Jet Nut Posted December 26, 2016 Share Posted December 26, 2016 12 hours ago, Savage69 said: That he wasn't that horrid in the 90's BB had one winning season in the 90's..and you can include 2000 5-11 season.. Teams change from year to year, look at the 15 and 16 Jets. Their roster are ever changing, some through turnover, some through injury. Their schedules and who they play changes from year to year. Thats why I asked, doesn't really prove much Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jet Nut Posted December 26, 2016 Share Posted December 26, 2016 8 hours ago, BurnleyJet said: Do you have eye's? - Read my lips, the guy can not coach. He's lost the team, the inmates run the Jets. Not Todd Bowles. I'm not signing up for year 3. Imagine how much stronger your argument would be if you were right and not just spewing one cliche after another. Two guys are fighting? In a lockerroom with 53 type A males you find this shocking and a mark against the HC? That 2 players were late? This proves he lost his team? I don't have a problem with the Jets firing Bowles, but for real reasons. Not this nonsense that your preaching as fact Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sperm Edwards Posted December 26, 2016 Share Posted December 26, 2016 12 hours ago, Jet Nut said: And to fire a GM in less than 3 seasons is about as dumb as it gets. No matter how many fans think it's smart Depends on the process that follows. If it's to bring in someone unique (e.g. Harbaugh) who'd want total control, then you don't wait for the sake of waiting. If they're going to fire him and then commence their usual GM and HC search like the last 2 times, then I agree it's pointless. Particularly if the HC and GM hires are going to be simultaneous again. Nope. Let them both sink or swim together next year. If they finish 6-10 next year but there's an obvious reason to be optimistic due to a young roster looking like it's just barely starting to click, including an actual young QB emerging, then I'll be plenty happy. If another $30-60M is spent on more 30+ yr old short-term bandaids, resulting in an 8-8 finish by winning the final meaningless game of the season, then I'll be in favor of firing them both. Of course the way this league works, that type of improvement will buy both another year. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jet Nut Posted December 26, 2016 Share Posted December 26, 2016 2 minutes ago, Sperm Edwards said: Depends on the process that follows. If it's to bring in someone unique (e.g. Harbaugh) who'd want total control, then you don't wait for the sake of waiting. If they're going to fire him and then commence their usual GM and HC search like the last 2 times, then I agree it's pointless. Particularly if the HC and GM hires are going to be simultaneous again. Nope. Let them both sink or swim together next year. If they finish 6-10 next year but there's an obvious reason to be optimistic due to a young roster looking like it's just barely starting to click, including an actual young QB emerging, then I'll be plenty happy. If another $30-60M is spent on more 30+ yr old short-term bandaids, resulting in an 8-8 finish by winning the final meaningless game of the season, then I'll be in favor of firing them both. Of course the way this league works, that type of improvement will buy both another year. Well yeah, you're right in that case. If you want a HC like JH and he wants control you have to weigh out what you feel is better, Macc fired and JH running it all or a different HC with Macc as GM. Could be a tough call if that HC doesn't come in as a proven GM as with Chip Kelly. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sperm Edwards Posted December 26, 2016 Share Posted December 26, 2016 Just now, Jet Nut said: Well yeah, you're right in that case. If you want a HC like JH and he wants control you have to weigh out what you feel is better, Macc fired and JH running it all or a different HC with Macc as GM. Could be a tough call if that HC doesn't come in as a proven GM as with Chip Kelly. The logic is that you make the move if JH is available now but isn't going to be available a year later. He's available when he's available and JH doesn't give a crap about the 2 vs 3 year window/timetable of alleged etiquette for giving a bad HC or GM 3 years apiece before moving on from either one. I am dead set against a new HC with Maccagnan returning as GM. I also think it's too early to fire both of them, given how quickly they fired Idzik, unless they had a unique/specific new hire in mind (like JH). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jetsfan80 Posted December 26, 2016 Share Posted December 26, 2016 Bottom line: A coach's job is to win games. Period. Don't care about strength of schedule. Just win games. And if he loses to Buffalo this week he'll be 14-18. Bottom line. Period. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jack48 Posted December 26, 2016 Share Posted December 26, 2016 19 hours ago, Jetsbb said: http://www.espn.com/blog/new-york-jets/post/_/id/65880/jets-coach-todd-bowles-is-reliving-the-old-pete-carroll-nightmare-sadly FOXBOROUGH, Mass. -- The debacle that unfolded Saturday was reminiscent of a long-ago Christmas Eve in 1994. The coach was Pete Carroll, and he got whacked after only one season because a couple of knuckleheads -- James Hasty and Brian Washington -- infected the locker room with their toxic attitude, creating a perception that the team had quit on Carroll. The New York Jets were awful down the stretch, culminating with an ugly loss in Houston on Dec. 24. Owner Leon Hess overreacted and fired Carroll, who has done quite nicely for himself. The same scenario is playing out for the current Jets, as Todd Bowles -- considered a rising star only a year ago -- is getting buried by a talent-thin team that seemingly isn't fighting for him. Not only did they get embarrassed by the New England Cheaters, 41-3, but they pointed fingers after the game, with some players questioning the effort. The locker room appears divided, with a couple of so-called stars -- Brandon Marshall and Sheldon Richardson -- in the forefront of the turmoil. Unwritten rule No. 1 in the NFL: If you want to get your coach fired, start bickering with each other and make comments about the team not trying hard enough. The players probably didn't do it on purpose, but they put Bowles squarely on the hot seat with one game remaining in this rotten season. If Bowles gets sacked, it'll be because of Saturday's mess -- on and off the field. Richardson, who should've been grateful he was allowed to play a week after his Snapchat fiasco, called out Marshall in the locker room. He went public with a simmering personal feud, creating another headache for Bowles, whose entire body ached in the aftermath of a kidney and gall-bladder attack. Wait, there was more. Leonard Williams, the team's most promising star, said "guys weren't ready to play" and were "going through the motions." Muhammad Wilkerson basically echoed Williams' sentiment. Imagine: Wilkerson made an impassioned speech before the game, imploring his teammates to win it for Bowles, who left a hospital to coach the game. If they were inspired by Bowles' toughness, it sure didn't show. Is the locker room dissension widespread? No, but a few bad apples can create the wrong perception. That happened in '94, and it cost Carroll his job. A couple of weeks ago, Bowles appeared safe, but he lost by 21 and 38 points to the Dolphins and Cheaters, respectively. Nothing irks owner Woody Johnson more than losing badly to division rivals. The Jets (4-11) were non-competitive against the mighty Cheaters. Eight of 11 starters on offense began the season as backups. They had no chance. Still, a 38-point loss is "inexcusable," as Bowles called it. Johnson didn't even make the game. Family obligation, the team said. Now what? If Johnson fires Bowles after only two seasons, he'd cast himself and the organization in an unflattering light. He'd be known as an owner who bails out at the first sign of adversity, and good luck trying to attract a top head-coaching candidate willing to work in that environment. Johnson is about to make one of the biggest decisions in his 16 years of ownership. He can be a strong leader and recommit to Bowles and general manager Mike Maccagnan, expressing dissatisfaction with 2016 but also showing he's a man of his convictions. After all, the Jets won 10 games last season; it's not as if MacBowles is a two-year bust. Or Johnson can make himself into an early-days George Steinbrenner, impatient and cartoonish, tossing Bowles and/or Maccagnan into the dumpster marked "John Idzik." Unless Johnson can pull Nick Saban out of a magic hat, he won't find a savior out there. Hess got antsy 22 years ago, dumping Carroll if favor of Rich Kotite. How'd that work out? Bowles is having a rough year, but he has been undermined by horrific quarterback play, an old roster and an inordinate number of injuries. He's well-respected around the league, and you can bet he'd get interviews for head-coaching positions if the Jets put him on the market. Now Johnson has reached a crossroads in his ownership. He can change the perception by staying the course or doing what his predecessor did all those years ago. For Pete's sake, Woody, don't be swayed by the noise and few meaningless games. If you made achecklist of tasks a head coach has to perform adequately to be retained, you could not check off a single box when you analyze Bowles perforance. There have been zero positives. It would be insane to keep a guy who is basically ALL negatives. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FOXBOROUGH, Mass. -- The debacle that unfolded Saturday was reminiscent of a long-ago Christmas Eve in 1994. The coach was Pete Carroll, and he got whacked after only one season because a couple of knuckleheads -- James Hasty and Brian Washington -- infected the locker room with their toxic attitude, creating a perception that the team had quit on Carroll. The New York Jets were awful down the stretch, culminating with an ugly loss in Houston on Dec. 24. Owner Leon Hess overreacted and fired Carroll, who has done quite nicely for himself. The same scenario is playing out for the current Jets, as Todd Bowles -- considered a rising star only a year ago -- is getting buried by a talent-thin team that seemingly isn't fighting for him. Not only did they get embarrassed by the New England Cheaters, 41-3, but they pointed fingers after the game, with some players questioning the effort. The locker room appears divided, with a couple of so-called stars -- Brandon Marshall and Sheldon Richardson -- in the forefront of the turmoil. Unwritten rule No. 1 in the NFL: If you want to get your coach fired, start bickering with each other and make comments about the team not trying hard enough. The players probably didn't do it on purpose, but they put Bowles squarely on the hot seat with one game remaining in this rotten season. If Bowles gets sacked, it'll be because of Saturday's mess -- on and off the field. Richardson, who should've been grateful he was allowed to play a week after his Snapchat fiasco, called out Marshall in the locker room. He went public with a simmering personal feud, creating another headache for Bowles, whose entire body ached in the aftermath of a kidney and gall-bladder attack. Wait, there was more. Leonard Williams, the team's most promising star, said "guys weren't ready to play" and were "going through the motions." Muhammad Wilkerson basically echoed Williams' sentiment. Imagine: Wilkerson made an impassioned speech before the game, imploring his teammates to win it for Bowles, who left a hospital to coach the game. If they were inspired by Bowles' toughness, it sure didn't show. Is the locker room dissension widespread? No, but a few bad apples can create the wrong perception. That happened in '94, and it cost Carroll his job. A couple of weeks ago, Bowles appeared safe, but he lost by 21 and 38 points to the Dolphins and Cheaters, respectively. Nothing irks owner Woody Johnson more than losing badly to division rivals. The Jets (4-11) were non-competitive against the mighty Cheaters. Eight of 11 starters on offense began the season as backups. They had no chance. Still, a 38-point loss is "inexcusable," as Bowles called it. Johnson didn't even make the game. Family obligation, the team said. Now what? If Johnson fires Bowles after only two seasons, he'd cast himself and the organization in an unflattering light. He'd be known as an owner who bails out at the first sign of adversity, and good luck trying to attract a top head-coaching candidate willing to work in that environment. Johnson is about to make one of the biggest decisions in his 16 years of ownership. He can be a strong leader and recommit to Bowles and general manager Mike Maccagnan, expressing dissatisfaction with 2016 but also showing he's a man of his convictions. After all, the Jets won 10 games last season; it's not as if MacBowles is a two-year bust. Or Johnson can make himself into an early-days George Steinbrenner, impatient and cartoonish, tossing Bowles and/or Maccagnan into the dumpster marked "John Idzik." Unless Johnson can pull Nick Saban out of a magic hat, he won't find a savior out there. Hess got antsy 22 years ago, dumping Carroll if favor of Rich Kotite. How'd that work out? Bowles is having a rough year, but he has been undermined by horrific quarterback play, an old roster and an inordinate number of injuries. He's well-respected around the league, and you can bet he'd get interviews for head-coaching positions if the Jets put him on the market. Now Johnson has reached a crossroads in his ownership. He can change the perception by staying the course or doing what his predecessor did all those years ago. For Pete's sake, Woody, don't be swayed by the noise and few meaningless games.
Unwritten rule No. 1 in the NFL: If you want to get your coach fired, start bickering with each other and make comments about the team not trying hard enough. The players probably didn't do it on purpose, but they put Bowles squarely on the hot seat with one game remaining in this rotten season. If Bowles gets sacked, it'll be because of Saturday's mess -- on and off the field. Richardson, who should've been grateful he was allowed to play a week after his Snapchat fiasco, called out Marshall in the locker room. He went public with a simmering personal feud, creating another headache for Bowles, whose entire body ached in the aftermath of a kidney and gall-bladder attack. Wait, there was more. Leonard Williams, the team's most promising star, said "guys weren't ready to play" and were "going through the motions." Muhammad Wilkerson basically echoed Williams' sentiment. Imagine: Wilkerson made an impassioned speech before the game, imploring his teammates to win it for Bowles, who left a hospital to coach the game. If they were inspired by Bowles' toughness, it sure didn't show. Is the locker room dissension widespread? No, but a few bad apples can create the wrong perception. That happened in '94, and it cost Carroll his job. A couple of weeks ago, Bowles appeared safe, but he lost by 21 and 38 points to the Dolphins and Cheaters, respectively. Nothing irks owner Woody Johnson more than losing badly to division rivals. The Jets (4-11) were non-competitive against the mighty Cheaters. Eight of 11 starters on offense began the season as backups. They had no chance. Still, a 38-point loss is "inexcusable," as Bowles called it. Johnson didn't even make the game. Family obligation, the team said. Now what? If Johnson fires Bowles after only two seasons, he'd cast himself and the organization in an unflattering light. He'd be known as an owner who bails out at the first sign of adversity, and good luck trying to attract a top head-coaching candidate willing to work in that environment. Johnson is about to make one of the biggest decisions in his 16 years of ownership. He can be a strong leader and recommit to Bowles and general manager Mike Maccagnan, expressing dissatisfaction with 2016 but also showing he's a man of his convictions. After all, the Jets won 10 games last season; it's not as if MacBowles is a two-year bust. Or Johnson can make himself into an early-days George Steinbrenner, impatient and cartoonish, tossing Bowles and/or Maccagnan into the dumpster marked "John Idzik." Unless Johnson can pull Nick Saban out of a magic hat, he won't find a savior out there. Hess got antsy 22 years ago, dumping Carroll if favor of Rich Kotite. How'd that work out? Bowles is having a rough year, but he has been undermined by horrific quarterback play, an old roster and an inordinate number of injuries. He's well-respected around the league, and you can bet he'd get interviews for head-coaching positions if the Jets put him on the market. Now Johnson has reached a crossroads in his ownership. He can change the perception by staying the course or doing what his predecessor did all those years ago. For Pete's sake, Woody, don't be swayed by the noise and few meaningless games.
UnitedWhofans Posted December 26, 2016 Share Posted December 26, 2016 10 hours ago, Sperm Edwards said: Depends on the process that follows. If it's to bring in someone unique (e.g. Harbaugh) who'd want total control, then you don't wait for the sake of waiting. If they're going to fire him and then commence their usual GM and HC search like the last 2 times, then I agree it's pointless. Particularly if the HC and GM hires are going to be simultaneous again. Nope. Let them both sink or swim together next year. If they finish 6-10 next year but there's an obvious reason to be optimistic due to a young roster looking like it's just barely starting to click, including an actual young QB emerging, then I'll be plenty happy. If another $30-60M is spent on more 30+ yr old short-term bandaids, resulting in an 8-8 finish by winning the final meaningless game of the season, then I'll be in favor of firing them both. Of course the way this league works, that type of improvement will buy both another year. I agree 100%. Unless Harbaugh wants to come here, keep Bowles. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Integrity28 Posted December 26, 2016 Share Posted December 26, 2016 23 hours ago, dbatesman said: The biggest problem with firing Bowles now, as @Sperm Edwards has pointed out, is that it probably buys Maccagnan at least 2-3 more years. Fire them both now or fire them both a year from now, but firing one now is dumb. Firing one and not the other is always stupid, Woody does it all the time. It's not a solution. It's cowardice. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jet Nut Posted December 26, 2016 Share Posted December 26, 2016 11 hours ago, Sperm Edwards said: The logic is that you make the move if JH is available now but isn't going to be available a year later. He's available when he's available and JH doesn't give a crap about the 2 vs 3 year window/timetable of alleged etiquette for giving a bad HC or GM 3 years apiece before moving on from either one. I am dead set against a new HC with Maccagnan returning as GM. I also think it's too early to fire both of them, given how quickly they fired Idzik, unless they had a unique/specific new hire in mind (like JH). Agree on part but I have no issue with Macc staying on and hiring another HC. For one I like his approach and he needs to be allowed to stick with that plan. He was exec of the year and is highly regarded. We'd be firing a GM who we don't know is incapable because you have to give a draft more than a year to rate. I have no problem with the thought process that went behind his signings given where we were at the time and where it took us. I don't see 10-6 a failure because it was the freaky season where that didn't get us into the playoffs. For all the moaning about Revis and Mo he needed a cab and got one really good season out of him. Don't know what the falloff is due to at this point but still, was a signing that made perfect sense. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
joewilly12 Posted December 26, 2016 Share Posted December 26, 2016 19 hours ago, JohnJ said: Don't let that stop you from posting any of Mehta's drivel tho FYI I didn't start this thread. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
joewilly12 Posted December 26, 2016 Share Posted December 26, 2016 19 hours ago, JohnJ said: Don't let that stop you from posting any of Mehta's drivel tho FYI I didn't start this thread. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
joewilly12 Posted December 26, 2016 Share Posted December 26, 2016 19 hours ago, JohnJ said: Don't let that stop you from posting any of Mehta's drivel tho FYI I didn't start this thread. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
joewilly12 Posted December 26, 2016 Share Posted December 26, 2016 19 hours ago, JohnJ said: Don't let that stop you from posting any of Mehta's drivel tho FYI I didn't start this thread. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
joewilly12 Posted December 26, 2016 Share Posted December 26, 2016 Dont know why that posted all those times? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pac Posted December 26, 2016 Share Posted December 26, 2016 1 hour ago, Integrity28 said: Firing one and not the other is always stupid, Woody does it all the time. It's not a solution. It's cowardice. Wrong. You keep Macc who has completely revamped the scouting department and FO and let him pick his own coach. Oh yeah and you make him the coaches boss. The arranged marriage that Macc and Bowles were forced into was awkward and a big part of the problem. I trust Macc way more than Bowles. Let him pick his coach. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DMan77 Posted December 26, 2016 Share Posted December 26, 2016 3 hours ago, Pac said: Wrong. You keep Macc who has completely revamped the scouting department and FO and let him pick his own coach. Oh yeah and you make him the coaches boss. The arranged marriage that Macc and Bowles were forced into was awkward and a big part of the problem. I trust Macc way more than Bowles. Let him pick his coach. This is a hard thing... But I do believe that the GM should be given a longer leash than a coach... I think it takes a GM 3-4 years to build things... Not just the roster, but to also get the people they want into place... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JohnJ Posted December 26, 2016 Share Posted December 26, 2016 59 minutes ago, joewilly12 said: FYI I didn't start this thread. FYI: no sh!t Sherlock Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shevys Posted December 26, 2016 Share Posted December 26, 2016 On 12/25/2016 at 9:26 AM, UnitedWhofans said: This year the Cubs won the World Series and the city of Cleveland won a sports championship and Leicester City, who finished next to last the previous year, won the Premier League. The odds of sports suggest that the Jets will win eventually, unless of course, it's fixed. You do realize it was over 100 years since the Cubs last won, right? How many "next seasons" do you think we all have? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sperm Edwards Posted December 26, 2016 Share Posted December 26, 2016 7 hours ago, Jet Nut said: Agree on part but I have no issue with Macc staying on and hiring another HC. For one I like his approach and he needs to be allowed to stick with that plan. He was exec of the year and is highly regarded. We'd be firing a GM who we don't know is incapable because you have to give a draft more than a year to rate. I have no problem with the thought process that went behind his signings given where we were at the time and where it took us. I don't see 10-6 a failure because it was the freaky season where that didn't get us into the playoffs. For all the moaning about Revis and Mo he needed a cab and got one really good season out of him. Don't know what the falloff is due to at this point but still, was a signing that made perfect sense. People keep saying he's highly regarded but there is no actual basis for this. Virtually any time he tries to do more than a low-level trade he gets the phone hung up on him. The only successful trades he's pulled off thus far are for players the former team badly wanted off the payroll (Marshall, Fitz, Clady). He is a total amateur. Any difficult transaction blew up in his face. This isn't even everything, but in no particular order: tried to trade up to #1 in the 2016 draft tried to trade up to #2 in the 2016 draft tried to trade up as high as #7-8, and at least at #10 for sure, in the 2016 draft for Tunsil tried to trade down from #6 in the 2015 draft tried to trade Mo for a pair of #1 picks in 2015 tried to trade Mo for a lone #1 pick in 2016 (or then, it would seem, the trade value of a #1 pick during the draft) tried to trade Sheldon for a #1 pick midseason in 2016 tried to sign Fitzpatrick to a 3 yr deal in Feb-Mar 2016, worth as much as $36m (and in doing so, set the market absurdly high for Fitz after waiting until the season ended to begin serious re-signing negotiations). He was only saved from this even-worse contract by Fitzpatrick's own foolishness. tried to trade Geno at the end of the 2016 summer & blew it, despite reportedly receiving at least "soft" interest tried to pick up a 2nd round pick for Snacks in 2015. Then waited until the 2015 season ended, after which he asked if Snacks would take a below-market rate in the weeks before he was about to become a UFA (no incentive for Snacks to bite early since the injury risk had now passed) tried to get Ferguson to take a $6M pay cut, but incompetently waited until a week into April to give him this ultimatum, after trying and failing to sign a replacement LT for the past month. He's delusional, and despite failing all over the place, seems to think he's smarter and more savvy than everyone else in the league. As much as anything, he was gifted an offer of Brandon Marshall for a 5th round pick early on in his tenure, and his actions since then suggest he took that to mean he was a great string-puller who could orchestrate lopsided trades to anyone he called on the phone. Except everyone isn't as dumb as he is, nor as dumb as he thinks they are, and he gets doors slammed in his face more than he pulls off actual deals. So from where I'm sitting, other GMs in the NFL, as well as agents and players, most certainly do not respect him. Maybe a couple of Jets fans respect him for some reason, I suppose, but there's no evidence that he is right now well-regarded around the league. He got an award because Ryan Fitzpatrick faced a joke of a schedule, and it was year 1 of the disastrous contracts he dolled out. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dbatesman Posted December 26, 2016 Share Posted December 26, 2016 56 minutes ago, Pac said: Wrong. You keep Macc who has completely revamped the scouting department and FO and let him pick his own coach. Oh yeah and you make him the coaches boss. The arranged marriage that Macc and Bowles were forced into was awkward and a big part of the problem. I trust Macc way more than Bowles. Let him pick his coach. This post is the best evidence yet that Maccagnan should be fired immediately. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pac Posted December 26, 2016 Share Posted December 26, 2016 15 minutes ago, Sperm Edwards said: People keep saying he's highly regarded but there is no actual basis for this. Virtually any time he tries to do more than a low-level trade he gets the phone hung up on him. The only successful trades he's pulled off thus far are for players the former team badly wanted off the payroll (Marshall, Fitz, Clady). He is a total amateur. Any difficult transaction blew up in his face. This isn't even everything, but in no particular order: tried to trade up to #1 in the 2016 draft tried to trade up to #2 in the 2016 draft tried to trade up as high as #7-8, and at least at #10 for sure, in the 2016 draft for Tunsil tried to trade down from #6 in the 2015 draft tried to trade Mo for a pair of #1 picks in 2015 tried to trade Mo for a lone #1 pick in 2016 (or then, it would seem, the trade value of a #1 pick during the draft) tried to trade Sheldon for a #1 pick midseason in 2016 tried to sign Fitzpatrick to a 3 yr deal in Feb-Mar 2016, worth as much as $36m (and in doing so, set the market absurdly high for Fitz after waiting until the season ended to begin serious re-signing negotiations). He was only saved from this even-worse contract by Fitzpatrick's own foolishness. tried to trade Geno at the end of the 2016 summer despite reportedly receiving at least "soft" interest tried to pick up a 2nd round pick for Snacks in 2015. Then waited until the 2015 season ended, after which he asked if Snacks would take a below-market rate in the weeks before he was about to become a UFA (no incentive for Snacks to bite early since the injury risk had now passed) tried to get Ferguson to take a $6M pay cut, but incompetently waited until a week into April to give him this ultimatum, after trying and failing to sign a replacement LT for the past month. He's delusional, and despite failing all over the place, seems to think he's smarter and more savvy than everyone else in the league. As much as anything, he was gifted an offer of Brandon Marshall for a 5th round pick early on in his tenure, and his actions since then suggest he took that to mean he was a great string-puller who could orchestrate lopsided trades to anyone he called on the phone. Except everyone isn't as dumb as he is, nor as dumb as he thinks they are, and he gets doors slammed in his face more than he pulls off actual deals. So from where I'm sitting, other GMs in the NFL, as well as agents and players, most certainly do not respect him. Maybe a couple of Jets fans respect him for some reason, I suppose, but there's no evidence that he is right now well-regarded around the league. He got an award because Ryan Fitzpatrick faced a joke of a schedule, and it was year 1 of the disastrous contracts he dolled out. You're slamming him for making calls to check the price of trading up then deciding it was too costly? I think his reluctance to pay a kings ransom for anything less than a can't miss prospect is a virtue. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pac Posted December 26, 2016 Share Posted December 26, 2016 9 minutes ago, dbatesman said: This post is the best evidence yet that Maccagnan should be fired immediately. and this post is the best evidence yet that you're a homo. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rex-n-effect Posted December 26, 2016 Share Posted December 26, 2016 9 minutes ago, Sperm Edwards said: He is a total amateur. Any difficult transaction blew up in his face. This isn't even everything, but in no particular order: ... He's delusional, and despite failing all over the place, seems to think he's smarter and more savvy than everyone else in the league. As much as anything, he was gifted an offer of Brandon Marshall for a 5th round pick early on in his tenure, and his actions since then suggest he took that to mean he was a great string-puller who could orchestrate lopsided trades to anyone he called on the phone. Except everyone isn't as dumb as he is, nor as dumb as he thinks they are, and he gets doors slammed in his face more than he pulls off actual deals. Your list seems bad out of context but can only be fairly assessed in the context of what other GMs did in a similar time period with similar needs and assets. Outside of mid-round draft picks we had very little to trade other teams. You're pinning him with blame that other teams didn't want Geno or to overpay for a player on the DL. That has nothing to do with Macc and everything to do with other teams not wanting to overpay or accept our trash. Negotiating requires hearing no from the other side a lot. If your offers are not rejected at a high rate then you're probably offering too much. Those "attempts" to trade up may have been actual trade offers or they may have been calls to test the market to see what potential moves could be made. You can't criticize somebody for researching the market. Nobody has said he is a great dealmaker; but this is raking him over the coals for all the wrong reasons. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
UnitedWhofans Posted December 26, 2016 Share Posted December 26, 2016 Sperm has a beef with the GM. He seems to think GMs shouldn't be trying to get bargains and sell low. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tony The Wiz Posted December 26, 2016 Share Posted December 26, 2016 On 12/25/2016 at 10:56 AM, Jetsbb said: http://www.espn.com/blog/new-york-jets/post/_/id/65880/jets-coach-todd-bowles-is-reliving-the-old-pete-carroll-nightmare-sadly FOXBOROUGH, Mass. -- The debacle that unfolded Saturday was reminiscent of a long-ago Christmas Eve in 1994. The coach was Pete Carroll, and he got whacked after only one season because a couple of knuckleheads -- James Hasty and Brian Washington -- infected the locker room with their toxic attitude, creating a perception that the team had quit on Carroll. The New York Jets were awful down the stretch, culminating with an ugly loss in Houston on Dec. 24. Owner Leon Hess overreacted and fired Carroll, who has done quite nicely for himself. The same scenario is playing out for the current Jets, as Todd Bowles -- considered a rising star only a year ago -- is getting buried by a talent-thin team that seemingly isn't fighting for him. Not only did they get embarrassed by the New England Cheaters, 41-3, but they pointed fingers after the game, with some players questioning the effort. The locker room appears divided, with a couple of so-called stars -- Brandon Marshall and Sheldon Richardson -- in the forefront of the turmoil. Unwritten rule No. 1 in the NFL: If you want to get your coach fired, start bickering with each other and make comments about the team not trying hard enough. The players probably didn't do it on purpose, but they put Bowles squarely on the hot seat with one game remaining in this rotten season. If Bowles gets sacked, it'll be because of Saturday's mess -- on and off the field. Richardson, who should've been grateful he was allowed to play a week after his Snapchat fiasco, called out Marshall in the locker room. He went public with a simmering personal feud, creating another headache for Bowles, whose entire body ached in the aftermath of a kidney and gall-bladder attack. Wait, there was more. Leonard Williams, the team's most promising star, said "guys weren't ready to play" and were "going through the motions." Muhammad Wilkerson basically echoed Williams' sentiment. Imagine: Wilkerson made an impassioned speech before the game, imploring his teammates to win it for Bowles, who left a hospital to coach the game. If they were inspired by Bowles' toughness, it sure didn't show. Is the locker room dissension widespread? No, but a few bad apples can create the wrong perception. That happened in '94, and it cost Carroll his job. A couple of weeks ago, Bowles appeared safe, but he lost by 21 and 38 points to the Dolphins and Cheaters, respectively. Nothing irks owner Woody Johnson more than losing badly to division rivals. The Jets (4-11) were non-competitive against the mighty Cheaters. Eight of 11 starters on offense began the season as backups. They had no chance. Still, a 38-point loss is "inexcusable," as Bowles called it. Johnson didn't even make the game. Family obligation, the team said. Now what? If Johnson fires Bowles after only two seasons, he'd cast himself and the organization in an unflattering light. He'd be known as an owner who bails out at the first sign of adversity, and good luck trying to attract a top head-coaching candidate willing to work in that environment. Johnson is about to make one of the biggest decisions in his 16 years of ownership. He can be a strong leader and recommit to Bowles and general manager Mike Maccagnan, expressing dissatisfaction with 2016 but also showing he's a man of his convictions. After all, the Jets won 10 games last season; it's not as if MacBowles is a two-year bust. Or Johnson can make himself into an early-days George Steinbrenner, impatient and cartoonish, tossing Bowles and/or Maccagnan into the dumpster marked "John Idzik." Unless Johnson can pull Nick Saban out of a magic hat, he won't find a savior out there. Hess got antsy 22 years ago, dumping Carroll if favor of Rich Kotite. How'd that work out? Bowles is having a rough year, but he has been undermined by horrific quarterback play, an old roster and an inordinate number of injuries. He's well-respected around the league, and you can bet he'd get interviews for head-coaching positions if the Jets put him on the market. Now Johnson has reached a crossroads in his ownership. He can change the perception by staying the course or doing what his predecessor did all those years ago. For Pete's sake, Woody, don't be swayed by the noise and few meaningless games. Don't compare Carroll with Bowles. He was a highly successful college coach with USC. Bowles does not have that resume. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FOXBOROUGH, Mass. -- The debacle that unfolded Saturday was reminiscent of a long-ago Christmas Eve in 1994. The coach was Pete Carroll, and he got whacked after only one season because a couple of knuckleheads -- James Hasty and Brian Washington -- infected the locker room with their toxic attitude, creating a perception that the team had quit on Carroll. The New York Jets were awful down the stretch, culminating with an ugly loss in Houston on Dec. 24. Owner Leon Hess overreacted and fired Carroll, who has done quite nicely for himself. The same scenario is playing out for the current Jets, as Todd Bowles -- considered a rising star only a year ago -- is getting buried by a talent-thin team that seemingly isn't fighting for him. Not only did they get embarrassed by the New England Cheaters, 41-3, but they pointed fingers after the game, with some players questioning the effort. The locker room appears divided, with a couple of so-called stars -- Brandon Marshall and Sheldon Richardson -- in the forefront of the turmoil. Unwritten rule No. 1 in the NFL: If you want to get your coach fired, start bickering with each other and make comments about the team not trying hard enough. The players probably didn't do it on purpose, but they put Bowles squarely on the hot seat with one game remaining in this rotten season. If Bowles gets sacked, it'll be because of Saturday's mess -- on and off the field. Richardson, who should've been grateful he was allowed to play a week after his Snapchat fiasco, called out Marshall in the locker room. He went public with a simmering personal feud, creating another headache for Bowles, whose entire body ached in the aftermath of a kidney and gall-bladder attack. Wait, there was more. Leonard Williams, the team's most promising star, said "guys weren't ready to play" and were "going through the motions." Muhammad Wilkerson basically echoed Williams' sentiment. Imagine: Wilkerson made an impassioned speech before the game, imploring his teammates to win it for Bowles, who left a hospital to coach the game. If they were inspired by Bowles' toughness, it sure didn't show. Is the locker room dissension widespread? No, but a few bad apples can create the wrong perception. That happened in '94, and it cost Carroll his job. A couple of weeks ago, Bowles appeared safe, but he lost by 21 and 38 points to the Dolphins and Cheaters, respectively. Nothing irks owner Woody Johnson more than losing badly to division rivals. The Jets (4-11) were non-competitive against the mighty Cheaters. Eight of 11 starters on offense began the season as backups. They had no chance. Still, a 38-point loss is "inexcusable," as Bowles called it. Johnson didn't even make the game. Family obligation, the team said. Now what? If Johnson fires Bowles after only two seasons, he'd cast himself and the organization in an unflattering light. He'd be known as an owner who bails out at the first sign of adversity, and good luck trying to attract a top head-coaching candidate willing to work in that environment. Johnson is about to make one of the biggest decisions in his 16 years of ownership. He can be a strong leader and recommit to Bowles and general manager Mike Maccagnan, expressing dissatisfaction with 2016 but also showing he's a man of his convictions. After all, the Jets won 10 games last season; it's not as if MacBowles is a two-year bust. Or Johnson can make himself into an early-days George Steinbrenner, impatient and cartoonish, tossing Bowles and/or Maccagnan into the dumpster marked "John Idzik." Unless Johnson can pull Nick Saban out of a magic hat, he won't find a savior out there. Hess got antsy 22 years ago, dumping Carroll if favor of Rich Kotite. How'd that work out? Bowles is having a rough year, but he has been undermined by horrific quarterback play, an old roster and an inordinate number of injuries. He's well-respected around the league, and you can bet he'd get interviews for head-coaching positions if the Jets put him on the market. Now Johnson has reached a crossroads in his ownership. He can change the perception by staying the course or doing what his predecessor did all those years ago. For Pete's sake, Woody, don't be swayed by the noise and few meaningless games.
Unwritten rule No. 1 in the NFL: If you want to get your coach fired, start bickering with each other and make comments about the team not trying hard enough. The players probably didn't do it on purpose, but they put Bowles squarely on the hot seat with one game remaining in this rotten season. If Bowles gets sacked, it'll be because of Saturday's mess -- on and off the field. Richardson, who should've been grateful he was allowed to play a week after his Snapchat fiasco, called out Marshall in the locker room. He went public with a simmering personal feud, creating another headache for Bowles, whose entire body ached in the aftermath of a kidney and gall-bladder attack. Wait, there was more. Leonard Williams, the team's most promising star, said "guys weren't ready to play" and were "going through the motions." Muhammad Wilkerson basically echoed Williams' sentiment. Imagine: Wilkerson made an impassioned speech before the game, imploring his teammates to win it for Bowles, who left a hospital to coach the game. If they were inspired by Bowles' toughness, it sure didn't show. Is the locker room dissension widespread? No, but a few bad apples can create the wrong perception. That happened in '94, and it cost Carroll his job. A couple of weeks ago, Bowles appeared safe, but he lost by 21 and 38 points to the Dolphins and Cheaters, respectively. Nothing irks owner Woody Johnson more than losing badly to division rivals. The Jets (4-11) were non-competitive against the mighty Cheaters. Eight of 11 starters on offense began the season as backups. They had no chance. Still, a 38-point loss is "inexcusable," as Bowles called it. Johnson didn't even make the game. Family obligation, the team said. Now what? If Johnson fires Bowles after only two seasons, he'd cast himself and the organization in an unflattering light. He'd be known as an owner who bails out at the first sign of adversity, and good luck trying to attract a top head-coaching candidate willing to work in that environment. Johnson is about to make one of the biggest decisions in his 16 years of ownership. He can be a strong leader and recommit to Bowles and general manager Mike Maccagnan, expressing dissatisfaction with 2016 but also showing he's a man of his convictions. After all, the Jets won 10 games last season; it's not as if MacBowles is a two-year bust. Or Johnson can make himself into an early-days George Steinbrenner, impatient and cartoonish, tossing Bowles and/or Maccagnan into the dumpster marked "John Idzik." Unless Johnson can pull Nick Saban out of a magic hat, he won't find a savior out there. Hess got antsy 22 years ago, dumping Carroll if favor of Rich Kotite. How'd that work out? Bowles is having a rough year, but he has been undermined by horrific quarterback play, an old roster and an inordinate number of injuries. He's well-respected around the league, and you can bet he'd get interviews for head-coaching positions if the Jets put him on the market. Now Johnson has reached a crossroads in his ownership. He can change the perception by staying the course or doing what his predecessor did all those years ago. For Pete's sake, Woody, don't be swayed by the noise and few meaningless games.
Sperm Edwards Posted December 27, 2016 Share Posted December 27, 2016 5 hours ago, Pac said: You're slamming him for making calls to check the price of trading up then deciding it was too costly? I think his reluctance to pay a kings ransom for anything less than a can't miss prospect is a virtue. No, I'm slamming him for constantly coming up short in closing deals he covets because of his unrealistic demands, and for the Jets being worse off as a result. I'm also questioning this baseless idea that he is well respected around the league. There is neither evidence of this assertion, nor is there any credible reason to believe it's true. King's ransom? Check this out. He was supposedly super high on Tunsil (as was everyone before the social media picture posting), and was calling team after team to move up as early as the 7th pick when he started his fall. In no instance was MM willing to cough up even regular chart value. For a move up from #20 to #10, for a "can't miss" player that should have gone #1 overall, he drew a hard line in the sand of his lower 2nd round pick (the Hackenberg pick) and no more. Get this? In impossible fashion, Lady Luck intervened to dangle a huge gift for him at a premiere position of enormous need, but he wouldn't take this gift. Not to mention, by that time word had reached everyone that Tunsil's smoke picture was from years earlier, and was posted by someone trying to hurt him (as opposed to an hour or so earlier, when people thought it was a recent picture & that he'd posted it himself). Instead, MM got cute over the extra, requisite compensation he otherwise has no problem tossing away for short term bandaids. So for a premiere prospect he was willing to cough up over 95% of the necessary compensation, yet he balked at the other 5% needed to close the deal. News flash: if the trade up cost was a "king's ransom" then 95% of that is still a king's ransom. And if you're sitting at #20 and are inquiring about reading up to #1 and #2, it goes without saying the cost is going to be gargantuan and I'm quite sure he's aware of that. So much for yet another false premise about MM's alleged wisdom. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
southparkcpa Posted December 27, 2016 Share Posted December 27, 2016 On 12/25/2016 at 11:26 AM, UnitedWhofans said: This year the Cubs won the World Series and the city of Cleveland won a sports championship and Leicester City, who finished next to last the previous year, won the Premier League. The odds of sports suggest that the Jets will win eventually, unless of course, it's fixed. Bullshlt..... the Cubs, Red Sox and Cavs all won only after a MAJOR change in philosophy, management and coaching. The JETS have done nothing to come close to that. It has NOTHING to do with statistics or regression analysis. It's all management. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CrazyCarl40 Posted December 27, 2016 Share Posted December 27, 2016 3 hours ago, UnitedWhofans said: Sperm has a beef with the GM. He seems to think GMs shouldn't be trying to get bargains and sell low. Yes because it's that cut and dry. The GM has not inspired confidence in the majority of his moves. His decisions are highly questionable. I mean the majority of this board cries about the Fitz decision but then they're just meh about Macc? Give me a break. Of course GMs should find bargains and sell low. It's situational though. Sometimes you just trade a player to shake it up and remove a bad locker room presence. He just doesn't seem like he understands what the coach wants. Unless, of course, he is intentionally trying to submarine Bowles which would be worse. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
detectivekimble Posted December 27, 2016 Share Posted December 27, 2016 7 hours ago, Sperm Edwards said: People keep saying he's highly regarded but there is no actual basis for this. Virtually any time he tries to do more than a low-level trade he gets the phone hung up on him. The only successful trades he's pulled off thus far are for players the former team badly wanted off the payroll (Marshall, Fitz, Clady). He is a total amateur. Any difficult transaction blew up in his face. This isn't even everything, but in no particular order: tried to trade up to #1 in the 2016 draft tried to trade up to #2 in the 2016 draft tried to trade up as high as #7-8, and at least at #10 for sure, in the 2016 draft for Tunsil tried to trade down from #6 in the 2015 draft tried to trade Mo for a pair of #1 picks in 2015 tried to trade Mo for a lone #1 pick in 2016 (or then, it would seem, the trade value of a #1 pick during the draft) tried to trade Sheldon for a #1 pick midseason in 2016 tried to sign Fitzpatrick to a 3 yr deal in Feb-Mar 2016, worth as much as $36m (and in doing so, set the market absurdly high for Fitz after waiting until the season ended to begin serious re-signing negotiations). He was only saved from this even-worse contract by Fitzpatrick's own foolishness. tried to trade Geno at the end of the 2016 summer & blew it, despite reportedly receiving at least "soft" interest tried to pick up a 2nd round pick for Snacks in 2015. Then waited until the 2015 season ended, after which he asked if Snacks would take a below-market rate in the weeks before he was about to become a UFA (no incentive for Snacks to bite early since the injury risk had now passed) tried to get Ferguson to take a $6M pay cut, but incompetently waited until a week into April to give him this ultimatum, after trying and failing to sign a replacement LT for the past month. He's delusional, and despite failing all over the place, seems to think he's smarter and more savvy than everyone else in the league. As much as anything, he was gifted an offer of Brandon Marshall for a 5th round pick early on in his tenure, and his actions since then suggest he took that to mean he was a great string-puller who could orchestrate lopsided trades to anyone he called on the phone. Except everyone isn't as dumb as he is, nor as dumb as he thinks they are, and he gets doors slammed in his face more than he pulls off actual deals. So from where I'm sitting, other GMs in the NFL, as well as agents and players, most certainly do not respect him. Maybe a couple of Jets fans respect him for some reason, I suppose, but there's no evidence that he is right now well-regarded around the league. He got an award because Ryan Fitzpatrick faced a joke of a schedule, and it was year 1 of the disastrous contracts he dolled out. Not all of these are correct. He tried to trade up to #1 so that he could draft Goff. He didn't make an offer for #2, but did inquire about what it would take to move up there in the event that LA took Wentz and not Goff. He never had any interest in Wentz. He tried to get a #1 for Wilkerson, but no one was biting. He then tried to get a #2 for Wilkerson, but no one was biting on that either. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sperm Edwards Posted December 27, 2016 Share Posted December 27, 2016 6 hours ago, rex-n-effect said: Your list seems bad out of context but can only be fairly assessed in the context of what other GMs did in a similar time period with similar needs and assets. Outside of mid-round draft picks we had very little to trade other teams. You're pinning him with blame that other teams didn't want Geno or to overpay for a player on the DL. That has nothing to do with Macc and everything to do with other teams not wanting to overpay or accept our trash. Negotiating requires hearing no from the other side a lot. If your offers are not rejected at a high rate then you're probably offering too much. Those "attempts" to trade up may have been actual trade offers or they may have been calls to test the market to see what potential moves could be made. You can't criticize somebody for researching the market. Nobody has said he is a great dealmaker; but this is raking him over the coals for all the wrong reasons. The notion that he had nothing to offer other teams is totally untrue. He was sitting on 2 young, pro bowl DE/DTs and didn't need at least one of them. They had trade value - especially Mo - but it just wasn't the delusional value he demanded. He was shopping Mo around for 2 years. He was actively shopping Sheldon and eventually found an interested party in Dallas. Then Dallas caught wind of the minimum 1st round pick he was demanding and laughed in his face, calling his ludicrous opening demand a nonstarter. Even if it was low - and it surely was - Geno had some trade value (as multiple teams reportedly inquired). He turned them all down, and Lord only knows what ridiculous compensation he demanded in exchange for Geno. Now we'll get nothing. This wasn't "researching the market" as you'd like to make up & project onto his motives. If he keeps hearing nothing but "no" from all directions, it means it's his demands that are out of touch, not everyone else's. He holds onto assets he doesn't need and wants to deal away, with the hopes an even better deal comes up later. Since he'd get credit for gambling like that and winning, he deservedly gets blame for gambling like that and losing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ken Schroy Posted December 27, 2016 Share Posted December 27, 2016 I wouldn't have a problem with getting rid of Bowles and Mac. But that is NOT going to happen. I do think if Bowles loses big to Rex on Sunday that he will be fired. I can live with that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RoadFan Posted December 27, 2016 Share Posted December 27, 2016 7 hours ago, Sperm Edwards said: People keep saying he's highly regarded but there is no actual basis for this. Virtually any time he tries to do more than a low-level trade he gets the phone hung up on him. The only successful trades he's pulled off thus far are for players the former team badly wanted off the payroll (Marshall, Fitz, Clady). He is a total amateur. Any difficult transaction blew up in his face. This isn't even everything, but in no particular order: tried to trade up to #1 in the 2016 draft tried to trade up to #2 in the 2016 draft tried to trade up as high as #7-8, and at least at #10 for sure, in the 2016 draft for Tunsil tried to trade down from #6 in the 2015 draft tried to trade Mo for a pair of #1 picks in 2015 tried to trade Mo for a lone #1 pick in 2016 (or then, it would seem, the trade value of a #1 pick during the draft) tried to trade Sheldon for a #1 pick midseason in 2016 tried to sign Fitzpatrick to a 3 yr deal in Feb-Mar 2016, worth as much as $36m (and in doing so, set the market absurdly high for Fitz after waiting until the season ended to begin serious re-signing negotiations). He was only saved from this even-worse contract by Fitzpatrick's own foolishness. tried to trade Geno at the end of the 2016 summer & blew it, despite reportedly receiving at least "soft" interest tried to pick up a 2nd round pick for Snacks in 2015. Then waited until the 2015 season ended, after which he asked if Snacks would take a below-market rate in the weeks before he was about to become a UFA (no incentive for Snacks to bite early since the injury risk had now passed) tried to get Ferguson to take a $6M pay cut, but incompetently waited until a week into April to give him this ultimatum, after trying and failing to sign a replacement LT for the past month. He's delusional, and despite failing all over the place, seems to think he's smarter and more savvy than everyone else in the league. As much as anything, he was gifted an offer of Brandon Marshall for a 5th round pick early on in his tenure, and his actions since then suggest he took that to mean he was a great string-puller who could orchestrate lopsided trades to anyone he called on the phone. Except everyone isn't as dumb as he is, nor as dumb as he thinks they are, and he gets doors slammed in his face more than he pulls off actual deals. So from where I'm sitting, other GMs in the NFL, as well as agents and players, most certainly do not respect him. Maybe a couple of Jets fans respect him for some reason, I suppose, but there's no evidence that he is right now well-regarded around the league. He got an award because Ryan Fitzpatrick faced a joke of a schedule, and it was year 1 of the disastrous contracts he dolled out. Excellent post. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sperm Edwards Posted December 27, 2016 Share Posted December 27, 2016 23 minutes ago, detectivekimble said: Not all of these are correct. He tried to trade up to #1 so that he could draft Goff. He didn't make an offer for #2, but did inquire about what it would take to move up there in the event that LA took Wentz and not Goff. He never had any interest in Wentz. He tried to get a #1 for Wilkerson, but no one was biting. He then tried to get a #2 for Wilkerson, but no one was biting on that either. If you can provide a link to any rumor or leak that MM would have accepted a 2nd rounder for Mo I'd be interested in seeing that (I'm not being sarcastic; I'd really be interested in seeing that). Last I remember his final line in the sand was a minimum of a 1st round pick in 2016, which was itself a good amount lower than his demand for Mo a year earlier. Also when Cleveland was on the clock I'm pretty sure the Jets were reportedly among those calling them about a trade up. I'm not looking up live coverage to replay, but that is my recollection from draft day coverage. If not, frankly it paints an even worse picture of Maccagnan than I'd imagined. I'd forget what non-interest you think you heard re Mac/Wentz, because he was also reportedly very interested in Lynch, including possibly trading up to get him, and he then passed on Lynch with our original pick. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jason423 Posted December 27, 2016 Share Posted December 27, 2016 Im not sure that those similarties really exist between the two coaches. Part of the big issue with canning Pete was the feeling he wasnt really professional enough with the players. Basically his whole mantra was all about having fun with basketball courts, bowling trips, and so on. When the Jets began to sink I think ownership was looking for some reaction on his part to say it wasnt ok, but more likely he was busy playing pickup games of basketball when it would hve been expected that a coach would be prepping for games and drilling his players down. I dont think any of that applies to Bowles. Bowles is coaching a bad team all of whom have checked out on him. If Bowles gets fired its strictly because he has been a bad football coach. Im not sure that there is anything that anyone can bring up that contradicts that either. I dont think firing him puts Woody or the Jets in Steinbrenner mode where you cant get anyone to come here. While Johnson had a quick trigger with Mangini he gave Rex a million years here and didnt even want to get rid of Herm when Herm was doing everything under the sun to get out of his contract so he could take over what he felt was a better team in Kansas City. Before Idzik he gave Bradway and Tannenbaum a million years and if he didnt need a fall guy for 2012 probably would have kept Tannebaum. If the Jets job isnt attractive its because of the management structure. I do think that there is a feeling that Woody and his guys dont know a great deal about football but still want to get involved. That leads to the coach generally getting direct contat with the owner all the time and the GMs being put in a position to potentially make some contract decisions they may not have wanted to do. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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