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Would YOU fire Bowles?


Sarge4Tide

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  1. 1. Do you fire Jets Coach Todd Bowles after the Buffalo game?

    • YES
      106
    • Don't Know / Undecided
      13
    • NO
      26


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This is a tough one. If he comes back, there has to be significant progress next season - which I think is not a hard task because it cannot get any worse than this season.

If we fire him, it better be for a hard-nosed retread that learned from his last stint as head coach (Haley, Harbaugh?) or a blue chip first timer with the pedigree we are looking for (Shanahan?). No matter what the choice is, WE COMMIT TO HIM! Nothing gets better from constantly blowing things up. So I understand if we fire Bowles.... but whoever we bring in, he's the guy and he gets his contract to work through the kinks and get us back into the playoffs.

We need to cut the dead weight (Sheldon, Revis, Clady, Giacomini) and restructure some of our long-time Jets (Harris, Mangold... cut them if they don't restructure). Choose wisely in free agency/hit on a pick or two in the draft and this team will turn around in a hurry, no matter who the coach is.

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I said no, we keep Todd Bowles.  One, this team is basically going to be the Jaguars without a QB.  Except with incredibly impatient, overly sensitive, and judgmental fan base.

Two, who the hell do you replace him with?

Replace the assistants.  This train wreck hasn't hit bottom yet. No sense changing HC on the way down.

We need to play out 2017.  We are going to be near the worst team in the league. We have legit QB prospects from USC, & Wash, and Tx Tech probably coming out in 2018.

If we don't have a number of quality young players from the 2015-2017 drafts, then start all over with a veteran GM and the smartest offensive minded HC possible.  And not Josh McDaniel.  He is a blatant cheater that gets exposed when not under the protective wing of BB.

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My criteria is this:  Will the guy ever coach a super bowl winner?  Will he coach one in his next spot if another team hires him?  If both answers are no, and I think they are, then I fire Bowles now. I would keep Mac and give him a chance to hire his own coach.

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I don't know if Bowles is HC material. He may be good someday. As for his future with the Jets. It should end on next Monday. Why waste another year on this guy. I know it's not good to dump a Coach after a couple years but he needs to go. If the Jets are going to rebuild, start with the coaching staff. Rebuild from the top down to the players. If we rebuild with Bowles and he gets fired in 2018, it will push the rebuild back even further. New coaches with new players now!

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Bowles seems like a nice guy who built a solid reputation as as DC. Unfortunately his in game actions and decisions were an abomination throughout the season. He is is not a HC and our GM has similarly been unimpressive but the jury is still out on him. We need a new HC who will command the troops as well as direct the GM ala Bellicheat Parcells etc. Woody should bring in a "consultant" like a Parcells for the sole purpose of directing the overhaul of the operation with a veto power. 

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47 minutes ago, TheSage said:

Bowles seems like a nice guy who built a solid reputation as as DC. Unfortunately his in game actions and decisions were an abomination throughout the season. He is is not a HC and our GM has similarly been unimpressive but the jury is still out on him. We need a new HC who will command the troops as well as direct the GM ala Bellicheat Parcells etc. Woody should bring in a "consultant" like a Parcells for the sole purpose of directing the overhaul of the operation with a veto power. 

There is reputational harm to blow it up now, even though Bowles and his cronies look completely lost in trying to produce an NFL job.

Nothing gets better until Woody restructures.

It is also clear to me that Woody and Bowles were behind Macc' questionable draft picks and signings.

Let Macc and Bowles spend another year trying to fix it, but under the supervision of a Football Custodian.  I think if the three of them put their heads together, they will do a better job than the current three heads.

Tanny's undoing was Bradway, Woody and Rex.

Firing Bowles now is the easy way out.  The Jets need to work their way out of the mess they crested.

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1 hour ago, Kleckineau said:

I would have fired him at half time during the Pats game.

That time out before the half was the last nail in the coffin to me.

 

And don't forget the off-sides on the Cheaters during the kick-off when we had the ball on 28 then went to the 15 after the re-kick, which the play after that was the now famous " false start on everyone except the center"  which the ref had to bite his tough from laughing to make the call.

Right there I was embarrassed to be a Jet fan.

It's not that we're 4-11, it's how we got to 4-11.

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9 minutes ago, varjet said:

There is reputational harm to blow it up now, even though Bowles and his cronies look completely lost in trying to produce an NFL job.

Nothing gets better until Woody restructures.

It is also clear to me that Woody and Bowles were behind Macc' questionable draft picks and signings.

Let Macc and Bowles spend another year trying to fix it, but under the supervision of a Football Custodian.  I think if the three of them put their heads together, they will do a better job than the current three heads.

Tanny's undoing was Bradway, Woody and Rex.

Firing Bowles now is the easy way out.  The Jets need to work their way out of the mess they crested.

Even if Macs were to have an incredible draft of his choosing-do you or anyone else believe the current HC could take the ingredients and make an acceptable meal???

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30 minutes ago, TheSage said:

Even if Macs were to have an incredible draft of his choosing-do you or anyone else believe the current HC could take the ingredients and make an acceptable meal???

No, but he did go 10-6 last year.   Nobody respectable replaces Bowles.  

The solution here is not to replace the HC first.   They need to first the organization from the top.  

Woody is the NFL's designated sucker.  First he pays the headhunter for Idzik and then meddles and blames Idzik.

Then he hires Casserly and Wolf, then meddles and maybe throws another 1 or 2 guys under the bus.

Who wants to come to the Jets are ruin their career and reputation?

BB and BP were right.  Get away from this guy.   

The only way it gets better is if Bowles runs it into the ground and then Woody steps down, handing a top draft pick to the new Jets Football Czar.

 

 

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Yes i would fire him and normally I would say that two years is never enough for a hc to make his mark.

The simple fact for me is that he has done nothing well this year, not one thing and has done a lot of things very badly.  You have to have at least one thing to hang your hat on.

Was he a good in game coach?  No.

Does he have a handle on the team discipline and respect wise (Do his players want to play for him)?  No

Has he handled the QB situation well?  No.

Has he gotten the best or at least adequate play from key players?  No

Has he done a good job of coaching his specialty (In this case the defense)  No

He has not done even one thing that you need a head coach to do even adequately.

The one of the above list that is the worst thing for me?  His defensive coaching.  The defense is disorganization, easily read, poor play calls.  His one major attribute is a total travesty.  

He will be around for at least one if not two more years but his performance this year has been pure awful.  We can only hope he realizes that he has been awful in all areas and changes accordingly.

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37 minutes ago, varjet said:

Who wants to come to the Jets are ruin their career and reputation?

Anyone who believes in their own skill, wants the support of one of the NFL's largest and most starved fan bases, and would enjoy winning in the largest media market.

Not to mention a guy who realizes it's perfect timing to build a winner in the AFC East.  With Brady turning 40, there will soon be a big opportunity to take over the division.

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2 hours ago, docdhc said:

My criteria is this:  Will the guy ever coach a super bowl winner?  Will he coach one in his next spot if another team hires him?  If both answers are no, and I think they are, then I fire Bowles now. I would keep Mac and give him a chance to hire his own coach.

Interesting thought process:  Let's look at history:  Mangini given 2nd chance with Browns=Failed, Rex Ryan 2nd chance with Buffalo=Failed, Herman Edwards 2nd chance with K.C.=Failed

Of the coaches we had:  Pete Carrol and Belichek had success later in their careers.

Now let's look at guy's who are having success who are having success from other teams given a 2nd chance:  Andy Reid with K.C., Jack Del Rio with the Raiders, Gary Kubiak with Denver

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25 minutes ago, Mike135 said:

Anyone who believes in their own skill, wants the support of one of the NFL's largest and most starved fan bases, and would enjoy winning in the largest media market.

Not to mention a guy who realizes it's perfect timing to build a winner in the AFC East.  With Brady turning 40, there will soon be a big opportunity to take over the division.

+1 ... you build a winner for Jet fans and you will be treated like a god for the rest of your life.

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1 hour ago, Beerfish said:

He will be around for at least one if not two more years but his performance this year has been pure awful.  We can only hope he realizes that he has been awful in all areas and changes accordingly.

I agree with this part 1000%!!

It is hard to square Bowles' performance this year with his Assistant Coach of the Year award just two short years ago!

Amazing......

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I said no, we keep Todd Bowles.  One, this team is basically going to be the Jaguars without a QB.  Except with incredibly impatient, overly sensitive, and judgmental fan base.
Two, who the hell do you replace him with?
Replace the assistants.  This train wreck hasn't hit bottom yet. No sense changing HC on the way down.
We need to play out 2017.  We are going to be near the worst team in the league. We have legit QB prospects from USC, & Wash, and Tx Tech probably coming out in 2018.
If we don't have a number of quality young players from the 2015-2017 drafts, then start all over with a veteran GM and the smartest offensive minded HC possible.  And not Josh McDaniel.  He is a blatant cheater that gets exposed when not under the protective wing of BB.


Ok, so let's say we opt for the fire-the-assistants route. Do you let Bowles make those hires? He completely botched the DC and ST coach hires (I'll give the Gailey hire leeway, as he needed a veteran coach on the staff). Can we really trust him to hire a solid new set of assistants? If not, does Macc make that call?
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Absolutely, no doubt-for the worst football season in Jets history? absolutely. This team was out of it before September was even over, there was no fight in this team no chemistry, no nothin' good. Horrible offense, defense, and special teams. Even the 1-15 team had more fight than this one-just look at the scores between the two teams

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2 hours ago, Charlie Brown said:

I agree with this part 1000%!!

It is hard to square Bowles' performance this year with his Assistant Coach of the Year award just two short years ago!

Amazing......

Assistant coach of the year....please, save it.  He's proven to be a terrible leader, move on.

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28 minutes ago, deucebag said:

Assistant coach of the year....please, save it.  He's proven to be a terrible leader, move on.

Bowles was the Assistant Coach of the Year, that was in part one of the reasons why he was hired! 

Your post is unnecessarily inflammatory since there is nothing to move on from or "save" anything based upon what I initially posted

My post was not a defense of anything Bowles has done this year but rather a statement of fact.

Bowles has been in my opinion and I have said it before numerous times awful this year. Awful.  And for me it started when he refused to sit down Fitz even for a series when Fitz was throwing six (6) INTs in the Kansas City game. I believe Bowles lost some respect from the players, since he was calling them out and yet kept rolling with Fitz.  

Bowles by his actions and statements showed that he had zero faith in Smith and if that was the case why was Geno Smith even on the team?

If Smith was so bad that he couldn't get into the game in which the starter was horrific then when could he get in the game?  Bowles actions have led to zero accountability.  And IMO that dumb move(s) lead to Richardson calling out BM the other day and that kind of insanity can be linked directly to Bowles poor decision making and team management. 

Finally if you don't think performance recognized by one's peers such as the Assistant HC of the year award is a sufficient criteria for selecting a HC, I would like to know what you do think would be a reasonable and objective criterion around which to select the next HC?

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I usually give a head coach a chance like I did with Rex but this team has no life or will to be on the field and I don't think it will change next year. I don't think he is a head coach who takes charge of the whole team and leaves the offense to his coordinator even if it doesn't work. Some coaches are just coordinators and others do become a head coach.  

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4 hours ago, Jetsfan80 said:

 


Ok, so let's say we opt for the fire-the-assistants route. Do you let Bowles make those hires? He completely botched the DC and ST coach hires (I'll give the Gailey hire leeway, as he needed a veteran coach on the staff). Can we really trust him to hire a solid new set of assistants? If not, does Macc make that call?

 

I'm never a fan of 'fire the coordinators' and keep the HC approach...never...It's just the 'wrong' answer in most cases and most certainly in this case.  It's not like there are some facets of our team are performing admirably and just wanting to make some tweaks on just one side of the ball here...the whole operation on Sundays is pathetic.

What kind of coordinators are you going to get to come work with Bowles after this season?  The same kind Rex got when we tried that approach with him over the last few years he was here...you get the Marty Morningweg/Tony Sparano types who are also retreads, no different than Gailey.  Who's gonna come here knowing Bowles is gonna get sh*tcanned in 1 year barring a miraculous turn around?  Certainly no one of significance, or Bowles would have brought them in here in the first place.

It's time to stop doing stuff half-assed here...I would hope that Woody is already talking to some folks about the idea of establishing a proper hierarchy of leadership with the NYJ.  Get a football man with a philosophy, hire them and give them carte blanche to make changes/fire/hire.  Have them talk to the people on the inside, review tape, interview the coaches and players etc.  Stop acting on whim and emotions and newspaper writers opinions.

Simple fact: this time is there isn't a 'single coordinator' here that bears a disproportionate share of the blame...and if you have to fire them all, that's an indictment of the performance of the man in charge just as much as the guys you firing.

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Yes, without a doubt.  

The team is ill-prepared on a weekly basis.  Time management issues abound.  Starter decisions based in idiocy.  Lack of control in locker room.  Lack of development.  Lack of ingenuity.  Team constantly comes out of a time out with a horrible play.   Blow out losses.   They are what 4-12 against teams at or better than .500 in the last season?

I think the last thing I saw, that assured me I didn't want him back was in the Dolphins game.  Powell gets a first down, and the Dolphins challenge.  The whole challenge takes like 4 minutes, before they reverse the call.  Bowles calls a TO, after that break.  What the heck was he doing during the challenge?  Any good coach has a "if the play stands" call and "if the play is reversed" call.  There should be no doubt, and shock as to what to do when you have one of two outcomes and ample time to prepare for both.  It's like the 2 point conversion in Buffalo, where he just seems like an idiot out there at times.   

I don't buy into the coaches won't come if we keep firing people ideology.  There is only a limited amount of head coaching opportunities, especially in the biggest media market, I'm sure they'll come.  

I don't mind McCagnan quite as much, because I feel like there has been some good moves (some bad as well) because Marshall was a good pick up, the receivers were good pick ups, I liked Lee.  Obviously some things haven't worked out, but I'd rather he gets three more years without Bowles, then Bowles coming back to evaluate the GM for one more year.  In essence, I don't think the upgrade from Mac to ideal GM candidate available next year is worth the extra year of Bowles.   

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I won't argue with anyone who advocates getting rid of Bowles. Speaking for myself however I would give him another year if the team decides they want to go all in again and they fail then I get rid of him. If they decide to blow it up and rebuild then you obviously have to give him more than one year. 

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11 hours ago, varjet said:

N

Who wants to come to the Jets are ruin their career and reputation?

BB and BP were right.  Get away from this guy.   

The only way it gets better is if Bowles runs it into the ground and then Woody steps down, handing a top draft pick to the new Jets Football Czar.

 

 

This is the weakest argument ever. It has never held true. There are 32 positions for HC in the entire WORLD. Coaches do not turn them down. Maybe you do not lure Gruden out of retirement, but keeping Bowles because "no one will come here" is just dumb.

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16 hours ago, Jetsfan80 said:

 


Ok, so let's say we opt for the fire-the-assistants route. Do you let Bowles make those hires? He completely botched the DC and ST coach hires (I'll give the Gailey hire leeway, as he needed a veteran coach on the staff). Can we really trust him to hire a solid new set of assistants? If not, does Macc make that call?

 

Who are you going to replace him with?  He has had a bad year, yes.  Not his fault that the OL fell apart.  What other coach had any success with four starting OL on IR?

Not his fault that Revis lost a step.  It was obvious by first qtr of second game that Revis was no longer a man cover corner.  And let's face it, he's terrible as a zone corner.  Ask Tampa Bay.

No HC in the history of football could turnover this roster to win next year.  Let TB and Macc have next year to develop the players they drafted in 2015-2017.  The will likely bottom out.  If they decide to move on, the new regime will have likely a top  pick where multiple franchise QB prospects are coming out and have a ton of cap space.

Hiring a HC after this season means we aren't getting anyone good enough to get us competitive in our division.  And it means we sign a bunch of Jags to make us competitively 6 win team.  Not bad enough to solve our QB issues and not good enough for anything.

 

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On 12/25/2016 at 4:53 PM, Sarge4Tide said:

You are the owner of the Jets.  Would YOU fire Todd Bowles after the Buffalo game.  Not what you THINK will happen or what Woody SHOULD do, but if you were the owner what would you do?

I would have no choice with what I have seen this season but to give Bowles a pink slip and order Mac to hire a new HC and to clean house without restriction. At least these players would have to be removed from the equation as well - Skrine, Revis, Pryor, Richardson, Brandon Marshall (send him and Richardson to the same team ha) Clady, Giacomini, Fitzpatrick, Geno Smith.

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