Any Bowles defenders still out there?

[drdetroit]

3 minutes ago, BurnleyJet said:

The answer we are the Browns, but without the effort (See my avatar).

How are we so much better off than the Browns?  We won 3 more games this season?  Wow.

 

I'd much rather be in the Browns' situation.  They have the #1 pick in every round, they know they don't have a real qb on their roster and they don't have friggin Tom Brady in their division.

 

[BurnleyJet]

1 minute ago, drdetroit said:

How are we so much better off than the Browns?  We won 3 more games this season?  Wow.

 

I'd much rather be in the Browns' situation.  They have the #1 pick in every round, they know they don't have a real qb on their roster and they don't have friggin Tom Brady in their division.

Like I said we are the Browns, but without the effort. Least they try to Win. 

[drdetroit]

1 minute ago, BurnleyJet said:

Like I said we are the Browns, but without the effort. Least they try to Win. 

If the Browns make a couple good moves they could be competing for a wildcard next year.

 

Meanwhile unless there's a radical overhaul of the coaching staff and roster I can't see us going better than 1-15 next year.  Seriously.

[Lizard King]

1 hour ago, AFJF said:

Al Groh went 9-7.

I meant Kotite. It's been awhile. I tried to forget that whole decade except for the parcells piece. 

[Jetsbb]

Everyone is using the talent excuse for Bowles. How many of these so called "busts" as Bowles likes to say have there been? You know those miscommunications where the defenders have no clue what they're doing? At least 4-5 a game. so tell me how is having busts a talent issue? This is a veteran team that makes mental mistakes. This is a coaching issue as much as a talent issue. All they are doing is delaying the inevitable. Unfortunately a lame duck HC will have a say on how our future is shaped since half the team will be cut this offseason.

[detectivekimble]

5 hours ago, CrazyCarl40 said:

This roster is atrocious. That's not on the coach. 

Wilkerson - Pro Bowl, All-Pro

Richardson - DROY, Pro Bowl

Leonard Williams - Premium talent

David Harris - Good

Marshall - Pro Bowl, All-Pro

Powell - Good

Enunwa - Good

Carpenter - Good

Winters - Good

Mangold - Pretty good

ASJ - Talented

 

The roster has lots of good players.  This might not be a legit contender, but they shouldn't be this pathetic.

[CrazyCarl40]

28 minutes ago, detectivekimble said:

Wilkerson - Pro Bowl, All-Pro not this year

Richardson - DROY, Pro Bowl not this year

Leonard Williams - Premium talent

David Harris - Good hasn't  been in years

Marshall - Pro Bowl, All-Pro not this year

Powell - Good solid contributor 

Enunwa - Good 

Carpenter - Good

Winters - Good lol no

Mangold - Pretty good declining rapidly and often injured

ASJ - Talented drunk dropped a TD today

 

The roster has lots of good players.  This might not be a legit contender, but they shouldn't be this pathetic.

The premium positions in the NFL are QB, CB, LT, and pass rusher. The Jets are devoid of talent in all of those positions. If you don't have a QB you need a lot more than a few good defensive lineman. 

[Beerfish]

Well since the 'All the things Bowles does wrong' angle does not work for all people, maybe we can switch it up.

What exactly has Todd Bowles done well as a head coach since the end of last year?  Name one thing.  I'm all ears.

[heymangold]

6 hours ago, CrazyCarl40 said:

This roster is atrocious. That's not on the coach. 

It's the EXACT same roster as last year. 

[UnitedWhofans]

29 minutes ago, CrazyCarl40 said:

The premium positions in the NFL are QB, CB, LT, and pass rusher. The Jets are devoid of talent in all of those positions. If you don't have a QB you need a lot more than a few good defensive lineman. 

I agree.

[UnitedWhofans]

2 minutes ago, heymangold said:

It's the EXACT same roster as last year. 

No it's not. No Brick at LT. 

[CrazyCarl40]

8 minutes ago, heymangold said:

It's the EXACT same roster as last year. 

That's not true at all. 

[Sperm Edwards]

6 hours ago, RutgersJetFan said:

So basically here's what happened:

1. Sheldon gets crucified for dumb social media post. Bowles feigns outrage. Declares he'll do something.

2. Anoints Sheldon captain for the game.

3. Sheldon then leads the d-line in standing up on a goal line stand letting a RB walk into the end zone in the 3rd quarter.

Your HC of the NYJ, folks.

"The grownups are now in charge" 

rofl

[Mecca]

A good coach understands how to get the most out of his players. The fact that we weren't a 4-3 team this year shows how bad Bowles is. 

 

Bowles never knew how to use Pryor.

Didn't use Revis as a press man corner.

Didnt use ASJ

Didn't use Powell enough 

Made Fitz' leash way too long. 

Toilet Bowles

[Matt39]

1 minute ago, Mecca said:

A good coach understands how to get the most out of his players. The fact that we weren't a 4-3 team this year shows how bad Bowles is. 

 

Bowles never knew how to use Pryor.

Didn't use Revis as a press man corner.

Didnt use ASJ

Didn't use Powell enough 

Made Fitz' leash way too long. 

Toilet Bowles

Pryor, Revis and ASJ all stink. 

[flgreen]

1 hour ago, CrazyCarl40 said:

The premium positions in the NFL are QB, CB, LT, and pass rusher. The Jets are devoid of talent in all of those positions. If you don't have a QB you need a lot more than a few good defensive lineman. 

Your right.

Last year's Bronco's proved your point.  Problem is, team needs to be burned down.  Regime is in 3rd year of power, they need to produce.  It's not going to start next year, it's going to be a 7-9 win now team.

Yep

[CrazyCarl40]

Just now, flgreen said:

Your right.

Last year's Bronco's proved your point.  Problem is, team needs to be burned down.  Regime is in 3rd year of power, they need to produce.  It's not going to start next year, it's going to be a 7-9 win now team.

Yep

I'd take another 4-12 year next year if there was marked improvement in the young players and an investment into more of them. We'll know more about the 2017 Jets and beyond when they figure out what their QB plan is for the year. I don't think the starter is on the team currently. 

[flgreen]

11 minutes ago, CrazyCarl40 said:

I'd take another 4-12 year next year if there was marked improvement in the young players and an investment into more of them. We'll know more about the 2017 Jets and beyond when they figure out what their QB plan is for the year. I don't think the starter is on the team currently. 

I agree again.  Unfortunately i don't think it's the way to go.  

They are going to bring another QB in. They are going to sign FA OL.  They will improve team to around 6-10, 7-9.  Doesn't really excite me.

I would much rather go in with Petty as starter.  No lose situation.  The 2018 draft, at this point, appears to be a QB rich draft.  It might be a blessing having the first pick in that draft.  If your 7-9, your going to miss out on the quality QB's.

The flip side is there is always a small chance Petty is the deal................................................  Maybe?

[rammagen]

Look then guy went 10 and 6 his first yr and this yr has been horrid which is the real bowles, can anyone answer that?

besides the injuries, I would blame his defensive coordinator for the defense. The Coordinator shoudl be responsible for putting players into position to succeed and they have not done that on either side of the ball.

 

I have no issue  with Mac as he inherited an  roster with no talent but he did have money. If we go on the carousel of changing coaches every two yrs we will get no-one to coach us worth a crap. it is so easy to say fire the bum but who replaces him? Who worth a damn would come here knowing we have impatient fans who think they know more then the gm and coaches?  We are not privy to everything that happens with the players while I agree this has sucked beyond imagination do we know for sure who is healthy suiting up and who isn't? This is where one injury shows because we have no depth thanks to Idzick.

It is pressure filled in the NFL the panic attack yesterday if true should tell bowles if he really wants the pressure or if he should step aside, IDK about firing him. Get a new defensive coordinator one that plays to the players strengths, redo the oline because that will make the running game and qb  better then look for that qb who will make everyone better. Steps one and two are easy but step three half the nfl is looking for the next guy.

[CanadaSteve]

4 hours ago, drdetroit said:

The people who know everything say we can't fire someone every 2 years because we become the Browns

 

No, just the people that know more.....

[Sperm Edwards]

3 hours ago, rammagen said:

Look then guy went 10 and 6 his first yr and this yr has been horrid which is the real bowles, can anyone answer that?

besides the injuries, I would blame his defensive coordinator for the defense. The Coordinator shoudl be responsible for putting players into position to succeed and they have not done that on either side of the ball.

 

I have no issue  with Mac as he inherited an  roster with no talent but he did have money. If we go on the carousel of changing coaches every two yrs we will get no-one to coach us worth a crap. it is so easy to say fire the bum but who replaces him? Who worth a damn would come here knowing we have impatient fans who think they know more then the gm and coaches?  We are not privy to everything that happens with the players while I agree this has sucked beyond imagination do we know for sure who is healthy suiting up and who isn't? This is where one injury shows because we have no depth thanks to Idzick.

It is pressure filled in the NFL the panic attack yesterday if true should tell bowles if he really wants the pressure or if he should step aside, IDK about firing him. Get a new defensive coordinator one that plays to the players strengths, redo the oline because that will make the running game and qb  better then look for that qb who will make everyone better. Steps one and two are easy but step three half the nfl is looking for the next guy.

Oh bullsh*t he inherited no talent. Decker, Enunwa, Kerley, Powell, Mangold, Winters, Mo, Sheldon, Snacks, Pryor. He also had starters in place or easily brought back, to get him into or through his first year if he'd wanted: Ivory, Brick, Breno, Colon, Pace, Davis, Harvin. He also inherited the 6th/5th pick in every round of a solid draft, and very few short term albatross contracts to go with some $60m in immediate cap space.

In particular, when he got here the secondary was in shambles and he had no clear starting QB -- just like now, despite bringing in 3 new QBs, 3 expensive new CBs, and an expensive new FS. As Carl mentioned above, and as I've hammered on a few times myself, the "big money" positions are major problems or outright holes entering his 3rd season here: QB, CB (x2-3), OT (x2), outside pass rusher.

He's also given up a full year of draft picks already, when one combines what he's passed on for Mo + Sheldon, the turned-away comp picks because he just had to sign pure UFAs for this 4-win season, and the trades for very short term veterans. I added it up some months ago, but it came to around 10 draft picks. Quite an achievement. 

[MaxAF]

Todd Bowles is a D-back by trade. That's what he was as a professional NFL player. He's not transferring his knowledge to the players or he doesn't have a clue. The secondary has had so many blown coverages and looks disoriented out there most of the time. And that's game after game. No adjustments, no corrections game after game.  The defensive line's game scheme has changed and for the worse. They don't blitz like they did last year because the secondary can't cover in man to man. Same players as last year!!! Why is that???? The Offense....Don't need to say anything more. Just awful. He can't figure out how to win or motivate his players. Poor play clock management, ete,etc. This team is getting worse every week while Bowles says we got to get better. He may never be a good head coach but let him practice at being a head coach someplace else. Hire a veteran head coach, that is a winner and rebuild from there. Bowles has done the same thing week after week expecting different results..... Insanity. He even said he's done at the end of the season. Not only have the players quit on him, he's quit on himself. He admitted that he stinks so bad as a coach and has epically failed so bad that he's telling Woody to fire him. And I agree 100%.

[rammagen]

On 12/25/2016 at 2:41 AM, Sperm Edwards said:

Oh bullsh*t he inherited no talent. Decker, Enunwa, Kerley, Powell, Mangold, Winters, Mo, Sheldon, Snacks, Pryor. He also had starters in place or easily brought back, to get him into or through his first year if he'd wanted: Ivory, Brick, Breno, Colon, Pace, Davis, Harvin. He also inherited the 6th/5th pick in every round of a solid draft, and very few short term albatross contracts to go with some $60m in immediate cap space.

In particular, when he got here the secondary was in shambles and he had no clear starting QB -- just like now, despite bringing in 3 new QBs, 3 expensive new CBs, and an expensive new FS. As Carl mentioned above, and as I've hammered on a few times myself, the "big money" positions are major problems or outright holes entering his 3rd season here: QB, CB (x2-3), OT (x2), outside pass rusher.

He's also given up a full year of draft picks already, when one combines what he's passed on for Mo + Sheldon, the turned-away comp picks because he just had to sign pure UFAs for this 4-win season, and the trades for very short term veterans. I added it up some months ago, but it came to around 10 draft picks. Quite an achievement. 

lts look at that great talent  Enunwa has been up and down  (granted qb play has sucked) Mangold old injured , Mo injuried  Snacks gone, Pryor may not even be extended, so this great talent was not that great this yr. There was allot of under performing which he needs to answer esp on teh defense for but lets fire a coach after two yrs and be the bills or the browns the issue here is not only performance but the impatience of the fan base who think they know better then gm or the coaches.

 

This team lacked depth and it really showed this yr, where is the depth at corner or even oline.  The lack of depth coupled with injuries showed this yr. Because of there was enough talent and depth the record would have been better and we would have won some of the closer games

[drdetroit]

On 12/25/2016 at 6:02 AM, MaxAF said:

Todd Bowles is a D-back by trade. That's what he was as a professional NFL player. He's not transferring his knowledge to the players or he doesn't have a clue. The secondary has had so many blown coverages and looks disoriented out there most of the time. And that's game after game. No adjustments, no corrections game after game.  The defensive line's game scheme has changed and for the worse. They don't blitz like they did last year because the secondary can't cover in man to man. Same players as last year!!! Why is that???? The Offense....Don't need to say anything more. Just awful. He can't figure out how to win or motivate his players. Poor play clock management, ete,etc. This team is getting worse every week while Bowles says we got to get better. He may never be a good head coach but let him practice at being a head coach someplace else. Hire a veteran head coach, that is a winner and rebuild from there. Bowles has done the same thing week after week expecting different results..... Insanity. He even said he's done at the end of the season. Not only have the players quit on him, he's quit on himself. He admitted that he stinks so bad as a coach and has epically failed so bad that he's telling Woody to fire him. And I agree 100%.

To call Bowles poor at game clock management would be giving him the biggest compliment ever.  He isn't bad or poor -- he is beyond horrible.  A 5year old girl who doesn't even know the rules could manage the game better than Bowles.

 

[Randy Rasmussen]

The people who know everything say we can't fire someone every 2 years because we become the Browns
 
So we have to stick with a complete dud coaching staff for another horrible season next year

Or the Bills


Sent from my iPhone using JetNation.com mobile app

[joenamathwouldn'tcry]

If you have any misgivings about jettisooning  Bowles after this season, remember this:  This guy was "supposed" to be a defensive guru.  Have , you seen a worse defense in the league this year? and it's not all on the players.  They're not even ready for the snap of the football.  How many times have we seen defensive backs two and three deep, nowhere near receivers running free?  Bull rushing three defensive linemen, no stunts, while the backs are playing fifteen yards off the receiver? The same stale blitz packages, game after game.  Getting our asses kicked by every other team in the league after halftime "adjustments"  No, my friends it is indeed the "coaching"  or the lack of it. And as far as team discipline goes  give me a break  He is a nice guy, but a weak ineffective, and clueless "leader"!  Let's flush, close the lid and move on.

[Sperm Edwards]

On 12/27/2016 at 7:06 PM, rammagen said:

lts look at that great talent  Enunwa has been up and down  (granted qb play has sucked) Mangold old injured , Mo injuried  Snacks gone, Pryor may not even be extended, so this great talent was not that great this yr. There was allot of under performing which he needs to answer esp on teh defense for but lets fire a coach after two yrs and be the bills or the browns the issue here is not only performance but the impatience of the fan base who think they know better then gm or the coaches.

 

This team lacked depth and it really showed this yr, where is the depth at corner or even oline.  The lack of depth coupled with injuries showed this yr. Because of there was enough talent and depth the record would have been better and we would have won some of the closer games

Nope. This team was lousy when everyone was healthy. And so much for blaming the horrible schedule. It wasn't as bad as expected; it just wasn't nearly the cake walk that was 2015, which for this roster and coaching staff is plenty hard enough. Left to the rationale you're putting forth here, the Broncos would have left Josh McDaniels and Brian Xanders in charge. They surely would have kept Fox in as HC, where their reward last season would have been lamenting over the downfall of Peyton Manning instead of celebrating a Super Bowl win.

One doesn't keep bad/underperforming staff around because one's worried about being the Browns or Bills, and poor performing coaches and GMs do not "deserve" another year or anything more than the opportunity they'd already been given. Those teams aren't bad because they're firing coaches as though they were fickle children. They're bad because they keep hiring bad people to replace them. If the Bills & Browns kept their past incompetent losers in place they'd surely still be incompetent losers.

Like Denver, the Bills & Browns - and the Jets - will significantly improve when they get better people to build and coach the team. One can't responsibly sit idly by and simply wait for the day we get another 2015-esque schedule.

And I never said the team was filled with "great" talent. You said they had "no talent" and this is a patently false statement. So now every new GM, taking over for a fired GM, has excuses up the wazoo unless he inherits a double-digit number of "great talents" on the roster. What a fairy tale. I listed a bunch of players with obvious talent to counter your preposterous claim that the team had none. Maccagnan has brought in or re-signed so many bad players to bad contracts that frankly he doesn't get any excuses on any level. If these were all - or even mostly - good moves he made, but suffered under the weight of injuries only because of a lack of depth, then you could make that argument.

He was facing a bad roster with some talent. He also has done a piss poor job himself. These two different statements can both be true at the same time.

[HighPitch]

There are no other coaching alternatives.  I also dont want to give some hot shot oc or dc a try at coaching.  That has gotten us nowhere.  I mean the last proven coach we had was parcells and that was heavenly.  Since then its been a revolving door of rookies. 

I NEVER thought ww cohld do worss than hermy or kotite,  but here we are.  Honestly,  rex waz the best weve had in a while.  Its sad.  

I dont think bowles ia getting fired

[rammagen]

you just kind of proved my point about lack of talent with your first statment this team was lousy when everyone was healthy..... that is not teh gms fault for getting a team that lacked talent and depth due to bad drafting for several yrs. It will take longer then one or two yrs to fix that. Coaching has been a let down but talent and injuries have something to do with that.

 

[drdetroit]

STUPIDITY

[UnitedWhofans]

6 hours ago, Sperm Edwards said:

 

One doesn't keep bad/underperforming staff around because one's worried about being the Browns or Bills, and poor performing coaches and GMs do not "deserve" another year or anything more than the opportunity they'd already been given. Those teams aren't bad because they're firing coaches as though they were fickle children. They're bad because they keep hiring bad people to replace them. If the Bills & Browns kept their past incompetent losers in place they'd surely still be incompetent losers.

Like Denver, the Bills & Browns - and the Jets - will significantly improve when they get better people to build and coach the team. One can't responsibly sit idly by and simply wait for the day we get another 2015-esque schedule.

Because only bad people want to go there. And that's because of the lack of time they are given.

[CanadienJetsFan]

 stick to the game plan and don't fire Bowles. Yes, it's been ugly but everything has gone wrong this year.It's easy to blame the coach,  he's in charge, I get it. Ultimately it's the players who dress and decide whether they're "all in" or not. This year, just too many vets phoned it in, that there is no denying.

This was a "win now" team and it didn't. They rolled the dice and they crapped out. There's no doubt that most of the veterans will be cut or let go and a new Corps of leaders will emerge. This team simply has no identity. The identity of the team comes from its core leaders. they are the ones who enforce the rules and hold all players to a high standard. it is safe to say that the core leadership group of this team failed miserably this year.. They did great last year, but failed this year. This was Bowles fault?

so many of you on this site want to blame Bowles for his lack of leadership. .. I don't. I blame the vets. I just think 2 years is too soon to throw the baby out with the bathwater. Believe It or Not, There is a game plan in place. Just because they don't publicly announce what the game plan is, i fail to believe that a multi-billion-dollar business like the New York Jets doesn't have a long-term game plan in place.  Both Bowles and Mac were hired in knowing that no long-term  quarterback  was in place.  and until a quarterback solution is realized, this team will always be like a rutterless ship. so you guys can blame them all you want for this situation but I say pick a QB until you find one. Finding a QB takes time too many of us are simply impatient. Until you have  stability at the QB position , you have uncertainty.

Getting back to Bowles, the true Testament of a very good NFL coach is how he makes adjustments . I am not only talking about in-game adjustments rather, I'm talking about  whether or not he is able to take a step back and realize that the way he approaches the game simply isn't working.  this year it's safe to say that Todd Bowles way of playing the game simply does not work. The NFL is a game of adjustments. Other NFL teams have adjusted to the way that Todd Bowles game plans ...it's now up to him to make adjustments. A good NFL coach also is able to look at his coaching staff and determine who's to say and who's to go.  This year again, it's safe to say that his choice of special teams coach and defensive coordinator should be put into question.  will he be able to adjust and make the appropriate changes? I'd like to see him try and do so.

When he was hired, i questioned whether it made sense to once again bring in a highly touted coordinator and make him a head coach. I would have preferred hiring a head coach with existing experience.. again they decided to go with the hottest coordinator they could find. Woody never seems to learn from his past mistakes...

Look, this is what you get with an inexperienced coach.   You Get Growing Pains.

Unless Woody can get an existing head coach with a winning pedigree, i say stay the course.

 

[drdetroit]

Just now, CanadienJetsFan said:

 stick to the game plan and don't fire Bowles.

 

Cool.  Our game plan is to go 0-16 in 2017 to get Lamar Jackson!

[BRONX DUDE]

38 minutes ago, drdetroit said:

STUPIDITY

Please take that back.  He's a nice guy who wants the Jets to perform well and WIN!!

[Kleckineau]

7 hours ago, Sperm Edwards said:

Nope. This team was lousy when everyone was healthy. And so much for blaming the horrible schedule. It wasn't as bad as expected; it just wasn't nearly the cake walk that was 2015, which for this roster and coaching staff is plenty hard enough. Left to the rationale you're putting forth here, the Broncos would have left Josh McDaniels and Brian Xanders in charge. They surely would have kept Fox in as HC, where their reward last season would have been lamenting over the downfall of Peyton Manning instead of celebrating a Super Bowl win.

One doesn't keep bad/underperforming staff around because one's worried about being the Browns or Bills, and poor performing coaches and GMs do not "deserve" another year or anything more than the opportunity they'd already been given. Those teams aren't bad because they're firing coaches as though they were fickle children. They're bad because they keep hiring bad people to replace them. If the Bills & Browns kept their past incompetent losers in place they'd surely still be incompetent losers.

Like Denver, the Bills & Browns - and the Jets - will significantly improve when they get better people to build and coach the team. One can't responsibly sit idly by and simply wait for the day we get another 2015-esque schedule.

Perfectly stated. Could not agree more.

I would add that last years 10 win mirage only served to hide the shortcomings of this regime. Adding to the smoke and mirrors was that silly exec of the year award. The signs of incompetancy by both GM and HC existed but most of us (me included) chose to chalk it up to rookie miscues. Unfortunately the poor decision making has worsened and became more frequent this season.