Poll: Your best guess - If Bill Belichick stayed on with the Jets after Parcells, would the Jets have had a Patriot-like Dynasty?

[TuscanyTile2]

Personally I think we would have.

[The Crusher]

Haha. No. 

[JetsFanatic]

Belichick was 5-11 in 2000 and started 1-3 in 2001, if not for Bledsoe's injury Belichick would have been fired by NE after the 2001 season.

[chirorob]

All the people BB used to build the team went with him to the Pats.

The GM, Weiss, Romeo.  He took them all, we had to make the Linebacker Coach the HC.

[Larz]

does he get ernie ?  why does everyone think the credit goes to belicheat and shady brady ?

no other team in the NFL has a "research" department, lol

[Tinstar]

No .

[Joe W. Namath]

Yes.  Bellchek is the best ever.

[Happy Clouds]

Belichick is a great coach. True, he wouldn't have had Brady, so it would have been much more difficult. I think if he were given enough time to work his magic, he could have succeeded here as well.  The question is, would he have been given enough time? 

 Dynasty? Who really knows? However, I think he could have at least made us a consistent winner.

[flgreen]

If he drafted Brady with the Jets,,,,,Yes

[j4jets]

No chance. Belichick gets too much credit for a man who was fired from several places and has never had any success without Brady. 

[newyorkjetfan]

Unfortunately we will never know. Would have liked to see how it turned out. I do think the stars were perfectly aligned. Brady is a big reason.


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[CotcheryifyouCan]

no.

[rex-n-effect]

Doubtful, especially if he doesn't get Brady.

I don't think Woody would have given over the kind of control Belichick wanted over the team. Kraft is a much stronger element of his team's success than Woody has been for his. 

A lot of the perennial success of that team comes from having a strong franchise QB that elevates the team. Like other teams with a franchise QB it's easy to build the other positions through draft and FA and players want to play on a team that wins. 

Even if we drafted Brady I still don't know if the front office gives him the support NE has. We probably would have at least a couple SB wins but maybe not as many. I think the same could be said of Brady plus almost any decent HC in the league. Not sure Woody could keep any around.

[New York Mick]

Does this include Brady and the crew of cheaters they have working for them? If yes then yes in no then no. 

[Jets0712]

I don't think so. We couldn't win with BIG BILL. Maybe we get to 4 a f c championships with little bill obviously lose them all. Would have been more heart breaking if you can believe that


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[SAR I]

3 hours ago, Joe W. Namath said:

Yes.  Bellchek is the best ever.

Agreed, and it's partially because the standard is so low. 

It's no surprise that guys like Coughlin and Belichick cut from the Parcells cloth were the last of their generation, the last with the balls it takes to play football like men, to take big risks, to sign hard workers, to cut lazy talent, they won 6 of 10 Super Bowl's played at one point.

There is no doubt that if the Jets had retained Belichick he'd have gotten the key coaches and key players that drove success in New England down here in New York to break through and win it at least once in the last sixteen years.

SAR I

[thadude]

Without Brady?  No

[rangerous]

11 hours ago, Larz said:

does he get ernie ?  why does everyone think the credit goes to belicheat and shady brady ?

no other team in the NFL has a "research" department, lol

maybe it's time the jets get one.

[rangerous]

7 hours ago, SAR I said:

Agreed, and it's partially because the standard is so low. 

It's no surprise that guys like Coughlin and Belichick cut from the Parcells cloth were the last of their generation, the last with the balls it takes to play football like men, to take big risks, to sign hard workers, to cut lazy talent, they won 6 of 10 Super Bowl's played at one point.

There is no doubt that if the Jets had retained Belichick he'd have gotten the key coaches and key players that drove success in New England down here in New York to break through and win it at least once in the last sixteen years.

SAR I

i don't think so because the jets just haven't ever had a qb last more than about 5 seasons.  it's not like they haven't been trying.  one thing the bellichicken has with the patsies is near full control.  anyone think woody would have given him the same carte blanche? woody would have just bought the team and would've been a little distrustful of a guy like bellichicken.  if he was able to last a few seasons i can see the team being very successful but until he got the qb it wouldn't be in a superbowl. one thing is for sure, he wouldn't tolerate the big mouths we see all too often on the ny sports scene.

[GKnight83]

I think Big Bill was the issue and Little Bill knew it.  With Parcell's between BB and WJ I see no dynasty possibilities.

[jdeacon]

Bill will probably be the best coach I will ever watch in my lifetime. Unless we lucked into Brady as well I doubt we see as many championships but I do believe we would be the dominate team in our division and have won a few SB's under his tutelage. The guy is just great, hate the cheating and the bs all you want but he is an incredibly good head coach

[loluchka80]

he would have been fired after 3 years

[long suffering jets fan]

13 hours ago, Joe W. Namath said:

Yes.  Bellchek is the best ever.

And not even close.  Given the time he would have gotten us there, there is no doubt in my mind.  Bill Belichick is the best first round pick ever.   And I feel we would have drafted Brady as well if he, Pioli, Weiss had stayed.  Belichick is a hands down winner.  Look at his roster when he got most of these players, they were no names.  Now they're household names. 

[Obrien2Toon]

12 hours ago, j4jets said:

No chance. Belichick gets too much credit for a man who was fired from several places and has never had any success without Brady. 

Every single other qb that he has put in there besides for Brady has been just about as successful as Brady 

[Dcat]

Only if the Jets draft Brady.  I do not believe that Belichick would be even close to the level of success he has attained without Brady.  Lucky 6th round pick changed the face of the AFCE and the NFL.  Otherwise the Pats would be the same as they always were.

[Dcat]

15 minutes ago, Obrien2Toon said:

Every single other qb that he has put in there besides for Brady has been just about as successful as Brady 

Certainly wasn't that way in Cleveland. The year that Cassel started, the Pats were a stacked team on both sides of the ball.  I was impressed with Garoppolo early this season.  Whichever team they trade him to will be very happy indeed.  Have their been any others?  Bledsoe was mediocre for Belichick and the Pats at best. They would have been around 8-8 with him each year.

[thadude]

Belichick without Brady has Al Groh's career

 

hes a great defensive play caller but having a GOAT Qb made his career

[thadude]

2 hours ago, Dcat said:

Certainly wasn't that way in Cleveland. The year that Cassel started, the Pats were a stacked team on both sides of the ball.  I was impressed with Garoppolo early this season.  Whichever team they trade him to will be very happy indeed.  Have their been any others?  Bledsoe was mediocre for Belichick and the Pats at best. They would have been around 8-8 with him each year.

Garropolo is the only good qb Belichick developed outside of Brady.  I will give him that

 

Cassel had a team that should have gone 19-0 the prior season.  Is he even in the nfl now?  What a bum.  Mallet was another hyped up loser.  Hoyer makes Fitz look good

[SAR I]

6 hours ago, rangerous said:

i don't think so because the jets just haven't ever had a qb last more than about 5 seasons.  it's not like they haven't been trying.  one thing the bellichicken has with the patsies is near full control.  anyone think woody would have given him the same carte blanche? woody would have just bought the team and would've been a little distrustful of a guy like bellichicken.  if he was able to last a few seasons i can see the team being very successful but until he got the qb it wouldn't be in a superbowl. one thing is for sure, he wouldn't tolerate the big mouths we see all too often on the ny sports scene.

He would have had Testaverde and Pennington in 2000, we got off to a 6-1 start without him, surely they were good enough to do far better under future Hall Of Famer Bill Belicick than nobody Al Groh, probably win the division, make a little noise in the playoffs.  But 2001, 2002, 2003, 2004, the division was ours for the taking if not for Belichick in New England, there were few dominant teams at that time.  Flip the script to Bill in New York, we'd have won at least one Championship.

SAR I

[rangerous]

5 minutes ago, SAR I said:

He would have had Testaverde and Pennington in 2000, we got off to a 6-1 start without him, surely they were good enough to do far better under future Hall Of Famer Bill Belicick than nobody Al Groh, probably win the division, make a little noise in the playoffs.  But 2001, 2002, 2003, 2004, the division was ours for the taking if not for Belichick in New England, there were few dominant teams at that time.  Flip the script to Bill in New York, we'd have won at least one Championship.

SAR I

i could see that happening.

[UntouchableCrew]

They don't turn into a "Patriots like dynasty" but I'd bet they'd be a very successful franchise with at least one Super Bowl win. You need to stumble into an all time great QB to get to where the Pats have.

[SAR I]

7 minutes ago, UntouchableCrew said:

They don't turn into a "Patriots like dynasty" but I'd bet they'd be a very successful franchise with at least one Super Bowl win. You need to stumble into an all time great QB to get to where the Pats have.

And I'll respectfully disagree.

The Patriots aren't amazing because of Tom Brady.  It's Bill Belichick.  If the Jets had their culture, if the Jets had their passion, if the Jets had their late-round drafting acumen, if the Jets had their sideline smarts, and if our owner had a GM/HC combo that he respected and left alone, we'd have the dynasty, not New England.  Take Belichick off the Patriots, they would be no better than the Jets these past 15 years, few wildcard berths, few playoff wins, revolving door at head coach.  It's who the Patriots were before Belichick arrived.

We will go to our graves with no Super Bowl championships because of one man who we let slip through our fingers.  To pretend that is not true won't do us any good.

SAR I

[UntouchableCrew]

Just now, SAR I said:

And I'll respectfully disagree.

The Patriots aren't amazing because of Tom Brady.  It's Bill Belichick.  If the Jets had their culture, if the Jets had their passion, if the Jets had their late-round drafting acumen, if the Jets had their sideline smarts, and if our owner had a GM/HC combo that he respected and left alone, we'd have the dynasty, not New England.  Take Belichick off the Patriots, they would be no better than the Jets these past 15 years, few wildcard berths, few playoff wins, revolving door at head coach.  It's who the Patriots were before Belichick arrived.

We will go to our graves with no Super Bowl championships because of one man who we let slip through our fingers.  To pretend that is not true won't do us any good.

SAR I

I 100% agree that Belichick made Brady and not the other way around, and have made this argument for years and years. I 100% agree that with Belichick as our HC/GM we are one of the better teams in the league and perennial playoff team with a SB to our name.

But their level of dominance is clearly based on the fact that they have both the GOAT coach and a first ballot Hall of Famer in Brady. Belichick simply couldn't do what he's done there with any old QB. Brady is one of the best and their unprecedented success is clearly linked to both of them.

I think your point about Belichick in 2001-04 with Testaverde/Pennington is a very interesting one. Really hard to know (we'd likely still need Penny to beat the Steelers in PIT) but I'd be curious how that would have played out. 

[detectivekimble]

38 minutes ago, SAR I said:

And I'll respectfully disagree.

The Patriots aren't amazing because of Tom Brady.  It's Bill Belichick.  If the Jets had their culture, if the Jets had their passion, if the Jets had their late-round drafting acumen, if the Jets had their sideline smarts, and if our owner had a GM/HC combo that he respected and left alone, we'd have the dynasty, not New England.  Take Belichick off the Patriots, they would be no better than the Jets these past 15 years, few wildcard berths, few playoff wins, revolving door at head coach.  It's who the Patriots were before Belichick arrived.

We will go to our graves with no Super Bowl championships because of one man who we let slip through our fingers.  To pretend that is not true won't do us any good.

SAR I

Wrong.  Belicheat was 5-13 in New England before Bledsoe went down.  What do you think happened, Belicheat learned suddenly learned how to coach after Bledsoe went down?  Give me a ******* break.  Belicheat also gave Bledsoe a $100 million extension before the 2001 season.  The guy is a lucky mother ****er.

Great QBs bring teams to Super Bowls.  Peyton Manning -- who wasn't as good as Brady -- went to a Super Bowl with four different coaches.  Jim Caldwell was 14-2 with Peyton Manning and 2-14 without him.  People would be calling him a great coach if he'd coached Peyton for 10 years.

[SAR I]

43 minutes ago, UntouchableCrew said:

I 100% agree that Belichick made Brady and not the other way around, and have made this argument for years and years. I 100% agree that with Belichick as our HC/GM we are one of the better teams in the league and perennial playoff team with a SB to our name.

But their level of dominance is clearly based on the fact that they have both the GOAT coach and a first ballot Hall of Famer in Brady. Belichick simply couldn't do what he's done there with any old QB. Brady is one of the best and their unprecedented success is clearly linked to both of them.

I think your point about Belichick in 2001-04 with Testaverde/Pennington is a very interesting one. Really hard to know (we'd likely still need Penny to beat the Steelers in PIT) but I'd be curious how that would have played out. 

Good post.  Agree, Brady unquestionably was a huge part of it but Belichick is the catalyst.  But interesting food for thought:

History shows us that a great quarterback with the wrong coach will bust but we've rarely seen a great quarterback carry a bad coach to glory.

Brett Favre was a terrible Atlanta Falcon, Steve Young was run out of town by Tampa Bay, Kurt Warner bagged groceries.  Might Chad Pennington have won 2 Super Bowls for the Jets with Bill Belichick or Tom Coughlin as his head coach?  Might Tom Brady been nothing more than a backup in New England with Al Groh, Herman Edwards, or Rex Ryan as his head coach?  I think the answer is yes.

SAR I