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1 hour ago, detectivekimble said:

But does he have the athleticism to cover guys at the NFL level?  I don't think he does.

Maye does, though.

So, the guy who is a worse athlete has the athleticism?  What does Maye have over Adams?  2" more vertical?  As far as I can tell, Adams was better at every other indication of athleticism.

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He can't cover, he lost four games to an injury and one to a suspension, and he's already 23. This is a pick that looked horrific at the time and somehow gets worse the more you learn about it.

Just to throw a little water on this... http://www.nfl.com/draft/2017/tracker#dt-tabs:dt-by-grade/dt-by-grade-input:2 - ranked 50 overall http://www.nfl.com/draft/2017/profiles/marcus-maye?id=255799

Even though he played nickel or free safety for 70% of his snaps. Generally he's considered good at everything but if it makes you feel good to make stuff up go right ahead.

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13 hours ago, Tony MaC said:

One of the biggest problem with last year's D was all the mental miscues our safety's had. Pryor in particular got scapegoated pretty hard this offseason, apparently they didn't like his football aptitude or attitude off the field- not that he did anything seriously wrong, I think it was a "You're either part of the problem or part of the solution" kind of thing and he provided nothing when the chips were down.

So... Mac went after two guys with a lot in the way of locker room leadership and football intelligence. These are two guys that should be able hit the ground running in terms of learning Bowles defense and working on improving themselves and also making each other better. They're an ideal response to last year's debacle in the defensive backfield.

Yes Pryor sucked but you don't need to dedicate and entire draft class just to replace him

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13 hours ago, Gas2No99 said:

 

 

Sadly it's becoming a constant theme with that poster. Just makes up stuff to further his argument to the point that it's just not even worth acknowledging, let alone respond to; I'm now getting to that point myself after a few "debates."

  Yeah cuz pretending Christian Hackenberg is good is not "making stuff up"

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2 hours ago, detectivekimble said:

But does he have the athleticism to cover guys at the NFL level?  I don't think he does.

Maye does, though.

I actually appreciate this sentiment since it is rarely expressed. 

Adams seems to have measurable on par with Landon Collins which is great and Adams out performs him at top end speed and short burst while lacking some of Collins's explosion (based on raw numbers). 

I'm surprised you think Maye has the athleticism as that's rarely mentioned with him beyond passing comments about 4.4 speed. I can honestly say I know little about him as a prospect.

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1 minute ago, thadude said:

Yes Pryor sucked but you don't need to dedicate and entire draft class just to replace him

They had a need at a lot of places and the draft fell in such a way that they found an opportunity to address one of them in a major way. The picks weren't woefully over value (like last year with Hack) and the actual players in questions seem promising. I just can't find it in me to be mad at double dipping at a position, not the way it happened here and not with how that position looked.

We were NEVER gonna address every outstanding problem this team has in one draft. I still dream of getting a Left tackle- wanted one drafted for years now. I'll take anything if the player contributes though.

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1 minute ago, Tony MaC said:

They had a need at a lot of places and the draft fell in such a way that they found an opportunity to address one of them in a major way. The picks weren't woefully over value (like last year with Hack) and the actual players in questions seem promising. I just can't find it in me to be mad at double dipping at a position, not the way it happened here and not with how that position looked.

We were NEVER gonna address every outstanding problem this team has in one draft. I still dream of getting a Left tackle- wanted one drafted for years now. I'll take anything if the player contributes though.

So will we be using the entire 2018 draft to replace Harris?

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1 minute ago, thadude said:

So will we be using the entire 2018 draft to replace Harris?

Assuming nobody steps up enough this year, we'd only need one seeing as how that's only one position of need, though it wouldn't surprise me under that scenario if Mac took an OLB, after he claims he always wants to have one in the pipeline.

We had a lot of needs not the least of which was replacements for two underperforming safety's and we addressed that need. There are others, but there was always gonna be others. It was a combo of going BPA and filling needs (which isn't hard because we've got a lot of those). They took a no brainer in round one and a player they think could supplement that no brainer and fix a position with two starters once and for all in round two.

Is there somebody you'd rather the Jets taken in the second round?

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8 hours ago, #27TheDominator said:

So, the guy who is a worse athlete has the athleticism?  What does Maye have over Adams?  2" more vertical?  As far as I can tell, Adams was better at every other indication of athleticism.

Maye is a worse athlete than Adams?  They were close in most of the drills, but Maye had a significantly better 40 yard time and better vertical.  He's clearly the better athlete.  That's why he'll be playing more FS than Adams.

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12 hours ago, detectivekimble said:

Maye is a worse athlete than Adams?  They were close in most of the drills, but Maye had a significantly better 40 yard time and better vertical.  He's clearly the better athlete.  That's why he'll be playing more FS than Adams.

This is why we have to be careful where you get our numbers from.  I double checked.  Adams ran poorly (4.56) at the combine.  That is why he ran again at his pro day (reported as 4.33, but scouts said 4.40/4.41-Gil Brandt had 4.45).  Collins ran great at the combine (4.53) and sat on his time. Maye was recovering from his broken arm at the combine and did not run - he ran 4.47 (some had low 4.5s) at his pro day.

The pro day 40 is traditionally faster because of the different tracks and hand-timed, so they can't necessarily be readily compared.  Adams was better at the shuttle, 3-cone and broad.  Maye had a better vertical. You may call them comparable, but I don't think anybody thinks Maye is a better athlete.  Collins was way worse in the shuttle and 3 cone, but obviously bigger. 

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1 hour ago, BurnleyJet said:

I'm glad most of this is "can they play football?" Not numbers, plenty of workout Warriors have failed in the NFL. I have high hopes for both guys. 

Maybe you'd be worried about the comments about being grabby, getting lost in coverage and stiff hips?  They are both nice prospects, but they have a way to go.  I can say for a fact, more workout warriors make it than gritty overachievers.

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On 6/12/2017 at 8:35 AM, Harlemnite1 said:

Jets have gone BPA for the last 10 years and its gotten them nowhere. Its lazy scouting and only fits if you are picking at the back end of the draft every year. The Jets also have a problem taking high-end talent only from the defensive side of the ball. It made the roster lopsided and that is why you have Bowles kicking field goals down 38.0.

Reaching for and over-commiting to unworthy QBs (ex: Sanchez, Mark & Smith, Geno) resulted in us passing on:

- Russell Wilson

- Kirk Cousins

- Teddy Bridgewater

- Derek Carr

Excuse me for not wanting to commit 3+ years to over-hyped prospects from a poor class like Watson and Mahomes a year away from the best QB class in years.  Possibly better than 2012.  The Jets did the smart thing ignoring the screams from fans and passing on all of these guys in the first round.  If Hackenberg bombs, they are now set up to take a real franchise-QB talent.

Watson, IMO, was the only one who deserved to be touched in the top 3 rounds and I still feel that he was over drafted.  Highest he should have gone was mid 2nd.  If Mahomes came out to join the next class (Darnold, Rosen, Rudolph, Allen, etc), he wouldn't even be drafted.  He had ZERO business being drafted in the first, let alone @ 6. 

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2 hours ago, #27TheDominator said:

Maybe you'd be worried about the comments about being grabby, getting lost in coverage and stiff hips?  They are both nice prospects, but they have a way to go.  I can say for a fact, more workout warriors make it than gritty overachievers.

Thing is neither have Elite metrics, but both have solid combine numbers, The thing is both have very good game smarts, and Adams apparently is the best Leader LSU have ever had.

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On 6/14/2017 at 11:10 AM, Mogglez said:

Reaching for and over-commiting to unworthy QBs (ex: Sanchez, Mark & Smith, Geno) resulted in us passing on:

- Russell Wilson

- Kirk Cousins

- Teddy Bridgewater

- Derek Carr

Excuse me for not wanting to commit 3+ years to over-hyped prospects from a poor class like Watson and Mahomes a year away from the best QB class in years.  Possibly better than 2012.  The Jets did the smart thing ignoring the screams from fans and passing on all of these guys in the first round.  If Hackenberg bombs, they are now set up to take a real franchise-QB talent.

Watson, IMO, was the only one who deserved to be touched in the top 3 rounds and I still feel that he was over drafted.  Highest he should have gone was mid 2nd.  If Mahomes came out to join the next class (Darnold, Rosen, Rudolph, Allen, etc), he wouldn't even be drafted.  He had ZERO business being drafted in the first, let alone @ 6. 

 

So we are back to waiting 3 years for next years QB class. How do you know the QB we pick will be a franchise one. How do you know the ones we didn't pick this year wouldn't have worked for us.  I trust Andy Reid evaluation 1000% over Macagnan and Bowels. If Hackienberg doesn't see the field this year they need to dumpster that dude. Just chalk it up to a lousy pick and try and correct it as soon as possible to get the stench off the team.

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On 6/12/2017 at 7:43 PM, TuscanyTile2 said:

I certainly am not complaining about Leonard WIlliams or Jamal Adams but it's amazing to me that no matter how much defense we draft, we're still never a shutdown type defense. The Pats always seem to be able to put up 38 against us.

That's more on Bowles cause he sucks. He coaches scared and his very next defensive adjustment will be his first.  

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20 minutes ago, Harlemnite1 said:

 

So we are back to waiting 3 years for next years QB class. How do you know the QB we pick will be a franchise one. How do you know the ones we didn't pick this year wouldn't have worked for us.  I trust Andy Reid evaluation 1000% over Macagnan and Bowels. If Hackienberg doesn't see the field this year they need to dumpster that dude. Just chalk it up to a lousy pick and try and correct it as soon as possible to get the stench off the team.

Did you really just respond to post from over a month ago?

I shouldn't give a sh*t but I'll end this nonsense by mentioning how Andy Reid hasn't developed jack sh*t via his draft "evaluations" since McNabb.  Every single one of his hand picked guys has failed.  Kevin Kolb, Nick Foles, Tyler Bray, Aaron Murray, Kevin Hogan. There's a huge difference between fixing up a decent/capable vet (Garcia,Vick, Smith) and building one from the ground up.  I wouldn't call picking (another) QB that can't read a defense going out and "buying the best clay".

We literally have to suffer through one more bad year to get prospects who are infinitely better prospects than Mahomes.  Would you play Russian roulette with a 6 shooter that's loaded with 5 bullets or, for less money, would you play with the gun with 1 bullet in the chamber?

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On 6/14/2017 at 10:38 AM, #27TheDominator said:

Maybe you'd be worried about the comments about being grabby, getting lost in coverage and stiff hips?  They are both nice prospects, but they have a way to go.  I can say for a fact, more workout warriors make it than gritty overachievers.

How are you defining a workout warrior vs a gritty overachiever? Because this is not a black and white issue, there are many shades of grey in between 

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58 minutes ago, Mogglez said:

Did you really just respond to post from over a month ago?

I shouldn't give a sh*t but I'll end this nonsense by mentioning how Andy Reid hasn't developed jack sh*t via his draft "evaluations" since McNabb.  Every single one of his hand picked guys has failed.  Kevin Kolb, Nick Foles, Tyler Bray, Aaron Murray, Kevin Hogan. There's a huge difference between fixing up a decent/capable vet (Garcia,Vick, Smith) and building one from the ground up.  I wouldn't call picking (another) QB that can't read a defense going out and "buying the best clay".

We literally have to suffer through one more bad year to get prospects who are infinitely better prospects than Mahomes.  Would you play Russian roulette with a 6 shooter that's loaded with 5 bullets or, for less money, would you play with the gun with 1 bullet in the chamber?

Not one QB named in this post has the talent of Pat Mahomes, and that includes McNabb, Mahomes will be the next QB to win a Super Bowl from the AFC once Brady finally calls it quits, unlike the Colts with Luck the Chiefs have a solid foundation built around Mahomes to succeed next season, or IMO this season as I believe for a 2nd time Alex Smith will lose his job mid season either due to injury, or the thought Mahomes gives a playoff bound team a better chance to win games VS the higher scoring big boys of the AFC.  Your blind hate for Mahomes is laughable, Brett Favre when he started his first year did not even know what Nickel defense ment, had zero clue reading defenses, but his arm talent, and knack for the big play that made your jaw dropped was plenty to still succeed until he learned how to read a defense as he got more experience, and Mahomes brings the same type of once every 25 year combination of arm strength, and knack to extend plays to make game changing throws that will make people's jaws drop.  It was a very difficult decision to pass on a can't miss top 5 prospect in the draft for Mahomes, but if your right you will have a GM job until you decide you don't want to be a GM for the rest of your life, while if your right on Adams it's well any guy with eyes could have made that pick.  I'd prefer Mahomes, but I get the Adams pick, and we can argue till we are both blue in the face neither of us will concede our stance right now, but time will settle this disagreement of opinion on Mahomes soon enough one way, or the other.

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44 minutes ago, Lupz27 said:

Not one QB named in this post has the talent of Pat Mahomes, and that includes McNabb, Mahomes will be the next QB to win a Super Bowl from the AFC once Brady finally calls it quits, unlike the Colts with Luck the Chiefs have a solid foundation built around Mahomes to succeed next season, or IMO this season as I believe for a 2nd time Alex Smith will lose his job mid season either due to injury, or the thought Mahomes gives a playoff bound team a better chance to win games VS the higher scoring big boys of the AFC.  Your blind hate for Mahomes is laughable, Brett Favre when he started his first year did not even know what Nickel defense ment, had zero clue reading defenses, but his arm talent, and knack for the big play that made your jaw dropped was plenty to still succeed until he learned how to read a defense as he got more experience, and Mahomes brings the same type of once every 25 year combination of arm strength, and knack to extend plays to make game changing throws that will make people's jaws drop.  It was a very difficult decision to pass on a can't miss top 5 prospect in the draft for Mahomes, but if your right you will have a GM job until you decide you don't want to be a GM for the rest of your life, while if your right on Adams it's well any guy with eyes could have made that pick.  I'd prefer Mahomes, but I get the Adams pick, and we can argue till we are both blue in the face neither of us will concede our stance right now, but time will settle this disagreement of opinion on Mahomes soon enough one way, or the other.

Lol.

For every Brett Favre (big arm, no brain QB), there's about 20 million duds.  He's a poor man's Colin Kaepernick and how's that dude doing right now?  Once in 25 years?  EL OH EL. There are 4-5 prospects coming out next year better than him.  Half of the piss poor class he came from were better prospects than him.  If he came out one year later he would've gone in the 5th round at the earliest.  I never once "dropped my jaw" watching Mahomes play.  The only thing blowing my mind was the fact that the conference he played in literally doesn't believe in playing defense.  He has zero footwork.  Zero touch.  He looks like he's taking a painful sh*t when he attempts to get under center.  He has athleticism and a howitzer.  That's it.  If we passed on Adams for him, I would have thrown a chair through my television.

Oh yeah, Nick Foles was a much better pro prospect when he came out by the way, so your whole "there's not one QB that has the talent of Mahomes, McNabb included" is so beyond ridiculous I don't really have words for it.  You realize McNabb was a 2nd overall pick who put together a career that is considered by many to be Hall of Fame worthy right?  He actually lived up to his own hype. Mahomes hasn't taken a snap as a pro and you're putting him above a canton bound QB...but MY opinion laughable?

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1 hour ago, Lupz27 said:

Not one QB named in this post has the talent of Pat Mahomes, and that includes McNabb, Mahomes will be the next QB to win a Super Bowl from the AFC once Brady finally calls it quits, unlike the Colts with Luck the Chiefs have a solid foundation built around Mahomes to succeed next season, or IMO this season as I believe for a 2nd time Alex Smith will lose his job mid season either due to injury, or the thought Mahomes gives a playoff bound team a better chance to win games VS the higher scoring big boys of the AFC.  Your blind hate for Mahomes is laughable, Brett Favre when he started his first year did not even know what Nickel defense ment, had zero clue reading defenses, but his arm talent, and knack for the big play that made your jaw dropped was plenty to still succeed until he learned how to read a defense as he got more experience, and Mahomes brings the same type of once every 25 year combination of arm strength, and knack to extend plays to make game changing throws that will make people's jaws drop.  It was a very difficult decision to pass on a can't miss top 5 prospect in the draft for Mahomes, but if your right you will have a GM job until you decide you don't want to be a GM for the rest of your life, while if your right on Adams it's well any guy with eyes could have made that pick.  I'd prefer Mahomes, but I get the Adams pick, and we can argue till we are both blue in the face neither of us will concede our stance right now, but time will settle this disagreement of opinion on Mahomes soon enough one way, or the other.

You're not serious with this nonsense are you?  

How wrong can someone be? 

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1 hour ago, Lupz27 said:

Not one QB named in this post has the talent of Pat Mahomes, and that includes McNabb, Mahomes will be the next QB to win a Super Bowl from the AFC once Brady finally calls it quits, unlike the Colts with Luck the Chiefs have a solid foundation built around Mahomes to succeed next season, or IMO this season as I believe for a 2nd time Alex Smith will lose his job mid season either due to injury, or the thought Mahomes gives a playoff bound team a better chance to win games VS the higher scoring big boys of the AFC.  Your blind hate for Mahomes is laughable, Brett Favre when he started his first year did not even know what Nickel defense ment, had zero clue reading defenses, but his arm talent, and knack for the big play that made your jaw dropped was plenty to still succeed until he learned how to read a defense as he got more experience, and Mahomes brings the same type of once every 25 year combination of arm strength, and knack to extend plays to make game changing throws that will make people's jaws drop.  It was a very difficult decision to pass on a can't miss top 5 prospect in the draft for Mahomes, but if your right you will have a GM job until you decide you don't want to be a GM for the rest of your life, while if your right on Adams it's well any guy with eyes could have made that pick.  I'd prefer Mahomes, but I get the Adams pick, and we can argue till we are both blue in the face neither of us will concede our stance right now, but time will settle this disagreement of opinion on Mahomes soon enough one way, or the other.

Yikes... and people thought i was crazy about Lynch.

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9 minutes ago, Tony MaC said:

I think Marcus Maye is going to be a good safety. He and Adams will make each other great. Just thought I'd say that. Was that off topic?

Yes, off topic. This is about working yourself up to terminal depression because you always know better than the GM and Coach. Too positive. :)

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4 hours ago, Mogglez said:

Lol.

For every Brett Favre (big arm, no brain QB), there's about 20 million duds.  He's a poor man's Colin Kaepernick and how's that dude doing right now?  Once in 25 years?  EL OH EL. There are 4-5 prospects coming out next year better than him.  Half of the piss poor class he came from were better prospects than him.  If he came out one year later he would've gone in the 5th round at the earliest.  I never once "dropped my jaw" watching Mahomes play.  The only thing blowing my mind was the fact that the conference he played in literally doesn't believe in playing defense.  He has zero footwork.  Zero touch.  He looks like he's taking a painful sh*t when he attempts to get under center.  He has athleticism and a howitzer.  That's it.  If we passed on Adams for him, I would have thrown a chair through my television.

Oh yeah, Nick Foles was a much better pro prospect when he came out by the way, so your whole "there's not one QB that has the talent of Mahomes, McNabb included" is so beyond ridiculous I don't really have words for it.  You realize McNabb was a 2nd overall pick who put together a career that is considered by many to be Hall of Fame worthy right?  He actually lived up to his own hype. Mahomes hasn't taken a snap as a pro and you're putting him above a canton bound QB...but MY opinion laughable?

Again can't wait for you to eat crow on Mahomes, time will tell.  Spew all your inaccurate nonsense to make your point look loud, and credible when it's just nonsense because you can't see threw the big 12 D, and air raid O, forget what's inside the kids brain, heart to go along with yes RARE arm talent, such a joke of a post.  McNabb Canton bound lol gl with that.

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3 hours ago, Jet Nut said:

You're not serious with this nonsense are you?  

How wrong can someone be? 

another one who will have to eat crow in a year, or 3.

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29 minutes ago, Lupz27 said:

Again can't wait for you to eat crow on Mahomes, time will tell.  Spew all your inaccurate nonsense to make your point look loud, and credible when it's just nonsense because you can't see threw the big 12 D, and air raid O, forget what's inside the kids brain, heart to go along with yes RARE arm talent, such a joke of a post.  McNabb Canton bound lol gl with that.

1. McNabb will likely get in the hall at some point.  It may take a while but he'll get in.  You lose all credibility for thinking that he won't.

2. - Mahomes brain isn't special.

     - He never saw a damn thing resembling a professional defense, like, ever.

      - Tebow had more heart than just about any QB I've ever seen and he's playing baseball now.

      - All Air Raid QBs have failed miserably in the NFL.  Excuse me for not "overlooking" that pretty vital f*cking point.

      - All the arm talent in the world won't compensate for being unable to read an NFL defense or take a snap comfortably under center.  You'd think that after the first hundred guys fitting the same description bombed, everyone would realize this but I guess there are some who don't realize chucking a football 65 mph is not impressive if it's flying to the arms of a linebacker/DB sitting underneath a complex blitz/cover scheme.

3.  If I'm wrong, I'll eat crow.  I don't care.  Said it a hundred times about him already.  Still don't think he's one I'll be eating crow over.  

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