Mecca Posted November 8, 2017 Share Posted November 8, 2017 Alright boys... lets start this hype train. Lamar's improvement as a passer this year has been fascinating to watch. He's no longer just a pure runner. His arm strength has potential to be elite. Accuracy is improving. Athleticism is the best at QB since Mike Vick. Jackson's hype is soaring as 'nfldraftscout'- a draft advisor for the NFL that posts on IG ranks him as the #1 QB in the 2018 draft. Don't let his completion % startle you. His WR's lead the league in drop %. He has no talent around him. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stark Posted November 8, 2017 Share Posted November 8, 2017 no hype train to start here. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Adoni Beast Posted November 8, 2017 Share Posted November 8, 2017 Once projected 2nd round pick, will go in the top 10 for sure. He has a lot of potential and can be good in the right system. Not sure he fits our offense though, unless you're willing to have an offense completely tailor made for him. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mecca Posted November 8, 2017 Author Share Posted November 8, 2017 9 minutes ago, Adoni Beast said: Once projected 2nd round pick, will go in the top 10 for sure. He has a lot of potential and can be good in the right system. Not sure he fits our offense though, unless you're willing to have an offense completely tailor made for him. I'd say he fits the offense. Quick short passing is where Lamar would excel because it minimizes reads Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mecca Posted November 8, 2017 Author Share Posted November 8, 2017 13 minutes ago, Stark said: no hype train to start here. Ironic someone that loves Mayfield hates Jackson. lol Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stark Posted November 8, 2017 Share Posted November 8, 2017 23 minutes ago, Mecca said: Ironic someone that loves Mayfield hates Jackson. lol I dont hate Jackson, I just said no hype train. And while I do like Mayfield I wouldn't say that I love him, I like what he can do but still have some reservations of him. As I have a lot more questions on Jackson than Mayfield. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mecca Posted November 8, 2017 Author Share Posted November 8, 2017 2 minutes ago, Stark said: I dont hate Jackson, I just said no hype train. And while I do like Mayfield I wouldn't say that I love him, I like what he can do but still have some reservations of him. As I have a lot more questions on Jackson than Mayfield. The hype train is evident as he's picked up steam as a first round pick. Yes, he's polarized, but his tools are real. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stark Posted November 8, 2017 Share Posted November 8, 2017 2 minutes ago, Mecca said: The hype train is evident as he's picked up steam as a first round pick. Yes, he's polarized, but his tools are real. Arm strength - check speed & quickness - check, rare running ability yes, exciting to watch. ability to get through reads - no check, usually leaves pocket to run if 1st read isn't there play from the pocket - a little better than previous season but still weak in pocket. throwing technique - little abnormal, has some balls sail on him and also doesn't step into his passes consistently. completion percentage - 60% and this is his high, yes a lot of drops, but he also misses some open throws Like I said I don't hate Jackson, but he has a lot to clean up/fix Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Adoni Beast Posted November 8, 2017 Share Posted November 8, 2017 44 minutes ago, Mecca said: I'd say he fits the offense. Quick short passing is where Lamar would excel because it minimizes reads West coast offense is complex and requires full read scans. Quick, short/intermediate throws are essential yes, but along with that you need a quarterback who is accurate. I'm not saying Lamar can't be that guy. But, I don't see the fit. Just like the second we signed Morton I knew Hackenberg didn't fit it either. I think he is an exciting player and very underrated. I just don't see him in a west coast offense. Drafting players is all about fit for your team. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mecca Posted November 8, 2017 Author Share Posted November 8, 2017 47 minutes ago, Stark said: Arm strength - check speed & quickness - check, rare running ability yes, exciting to watch. ability to get through reads - no check, usually leaves pocket to run if 1st read isn't there play from the pocket - a little better than previous season but still weak in pocket. throwing technique - little abnormal, has some balls sail on him and also doesn't step into his passes consistently. completion percentage - 60% and this is his high, yes a lot of drops, but he also misses some open throws Like I said I don't hate Jackson, but he has a lot to clean up/fix His play in the pocket has strengthened dramatically. Last year he was a RB. This year he's staying confident in the pocket. Completion % - I'll point out how his weapons lead the NCAA in drop % with 0 pro talent on offense. Speed and quickness isn't just a check. It's literally other worldly. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Philc1 Posted November 8, 2017 Share Posted November 8, 2017 Lamar is a much better passer than the people who know everything think Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dbatesman Posted November 8, 2017 Share Posted November 8, 2017 He's completing 60.4% of his passes this season, and that's actually a huge improvement over the last two years. Hard pass. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stark Posted November 8, 2017 Share Posted November 8, 2017 34 minutes ago, Mecca said: His play in the pocket has strengthened dramatically. Last year he was a RB. This year he's staying confident in the pocket. Completion % - I'll point out how his weapons lead the NCAA in drop % with 0 pro talent on offense. Speed and quickness isn't just a check. It's literally other worldly. I mentioned the drops. His play in the pocket has strengthened dramatically, and its still just average. He is a prime example of needing another year in school IMO Agree on speed and quickness Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stark Posted November 8, 2017 Share Posted November 8, 2017 31 minutes ago, Philc1 said: Lamar is a much better passer than the people who know everything think LOL sure, he is just now hitting 60% and still can't consistently stay in the pocket to get to his 2nd or 3rd read. He just needs more time developing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mecca Posted November 8, 2017 Author Share Posted November 8, 2017 3 hours ago, dbatesman said: He's completing 60.4% of his passes this season, and that's actually a huge improvement over the last two years. Hard pass. Stat has some fallacies in it. Louisville leads NCAAFB in drop pass rate. That is 5-10% off your percentages. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bla bla bla Posted November 8, 2017 Share Posted November 8, 2017 Honestly I wouldn't be upset with Jackson, I think he is electric but I have my heart set on Mayfield. He just feels like he belongs here. Guy has always played with a ship on his shoulder since walking on to Texas Tech. It's not fair to compare him to RG3 much like it's not fair to compare Mayfield to Manziel but I'm afraid Jackson is going to take a big hit and be knocked out. His body just looks like it wouldn't be able to withstand an NFL pounding. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dbatesman Posted November 8, 2017 Share Posted November 8, 2017 13 minutes ago, Mecca said: Stat has some fallacies in it. Louisville leads NCAAFB in drop pass rate. That is 5-10% off your percentages. oh ok nvm Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CotcheryifyouCan Posted November 8, 2017 Share Posted November 8, 2017 im in why not ? I mean i rather have rosen or darnold but hes not a bad consolation prize. would u rather roll the dice on him or draft another db in the first after we sign a vet qb Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paradis Posted November 9, 2017 Share Posted November 9, 2017 14 hours ago, Stark said: ability to get through reads - no check, usually leaves pocket to run if 1st read isn't there 12 hours ago, Stark said: can't consistently stay in the pocket to get to his 2nd or 3rd read. He just needs more time developing. That's actually not true at all. I'm not sure what games you're watching, but Lamar stands tall and reads the field just fine. Huge strides in that department in 2016... 2017? Hasn't been an issue IMO. His accuracy and placement - different story. But staying in the pocket? That's not an accurate complaint. I've been high on Lamar periodically, but after watching him more and more, i think you're going to get a player who fits somewhere between Newton and Taylor..., can bring enough natural talent to the table to put a good team over into championship material. I don't know if you can ask him to carry a team the way newton does for 16 weeks though. He gets too streaky when asked to do everything. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Philc1 Posted November 9, 2017 Share Posted November 9, 2017 I think the people who want us to pass on Jackson need to realize we have no shot at Darnold, Mayfield, Rosen and probably not even Allen falls to us if he kills it in workouts which he will Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paradis Posted November 9, 2017 Share Posted November 9, 2017 3 hours ago, Philc1 said: I think the people who want us to pass on Jackson need to realize we have no shot at Darnold, Mayfield, Rosen and probably not even Allen falls to us if he kills it in workouts which he will If we’re using history (and present rumours) as a measure, I’d say we have a much better chance of trading up to #1 or 2 then we do selecting whomever falls to us. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Philc1 Posted November 9, 2017 Share Posted November 9, 2017 29 minutes ago, Paradis said: If we’re using history (and present rumours) as a measure, I’d say we have a much better chance of trading up to #1 or 2 then we do selecting whomever falls to us. We can trade up to 1 or 2 but get ready to offer the entire draft Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paradis Posted November 9, 2017 Share Posted November 9, 2017 8 minutes ago, Philc1 said: We can trade up to 1 or 2 but get ready to offer the entire draft Yes we will, that’s ok. Do you think the Rams or the Eagles regret mortgaging their draft to get their respective quarterbacks? Do you think our GM regrets not throwing in the extra third pic that would’ve got us Wentz right now? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
maury77 Posted November 10, 2017 Share Posted November 10, 2017 10 hours ago, Paradis said: Yes we will, that’s ok. Do you think the Rams or the Eagles regret mortgaging their draft to get their respective quarterbacks? Do you think our GM regrets not throwing in the extra third pic that would’ve got us Wentz right now? Exactly. The only way the Jets are going to escape the neverending cycle of mediocrity is by making a bold move. Get the franchise QB and let him and Adams be the face of the franchise for the next 10 years. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mecca Posted November 10, 2017 Author Share Posted November 10, 2017 2 minutes ago, maury77 said: Exactly. The only way the Jets are going to escape the neverending cycle of mediocrity is by making a bold move. Get the franchise QB and let him and Adams be the face of the franchise for the next 10 years. Don't disagree. However, as the draft gets closer and closer Darnold and Rosen continue to drop on big boards. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
maury77 Posted November 10, 2017 Share Posted November 10, 2017 As for the criticisms of Jackson's processing speed, I recommend that you read this article: http://insidethepylon.com/pylon-u/teams-ncaa/division-ia-fbs/acc/louisville-cardinals/2017/08/07/lamar-jackson-and-the-thought-process-from-the-pocket/ Mark Schofield, a former college QB and attorney, is IMO the best guy on the net when it comes to evaluating QBs. He picked Wentz and Watson as the best QBs coming out of the last 2 drafts. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mecca Posted November 10, 2017 Author Share Posted November 10, 2017 Don't look now, but Erik Galco of Sporting News reports that the Jets see him as a perfect fit for Morton's offense: https://twitter.com/OptimumScouting/status/928278802140102656 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paradis Posted November 10, 2017 Share Posted November 10, 2017 1 hour ago, Mecca said: Don't look now, but Erik Galco of Sporting News reports that the Jets see him as a perfect fit for Morton's offense: https://twitter.com/OptimumScouting/status/928278802140102656 nice to hear, but Eric is writing for retweets. Scouts/teams are still balls deep in evaluation mode. No franchise is romanticizing a fit with a QB at this point in time. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
maury77 Posted November 10, 2017 Share Posted November 10, 2017 5 hours ago, Paradis said: nice to hear, but Eric is writing for retweets. Scouts/teams are still balls deep in evaluation mode. No franchise is romanticizing a fit with a QB at this point in time. I'll post some Jackson film over here once the season ends. Draft Breakdown just switched to a paid subscription and I'm not in the mood to shell out any $$$ right now. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stark Posted November 10, 2017 Share Posted November 10, 2017 On 11/9/2017 at 12:36 AM, Paradis said: That's actually not true at all. I'm not sure what games you're watching, but Lamar stands tall and reads the field just fine. Huge strides in that department in 2016... 2017? Hasn't been an issue IMO. His accuracy and placement - different story. But staying in the pocket? That's not an accurate complaint. I've been high on Lamar periodically, but after watching him more and more, i think you're going to get a player who fits somewhere between Newton and Taylor..., can bring enough natural talent to the table to put a good team over into championship material. I don't know if you can ask him to carry a team the way newton does for 16 weeks though. He gets too streaky when asked to do everything. I do agree he is showing a willingness to stand in the pocket this year, but in the plays I have seen it seems like he is forcing himself to do it, that it doesn't seem natural yet. I will try to watch him more the rest of the way to see if I am just missing it. That being said I don't have a problem with Jackson, I said earlier I have him as the 4th QB to this point (if Darnold doesn't leave SC then he is 3rd) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stark Posted November 10, 2017 Share Posted November 10, 2017 20 hours ago, Paradis said: Yes we will, that’s ok. Do you think the Rams or the Eagles regret mortgaging their draft to get their respective quarterbacks? Do you think our GM regrets not throwing in the extra third pic that would’ve got us Wentz right now? Agree. No one in Philly is upset about it right now, nor anyone in LA. Mac should be kicking himself for not throwing the extra pick. Wentz in this offense would be fun to watch. Everyone saying that they don't want to give multiple picks for a QB needs to realize that, it is the going rate. For a team that hasn't had jack sh!t at QB in decades I am more surprised at the people that say they don't want to give up draft picks for potential franchise QB. We can sit here and be mediocre and scared to go get the QB we want, or we can go all in and maybe get the guy that will carry this franchise for the next 10-14 years. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mecca Posted November 10, 2017 Author Share Posted November 10, 2017 1 hour ago, Stark said: Agree. No one in Philly is upset about it right now, nor anyone in LA. Mac should be kicking himself for not throwing the extra pick. Wentz in this offense would be fun to watch. Everyone saying that they don't want to give multiple picks for a QB needs to realize that, it is the going rate. For a team that hasn't had jack sh!t at QB in decades I am more surprised at the people that say they don't want to give up draft picks for potential franchise QB. We can sit here and be mediocre and scared to go get the QB we want, or we can go all in and maybe get the guy that will carry this franchise for the next 10-14 years. This is it right here. The fundamental flaw of the Jets' organization is playing possum at QB. Spending 2nd rounders on a QB is what GM's do when they're scared to take risks and potentially lose their job. IE Clemens, Geno, Hack.. Sanchez was the team's singular first round pick QB since Pennington. If Mayfield is our guy, you take him round 1. If Rosen is our guy, you open up the cupboard for him. Ideally, I'd prefer Jackson or Mayfield rather than trading up for Darnold/Rosen as I think they're superior prospects, but either way, you can't wait until round 2-3 again. You need to go all in. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Philc1 Posted November 11, 2017 Share Posted November 11, 2017 22 hours ago, Mecca said: This is it right here. The fundamental flaw of the Jets' organization is playing possum at QB. Spending 2nd rounders on a QB is what GM's do when they're scared to take risks and potentially lose their job. IE Clemens, Geno, Hack.. Sanchez was the team's singular first round pick QB since Pennington. If Mayfield is our guy, you take him round 1. If Rosen is our guy, you open up the cupboard for him. Ideally, I'd prefer Jackson or Mayfield rather than trading up for Darnold/Rosen as I think they're superior prospects, but either way, you can't wait until round 2-3 again. You need to go all in. Agree we absolutely have to draft a qb in the first round But we wont Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
maury77 Posted November 11, 2017 Share Posted November 11, 2017 Good breakdown on Jackson http://settingedge.com/nfl-draft-video-lamar-jackson-qb-louisville-scouting-report Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RESNewYork Posted November 15, 2017 Share Posted November 15, 2017 Big fan and I would be ecstatic if we picked up Lamar Jackson. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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