Report: Jets Decline Option on Clady, set to Become Free Agent

[UnitedWhofans]

Just now, Sperm Edwards said:

It would be pointless. 

Seriously, I don't see how you can translate a traded 5th round pick into a 4th round pick

[#27TheDominator]

8 minutes ago, Sperm Edwards said:

Yes, this is what I'm saying. It cost our 4th this year to replace the lost 5th last year. Fairly textbook trade on paper - a round higher the following year - but it was made necessary by the Clady trade in the first place. 

Looked at through that lens, the trade for Clady, to rent him for short term, cost us a 2nd round pick in 2019 lol. 

2020 1st rounder!   We should be at least 2 FO regimes from Bowles/Maccagnan by then!

3 minutes ago, UnitedWhofans said:

Seriously, I don't see how you can translate a traded 5th round pick into a 4th round pick

Pretty simple.  They traded their 4th to overpay Clady for being hurt.  When they wanted Brandon Shell in the 5th, they had to trade their 2017 4th rounder to get him (for literally the pick after the Clady pick).  Strange thing is the Broncos traded that pick for 6ths in 2016 and 2017, but it wasn't a far move to the Titans pick at the top of the 6th.

[UnitedWhofans]

6 minutes ago, #27TheDominator said:

Pretty simple.  They traded their 4th to overpay Clady for being hurt.  When they wanted Brandon Shell in the 5th, they had to trade their 2017 4th rounder to get him (for literally the pick after the Clady pick).  Strange thing is the Broncos traded that pick for 6ths in 2016 and 2017, but it wasn't a far move to the Titans pick at the top of the 6th.

Wait. Who traded their 4th? The Jets traded a 5th to get him

[Sperm Edwards]

[#27TheDominator]

1 minute ago, UnitedWhofans said:

Wait. Who traded their 4th? The Jets traded a 5th to get him

Dear Lord.  Read wikipedia.  The Jets traded their 2016 5th for Clady.  They were in love with Shell, so they traded their 4th in 2017 for the pick they used to draft Shell.  

Quote

1.  No. 157: multiple trades:
          No. 157: New York Jets → Denver (PD). NY Jets traded this selection to Denver in exchange for Denver's seventh-round selection (235th) and offensive tackle Ryan Clady.^{[source 31]}
          No. 157: Denver → Tennessee (D). Denver traded this selection and a seventh-round selection (253rd) in exchange for a sixth-round selection (176th) and a sixth-round selection in 2017.^{[source 32]}
2. Jump up^ No. 158: Washington → New York Jets (D). Washington traded this selection to the New York Jets in exchange for New York's fourth-round selection in 2017.^{[source 33]}

#reliablesource? 

Maybe not, but that is the way I remembered it anyway.

[Sperm Edwards]

17 minutes ago, #27TheDominator said:

2020 1st rounder!   We should be at least 2 FO regimes from Bowles/Maccagnan by then!

Pretty simple.  They traded their 4th to overpay Clady for being hurt.  When they wanted Brandon Shell in the 5th, they had to trade their 2017 4th rounder to get him (for literally the pick after the Clady pick).  Strange thing is the Broncos traded that pick for 6ths in 2016 and 2017, but it wasn't a far move to the Titans pick at the top of the 6th.

I was going to go so far as to make it a 1st, but I wanted to keep it in the realm of reality. Hee.

[UnitedWhofans]

1 minute ago, #27TheDominator said:

Dear Lord.  Read wikipedia.  The Jets traded their 2016 5th for Clady.  They were in love with Shell, so they traded their 4th in 2017 for the pick they used to draft Shell.  

#reliablesource? 

Maybe not, but that is the way I remembered it anyway.

OK. That's fine. But how are Brandon Shell and Ryan Clady related? How are those two trades related to each other?

They play two different positions

[#27TheDominator]

2 minutes ago, UnitedWhofans said:

OK. That's fine. But how are Brandon Shell and Ryan Clady related? How are those two trades related to each other?

They play two different positions

[UnitedWhofans]

Just now, #27TheDominator said:

Precisely what I feel right now. Shell is a RT. Clady is a LT. If Shell was intended to be backup for Clady only and not a starter at all, then I could understand it. Instead he became a starter by himself

[Freemanm]

Let's hope Mevis is next to go

[#27TheDominator]

14 minutes ago, UnitedWhofans said:

Precisely what I feel right now. Shell is a RT. Clady is a LT. If Shell was intended to be backup for Clady only and not a starter at all, then I could understand it. Instead he became a starter by himself

I did not know it,  but apparently I am a masochist, so I will try this again. 

If the Jets had not traded for Clady, they would have had their 5th round pick and could have chosen Shell.  They did not have their pick, but felt compelled to trade back into the 2016 5th.  That compulsion cost them their 2017 4th.  Thus, the trade for Clady cost them their 2017 4th round pick.  I will not take this any further, I will not draft charts and diagrams.  I will not use color coding.  I do not give a single **** which side of the line either played on.  If they had traded up for a CB, the point would be the same.  

[UnitedWhofans]

43 minutes ago, #27TheDominator said:

I did not know it,  but apparently I am a masochist, so I will try this again. 

If the Jets had not traded for Clady, they would have had their 5th round pick and could have chosen Shell.  They did not have their pick, but felt compelled to trade back into the 2016 5th.  That compulsion cost them their 2017 4th.  Thus, the trade for Clady cost them their 2017 4th round pick.  I will not take this any further, I will not draft charts and diagrams.  I will not use color coding.  I do not give a single **** which side of the line either played on.  If they had traded up for a CB, the point would be the same.  

That's the key sentence. That makes sense. 

However, as with most of Macc's moves, it's not going to affect the future much because they are going to get a 4th round pick anyway via the comp pick from Snacks, which was at risk for signing Jenkins. So at the end of the day, they will 7 picks as they had before. 8 picks would have been gravy, but 7 is fine too

So that kind of shows why I think Macc is better than Idzik and Tanny. He gets draft picks back in trades unlike Tanny and he can trade away extra picks, unlike Idzik who used them all and got nowhere, while not having a major consequence

[jamesr]

Dolphags are releasing Brandon Albert ... any chance we try to sign him as a viable starter for a few years?

[#27TheDominator]

2 minutes ago, UnitedWhofans said:

That's the key sentence. That makes sense. 

However, as with most of Macc's moves, it's not going to affect the future much because they are going to get a 4th round pick anyway via the comp pick from Jarvis Jenkins. So at the end of the day, they will 7 picks as they had before. 8 picks would have been gravy, but 7 is fine too

They didn't gain anything for Jarvis Jenkins, they risked losing the comp pick they would have gotten for Harrison by signing that stiff.  Hopefully, they cut Jenkins in time to still get the comp pick.  They lost Harrison, Ivory and Demario Davis and gained Jenkins, Forte and McClendon.  McClendon is the only one I would consider a need.

[UnitedWhofans]

2 minutes ago, #27TheDominator said:

They didn't gain anything for Jarvis Jenkins, they risked losing the comp pick they would have gotten for Harrison by signing that stiff.  Hopefully, they cut Jenkins in time to still get the comp pick.  They lost Harrison, Ivory and Demario Davis and gained Jenkins, Forte and McClendon.  McClendon is the only one I would consider a need.

http://overthecap.com/projecting-2017-compensatory-draft-picks/

Jets are projected a 4th round comp pick for Damon Harrison. And they did cut Jenkins in time . Signing Jenkins was one of the mistakes that is frontsight and hindsight. No argument there.

But once again, no damage at all to the future. I did edit my post accordingly, though. Thank you.

[#27TheDominator]

8 minutes ago, UnitedWhofans said:

http://overthecap.com/projecting-2017-compensatory-draft-picks/

Jets are projected a 4th round comp pick for Damon Harrison. And they did cut Jenkins in time . Signing Jenkins was one of the mistakes that is frontsight and hindsight. No argument there.

But once again, no damage at all to the future. I did edit my post accordingly, though. Thank you.

1. you are assuming that they cut him in time.  As stated in the article you cite, Nick says:  

Quote

Because neither Engram nor Favors qualified, I am projecting that Jenkins will not qualify either, but because it’s close enough there’s a chance I’m wrong and he might qualify.

We hope the Jets knew the parameters are are smart enough to cut that dead weight in time, but they carried Breno Giacomini on the PUP list even though cutting would have saved them close to $4M last year and $5M this year.  Money that gets pushed forward now. 

2. I will agree that the future is not destroyed, but the lack of a 4th, but "no damage at all"?  OF COURSE THERE WAS DAMAGE, THEY GAVE UP THEIR 2017 4th ROUNDER.  Their 4th rounder would have been at the top of the round, this pick will be after the 32nd pick in the 4th.  The difference in the draft value chart between #6 in the 4th round and the first comp pick is 49 points which is... you guessed it!  A 4TH ROUND PICK!  #27 in the round, higher than whatever comp pick they end up with and that is just the difference between the two picks, not the actual value of the pick they gave up since they should have both.  

[UnitedWhofans]

7 minutes ago, #27TheDominator said:

1. you are assuming that they cut him in time.  As stated in the article you cite, Nick says:  

We hope the Jets knew the parameters are are smart enough to cut that dead weight in time, but they carried Breno Giacomini on the PUP list even though cutting would have saved them close to $4M last year and $5M this year.  Money that gets pushed forward now. 

2. I will agree that the future is not destroyed, but the lack of a 4th, but "no damage"?  OF COURSE THERE WAS DAMAGE, THEY GAVE UP THEIR 2017 4th ROUNDER.

If you read the paragraph, he mentions two instances that they did not qualify. One in 2002 and one in 2009. That wording means that there could be instances where a team has qualified under those parameters. But that's just interpretation. The wording is weird

The other weird thing is that even though he says in text that he doesn't think they will qualify, he has them listed as getting the pick. It is also free on the comp pick cancellation chart. http://overthecap.com/compensatory-draft-picks-cancellation-chart/

And I remember at the time that Jenkins was cut, it was noted that he was cut in time to get the comp pick

As for your second point, if they do qualify they did give up a 4th round pick, but they will get a 4th round pick back. Net loss of zero.

 

[#27TheDominator]

34 minutes ago, UnitedWhofans said:

If you read the paragraph, he mentions two instances that they did not qualify. One in 2002 and one in 2009. That wording means that there could be instances where a team has qualified under those parameters. But that's just interpretation. The wording is weird

The other weird thing is that even though he says in text that he doesn't think they will qualify, he has them listed as getting the pick. It is also free on the comp pick cancellation chart. http://overthecap.com/compensatory-draft-picks-cancellation-chart/

As for your second point, if they do qualify they did give up a 4th round pick, but they will get a 4th round pick back. Net loss of zero.

 

I think you need to stop, take a breath and read everything again.  You are completely off.  If Jenkins qualifies they do not get the pick.  He cancels out the loss of Harrision.  If he doesn't qualify, he is not considered and the team gets the pick.  The writer  is not sure of the rules (no one outside the league does) and is making an assumption.  He is likely correct, but not sure.

As for your last paragraph, re-read my post.  If you still think giving up the #6 pick in 4th round for the #33 or higher pick in the 4th round is a "net loss of zero" take a logic class.  Furthermore, there is no reason (outside of 1/2 a season of Clady) they should not have BOTH their pick and the comp pick.  NET LOSS OF AROUND #102 OVERALL.  No wonder everybody wants to trade down.  You people think "Hey, we traded #6 overall for the last pick in the first round.  Net loss of zero."  

[UnitedWhofans]

7 minutes ago, #27TheDominator said:

I think you need to stop, take a breath and read everything again.  You are completely off.  If Jenkins qualifies they do not get the pick.  He cancels out the loss of Harrision.  If he doesn't qualify, he is not considered and the team gets the pick.  The writer does is not sure of the rules (no one outside the league does) and is making an assumption.  He is likely correct, but not sure.

As for your last paragraph, re-read my post.  If you still think giving up the #6 pick in 4th round for the #33 or higher pick in the 4th round is a "net loss of zero" take a logic class.  Furthermore, there is no reason (outside of 1/2 a season of Clady) they should not have BOTH their pick and the comp pick.  NET LOSS OF AROUND #102 OVERALL.  No wonder everybody wants to trade down.  You people think "Hey, we traded #6 overall for the last pick in the first round.  Net loss of zero."  

 As you say, in the first round, the difference in talent is massive. I couldn't say that it was a net loss of zero in the first round. But by the 4th round the talent level is meshed and more generic, save for the diamonds in the rough. So the difference is much less.

And I do acknowledge that having two 4's would be gravy. But it's gravy. It's a bonus.  At the very least, you want to maintain those 7 picks. He, I believe, will have done that. 

[#27TheDominator]

3 minutes ago, UnitedWhofans said:

 As you say, in the first round, the difference in talent is massive. I couldn't say that it was a net loss of zero in the first round. But by the 4th round the talent level is meshed and more generic, save for the diamonds in the rough. So the difference is much less.

And I do acknowledge that having two 4's would be gravy. But it's gravy. It's a bonus.  At the very least, you want to maintain those 7 picks. He, I believe, will have done that. 

I gave you the draft chart numbers.  If you want to ignore them, be my guest.  The difference in value between the two picks is more than the pick we will get.  Two of those comp picks is not worth the pick we traded for Clady according to the draft chart.  If you throw away the gravy all the time, you are going to be eating nothing but dry meat.  That may fly in the mod lounge, but not in the NFL. 

[dbatesman]

52 minutes ago, UnitedWhofans said:

However, as with most of Macc's moves, it's not going to affect the future much because they are going to get a 4th round pick anyway via the comp pick from Snacks, which was at risk for signing Jenkins. So at the end of the day, they will 7 picks as they had before. 8 picks would have been gravy, but 7 is fine too

Holy ******* hell

[UnitedWhofans]

3 minutes ago, #27TheDominator said:

I gave you the draft chart numbers.  If you want to ignore them, be my guest.  The difference in value between the two picks is more than the pick we will get.  Two of those comp picks is not worth the pick we traded for Clady according to the draft chart.  If you throw away the gravy all the time, you are going to be eating nothing but dry meat.  That may fly in the mod lounge, but not in the NFL. 

Not all the time, but in that situation, given the options, I think it was necessary. 

As for the draft chart, that's just my opinion. And if the chart says differently so be it.

[joewilly12]

Clady never did fill the shoes of D-Brick, thanks Macc. 

[lambo]

no OL, that's great gives Macc an out when Petty and Hack get killed great strategy by an incompetent GM. The Dolphins D twisted Petty up like a pretzel mission not quite complete keep up the good work Macc..

[joewilly12]

9 minutes ago, lambo said:

no OL, that's great gives Macc an out when Petty and Hack get killed great strategy by an incompetent GM. The Dolphins D twisted Petty up like a pretzel mission not quite complete keep up the good work Macc..

Macc is clueless and in over his head. 

[Beerfish]

35 minutes ago, lambo said:

no OL, that's great gives Macc an out when Petty and Hack get killed great strategy by an incompetent GM. The Dolphins D twisted Petty up like a pretzel mission not quite complete keep up the good work Macc..

Well that was the fault of the center who snapped the ball as the rest of the oline stayed in their stance.

[SickJetFan]

3 hours ago, #27TheDominator said:

I did not know it,  but apparently I am a masochist, so I will try this again. 

If the Jets had not traded for Clady, they would have had their 5th round pick and could have chosen Shell.  They did not have their pick, but felt compelled to trade back into the 2016 5th.  That compulsion cost them their 2017 4th.  Thus, the trade for Clady cost them their 2017 4th round pick.  I will not take this any further, I will not draft charts and diagrams.  I will not use color coding.  I do not give a single **** which side of the line either played on.  If they had traded up for a CB, the point would be the same.  

This is just silly jet fan drama

Mac traded a 5th rounder for clsdy.   The odds of any 5th rounder sticking after 2 years is around 35% and goes down to around 15% after 4...not real good odds for success .  with that in mind prior to draft Mac gambled those odds against a former pro bowl lineman who is young and had had injury history who was medically cleared....he bet and lost.

Mac traded a 4th rounder for Shell.   The odds of any 4th rounder sticking after 2 years is around 50% and goes down to 35% after 4 years.   With that in mind Mac took a gamble and this time it seems it has paid off.   

So he is actually ahead of the game because the odds of coming away with a starting player with 2 picks 4th and 5th rounder is not very good historically 

[#27TheDominator]

What about 2 picks and $7.5M? 

[Sperm Edwards]

2 hours ago, #27TheDominator said:

I think you need to stop, take a breath and read everything again.  You are completely off.  If Jenkins qualifies they do not get the pick.  He cancels out the loss of Harrision.  If he doesn't qualify, he is not considered and the team gets the pick.  The writer  is not sure of the rules (no one outside the league does) and is making an assumption.  He is likely correct, but not sure.

As for your last paragraph, re-read my post.  If you still think giving up the #6 pick in 4th round for the #33 or higher pick in the 4th round is a "net loss of zero" take a logic class.  Furthermore, there is no reason (outside of 1/2 a season of Clady) they should not have BOTH their pick and the comp pick.  NET LOSS OF AROUND #102 OVERALL.  No wonder everybody wants to trade down.  You people think "Hey, we traded #6 overall for the last pick in the first round.  Net loss of zero."  

Lol. What is it you think are you doing?

[#27TheDominator]

4 minutes ago, Sperm Edwards said:

Lol. What is it you think are you doing?

 

3 hours ago, Sperm Edwards said:

 

[thadude]

3 hours ago, jamesr said:

Dolphags are releasing Brandon Albert ... any chance we try to sign him as a viable starter for a few years?

Yes please

[lambo]

16 hours ago, Beerfish said:

Well that was the fault of the center who snapped the ball as the rest of the oline stayed in their stance.

I honestly believe your starting to get it...

[UnitedWhofans]

You cant win NFL executive of the Year and completely botch free agency.

[peebag]

7 minutes ago, UnitedWhofans said:

You cant win NFL executive of the Year and completely botch free agency.

Oh yee of little faith...

[kelly]

20 hours ago, jamesr said:

Dolphags are releasing Brandon Albert ... any chance we try to sign him as a viable starter for a few years?

he's better than any OT's  we have on our roster now.. sad