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Former Jets QB Chad Pennington hopes Todd Bowles gets the chance to turn franchise around


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4 hours ago, southparkcpa said:

So... you dont want the truth?   You want the company line?  Got it.  

And you know it's not the truth as he sees it just how?  You've already given some ridiculous reasons for disliking Chad earlier.  You take a lot of liberty with the truth, should be last one accusing someone of not being truthful

Still want to know how someone who has no affiliation with the Jets was given this company line and what his motivation is to pass it on to the world if he doesn't agree with it.  Please explain that one.  I know it fits the overall negative vibe but really? 

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On 7/15/2017 at 2:55 PM, Larz said:

There were some things I liked about Pennington, but he is a big phony. Always saying the company line

+1

It's nice that there's a national voice who doesn't reflexively mock the Jets and everything they do, but he said all this stuff about Rex (and Sanchez, and Geno, and Fitzpatrick) too.

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59 minutes ago, southparkcpa said:

Don't forget Herm....... ?

In the context of the Jets and the last 20 years or so...Herm wasnt that terrible in hindsight. He figured out a way to surround himself with pretty decent positional coaches(a lot of whom have moved up)...was able to hire Westhoff...and the team was always at the bottom in penalties committed. I dont get the sense that there's anyone on Bowles' staff in line for a promotion. 

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I'll always like Penny. If the guy was durable, I have no doubt he would have brought a SB here. Kid was just an icredible football mind and had all the tools to succeed before his injury. Yeah he didn't have a huge arm, but that was overblown. Once he tore the labrum though, it was over and he was never the same. His "weak" arm became a legitimately weak arm that could no longer make NFL throws.  But the guy had the perfect mental makeup and approach to the game. He was Peyton Manning-esque. I'd love for him to get out of the broadcasting game and into coaching. He'd likely be an incredible coach.  Jets should ask him every year if he'd like to join a staff as a quality control asst and groom him on a fast track to be a QB coach.
That said, I get that Bowles is a highly respected coach in NFL circles. I get that he's in a bad situation. I get all the reasons to keep him.  But I have 2 to get rid of him that trumps all the good. 
1) He lost the team.
2) He has no ability to effect the game from the sidelines. That's a bit of a catch all in saying he can't game plan, cant adjust, can't manage game situations or a clock properly, can't scheme an effective defense to fit the players abilities (stuck in his "system").
He's probably a great guy and an old school coaches coach type of guy.  But he's also toothless and ineffective. 2 things that you can not be taught or developed. You either command respect or you don't. You either are a guy that will do whatever it takes to find a way to make things work for you or you are the type of guys who is willing to just to sit back and become a spectator when you feel things are out of your control. 


So the only 'good' coach we have had was parcels ???


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18 hours ago, dbatesman said:

+1

It's nice that there's a national voice who doesn't reflexively mock the Jets and everything they do, but he said all this stuff about Rex (and Sanchez, and Geno, and Fitzpatrick) too.

well Rex and Sanchez helped this team make 2 title game apps.  why is it Jet fans treat rex and Mark like Kotite and bubby Brister?

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29 minutes ago, whodeawhodat said:

you crack me up man

it's so weird how as a group of fans we judge players and coaches.

-Brett favre sabotages a season for us and he's beloved

-Ken O'Brien never wins a playoff game and he's beloved(Now, when he was playing he was hated)

-Mark Sanchez wins 4 PO games and is hated

-Chad Pennington wins a rare div title and is hated

-Rex wins 4 PO games and is hated

Herm takes us to PO 3 times and is hated.

 

it's odd.  I'm not saying build a statue for any of these guys but can we have some appreciation?

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2 minutes ago, nyjunc said:

it's so weird how as a group of fans we judge players and coaches.

-Brett favre sabotages a season for us and he's beloved

-Ken O'Brien never wins a playoff game and he's beloved(Now, when he was playing he was hated)

-Mark Sanchez wins 4 PO games and is hated

-Chad Pennington wins a rare div title and is hated

-Rex wins 4 PO games and is hated

Herm takes us to PO 3 times and is hated.

 

it's odd.  I'm not saying build a statue for any of these guys but can we have some appreciation?

dude... please.... we have rehashed teh sanchize time and time again.  I am pretty much the closest ally you have in all of Jetdom when it comes to him and we arent even close to agreeing which says alot...

 

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17 minutes ago, whodeawhodat said:

dude... please.... we have rehashed teh sanchize time and time again.  I am pretty much the closest ally you have in all of Jetdom when it comes to him and we arent even close to agreeing which says alot...

 

so you wouldn't agree he deserves some appreciation?  what exactly do you disagree w/?  (this should be interesting to read your perception).

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Just now, CanadienJetsFan said:

Training camp can't come soon enough. It amazes me just how many players, ex-players, pundits, call them what you will, seem to like Bowles immensely...

Chad does work for the Jets organization, he's not going to blast the HC.

 

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9 minutes ago, nyjunc said:

so you wouldn't agree he deserves some appreciation?  what exactly do you disagree w/?  (this should be interesting to read your perception).

you and I have had this exact discussion many times, not going down that road with you again.  I have been open to discussing who sanchez is at every stop on his career.  there is no reason to have that discussion today or ever again(hopefully).

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3 minutes ago, whodeawhodat said:

you and I have had this exact discussion many times, not going down that road with you again.  I have been open to discussing who sanchez is at every stop on his career.  there is no reason to have that discussion today or ever again(hopefully).

what does that have to do w/ appreciating winning more PO games w/ him than any other QB in Jets history?

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14 minutes ago, CanadienJetsFan said:

Training camp can't come soon enough. It amazes me just how many players, ex-players, pundits, call them what you will, seem to like Bowles immensely...

These comments are not meaningful. 

Q: What do you think about Bowles and his chances with the Jets?

A: I hope he has a chance to succeed.

Q: What do you about X and his chances with Y?

A: I hope he has a chance to succeed.

It's just an upbeat non-answer. 

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13 minutes ago, nyjunc said:

what does that have to do w/ appreciating winning more PO games w/ him than any other QB in Jets history?

That is your saving grace after all these years and all the chances sanchez has had around the league.  QB friendly coaches, little to no competition at the position.  now all you can do is hang your hat on the point that he was part of a run first team with a good defense that was successful.

 

And i know you remember our convos due to your little disclaimer at the end of your original post about not building him a statue ;) 

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19 minutes ago, whodeawhodat said:

That is your saving grace after all these years and all the chances sanchez has had around the league.  QB friendly coaches, little to no competition at the position.  now all you can do is hang your hat on the point that he was part of a run first team with a good defense that was successful.

 

And i know you remember our convos due to your little disclaimer at the end of your original post about not building him a statue ;) 

I don't get your point? You are acting like I said he was all pro caliber.  I don't care what he did when he left(though he was damn good in Philly in 2014), I care about what he did here and we don't make those runs w/o him so I appreciate what he did. If we had him in 2015 our playoff drought would be over.

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1 hour ago, nyjunc said:

I don't get your point? You are acting like I said he was all pro caliber.  I don't care what he did when he left(though he was damn good in Philly in 2014), I care about what he did here and we don't make those runs w/o him so I appreciate what he did. If we had him in 2015 our playoff drought would be over.

This is where you overrate Sanchez. You give him to much credit for the 09 and 10 success. Because Mark Sanchez, a very at best average QB on a really strong team made the playoffs in his first two seasons in the NFL does not mean that he would have got the job done with the 2015 Jets.

You're looking at it along the lines of "well he's clutch and has had some big wins for us, so we wouldn't have blown that game in Buffalo with him" when in reality Mark Sanchez has also helped give away games during his career with the Jets, or has just played games poorly where the Jets have gone on to lose. Maybe Mark does beat the Bills the final week in 2015, but maybe he doesn't pick up that clutch first down against the Giants on QB  keeper a few weeks before that to keep the Jets hopes alive in a game they would go on to win.

To make a blanket statement like "If we had him in 2015 our playoff drought would be over" shows how you overrate him. He's not Peyton Manning, Tom Brady, Rodgers, etc. He's Mark Sanchez, a very average QB at best, at best....

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32 minutes ago, ScarletKnight89 said:

This is where you overrate Sanchez. You give him to much credit for the 09 and 10 success. Because Mark Sanchez, a very at best average QB on a really strong team made the playoffs in his first two seasons in the NFL does not mean that he would have got the job done with the 2015 Jets.

You're looking at it along the lines of "well he's clutch and has had some big wins for us, so we wouldn't have blown that game in Buffalo with him" when in reality Mark Sanchez has also helped give away games during his career with the Jets, or has just played games poorly where the Jets have gone on to lose. Maybe Mark does beat the Bills the final week in 2015, but maybe he doesn't pick up that clutch first down against the Giants on QB  keeper a few weeks before that to keep the Jets hopes alive in a game they would go on to win.

To make a blanket statement like "If we had him in 2015 our playoff drought would be over" shows how you overrate him. He's not Peyton Manning, Tom Brady, Rodgers, etc. He's Mark Sanchez, a very average QB at best, at best....

I give him proper credit unlike most who give him zero.  we were a QB that could make big plays in big spots away from being a playoff team in 2015.  we had all the pieces we had in 2009 and 2010 yet we couldn't get it done against a dead Bills team.

 

Mark has certainly given away games here and there(not as many as you guys like to credit him for) but he's played well in big games more often than he hasn't and he never crapped the bed in a win and in type game like Fitz did.

I truly believe if we had a QB like Mark we make the playoffs in 2015 and can go on a run. he's not Peyton Manning, a guy like Peyton gets you to the POs every year which Mark cannot BUT you can get there w/ Mark and once in he played really well- better than supposed much better QBs.  he didn't hold his team back like Peyton so often did or like a Rivers, etc...

Mark is an average QB that can elevate, I'd rather have that than a big #s guy who comes up small in big spots.

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9 hours ago, Dunnie said:

 


So the only 'good' coach we have had was parcels ???


Sent from my iPhone using JetNation.com mobile app

I mean, I guess I liked Mangini as a coach, but he definitely had his warts.  Rex was an amazing DC and a great guy to root for, but he couldn't manage the team at all, knew very little about the offensive game management and let the lockerroom devolve into a total sh*tshow.  Benefit of having a great roster and a ball control offense and attacking defense.  But it disintegrated very quickly. Herm was just a joke as a coach. He could really motivate his guys, a great mentor type, but that's about all.  Players loved Herm and Rex.  That is never a good sign.  Players need to respect their coaches, not want to go out for a beer and a lapdance with them.  Mangini probably was our best "coach" over the post Parcells time frame.  If he had a real GM he reported to and was kept in check instead of being given the keys to the franchise and a puppet GM and total control...who knows?  The guy did everything the right way.  But the poor players didn't like having to be accountable for everything and work harder than they felt they needed to.  If he was put in a situation where he was being managed by an established GM and was given limited control, things may have turned out different. But our special little richie rich owner is forever learning on the job every year for the past 17 years or whatever and still hasn't figured anything out.

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13 hours ago, rex-n-effect said:

These comments are not meaningful. 

Q: What do you think about Bowles and his chances with the Jets?

A: I hope he has a chance to succeed.

Q: What do you about X and his chances with Y?

A: I hope he has a chance to succeed.

It's just an upbeat non-answer. 

Agreed, you can't expect someone like Pennington to come out and blast the current coach. Plus, he's connected to the Jets franchise both currently and in the past.

Still, I haven't heard anyone else  (who are not affiliated with the Jets and are paid to comment and or criticize ) come out and blast Bowles...

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On ‎7‎/‎17‎/‎2017 at 4:45 PM, nyjunc said:

I give him proper credit unlike most who give him zero.  we were a QB that could make big plays in big spots away from being a playoff team in 2015.  we had all the pieces we had in 2009 and 2010 yet we couldn't get it done against a dead Bills team.

 

Mark has certainly given away games here and there(not as many as you guys like to credit him for) but he's played well in big games more often than he hasn't and he never crapped the bed in a win and in type game like Fitz did.

I truly believe if we had a QB like Mark we make the playoffs in 2015 and can go on a run. he's not Peyton Manning, a guy like Peyton gets you to the POs every year which Mark cannot BUT you can get there w/ Mark and once in he played really well- better than supposed much better QBs.  he didn't hold his team back like Peyton so often did or like a Rivers, etc...

Mark is an average QB that can elevate, I'd rather have that than a big #s guy who comes up small in big spots.

Mark had a knack for coming up big in a big spot. He played very well in the playoffs. But he could also lose any week to any team as well. Fitz played very well in 2015, he stinks but he had a good season. There were games we won with him that we may not have won with Mark. Not because Mark isn't as good, but because they are both shaky players at the position and either one could fall apart against any team in any game.

More is expected out of guys like Peyton and Rivers than it is out of Mark. Mark was asked not to lose games. Peyton and Rivers were high level players who were going to be the reason there team either won or lost. In Marks first playoff game Rex asked him to throw the ball only 16 times. He did a good job in that game, but the Jets were clearly afraid of him airing it out. Rivers has played 9 postseason games and was only asked to throw the ball under 25 times twice. More was expected out of Rivers and obviously Manning because they were/are better players.

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On 7/17/2017 at 11:59 AM, nyjunc said:

I don't get your point? You are acting like I said he was all pro caliber.  I don't care what he did when he left(though he was damn good in Philly in 2014), I care about what he did here and we don't make those runs w/o him so I appreciate what he did. If we had him in 2015 our playoff drought would be over.

In his damn good year, he appeared in 9 games, starting 8, and threw 11 interceptions and added 7 fumbles. He started 4-1, finished 1-3 with the team out of the playoffs (After Nick Foles got them out to a 6-2 start). There's a reason this guy is currently employed as a third string QB. 

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1 hour ago, ScarletKnight89 said:

Mark had a knack for coming up big in a big spot. He played very well in the playoffs. But he could also lose any week to any team as well. Fitz played very well in 2015, he stinks but he had a good season. There were games we won with him that we may not have won with Mark. Not because Mark isn't as good, but because they are both shaky players at the position and either one could fall apart against any team in any game.

More is expected out of guys like Peyton and Rivers than it is out of Mark. Mark was asked not to lose games. Peyton and Rivers were high level players who were going to be the reason there team either won or lost. In Marks first playoff game Rex asked him to throw the ball only 16 times. He did a good job in that game, but the Jets were clearly afraid of him airing it out. Rivers has played 9 postseason games and was only asked to throw the ball under 25 times twice. More was expected out of Rivers and obviously Manning because they were/are better players.

mark cost us very few games and there wasn't really a game in 2015 that we couldn't have won with him(and there were games we lost we could have won w/ him).

Peyton and Rivers were more often than not the reason their teams lost in postseason including when we beat the Chargers in the '09 div rd where Rivers played like a rookie and Mark like a vet.

In Mark's first playoff game he was 13-16 w/ 2 of them drops including what would have been a 50+ yd TD.  they got a lead and stopped throwing.

In Mark's 4 wins he averaged 24 attempts, in the 2 losses he averaged 32 attempts.  why? b/c we trailed by more than a score in the 2 losses while in the 4 wins our largest deficit was 7.

In Rivers' 5 PO losses he averaged 34 attempts, in his 4 wins(3 really, his backup won one of the games) he averaged 25.  pretty similar to Mark.

Rivers is the better reg season QB, Mark the better postseason QB.  I would trust mark in a big game more than the overrated Rivers wh had one of the most talented rosters in football the first half of his career and only made 1 title game when his backup led the GW TD drive.

 

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22 minutes ago, slats said:

In his damn good year, he appeared in 9 games, starting 8, and threw 11 interceptions and added 7 fumbles. He started 4-1, finished 1-3 with the team out of the playoffs (After Nick Foles got them out to a 6-2 start). There's a reason this guy is currently employed as a third string QB. 

both QBs started 8 games. Foles was 6-2(really 5-2 as Mark came in tie game and led Philly to win in Houston), Mark 4-4.  looks bad but let's dig deeper, shall we?

in 8 games Foles started they faced just 2 playoff teams, going 1-1 against Indy and Ari

In 8 games mark started 5 were against playoff bound teams- actually 5 were against the NFC final 4 that year- 2 vs. Dallas, 1 vs. Sea, GB and Car

so we can see he faced the MUCH, MUCH, MUCH tougher portion of the schedule.

w/ that much tougher sched let's look at the pts the QBs led their O to.(we'll prorate the Houston game)

w/ Fole in 7 games:

O averaged 22 points per game

w/ sanchez in essentially 9 games:

O averaged 27.1 PPG

against a MUCH tougher part of sched the O average over 5 more PPG, almost a TD more per game but yeah it was Mark's fault why they went 4-4 w/ him starting and missed the playoffs.

 

 

 

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Peyton Manning averaged almost 20 more yards per playoff game than Sanchez has ever thrown for.  He has more 400 yard playoff games than Sanchez has 200 yard playoff games.   Sure, let's play compare.  Stick to comparing him to Nick Foles.  He doesn't do so well there either, but at least you aren't looking at a 72-hour hold.

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21 minutes ago, nyjunc said:

mark cost us very few games and there wasn't really a game in 2015 that we couldn't have won with him(and there were games we lost we could have won w/ him).

Peyton and Rivers were more often than not the reason their teams lost in postseason including when we beat the Chargers in the '09 div rd where Rivers played like a rookie and Mark like a vet.

In Mark's first playoff game he was 13-16 w/ 2 of them drops including what would have been a 50+ yd TD.  they got a lead and stopped throwing.

In Mark's 4 wins he averaged 24 attempts, in the 2 losses he averaged 32 attempts.  why? b/c we trailed by more than a score in the 2 losses while in the 4 wins our largest deficit was 7.

In Rivers' 5 PO losses he averaged 34 attempts, in his 4 wins(3 really, his backup won one of the games) he averaged 25.  pretty similar to Mark.

Rivers is the better reg season QB, Mark the better postseason QB.  I would trust mark in a big game more than the overrated Rivers wh had one of the most talented rosters in football the first half of his career and only made 1 title game when his backup led the GW TD drive.

 

Mark Sanchez was the 5th overall pick in the 2009 draft. You're not grading him on a fair scale. He had so many bad games as a Jets QB. Yeah, the game might not have fell squarely on his shoulders, but he played poorly in so many games. When you draft a guy 5th overall, you expect him to elevate your team. There should have been games we had where he carried us to victory. He couldn't do that,

Mark Sanchez is not a better QB than Phillip Rivers. I'm not going to get into numbers because it's ridiculous. He's clearly a better player than Mark Sanchez who is hanging on to a job in this league by a thread while only being 30 years old.

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8 minutes ago, ScarletKnight89 said:

Mark Sanchez was the 5th overall pick in the 2009 draft. You're not grading him on a fair scale. He had so many bad games as a Jets QB. Yeah, the game might not have fell squarely on his shoulders, but he played poorly in so many games. When you draft a guy 5th overall, you expect him to elevate your team. There should have been games we had where he carried us to victory. He couldn't do that,

Mark Sanchez is not a better QB than Phillip Rivers. I'm not going to get into numbers because it's ridiculous. He's clearly a better player than Mark Sanchez who is hanging on to a job in this league by a thread while only being 30 years old.

I agree with completely but in fairness.... 2010 Mark was a stud and brought us back from defeat on several occasions.  

Unrortunately for us, game 3 2009  was more a true example of what Mark would be like much of his career. 

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