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Scouting the qbs for next year thread


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We have certainly talked about that.  Extensively.  I could write about 5 pages on the Hackenberg situation and the thought process there, but I don't want to waste too much time on it in a prospects

You'd be doing plenty of this:

Here's my Rosen hot take: he's playing better the more he gets his ass kicked, which will be an extremely valuable trait for whatever quarterback we conscript to play here next May. 

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2 hours ago, dbatesman said:

He makes terrible mistakes, he has major injury concerns, and everyone hates his guts. I honestly cannot think of a more likely first-round pick for the Jets.

We'll see how he progresses.  So far he's got 33 TDs to 16 picks.  His teammates let a ton of TDs go through their hands too.  2:1 isn't bad going to your Junior year at all. The biggest statistical jump is usually year 3.

I don't see injury actually being an issue since he's only had one major injury to date.  Haven't really heard much about anything else.  Regardless, he's since bulked up since then.  I personally think he'll be fine, health-wise.

Many teammates and coaches have spoken out against the "he's hated" rumors.  It came from WalterFootball who I'll never give the time of day.  Jameis Winston and Cam had their attitudes come into question big time and they're both doing just fine right now.  I'd kill to have either one.  Is Josh outspoken and opinionated?  Sure.  Cocky and arrogant?  I don't know a QB who isn't.  If he can back it up on the field, I won't care much. Rivers and Ben are supposedly gigantic douche canoes.  They're just good at what they do.  This isn't Johnny 8-ball.  It's just an outspoken college kid with "top dog" syndrome.

Again, we'll see if he finally puts it all together this year.  I like him a ton.  It's a long way to go.  Darnold can come out for the rest of the year and look like the guy we thought he would be and this will all be moot come draft time.

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2 hours ago, Mogglez said:

Rudolph, Mayfield, and Falk really helped themselves this week.  Darnold isn't drawing too much criticism just yet.  Season is a long one.  We'll see.

Without saying too much to blow my guy's cover, some of you might remember that I'm close with someone close to the organization.  This was the same guy who gave me the Darron Lee and Fitzpatrick signings a day before they happened (I posted that here if you want "concrete" proof).  Well long story short, I caught up with this person this week and was able to get a little out of him.  Much to my delight, he told me that the Jets really like Rosen.  They REALLY like him.  More than Darnold in many areas.

UCLA and Texas A&M is a big game for us to keep an eye on tomorrow.  TUNE IN FELLAS.

Great news. I still like Rosen the most, so if the Jets ended up taking him I'd be ecstatic.

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32 minutes ago, King P said:

Great news. I still like Rosen the most, so if the Jets ended up taking him I'd be ecstatic.

If it means anything to you, according to him, their top 6 going into today was:

Darnold

Rosen

Rudolph

Falk

Mayfield

Allen

Right below that is the 2nd tier guys, Jackson, Browning, Stidham (who is FLYING up that list), etc.  

They're not as high on Allen as you would think, although there is room for that to change.  Right now, their thought process regarding him is pretty close to what made them throw Paxton Lynch so low on their board in 2016.  On the flip side, The team loves those top 3 a lot. A LOT.  That makes me happy because that's the same rankings I had going into the season.  Rosen and Darnold were considered interchangeable going into today.  The team is smitten with both guys.

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5 hours ago, Mogglez said:

Rudolph, Mayfield, and Falk really helped themselves this week.  Darnold isn't drawing too much criticism just yet.  Season is a long one.  We'll see.

Without saying too much to blow my guy's cover, some of you might remember that I'm close with someone close to the organization.  This was the same guy who gave me the Darron Lee and Fitzpatrick signings a day before they happened (I posted that here if you want "concrete" proof).  Well long story short, I caught up with this person this week and was able to get a little out of him.  Much to my delight, he told me that the Jets really like Rosen.  They REALLY like him.  More than Darnold in many areas.

UCLA and Texas A&M is a big game for us to keep an eye on tomorrow.  TUNE IN FELLAS.

Rosen is the guy, really not that impressed with Darnold at all

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6 hours ago, dbatesman said:

He makes terrible mistakes, he has major injury concerns, and everyone hates his guts. I honestly cannot think of a more likely first-round pick for the Jets.

I was gonna say this, too. That said, he's my favorite prospect simply because he's going to burn the franchise to the ground with his mouth. 

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7 hours ago, Mogglez said:

If it means anything to you, according to him, their top 6 going into today was:

Darnold

Rosen

Rudolph

Falk

Mayfield

Allen

Right below that is the 2nd tier guys, Jackson, Browning, Stidham (who is FLYING up that list), etc.  

They're not as high on Allen as you would think, although there is room for that to change.  Right now, their thought process regarding him is pretty close to what made them throw Paxton Lynch so low on their board in 2016.  On the flip side, The team loves those top 3 a lot. A LOT.  That makes me happy because that's the same rankings I had going into the season.  Rosen and Darnold were considered interchangeable going into today.  The team is smitten with both guys.

This is great, because my Top 3 is Rosen, Darnold, Rudolph. If we get a Top 3 pick, we'll be in great shape

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I;d be all in on Rosen if it wasn't for his injury.  If he proves he's 100% healthy and he continues to improve...great.  But that's a HUGE if.  I don't care about his politics or outspokenness.  Hopefully he gets an agent and PR team to keep his mouth in check and help him understand how he needs to be projecting himself if he wants to be a superstar.  But great to hear that we might have the top 3 QBs locked into the right spots as we start to scout them.

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15 hours ago, Mogglez said:

Rudolph, Mayfield, and Falk really helped themselves this week.  Darnold isn't drawing too much criticism just yet.  Season is a long one.  We'll see.

Without saying too much to blow my guy's cover, some of you might remember that I'm close with someone close to the organization.  This was the same guy who gave me the Darron Lee and Fitzpatrick signings a day before they happened (I posted that here if you want "concrete" proof).  Well long story short, I caught up with this person this week and was able to get a little out of him.  Much to my delight, he told me that the Jets really like Rosen.  They REALLY like him.  More than Darnold in many areas.

UCLA and Texas A&M is a big game for us to keep an eye on tomorrow.  TUNE IN FELLAS.

So two things come mind... They're not wrong for loving Rosen. He is the best QB-clay in nearly 2 decades... if he puts it all together this year, it's a no brainer. If he doesn't, then i'm sure we'll pass on him. Not a situation I stress about. If everyone played their best ball it's easily Rosen/Darnold/Falk as your top 3.. Questions though, who thoughts they could throw out 2-3 seasons of garbage tape and fix hackenberg. What the hell was up with that. Your pal every explain that one... cause it's not like he lit it up and college and we can pretend we got tricked.  

 

SIDE TOPIC: It's ridiculous how undervalued Lamar Jackson is by the public/draft-media. He's come SO far in 2 seasons as a passer. He deserves more respect. 

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2 minutes ago, Paradis said:

SIDE TOPIC: It's ridiculous how undervalued Lamar Jackson is by the public/draft-media. He's come SO far in 2 seasons as a passer. He deserves more respect.

I am 100% guilty of this, and 100% agree with you, Jackson has earned my respect, I thought midway through last year he was a NFL WR, but now he has definitely gotten my attention as a top QB prospect heading in to next years draft, I'd rank him in the top 5 for sure with the chance to be 2nd overall.

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4 minutes ago, Paradis said:

So two things come mind... They're not wrong for loving Rosen. He is the best QB-clay in nearly 2 decades... if he puts it all together this year, it's a no brainer. If he doesn't, then i'm sure we'll pass on him. Not a situation I stress about. If everyone played their best ball it's easily Rosen/Darnold/Falk as your top 3.. Questions though, who thoughts they could throw out 2-3 seasons of garbage tape and fix hackenberg. What the hell was up with that. Your pal every explain that one... cause it's not like he lit it up and college and we can pretend we got tricked.  

 

SIDE TOPIC: It's ridiculous how undervalued Lamar Jackson is by the public/draft-media. He's come SO far in 2 seasons as a passer. He deserves more respect. 

Also Falk has a pop gun arm, and shouldn't be considered as a 1st round talent at QB, maybe 3-5th round, he is accurate as all hell inside 10 yards, but after that he has nothing, and plays in the worst gimmick offense without elite arm talent so no thanks.

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Ya, I disagree that Faulk is in the top 3 if all are playing to their potential. He has a limited ceiling. Of course, as we all know decison making and accuracy trump prototype size and arm strength every time.

I do, however, agree that Lamar Jackson is the one to watch. Best athlete on the field every time he's on the field. Would he absorb too many hits in the NFL is the question with him. Still, love his combination of arm and athleticism.

Personally I think the super-stud to watch is Shea Patterson of Ole Miss. He's a 2019 guy, however. Think Manziel with better size and none of the baggage.  

For the record,  NOT advocating waiting til 2019. Just some food for thought as we follow these guys' careers.

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14 minutes ago, Lupz27 said:

I am 100% guilty of this, and 100% agree with you, Jackson has earned my respect, I thought midway through last year he was a NFL WR, but now he has definitely gotten my attention as a top QB prospect heading in to next years draft, I'd rank him in the top 5 for sure with the chance to be 2nd overall.

Watching him last night all I kept thinking was a tall Michael Vick . I don't know what he is yet, but he was absolutely amazing on last night .

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7 minutes ago, Mogglez said:

We have certainly talked about that.  Extensively.  I could write about 5 pages on the Hackenberg situation and the thought process there, but I don't want to waste too much time on it in a prospects thread.  For anyone who wants a little closure, it boils down to this:

The second they got him into the film room and interviews, they loved him.  Everyone I've ever spoken to about Hackenberg says the same thing:  In the film room, he's absolutely brilliant.  He retains information like a seasoned vet, is a great kid, and seems to have an excellent football mind.  This comes from my buddy and people he works with on the team, former teammates (I played high school ball with a WR of Hack's), and some PSU staff.  The major concerns that they had were that they felt that there was a chance that he was shell-shocked from his time behind the line of PSU.  Nothing really we didn't already know.  However, they felt that he was young enough to get over it and with some mechanical coaching, he could get back to being the QB everyone thought he could be.  After teams met with him 1-1, that notion was reinforced.  The Jets were not the only team who felt this way, if everything I've been told is true...for the record.  My friend felt more comfortable with him in the mid-bottom 3rd round/early 4th, but the consensus was that he wasn't going to be there.  2 other teams were targeting him in the early 3rd.  Macc, from my understanding, just didn't want to take the chance on him being taken and pulled the trigger.  I'm of the belief that if you believe in a guy, you go and get him.  Just don't be surprised if you have to answer for it when it's a gamble like the one they made.  That's for Macc to do though, not me.

As with any prospect, there were some people within who didn't fully believe that Hack could be put back together again, but the consensus belief was that the reward outweighed the risk and that, just like with Jimmy Clausen, as long as a first round pick wasn't used, you could move on quickly if it wasn't meant to be for Hack and you loved a QB coming out in the upcoming drafts. 

Where we stand now is that Hackenberg basically has, what I like to call, Jay Cutler syndrome going on.  In film study, game prep, there's no issues.  He can call out a blitz, read the Defense, know what play to check into, etc...when he gets onto the field, into the thick of things, with the game flying at 110MPH, everything he knows to do just never materializes.  It's disappointing.  There isn't a soul in that organization that doesn't feel frustrated or upset.  That's all I can really say at this point.  They're coming to the realization that the project likely won't pan out and putting all their focus into the evaluation of the other guys on the roster along with scouting the big name QBs on their list. Petty (to answer @nycdan) isn't hated or been forgotten about either...he will get his shot.  The injuries have not helped get him on the field though.  There was a decent chance we're looking at Bryce Week 1 if he wasn't injured...again.  He isn't full go yet.

I didn't think it was possible for me to have a lower opinion of the Jets front office, but this did it.

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4 minutes ago, dbatesman said:

I didn't think it was possible for me to have a lower opinion of the Jets front office, but this did it.

I'm there with you. This conversation was basically what put me into the IDGAF mood I'm now in regarding everyone in charge.  If they die, they die.  

For the record, my buddy is a good guy.  He just doesn't have the power to change the world to his liking (the team obvi).  You and him would probably get along real well, lol.

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I just watched Sam Darnold's highlights from yesterday and I have to admit I am not that impressed.  I think Petty is better at this point. Maybe the highlights didn't do justice and I haven't seen a full game, but from what I did see, Sam didn't look all that good.  I don't watch college football, so maybe he is legit.  Don't know.

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2 minutes ago, Mogglez said:

I'm there with you. This conversation was basically what put me into the IDGAF mood I'm now in regarding everyone in charge.  If they die, they die.  

For the record, my buddy is a good guy.  He just doesn't have the power to change the world to his liking (the team obvi).  You and him would probably get along real well, lol.

I honestly cannot imagine how frustrating it must be for a competent person to work for this dogsh*t outfit.

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19 minutes ago, Mogglez said:

We have certainly talked about that.  Extensively.  I could write about 5 pages on the Hackenberg situation and the thought process there, but I don't want to waste too much time on it in a prospects thread.  For anyone who wants a little closure, it boils down to this:

The second they got him into the film room and interviews, they loved him.  Everyone I've ever spoken to about Hackenberg says the same thing:  In the film room, he's absolutely brilliant.  He retains information like a seasoned vet, is a great kid, and seems to have an excellent football mind.  This comes from my buddy and people he works with on the team, former teammates (I played high school ball with a WR of Hack's), and some PSU staff.  The major concerns that they had were that they felt that there was a chance that he was shell-shocked from his time behind the line of PSU.  Nothing really we didn't already know.  However, they felt that he was young enough to get over it and with some mechanical coaching, he could get back to being the QB everyone thought he could be.  After teams met with him 1-1, that notion was reinforced.  The Jets were not the only team who felt this way, if everything I've been told is true...for the record.  My friend felt more comfortable with him in the mid-bottom 3rd round/early 4th, but the consensus was that he wasn't going to be there.  2 other teams were targeting him in the early 3rd.  Macc, from my understanding, just didn't want to take the chance on him being taken and pulled the trigger.  I'm of the belief that if you believe in a guy, you go and get him.  Just don't be surprised if you have to answer for it when it's a gamble like the one they made.  That's for Macc to do though, not me.

As with any prospect, there were some people within who didn't fully believe that Hack could be put back together again, but the consensus belief was that the reward outweighed the risk and that, just like with Jimmy Clausen, as long as a first round pick wasn't used, you could move on quickly if it wasn't meant to be for Hack and you loved a QB coming out in the upcoming drafts. 

Where we stand now is that Hackenberg basically has, what I like to call, Jay Cutler syndrome going on.  In film study, game prep, there's no issues.  He can call out a blitz, read the Defense, know what play to check into, etc...when he gets onto the field, into the thick of things, with the game flying at 110MPH, everything he knows to do just never materializes.  It's disappointing.  There isn't a soul in that organization that doesn't feel frustrated or upset.  That's all I can really say at this point.  They're coming to the realization that the project likely won't pan out and putting all their focus into the evaluation of the other guys on the roster along with scouting the big name QBs on their list. Petty (to answer @nycdan) isn't hated or been forgotten about either...he will get his shot.  The injuries have not helped get him on the field though.  There was a decent chance we're looking at Bryce Week 1 if he wasn't injured...again.  He isn't full go yet.

I hope that's enough for you to feel satisfied my friend.  I could go on about it for hours...but the skinny of it basically covers the important stuff.  I believed in the kid too...I'm not gonna lie.  I'll own it.  It stings me a bit to know I was totally wrong too...but it's not the first time and it won't be the last for me.  We'll see if Macc gets a chance to right his wrong at QB...if not, so be it.  I'm not a GM.  Him being wrong has far more consequences that he'll have to deal with.

I mean, cure someone of shell shock? Were they aware of who they had playing OL here?

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57 minutes ago, dbatesman said:

I honestly cannot imagine how frustrating it must be for a competent person to work for this dogsh*t outfit.

Lmao, we're both both big time scotch fans.

In all truth he loves what he does.  It's a great job and he's gained connections and experience that will last him a lifetime.  We love this goddamn sport and team so, even with the hiccups, he's at peace.  Don't get me wrong, he's frustrated as all hell that he doesn't have the say that he wants....but he knows how this business goes.  He's gotta claw his way to the top like every person before him.  He keeps his mouth shut around his bosses, does his job, and uses our talks as his healthy outlet for his own ideas :).

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1 minute ago, Mogglez said:

Lmao, we're both both big time scotch fans.

In all truth he loves what he does.  It's a great job and he's gained connections and experience that will last him a lifetime.  We love this goddamn sport and team so, even with the hiccups, he's at peace.  Don't get me wrong, he's frustrated as all hell that he doesn't have the say that he wants....but he knows how this business goes.  He keeps his mouth shut around his bosses, and uses our talks as his healthy outlet :)

What's going on here is sad, and I don't meant anything the Jets did or may have done .

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On 9/2/2017 at 3:50 PM, Joe W. Namath said:

I agree.  All offseason to prepare and you come out like that?  I understand struggling against a better team but those numbers are pathetic.  Off my board as well.

A WEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEE  bit hasty.

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7 minutes ago, T0mShane said:

I mean, cure someone of shell shock? Were they aware of who they had playing OL here?

Honestly, maybe it's the last shred of optimism, but I think with a QB who knows how to call the right protections, they'll be ok.  Middle of the pack is what I'm expecting at the very least.

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38 minutes ago, Tinstar said:

What's going on here is sad, and I don't meant anything the Jets did or may have done .

That's great for you.  

Sorry if hearing what you didn't want to hear is "sad".  I'm not going behind anyone's back to share this and if you don't want to hear it then ignore it.  No need to get passive aggressive because I figured that maybe some people wanted to actually hear about some of the behind the scenes stuff of an NFL organization, let alone the one we all root for and love.  Nothing I said was meant to be taken as criticism or slander.  It was a simple explanation to one of the more polarizing decisions this team has made in recent years.  Even a fan of Hackenberg knows that this pick was more outside the box than not.  I never said that there's mutiny awaiting Maccagnan or anything like that.  If you took it all that way, then that speaks more about Macc's job performance and the way you believe he's perceived than anything else.

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20 minutes ago, JetFreak89 said:

Just wanted to let you know that the post above about Hack was really interesting and it's great to hear an "insider's perspective" of what's been going on lately. Don't let the ignoramuses of the site get in your head, I'm sure the vast majority of posters appreciate it, like I do. 

Thank you.  It means a lot to know it's appreciated.  

I'm lucky to have a buddy for years who let's me in on the inner workings of the team, let alone one who is completely comfortable with me sharing the things that I have.  At the end of the day, I'd never say anything that would put his career at stake.  What he green-lights is what I'll divulge. Nothing more, nothing less.  He lurks here too, loves the place, knows that it's just a forum filled with people who are just as passionate as we were growing up, and feels cool with me passing on information.  Not "anonymouz" criticisms, ala Mehta, ....just tidbits of information.  I guess for some, that information doesn't jive with their own opinions and it causes some hurt feelings.  Not gonna change anything for me or him.  It won't stop me from passing on nuggets here and there.

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