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Passing on a QB in 2017


varjet

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I can come up with some good rebuttals to the points made in this article, but he makes some good points.

I predict there is a significant reinvestment in QB in 2018.  I think the sweet spots are top of 1st round, 4th round and below, and FA who is proven to be able to play.

******

http://newyork.cbslocal.com/2017/05/08/keidel-jets-quarterback-search/

Keidel: Jets Appear To Be In No Hurry To Find Their QB Of The Future

While Other Desperate Teams Drafted Signal-Callers, Gang Green Stood Pat With Unimpressive TrioMay 8, 2017 8:26 AM

Filed Under: Jason Keidel, New York Jets

By Jason Keidel
» More Columns

No matter what you think of the Cleveland Browns, Chicago Bears or Houston Texans, they all shoved their draft-day chips to the middle and gambled on a quarterback in the first round of the NFL Draft. Even the Chiefs, with easily one of the five best rosters in the league, belched some valuable picks to bag their QB of the future.

The Jets? In light of their long-term quarterback woes, they went all in by … loading up on sixth-round draft picks and leaving Philadelphia sans a single quarterback. After stalwart safety Jamal Adams from LSU fell into Gang Green’s lap in the first round, they could at least have taken a flyer on one QB. While this draft class was, by nearly all accounts, pedestrian at the position, there was value to be had.

Even the Giants, who have had the QB spot locked down for a dozen years, have at least gestured at the future, by drafting former Syracuse QB Ryan Nassib in 2013. And some feel they got a steal this year in the third round with Cal QB Davis Webb. That’s what good franchises do — meet today’s needs with an eye on tomorrow’s holes. It’s amazing how teams can occupy the same state, county and building for over 30 years and be so historically divergent.

The Jets’ presumed quarterback of the future, Christian Hackenberg, has taken on comical contours, with last year’s second-round pick not even taking a single snap on a team desperate for someone to grab the gig. So far, Hackenberg makes Geno Smith look like Joe Montana.

MORE: Jets Sign Tryout Players Braden, Bordelon From Rookie Camp

Could the current lineup possibly be the Jets’ dream for the future? To sign Josh McCown, a 37-year-old (who turns 38 in July), with any hopes of winning today? Even worse, is he a bridge to Hackenberg? Or to Bryce Petty?

Say what we want about the Bears — and much has, particularly by the beleaguered natives — but they at least had the stones to strike a deal and snag the man they wanted. Sure, it seems silly now for them to give up so much for a player no one heard of six months ago and has all of 13 college starts under his belt — and an 8-5 record, at that — but if Mitchell Trubisky actually matures into a starting NFL quarterback then he will have been worth the post-draft rancor from the fans.

Kansas City arched a few eyebrows by being so bullish on Patrick Mahomes. But Andy Reid has earned the latitude to make such moves. And even the lowly Browns got a QB with considerable gifts in DeShone Kizer. His talent is unquestioned, just not his temerity. Even still, the Browns have options at QB. And the Texans, who seem to have skill at every position except quarterback, picked the man who picked apart Alabama — twice — in Deshaun Watson.

And the Jets got Josh McCown.

MORE: Adams, Maye Thrilled To Finally Join Forces

Not only did they get their man in the middle-aged vagabond, they outbid the Dallas Cowboys by $4 million to get him (according to NFL Network’s Ian Rappaport). The Jets are McCown’s eight — yes, eighth — NFL employer.

Would it have been so much to ask the Jets to grab Webb, or Nathan Peterman, or Josh Dobbs? Or use one of their three sixth-round picks to pluck Brad Kaaya? Someone, anyone, to give the fan base and franchise a variable for 2017, instead of the same failures and retreats that rule the roster today.

Maybe the Jets are shell shocked. After Browning Nagle and Geno Smith and Mark Sanchez and the litany of failures under center, they simply can’t pull any trigger on another quarterback. But that’s not the way to run a football team. All it takes is one, the right one, and all the wrong ones will be forgotten.

Lord knows, Mr. Right is not on the roster now.

Please follow Jason on Twitter at @JasonKeidel

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He makes some good points, but I'm not sure from a team building standpoint.  

Let's assume they don't sign McCown.  We go into the season with Petty (from a Baylor offense- who studied a spread offense under Gailey) and Hackenberg (Who had a tumultuous college career with mechanical issues) as our only options at QB.  

- We are now pigeonholed into picking a QB in the draft, other teams know this and can take advantage (See Tavon Austin)

-We will possibly have three young QBs trying to learn a WC offense, and no one can really help each other out

-This is a weak QB draft, so Webb/Peterman/Dobbs are all sitting out this year, thus having no effect on said season

-None of them are can't miss prospects to the point that waiting on them can be fruitful in any certainty.  It's a gamble

-Next year's crop is regarded as one of the most loaded classes in years, so there is some long term game plan to wait a year, especially if none of the options are putting us over the edge.

-If you look at the teams that did make a move, they had two distinct characteristics:  One- Desperation:  The Bears/Texans have a staff that desperately needs confidence boosts from the fans.  The Bears are in rebuild mode and let Cutler and Jeffery go, so the fans would have turned if they didn't go all in.  Decent chance the GM would be out of a job if he initiated a full on rebuild.  This move buys him two years, and a quirky way to make value.  The Texans are in the same boat, they went all in Osweiller last year and it failed miserably.  They are a team set to win now, so they need a QB that can step in now and play, even if the upside might not be the highest.  Two: Security- the Chiefs are just fine with Alex Smith so they can afford to take the risk on Mahomes.  Just like the Packers were just fine with Brett Favre, that they can take Rodgers.  However, for every Rodgers, there are Mallets and Osweillers.  

-This is a rebuilding year, the team is gutting it's veterans.  There is no point in starting the clock on a QB with his contract when the team accepts that this is a lost year.  Rather set up the team with young pieces and cap space in the future for veterans, and then bring in a high draft pick than hoping to develop everything together.   

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Even if you excuse the Jets for passing on a QB this year, it's still inexcusable to do little to pad the nest for the QB they'll draft in 2018. Next year's roster at the skill positions will be even bleaker than this year's because you're definitely losing Decker and could potentially lose Enunwa as an RFA. Even if you're getting Darnold, he could be walking into a huddle with no OLT, no viable C, no WR1, and Bilal Powell. We'll be optimistic and say that Stewart and/or Enunwa develop into a #2 WR, but the cupboard is bare otherwise. 

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Why is this ******* guy patting the Giants on the back for drafting Nassib and Webb?  Have either of those selections shown any indication they were worthwhile?  What are the odds either of them ever starts an NFL game? 

The Jets are too shellshocked to draft a QB?  They do nothing but.  For all the picks we whine about Tannenbaum wasting to trade up, they wasted just as many on sh*tty QBs.  I know the mantra is to "draft one every year until you find one," but if you have so many they can't all play, you will never know if you have/had one or not.  

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1 minute ago, T0mShane said:

Even if you excuse the Jets for passing on a QB this year, it's still inexcusable to do little to pad the nest for the QB they'll draft in 2018. Next year's roster at the skill positions will be even bleaker than this year's because you're definitely losing Decker and could potentially lose Enunwa as an RFA. Even if you're getting Darnold, he could be walking into a huddle with no OLT, no viable C, no WR1, and Bilal Powell. We'll be optimistic and say that Stewart and/or Enunwa develop into a #2 WR, but the cupboard is bare otherwise. 

Theres always next year T0mShane and the year after that. 

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Say what we want about the Bears — and much has, particularly by the beleaguered natives — but they at least had the stones to strike a deal and snag the man they wanted. Sure, it seems silly now for them to give up so much for a player no one heard of six months ago and has all of 13 college starts under his belt — and an 8-5 record, at that — but if Mitchell Trubisky actually matures into a starting NFL quarterback then he will have been worth the post-draft rancor from the fans.

Yeah, way to go Chicago.  You made a horrible deal for a QB that has 13 starts.   But hey, they have stones!!

 

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4 minutes ago, T0mShane said:

Even if you excuse the Jets for passing on a QB this year, it's still inexcusable to do little to pad the nest for the QB they'll draft in 2018. Next year's roster at the skill positions will be even bleaker than this year's because you're definitely losing Decker and could potentially lose Enunwa as an RFA. Even if you're getting Darnold, he could be walking into a huddle with no OLT, no viable C, no WR1, and Bilal Powell. We'll be optimistic and say that Stewart and/or Enunwa develop into a #2 WR, but the cupboard is bare otherwise. 

Nonsense.  If we are in line to draft Sam Darnold he is just as likely to stay in school that I am  going up to the buffet for  seconds, thirds....

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1 minute ago, Larz said:

If any of the QBs were any good, the browns and 9ers take them.

It was a meh class

Taking a QB at 6 means he has to start week 1

Would have been dumb

Other options McCown,Petty,Hackenberg better or worse options. 

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4 minutes ago, T0mShane said:

Even if you excuse the Jets for passing on a QB this year, it's still inexcusable to do little to pad the nest for the QB they'll draft in 2018. Next year's roster at the skill positions will be even bleaker than this year's because you're definitely losing Decker and could potentially lose Enunwa as an RFA. Even if you're getting Darnold, he could be walking into a huddle with no OLT, no viable C, no WR1, and Bilal Powell. We'll be optimistic and say that Stewart and/or Enunwa develop into a #2 WR, but the cupboard is bare otherwise. 

I expect the Jets to spend freely in FA next year for offensive help.  They will sign a RB to replace Forte and draft one.  They could sign a WR and will renew Enunwa.  I am giving them the benefit of the doubt that they drafted well, for now.

Yes, they do draft more defenders, but I think they spend more on offensive FAs.

4 minutes ago, #27TheDominator said:

Why is this ******* guy patting the Giants on the back for drafting Nassib and Webb?  Have either of those selections shown any indication they were worthwhile?  What are the odds either of them ever starts an NFL game? 

The Jets are too shellshocked to draft a QB?  They do nothing but.  For all the picks we whine about Tannenbaum wasting to trade up, they wasted just as many on sh*tty QBs.  I know the mantra is to "draft one every year until you find one," but if you have so many they can't all play, you will never know if you have/had on or not.  

The big bet this year, in my view, believe it or not, was on Petty.  If the Jets could have gotten a few more draft picks (such as by making the Sheldon trade happen), I am thinking I would rather have Webb or Peterman over Petty.  Hack we are stuck with, and McCown was the lesser of many evils.

We are signing a FA QB and drafting one next year.  Getting rid of Sheldon is key.

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1 minute ago, joewilly12 said:

Other options McCown,Petty,Hackenberg better or worse options. 

The Jets made the right moves rounds 1-3.

Let's see how Peterman turns out.  I hate it when the Bills and Dolphins take players I like.  I am sure that the Jets wanted Hansen and Leggett, but Petty could have been upgraded this year.

But maybe he was....let's see how Evans plays.

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1 minute ago, varjet said:

The Jets made the right moves rounds 1-3.

Let's see how Peterman turns out.  I hate it when the Bills and Dolphins take players I like.  I am sure that the Jets wanted Hansen and Leggett, but Petty could have been upgraded this year.

But maybe he was....let's see how Evans plays.

We shall soon see. 

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17 minutes ago, T0mShane said:

Even if you excuse the Jets for passing on a QB this year, it's still inexcusable to do little to pad the nest for the QB they'll draft in 2018. Next year's roster at the skill positions will be even bleaker than this year's because you're definitely losing Decker and could potentially lose Enunwa as an RFA. Even if you're getting Darnold, he could be walking into a huddle with no OLT, no viable C, no WR1, and Bilal Powell. We'll be optimistic and say that Stewart and/or Enunwa develop into a #2 WR, but the cupboard is bare otherwise. 

It's kinda ridiculous to complain about those positions because there is a young guy with potential in line to play there. That doesn't mean that any player will pan out but it doesn't mean that we have nothing at the positions. OLT is currently either gonna feature a former quality starter in Beachum or a young guy that played well in his few starts of his rookie year. It's not ideal but if the oline is decent this year your complaint will be foolish. Johnson graded well last season at C. The same goes for WR where we have depth and it's pretty good depth. RB is an issue because even if Maguire is good that's only 2 backs and one has an injury problem.

You're assuming the future because there are unknowns and I hated the Mayes pick but Mike Williams was a much more flawed prospect than Adams with a higher bust potential. And considering the lack of talent on this team from known liabilities like Pryor, Gilchrist and this CB group, BAP was the right move. 

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1 minute ago, kdels62 said:

It's kinda ridiculous to complain about those positions because there is a young guy with potential in line to play there. That doesn't mean that any player will pan out but it doesn't mean that we have nothing at the positions. OLT is currently either gonna feature a former quality starter in Beachum or a young guy that played well in his few starts of his rookie year. It's not ideal but if the oline is decent this year your complaint will be foolish. Johnson graded well last season at C. The same goes for WR where we have depth and it's pretty good depth. RB is an issue because even if Maguire is good that's only 2 backs and one has an injury problem.

You're assuming the future because there are unknowns and I hated the Mayes pick but Mike Williams was a much more flawed prospect than Adams with a higher busy potential. And considering the lack of talent on this team from known liabilities like Pryor, Gilchrist and this CB group, BAP was the right move. 

I'd just like to point out one contradiction in here that short-circuits your entire argument: you say that Mike Williams has high "bust potential," but WR and OL is ok because there are "young guys with potential" to play there.

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The problem in the NFL is it's takes a few years to develop a QB.  So teams like the NYJ, SF, Cle etc, is that none of them have any QBs that can hold the fort for a couple of seasons while guys like Mahones, Watson, Webb, or even Peterman and develop.  

If the Jets or any of this other teams I mentioned draft these guys, there's zero patience because there's no other answer currently on their team.  In fact, Watson is probably getting thrown to the wolves this season.

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Jets are in no rush to select their QB of the future. They only just made a massive reach for Hack in the second round last year. Kinda hints desperation, but you know, they're not in a hurry. 

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13 minutes ago, kdels62 said:

It's kinda ridiculous to complain about those positions because there is a young guy with potential in line to play there. That doesn't mean that any player will pan out but it doesn't mean that we have nothing at the positions. OLT is currently either gonna feature a former quality starter in Beachum or a young guy that played well in his few starts of his rookie year. It's not ideal but if the oline is decent this year your complaint will be foolish. Johnson graded well last season at C. The same goes for WR where we have depth and it's pretty good depth. RB is an issue because even if Maguire is good that's only 2 backs and one has an injury problem.

You're assuming the future because there are unknowns and I hated the Mayes pick but Mike Williams was a much more flawed prospect than Adams with a higher bust potential. And considering the lack of talent on this team from known liabilities like Pryor, Gilchrist and this CB group, BAP was the right move. 

Why are we definitely losing Decker? If he's any good, $9 mil for him isn't a lot. If he's not any good, then we're better off without him. Mac set this up perfectly. Wait, that was Idzik. Never mind. 

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9 minutes ago, T0mShane said:

I'd just like to point out one contradiction in here that short-circuits your entire argument: you say that Mike Williams has high "bust potential," but WR and OL is ok because there are "young guys with potential" to play there.

Except none of those players were drafted using the 6th overall pick where a bust sets back your team because your WR1 fails and you picked that player using a valuable  asset that could've been used on the safer impact defender. Not that Adams won't bust but by all measurable accounts that is a less likely outcome.

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Just now, j4jets said:

Why are we definitely losing Decker? If he's any good, $9 mil for him isn't a lot. If he's not any good, then we're better off without him. Mac set this up perfectly. Wait, that was Idzik. Never mind. 

I went with the assumption given to me by TomShane. Let him know.

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9 minutes ago, kdels62 said:

I went with the assumption given to me by TomShane. Let him know.

True. I was actually intending on quoting him and not you. I just had a Fitzpatrick moment. 

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41 minutes ago, T0mShane said:

Even if you excuse the Jets for passing on a QB this year, it's still inexcusable to do little to pad the nest for the QB they'll draft in 2018. Next year's roster at the skill positions will be even bleaker than this year's because you're definitely losing Decker and could potentially lose Enunwa as an RFA. Even if you're getting Darnold, he could be walking into a huddle with no OLT, no viable C, no WR1, and Bilal Powell. We'll be optimistic and say that Stewart and/or Enunwa develop into a #2 WR, but the cupboard is bare otherwise. 

The other issue, as Beerfish pointed out, is that if this draft does indeed turn out to be a QB bonanza (which I'm skeptical about), we're already behind the eight ball by not trading down and picking up a future first, like the Bills did. Just another hidden cost of drafting a safety at #6 overall.

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39 minutes ago, Pcola said:

The problem in the NFL is it's takes a few years to develop a QB.  So teams like the NYJ, SF, Cle etc, is that none of them have any QBs that can hold the fort for a couple of seasons while guys like Mahones, Watson, Webb, or even Peterman and develop.  

If the Jets or any of this other teams I mentioned draft these guys, there's zero patience because there's no other answer currently on their team.  In fact, Watson is probably getting thrown to the wolves this season.

I predict that the Jets in 2018 go with a modified version of the Chicago plan.

Either 1) Hack can be good enough to hold the fort or 2) they will overpay for a FA QB who is capable of starting and holding the fort.  Option 1 is much cheaper.  Option 2 is a Glennon (he could get cut), McCarron, Garapollo.  Cousins could be too expensive (in length) but could happen.

For anyone other than Cousins, the Jets draft a QB as high as they can, if not 2.

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16 minutes ago, varjet said:

I predict that the Jets in 2018 go with a modified version of the Chicago plan.

Either 1) Hack can be good enough to hold the fort or 2) they will overpay for a FA QB who is capable of starting and holding the fort.  Option 1 is much cheaper.  Option 2 is a Glennon (he could get cut), McCarron, Garapollo.  Cousins could be too expensive (in length) but could happen.

For anyone other than Cousins, the Jets draft a QB as high as they can, if not 2.

I predict Hack will totally suck

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2 minutes ago, jeremy2020 said:

Who's excited about the Jets getting the 3rd QB in 2018?!

Outside of Darnold none of the QB prospects coming out in 2018 are that great.  Rosen is coming off an injury and supposedly a headcase, Lamar Jackson could be just a glorified Vick, one of the other "top 10 draft pick qb's" currently plays in an air raid offense that has only produced bust NFL quarterbacks.

 

It's either the Jets go 0-16 and get Darnold (which is really looking possible) or bust.

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This is another so called expert doing Monday Morning QB'ing on drafting. The article is filled with, If this guy turns out to be this....

Oh sure. If Kizer turns into something then all the experts missed it. But the chances are slim for any of these guys and I for one didn't want to waste another 1st rounder rolling the dice on if's. I like our chances next year for a QB. I disagree with some saying the cupboard will be bare next year for our WR's. That is presuming we just drafted all duds. I don't think so, but I'm willing to wait for at least TC to find out.

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1 hour ago, The Crusher said:

Nonsense.  If we are in line to draft Sam Darnold he is just as likely to stay in school that I am  going up to the buffet for  seconds, thirds....

If Darnold has a good season and is ready for the NFL he'll go.  The team picking 1 is always awful, it doesn't matter if it's the Jets or someone else.

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2 hours ago, #27TheDominator said:

Why is this ******* guy patting the Giants on the back for drafting Nassib and Webb?  Have either of those selections shown any indication they were worthwhile?  What are the odds either of them ever starts an NFL game? 

The Jets are too shellshocked to draft a QB?  They do nothing but.  For all the picks we whine about Tannenbaum wasting to trade up, they wasted just as many on sh*tty QBs.  I know the mantra is to "draft one every year until you find one," but if you have so many they can't all play, you will never know if you have/had one or not.  

Besides Ryan Fitzpatrick, Ryan Nassib is the worst QB I have ever seen play.

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6 minutes ago, ASH1962 said:

Besides Ryan Fitzpatrick, Ryan Nassib is the worst QB I have ever seen play.

Some people applaud the teams that tried to get QBs.  I can see that.  Nassib was not great.  Prescott was.  You have to try and then coach them.

Maybe Macc has decided that it is better to use draft picks on players he feels can be NFL players rather than roll the dice on QBs.  Using a 2nd or 4th round QB who turns out not good seems like a waste, even it it was only a 2nd or 4th round pick.  Over the past 10 years the Jets have used more draft picks on QBs than any other team, and they do not have much to show for it.  

The Jets were in a bad spot because whatever QB they picked 3rd round and up would be more likely to play sooner than for other teams.  The only reasons Webb plays for the Giants is because Manning and Geno get hurt (or Geno is atrocious).

If he was picked by the Jets, the odds of a QB above him being atrocious or hurt are much greater than with the Giants.  

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2 hours ago, Pcola said:

The problem in the NFL is it's takes a few years to develop a QB.  So teams like the NYJ, SF, Cle etc, is that none of them have any QBs that can hold the fort for a couple of seasons while guys like Mahones, Watson, Webb, or even Peterman and develop.  

If the Jets or any of this other teams I mentioned draft these guys, there's zero patience because there's no other answer currently on their team.  In fact, Watson is probably getting thrown to the wolves this season.

While I believe Watson could use a little seasoning he is going to the perfect situation for him. A tough talented team that made the playoffs with scrubs as their starting QB. Watson can do no worse than what the Texans had last year. In fact a veteran team such as the Texans could be even better if Watson progresses like I think he will over the course of the season. Remember the Ravens won the Super Bowl with Dilfer at QB with a great defense. There is no reason why history can't repeat itself. I do feel its a longshot but I just might be putting some C-notes on the Texans to win it all next season. Would I have liked to see Watson in the Green and White? HELL YEAH!! I wanted them to draft OFFENSIVE players in the first 2 rounds because they need talent around whoever the starter will be this year and for that talent to gain VALUABLE experience playing in this league in case they can draft one of the highly touted QB's next year. Its how you build a winning program that is a contender year after year. Mac is eyeing all that cap money next year because he thinks he can go all in and buy a Championship. Its his track record. Yeah yeah he had to spend that money but he will do the same next year as well. Just ask Steinbrenner how that worked out for the Yankees for most of the 80' and 90's.

 

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