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Brandon shell


Jets Daily Dosage.

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24 minutes ago, phill1c said:

FWIW, IMO

  • Skrine is playing out of position. He's a slot corner
  • Gilchrist is probably the worst FS in football.

The Chargers were one of the softest defenses in football when Gilchrist was starting there? That was a strange free agent grab. Guy is soft as charmin. They also redid Skrines contract so I think he's back albeit in a roll more suited to his strengths (nickel/dime slot).

Jets need to go after Gilmore from Buffalo. Love his toughness. I know Jet fans might lose their sh*t but don't be surprised in a sign Gilmore, draft Jabrill Peppers scenario. We have GOT to get tougher on the backend of our defense.

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19 minutes ago, Tinstar said:

But it is, and that's what the fans need to realize . Sometimes, before you can go forward, you have to take a step back .Last yr  we entered the season with an Old OL, no QB , issues at WR depth, issues at the TE position  and inexperience in the linebacking core . Due to injuries and our record, lots of young guys got playing time and experience and some have shown promise .

Last yrs OL :

LT -  Clady  -  over 32 and off injured

LG - Carpenter -  27 and solid

OC - Mangold - over 31 and off injured

RG : Brian Winters - huge question mark

RT : Rotational  -  injured Giacomini  was our fail safe .

Next yr potential OL :

LT - Who knows

LG - Carpenter - Solid

OC - Johnson - developing nicely

LG - Winters - developing nicely and needs a contract

RT : Shell : developing nicely

The TE position has some nice prospects in ASJ, Tomlinson and Bowman  compared to what we started with last yr

The WR core is young, fast, with a mixture of size and experience .

QB is still a mess, but what else is new .

The defensive line is in flux, but I think really solid . We have some young players that were injured early who showed promise

There are about 20 guys on our roster starters and vets who are over the age of 29  or at 29, and we can do without every single 1 .The team is changing and getting younger, and developing nicely . We're experiencing growing pains .

I guess this is the big problem I see - I agree, we should get rid of every one of them - and let the true rebuild begin.  

You pointed to 6 or 7 players that are "developing nicely" which is fine - but none at premium positions (CB, LT, Edge Rusher, QB) and none developing to be impact players (except Williams)

Moreover, this could have began two years ago - especially with cap room we had.    Two years ago we were in a better position to begin to rebuild the roster.  It was delayed under some false illusion of "competitive rebuild"

I'm sorry, but that's on the GM. 

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1 hour ago, DMan77 said:

Lee can make the jump, I really believe that... Shell will be in the spotlight too because of the pick it cost them this coming year... They'll be talking about him a lot this offseason when they review the Jets draft and mention why they don't have a 4th.

He has been getting help, but he's played the role really well... If they can adequately solve the RT position it opens them up to spend money and picks on other ends.

I'd love to see them get Cam Robinson in this draft... If you come out of back to back drafts with good starting RT and a good starting LT, that's a pretty good couple of years...

I think Cam is who they have their sights on.  

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39 minutes ago, C Mart said:

as reference.

"As the draft unfolded, the player slid to a point where we felt it would be worth investing and trading a [2017] fourth-round pick to get the player we liked in the fifth round," GM Mike Maccagnan explained. "We took the player now from an investment standpoint and gave up a fourth-round pick going forward.

"Some of that also had to do with the fact that we had compensatory picks that we’re projected to have next year after what happened in free agency. We’ll still potentially have a fourth-round pick next year that’s a compensatory pick. We just used it a little bit earlier this year. We didn’t actually trade the compensatory pick. We traded our actual draft pick we have in the fourth round next year."

Maccagnan thinks Shell has "a lot of ability and potential. We thought from a value standpoint where we took him was very good. He’s a big, long athletic offensive tackle who has the chance to potentially develop into a good backup, possibly a starter in time. He’s like a lot of players. He probably needs some work. We’re excited about where we took him and felt the investment for making the trade was well worthwhile."

http://www.newyorkjets.com/news/article-randylangefb/Jets-Trade-Up-Take-T-Brandon-Shell-in-Round-5/bd5a5107-7a3e-4771-9fc6-9b9793a72ca4

 

What I like about this is two-fold, it debunks all the crying from some here about how Mac doesn't understand comp picks - and it also shows that we have a GM that knows he has just as much responsibility to find #2 players at key positions, as he does #1 players... and he's not compelled to do it in order, but rather in the flow of when opportunity presents itself. Not every pick is going to be a stud, like some fans assume, but every pick can and should contribute. To have a mindset that you can secure your backup OT for a future 4th, knowing that you'll get a comp pick to replace it, is far more strategic than anything the Bradway/Tannenbaum regimes did for us.

 

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47 minutes ago, Maxman said:

I still think that was either on the center or Petty. The ball seemed to be snapped on an earlier count than anyone else realized. Neither tackle moved, that is just strange. Petty said it was his fault.

I think that was in reference to the preseason game where he whiffed on 2 defenders and got Petty's shoulder messed up.

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39 minutes ago, C Mart said:

WJohnson has taken blame..He had the wrong snap count

 

FLORHAM PARK, N.J. (AP) — Wesley Johnson watched his quarterback writhing on the turf and knew it was all his fault.

Bryce Petty was sandwiched last Saturday by Miami's Cameron Wake and Ndamukong Suh while throwing a pass in the New York Jets' 34-13 loss, suffering a bruised chest that looked to be a lot worse at first. X-rays and a CT scan were negative, and Petty will start Saturday at New England.

Petty, coach Todd Bowles and offensive coordinator Chan Gailey all called the play a "miscommunication," but Johnson shouldered the blame.

 

"I appreciate them all saying it was a 'miscommunication,' but yeah, I snapped it early," Johnson told The Associated Press on Thursday. "That's why none of the other guys were moving."

In replays, the ball is seen snapped by Johnson — starting in place of the injured Nick Mangold — to Petty, but the rest of the offense line doesn't appear ready to block . That left Wake and Suh with clear lanes to Petty in the backfield.

"That was a mistake that turned into a bad one," Johnson said. "It was on me"

Yeah, that's definitely why the standard is a bit higher for Cs more than the others (excluding LT).  The other OL get the snap count wrong and it's a false start, which sucks but isn't the worst thing to happen.  The C gets the snap count wrong and gets his QB killed.

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7 minutes ago, FidelioJet said:

I guess this is the big problem I see - I agree, we should get rid of every one of them - and let the true rebuild begin.  

You pointed to 6 or 7 players that are "developing nicely" which is fine - but none at premium positions (CB, LT, Edge Rusher, QB) and none developing to be impact players (except Williams)

Moreover, this could have began two years ago - especially with cap room we had.    Two years ago we were in a better position to begin to rebuild the roster.  It was delayed under some false illusion of "competitive rebuild"

I'm sorry, but that's on the GM. 

2 years ago we did begin the rebuild. 

Rebuild doesn't necessitate "dump everyone". No team does that. The Browns are a 1-win team, rebuilding again for like the 10th year in a row, and they still have Joe Thomas. Why? Because he's a good player, who still contributes. Why forfeit a good player who contributes, just because you need lots of other players? If the goal is to rebuild, a part of that is to assess where you're at, and what you need. Not just jettison everyone and start over. It's impossible to do that. You'd literally need 40+ draft picks in a 2 year window.

And the reality is this... players don't typically contribute at a high level their first 2 years. Unless they are special, like Leonard Williams. The reason we're a 4-win team is because of culture and an unprecedented amount of injuries. The roster is absolutely better now than it was 2 years ago. No question. 

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38 minutes ago, FidelioJet said:

Not to be argumentative but he took the team over with a massive amount of cap space and flexibility and, for the most part, doled out bad contracts to old vets. 

Next year this team is going to be awful - at least it should be as all bad actors the old, slow, vets need to be cut - and this team needs to start from scratch.   Marshall, Richardson, Mangold, Harris, Giacomini and Revis all need to be cut.  It didn't need to be this way had Mac managed free agency, the draft and cap in a more efficient way.

Next year's team is going to look very different personnel-wise. This is going to be an interesting offseason. 

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3 minutes ago, FidelioJet said:

I guess this is the big problem I see - I agree, we should get rid of every one of them - and let the true rebuild begin.  

You pointed to 6 or 7 players that are "developing nicely" which is fine - but none at premium positions (CB, LT, Edge Rusher, QB) and none developing to be impact players (except Williams)

Moreover, this could have began two years ago - especially with cap room we had.    Two years ago we were in a better position to begin to rebuild the roster.  It was delayed under some false illusion of "competitive rebuild"

I'm sorry, but that's on the GM. 

Two things ;

1 - you have to develop what you have and thus far we haven't been able to land that premier LT or QB or Edge rusher even thou we have tried . The GM tried to trade up for Wentz and then for the Tackle the Dolphins drafted . He just wasn't willing to give away all his draft picks to accomplish it .  It also depends on your definition of a Premium position  . OC, DT and SS are included in my along with most of the positions you mentioned . I don't include CB . 

2 - A 1st time GM and HC have to get off to a solid start to build credibility  for their programs . Imagine if this season followed a losing season last yr .  The best thing that that happen to Mac and Bowles was losing to the Bills last yr . Making the playoffs would have created even higher expectations than what was expected this yr . That game should have shown the fans just where this team was .

Last yr some guys got experience and it shows this season . Some guys got older and that showed also but it gave youngsters a chance to get gainful experience . The rebuild is happening before our very eyes, but it takes time .  It doesn't help when you draft talented players and they have poor character . I'm excusing Wilkerson this season because I think he was healthy, but next yr either he steps up or he's on the clock . Richardson is done here if I had any say . He acts the fool and hasn't even gotten paid yet .

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2 hours ago, Tinstar said:

What we need is to quit blaming the current regime for the last 40 years . It took 40 + years to create this mess, but a new regime is supposed to fix it in 1 yr . 

LOL "but they went 10-6 last season".... So you actually have faith that this regime can fix this absolute train wreck of a team? Sorry, I cannot fathom where one would find such optimism considering what has transpired here this past 4 months.

 

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53 minutes ago, FidelioJet said:

Not to be argumentative but he took the team over with a massive amount of cap space and flexibility and, for the most part, doled out bad contracts to old vets. 

Next year this team is going to be awful - at least it should be as all bad actors the old, slow, vets need to be cut - and this team needs to start from scratch.   Marshall, Richardson, Mangold, Harris, Giacomini and Revis all need to be cut.  It didn't need to be this way had Mac managed free agency, the draft and cap in a more efficient way.

And, this year, after he jettisons the bad/old vets, he will have a ton of cap space and flexibility AGAIN. This team had a ton of holes when he took over and a very old team. He filled holes with vets - and it worked the first year. Meanwhile, some of the players got older and slower. Fortunately, most of the guys he signed were with 2 year deals.

Mangold and Brick got too old. Harris is getting up there. Pace got too old.

Fortunately, we rebuilt our WR corp and have some young players that are getting experience. It was a huge weakness, not it has potential. We have added depth to LB and likely have 2 new starters in Lee and Jenkins.

As to be expected, OL and secondary are still huge weaknesses. He will get rid of some expensive contracts, and have to resign some FAs to fill the holes until the rookies are ready and he can draft some more. Hopefully he finds another quality starter (like he did with Carpenter) or two, and he will sign some fill in the gaps types. But, you cannot replace the entire team in an offseason or two. You can play only so many rookies as they need to be surrounded with veteran players to help them grow. His drafting may not have been great, but it certainly is showing some promise. I am not sure how much you expected. We have drafted too little or too poorly for the past 4-6 years. It took its toll.

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59 minutes ago, SR24 said:

This might be a perfect draft to trade down a bit to grab Robinson however there are quit a few high end free agent olineman available idk how mac does it but he's got to get this oline rebuilt

Robinson is rising a lot in recent mocks... I was looking at some early mocks, and then a few from the last few weeks and he's creeping into the top 10... So it may not end up being a huge reach to grab him... I think they'll take a CB if there's one on the board, but I would love Robinson.

And I'm 100% with you. I'm going to yell it in every thread I can from now until the end of the offseason... They need to keep building that line... I like our guards and I like shell. I think we need depth at guard and maybe need to grab a young C to start developing... I want a strong LT and some solid depth pieces and I'll be one happy fan... I think a strong line completely changes the dynamic of this team and their chances next year... It might not be flashy, but with a top 5 OL the Jets are a competitive team, even if they somehow don't address their other issues... I have little doubt about that. It makes such a massive difference. 

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1 minute ago, ASH1962 said:

LOL "but they went 10-6 last season".... So you actually have faith that this regime can fix this absolute train wreck of a team? Sorry, I cannot fathom where one would find such optimism considering what has transpired here this past 4 months.

 

A harder schedule; Brick retiring; Mangold getting another year older. Pace getting too old. 11 starters on IR (12 now that Petty is gone - I think), 3rd string OL starting, Fitz choking. Is it really hard to see why this year sucked so much?

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2 minutes ago, ASH1962 said:

LOL "but they went 10-6 last season".... So you actually have faith that this regime can fix this absolute train wreck of a team? Sorry, I cannot fathom where one would find such optimism considering what has transpired here this past 4 months.

 

The Jets have some talent to be competitive... They need to just half-plug a few holes and they can be an ok team... Not saying they're going 16-0, but they can play much better next season if they get another piece or two on the OL and bring in a halfway decent CB.

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1 hour ago, C Mart said:

and '15 draft...Harrison washed out..Smith are Petty are still TBD. However, it seems so far MM hit on Leo, Mauldin and Simon

In 2 drafts, This GM has added some talent to this roster  and has followed it up with some nice free agents . Any draft picks that haven't panned out can easily be replaced by players we have added via free agency or off wavers . What we need to find is a QB and a LT and I think we will be on our way .Personally, I would use our 1st rounder to try and acquire either the edge rusher or the tackle and then a trade of Richardson and our 2nd to move up and  grab the other position .  As of this posting I am targeting 3 players  and all 3 are from what I consider premium positions .

LT - Ryan Ramzcyk - Wisconsin

ER - Myles Garrett - A&M  - not one of my favorites

SS - Jabril Peppers - Michigan - Don't really want to do this   

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1 minute ago, Tinstar said:

In 2 drafts, This GM has added some talent to this roster  and has followed it up with some nice free agents . Any draft picks that haven't panned out can easily be replaced by players we have added via free agency or off wavers . What we need to find is a QB and a LT and I think we will be on our way .Personally, I would use our 1st rounder to try and acquire either the edge rusher or the tackle and then a trade of Richardson and our 2nd to move up and  grab the other position .  As of this posting I am targeting 3 players  and all 3 are from what I consider premium positions .

LT - Ryan Ramzcyk - Wisconsin

ER - Myles Garrett - A&M  - not one of my favorites

SS - Jabril Peppers - Michigan - Don't really want to do this   

Garrett and Peppers are worth a high pick but no LT in this draft is worth that high pick. 

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30 minutes ago, ASH1962 said:

LOL "but they went 10-6 last season".... So you actually have faith that this regime can fix this absolute train wreck of a team? Sorry, I cannot fathom where one would find such optimism considering what has transpired here this past 4 months.

 

It had to happen . Once Brick retired, the rest of the house had to get torn down, but in such a way that reasonable people could understand . Half this board hates a Jet player today because he said that the players including himself should be embarrassed by their performance in New England .

You people need perspective . 

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1 hour ago, FidelioJet said:

Not to be argumentative but he took the team over with a massive amount of cap space and flexibility and, for the most part, doled out bad contracts to old vets. 

Next year this team is going to be awful - at least it should be as all bad actors the old, slow, vets need to be cut - and this team needs to start from scratch.   Marshall, Richardson, Mangold, Harris, Giacomini and Revis all need to be cut.  It didn't need to be this way had Mac managed free agency, the draft and cap in a more efficient way.

I believe he thought it did need to be that way in order to keep his job.

He saw what happened to Idzik.

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1 minute ago, UnitedWhofans said:

I believe he thought it did need to be that way in order to keep his job.

+1 and he managed free agency in a way that if those players didn't perform, they were curable after 2 years.... see a lot of the veterans that will be cut in the coming months.

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46 minutes ago, Scott Dierking said:

I read that the Jets used 73, SEVENTY THREE players this year. The record, since 1993 is 75. 

I know it is against the rank and file here to look at reasons, but the Jets have been a turnstile of players this year.

they juggled the bottom of the roster a lot because they initially had 4 QB's on the roster, but the injury bug definitley evened out this year, they have been lucky in some years

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45 minutes ago, ASH1962 said:

LOL "but they went 10-6 last season".... So you actually have faith that this regime can fix this absolute train wreck of a team? Sorry, I cannot fathom where one would find such optimism considering what has transpired here this past 4 months.

 

What makes you think they won't? 

And what makes you think they are a trainwreck? I had them winning only 7 games this year

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12 minutes ago, bitonti said:

Garrett and Peppers are worth a high pick but no LT in this draft is worth that high pick. 

I agree Bit, but the problem I have is I don't see the guy I want making it to the 2nd round .  I would love to trade my #5 pick and Sheldon Richardson to the Browns for their #10  pick in the 1st and their 2nd round pick .  If not, I'm picking Ramczyk  and be done with it provided Garrett is gone .

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1 hour ago, Tinstar said:

I agree Bit, but the problem I have is I don't see the guy I want making it to the 2nd round .  I would love to trade my #5 pick and Sheldon Richardson to the Browns for their #10  pick in the 1st and their 2nd round pick .  If not, I'm picking Ramczyk  and be done with it provided Garrett is gone .

Garrett will be a top 3 pick, ramczyk has late first round grade. Best value at 5-6 will probably be corner I think. 

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2 minutes ago, Barkus said:

Garrett will be a top 3 pick, ramczyk has late first round grade. Best value at 5-6 will probably be corner I think. 

Are you familiar with the name Lane Johnson, where he was projected about this time prior to the draft and where he got drafted ?

I like Ramczyk, and I think, provided that his medical checks out, that he's going to be a LT for someone for 10 yrs   barring injury. I would like that someone to be the Jets .

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Gents, this is one of the best and thought provoking threads I've read in a while, especially among all the anger lately. Well done,

I like the ideas that are being provided here and opinions/ideas going forward on what might happen and options that the GM may pursue.

I've follow Shell with interest since the draft cause of the fact they used a draft pick from next year to acquire him seemed to show they saw him as a long term contributor if developed correctly. So far I think he's been a good 4th round pick with clear potential to be here for quite some time.

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