortune

Ohio State has how many blocked kicks allowed?  And it goes for a TD, and you are arguing it was preparation?

The stats for that game:

Ohio State:  413 yards, Penn State:  276

Turnovers: OS- 0, PS- 1

TOP:  OS- 37 minutes, PS- 22 

First Downs- OS- 19 PS- 13

So are you arguing that they had them just where they wanted them?  There are 23 NFL teams that don't even have a blocked FG against them this season, 31 college teams, let alone returned for a TD.  

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3 hours ago, win4ever said:

https://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/luck

Definition of luck

:  to prosper or succeed especially through chance or good fortune

Ohio State has how many blocked kicks allowed?  And it goes for a TD, and you are arguing it was preparation?

The stats for that game:

Ohio State:  413 yards, Penn State:  276

Turnovers: OS- 0, PS- 1

TOP:  OS- 37 minutes, PS- 22 

First Downs- OS- 19 PS- 13

So are you arguing that they had them just where they wanted them?  There are 23 NFL teams that don't even have a blocked FG against them this season, 31 college teams, let alone returned for a TD.  

Haley had gone over with coaches how he needed to take a better angle, in order to block the field goal as it crossed the LOS. That is preparation, not luck.

Any way, that is one game. tell me again how PSU's entire season is about luck.

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56 minutes ago, Scott Dierking said:

Haley had gone over with coaches how he needed to take a better angle, in order to block the field goal as it crossed the LOS. That is preparation, not luck.

Any way, that is one game. tell me again how PSU's entire season is about luck.

Isn't that the goal of every FG block attempt?  It's not like all this time they had people forming a pyramid by the goal post to block it from going in.   And if it was a new found blocking ability, where are the other blocked FGs? 

The other game, was the Golden Gophers one, where they got lucky on the 3rd down play, down 3 late in the game where the defense let the Qb run for about 30 yards.  

I'm not saying their season was entirely lucky, but they were also about two unlikely plays away from being a 4 loss team.  That's similar to how the Jets seemed to catch a bunch of breaks last year, which helped pad their record.  Are they better than I thought they would be? Absolutely.  But I also do think, luck played a factor in two of those games.  

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1 hour ago, win4ever said:

Isn't that the goal of every FG block attempt?  It's not like all this time they had people forming a pyramid by the goal post to block it from going in.   And if it was a new found blocking ability, where are the other blocked FGs? 

The other game, was the Golden Gophers one, where they got lucky on the 3rd down play, down 3 late in the game where the defense let the Qb run for about 30 yards.  

I'm not saying their season was entirely lucky, but they were also about two unlikely plays away from being a 4 loss team.  That's similar to how the Jets seemed to catch a bunch of breaks last year, which helped pad their record.  Are they better than I thought they would be? Absolutely.  But I also do think, luck played a factor in two of those games.  

Have you even watched Clemson/Michigan/OSU play this   year? Those teams had some bad games also where they could have lost a couple of more games if not for a break. OSU  needed 2 OT wins and barely got past MSU a pathetic team that PSU trounched. 

In my opinion, the 3 best teams in the country are Bama, USC and Penn State. But there are consequences to losses in college football even if they all  happened early in the season. There was just no way they were going to let in a 2 loss team over a 1 loss OSU team or a 1 loss Pac 12 team (a conference that deserves a team in the playoff). 

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42 minutes ago, JoJoTownsell1 said:

Have you even watched Clemson/Michigan/OSU play this   year? Those teams had some bad games also where they could have lost a couple of more games if not for a break. OSU  needed 2 OT wins and barely got past MSU a pathetic team that PSU trounched. 

In my opinion, the 3 best teams in the country are Bama, USC and Penn State. But there are consequences to losses in college football even if they all  happened early in the season. There was just no way they were going to let in a 2 loss team over a 1 loss OSU team or a 1 loss Pac 12 team (a conference that deserves a team in the playoff). 

Who was talking about any of the other teams?  But I'll bite:  

Name the Michigan one.  

Ohio State has one in Michigan State, Penn State has 2.

I agree with Clemson, they should have lost a couple more, I have no arguments against that, but that isn't my point.  My whole point was that Penn State got lucky in a couple of game.  Why do you think Watson has taken a downgrade this year?  Because the team has underachieved.   How would you argue Michigan over Penn State?  Both played Ohio State close (which you state wasn't one of the top 4 teams in the game), both have two losses, and Michigan destroyed them head to head, both beat Wisconsin by 7, so what is the argument?  

I don't particularly like the college set up, but if you are arguing against their set up, but then you are just making the case for Michigan.  

Bama is the only one this year without any question marks.  

From 2-6, it's completely interchangeable.  

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5 hours ago, win4ever said:

Ohio State has one in Michigan State, Penn State has 2.

 

Oh, so Ohio State did not get "luck" in the Michigan game? Intercepting 2 ill advised passes? Getting a PI call on a ball that was clearly uncatchable? Getting a spot call on 4th down?

You have reached here.

You compared the PSU season to the Jets last year, and where the Jets got "lucky", was that they did not play quality opponents. Not the case with Penn State. Teams make their own luck in games that they win, unless things are given to them. You have not shown where PSU was given anything. 

 

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I apologize in advance if there was a thread made about this.

Is it just me or is it extremely alarming that the year after Hack leaves Penn State they go on to WIN THE BIG TEN?! A conference with Michigan and Ohio State. I think that is an awful reflection on hack.

They are now playing in the Rose Ball against USC and missed out barely on the NCAA playoffs.

Last Year with Hack at QB they went 7-6 with losses to Temple and Northwestern.

In 2014 they went 7-6 as well with loses to Northwestern, Illinois and Maryland.

Now the year AFTER hack leaves they win the BIG TEN TITLE. Maybe i'm wrong but i think that is an awful reflection on hack.

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1 minute ago, LamarJackson2017 said:

I apologize in advance if there was a thread made about this.

Is it just me or is it extremely alarming that the year after Hack leaves Penn State they go on to WIN THE BIG TEN?! A conference with Michigan and Ohio State. I think that is an awful reflection on hack.

They are now playing in the Rose Ball against USC and missed out barely on the NCAA playoffs.

Last Year with Hack at QB they went 7-6 with losses to Temple and Northwestern.

In 2014 they went 7-6 as well with loses to Northwestern, Illinois and Maryland.

Now the year AFTER hack leaves they win the BIG TEN TITLE. Maybe i'm wrong but i think that is an awful reflection on hack.

Hey I am going to merge this, because there is another thread. It is a valid point and a big concern.

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Just now, Maxman said:

Hey I am going to merge this, because there is another thread. It is a valid point and a big concern.

Hey Maxman, thanks! Sorry must have missed it when looking for it thanks for merging. Going to read through these pages to see peoples thoughts!

By no means am i saying this means hes a bust at all, just has me very very concerned.

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