QB Prospects (A Lengthy List)

[Augustiniak]

1 minute ago, Pac said:

So realistically it's Jackson, Mayfield, or Allen right?

And Macc will have to in all likelyhood move up to get the one he likes the most?

I've never seen any of them play but Jackson sure does sound like he'd be the most fun to watch.

or bridgewater, or mccown, or smith, or mccarron, or......

[JoJoTownsell1]

9 minutes ago, faba said:

Jackson gives you the mobility you need in  a QB especially in todays NFL  would not be upset if we took the flyer on him

If you watch him run,  he gives you the mobility you need to win the olympic 100m race. The guy is a freak. The problem is he is not a refined QB. Not even close. 

I won't be upset if we take him, but you run the risk of drafting a glorified WR. 

[Pac]

6 minutes ago, Augustiniak said:

or bridgewater, or mccown, or smith, or mccarron, or......

I think it's very unlikely that Macc tries to sell this fanbase one of those guys with Petty and Hack..  no way.

I'd say there's a 95% chance we're drafting a QB with the 1st pick and the other 5% is a Cousins signing.

McCown was great for this team in the first year of a rebuild but it's time to enter phase II.  I could definitely see them re-signing him to mentor the rookie QB and play if necessary but I think they're highly motivated to get a long term solution in place.

[JoJoTownsell1]

30 minutes ago, JiF said:

Not sure what Watson setting the league on firing at a record setting pace has to do with the 2018 QB draft class but thanks for this informative post. 

Every QB outside of Peyton/Luck/Elway comes with question marks. Goff and Wentz came with question marks also. Not sure why you are getting all worked up about the flaws in Rosen/Darnold/Mayfield etc.. Are they the perfect QB prospect? No. But neither was Rodgers and Wentz and Big Ben and Eli etcc (forget Brady who was off everyones radar). 

The fact is that these guys are the best group of QB prospects (flaws and all) in a long time. Despite what you are saying, this is a great year to head into the draft needing a QB. Period. 

[JoJoTownsell1]

2 minutes ago, Pac said:

I think it's very unlikely that Macc tries to sell this fanbase one of those guys with Petty and Hack..  no way.

I'd say there's a 95% chance we're drafting a QB with the 1st pick and the other 5% is a Cousins signing.

McCown was great for this team in the first year of a rebuild but it's time to enter phase II.  I could definitely see them re-signing him to mentor the rookie QB and play if necessary but I think they're highly motivated to get a long term solution in place.

Agreed. The only problem with bringing Mccown back is Bowles. You CANNOT give Bowles the choice of a rookie or Mccown or he will default to the old vet every-time because he is coaching for his life and not to better the franchise long term. 

I would LOVE to fire Bowles, bring in Obrien and give him the security to what is right for the next 4-5 years and not just for 2018. But for some reason  everyone thinks Bowles is safe and that scares me. 

[faba]

4 minutes ago, JoJoTownsell1 said:

If you watch him run,  he gives you the mobility you need to win the olympic 100m race. The guy is a freak. The problem is he is not a refined QB. Not even close. 

I won't be upset if we take him, but you run the risk of drafting a glorified WR. 

You are going have question marks with any of these top guys Do not expect any of them just to step and be a star. I will take someone that has atheticism to mold around

[Augustiniak]

1 minute ago, Pac said:

I think it's very unlikely that Macc tries to sell this fanbase one of those guys with Petty and Hack..  no way.

I'd say there's a 95% chance we're drafting a QB with the 1st pick and the other 5% is a Cousins signing.

McCown was great for this team in the first year of a rebuild but it's time to enter phase II.  I could definitely see them re-signing him to mentor the rookie QB and play if necessary but I think they're highly motivated to get a long term solution in place.

a few years ago, mccagnan had time on his side, he could afford to pick BAP and draft qbs in later rounds hoping one would show promise.  he's 0 for 2 in qbs, but he's done a lot better with retreads.  i could easily see him trading a 3rd rounder for a bridgewater, then drafting a guy like mason rudolph in the 2nd, and having those guys battle it out.  that way he could still take his precious BAP in the first round and continue to fill less important holes in the roster.  i don't like this strategy, i would rather find a very good player to play qb instead of someone who at his best is ok, but i don't see the risk-taker in our gm.  he seems to prefer to spread the qb equation over multiple players so that he's more likely to find someone who won't embarrass the franchise, but less likely to find someone who will take the nfl by storm and really make a name for himself.

[Augustiniak]

Just now, Augustiniak said:

a few years ago, mccagnan had time on his side, he could afford to pick BAP and draft qbs in later rounds hoping one would show promise.  he's 0 for 2 in drafting qbs, but he's done a lot better with retreads.  i could easily see him trading a 3rd rounder for a bridgewater, then drafting a guy like mason rudolph in the 2nd, and having those guys battle it out.  that way he could still take his precious BAP in the first round and continue to fill less important holes in the roster.  i don't like this strategy, i would rather find a very good player to play qb instead of someone who at his best is ok, but i don't see the risk-taker in our gm.  he seems to prefer to spread the qb equation over multiple players so that he's more likely to find someone who won't embarrass the franchise, but less likely to find someone who will take the nfl by storm and really make a name for himself.

 

[JustInFudge]

25 minutes ago, JoJoTownsell1 said:

Every QB outside of Peyton/Luck/Elway comes with question marks. Goff and Wentz came with question marks also. Not sure why you are getting all worked up about the flaws in Rosen/Darnold/Mayfield etc.. Are they the perfect QB prospect? No. But neither was Rodgers and Wentz and Big Ben and Eli etcc (forget Brady who was off everyones radar). 

The fact is that these guys are the best group of QB prospects (flaws and all) in a long time. Despite what you are saying, this is a great year to head into the draft needing a QB. Period. 

You're the one getting worked up, homey. I'm perfectly relaxed saying the same thing I've been saying for a year and ultimately, I know none of this matters because the Jets aren't taking any of these guys in the 1st round. 

I'm also well aware 99% of college QB's have flaws.  Especially nowadays.   While everyone was touting 2018 as the best draft class ever, I astutely pointed out all the issues that have surfaced since the beginning of this ridiculous hype train.

There is no fact.  That's the problem here and has been the problem since people said, just wait till 2018, it's going to be historic!  I personally think 2017 is/was better than 2018 and it just had 3 true prospects and a bunch of fodder.  But give me those 3 over the top 3 in this draft, all day long.

.

[Pac]

29 minutes ago, JoJoTownsell1 said:

The only problem with bringing Mccown back is Bowles. You CANNOT give Bowles the choice of a rookie or Mccown or he will default to the old vet every-time because he is coaching for his life and not to better the franchise long term.

I think that's a bit overblown.  He didn't play Petty this year because Petty is horrible.  Mystery solved.

Young guys have been playing this year with regularity at a number of positions and the long term health of the franchise will be better off for it.

Although it was too late for my liking, he did finally bench that bearded mess last year but Geno got hurt.  

If he's here next year then he will have been extended so there's no reason to think he'd be reluctant to start a young QB.

 

 

[Pac]

2 minutes ago, JiF said:

You're the one getting worked up, homey. I'm perfectly relaxed saying the same thing I've been saying for a year and ultimately, I know none of this matters because the Jets aren't taking any of these guys in the 1st round. 

I'm also well aware 99% of college QB's have flaws.  Especially nowadays.   While everyone was touting 2018 as the best draft class ever, I astutely pointed out all the issues that have surfaced since the beginning of this ridiculous hype train.

There is no fact.  That's the problem here and has been the problem since people said, just wait till 2018, it's going to be historic!  I personally think 2017 is/was better than 2018 and it just had 3 true prospects and a bunch of fodder.  But give me those 3 over the top 3 in this draft, all day long.

.

so you're saying you Lamar Jackson too?

[JustInFudge]

7 minutes ago, Pac said:

so you're saying you Lamar Jackson too?

Am I saying what about Lamar Jackson? 

[BigO]

6 hours ago, The Crusher said:

Are any of them over 30? Asking for my friend Todd , uhh ,, I mean Doug, yeah Doug. 

Are you referring to Todd Blows uhhh Doug Bowles?

[BigO]

6 hours ago, JoJoTownsell1 said:

Jackson is a special talent but he's never going to be a pocket passer and isn't big enough to absorb all the hits he will take as runner.

His upside is a lightning in a bottle type player that wins rookie of the year, maybe even comes close to an MVP type candidate but won't be around too long. 

He's probably the type of QB bowles will push for since it gives him a chance to win immediately because Jackson will win plenty of games with his legs before he is mentally ready to read defenses and make plays from the pocket.

I won't be upset if we take him....

NFL films presentsThe reincarnation of RG III

[Pac]

14 minutes ago, JiF said:

Am I saying what about Lamar Jackson? 

want to draft..  missed a word or 2 in that post.

[FidelioJet]

7 minutes ago, BigO said:

NFL films presentsThe reincarnation of RG III

If he has RGIII's skill set - Would be more than happy with him - just has to be smart enough to slide.

[The Crusher]

1 hour ago, JiF said:

Yes.  Just ok, IMHO.

Rosen the best prospect of the crew could literally give 2 sh*ts about Football.  

Darnold has a wind-up and some bad mechanics and is a meh athlete, but I like him.  

We're not getting either, unfortunately.

Allen is Hack 2.0

Mayfield helped himself but we'll see what he can do come playoffs.  Me thinks he'll be exposed and he'll still be over drafted because of his gaudy video game numbers and firey passion. 

Jackson is attempting to do something no run first QB has ever done.

The rest are typical draft maybes. 

This time last year everyone was acting like between Allen, Rosen and Darnold are locks to be the next Eli, Rivers and Big Ben.  And that's just not the case.  Sure, I may be wrong about how they pan out in the NFL but they went from locks to maybes in an instance.

I agree with that. After the Bowl games last year the hype machine was strong.

[JustInFudge]

1 minute ago, Pac said:

want to draft..  missed a word or 2 in that post.

I've belabored this in the Watson vs. Jackson thread but no, I wouldn't touch Jackson.  He's attempting to do something no college QB has successfully done.  Transition from a run first QB with accuracy issues into a successful NFL QB.  That said, I totally understand the appeal to a player like Jackson.  He's exciting and electric and plenty of coaches are going to want to try and work with that type of talent.  I'm just really big on historical data when it comes to the draft because it's such a crap shoot that you have to have some baseline standards and some of the historical data is undefeated.   Jackson coming to the league with more rush attempts than completions and a career comp% of 57.4 are stats that no college QB has ever overcome at the next level.

 

[JustInFudge]

1 minute ago, The Crusher said:

I agree with that. After the Bowl games last year the hype machine was strong.

That's what I'm getting at here and at the time, it was purely based on hype and a game here and a game there.  The production didn't match the hype. 

I wish I could find the thread.  I said it was over-hyped prior to the season even getting started and I got attacked from all angles with strong anger from the masses. 

[Augustiniak]

2 minutes ago, JiF said:

I've belabored this in the Watson vs. Jackson thread but no, I wouldn't touch Jackson.  He's attempting to do something no college QB has successfully done.  Transition from a run first QB with accuracy issues into a successful NFL QB.  That said, I totally understand the appeal to a player like Jackson.  He's exciting and electric and plenty of coaches are going to want to try and work with that type of talent.  I'm just really big on historical data when it comes to the draft because it's such a crap shoot that you have to have some baseline standards and some of the historical data is undefeated.   Jackson coming to the league with more rush attempts than completions and a career comp% of 57.4 are stats that no college QB has ever overcome at the next level.

 

he's great to watch, but i can see him really getting dinged up in the nfl with those thin legs when he's scrambling.  

[The Crusher]

6 minutes ago, FidelioJet said:

If he has RGIII's skill set - Would be more than happy with him - just has to be smart enough to slide.

Live in DC. Watched RG III's first season and damn that was some awesome football that kid played. He sucked at sliding and was built like a hurdler and that cost him. If we do draft Jackson it will be a fun ride regardless of the end destination. Lets be honest, last few years of Jets football been boring as shit.

[The Crusher]

2 minutes ago, JiF said:

That's what I'm getting at here and at the time, it was purely based on hype and a game here and a game there.  The production didn't match the hype. 

I wish I could find the thread.  I said it was over-hyped prior to the season even getting started and I got attacked from all angles with strong anger from the masses. 

After watching the Rose Bowl I was one of the biggest offenders.

[JustInFudge]

4 minutes ago, Augustiniak said:

he's great to watch, but i can see him really getting dinged up in the nfl with those thin legs when he's scrambling.  

He's a tough player to manage.  You're drafting him because he's electric and can be deadly with his legs but do you want him to be running that much?  I don't think so. He's not built like Cam or Wilson for that matter and both were considerably better passers than Jackson in college.

And honestly, that scrambling non-stop to make a big play isn't sustainable.  Look how inconsistent Seattle is from week to week.  Now, I think that's more product of a terrible OLine but still, I think Seattle would prefer to have Russell in a clean pocket driving the ball down field rather than running for his life all the time.

 

[JustInFudge]

8 minutes ago, The Crusher said:

After watching the Rose Bowl I was one of the biggest offenders.

I know.  You were all aboard the Suck for Sam train and I just kept saying...anyone remember this dude named Mark Sanchez and his magical one season at USC and Rose Bowl performance?  

Sam backed it up this season but I think he'd still be better served to stay in school another year.

[Augustiniak]

1 minute ago, JiF said:

He's a tough player to manage.  You're drafting him because he's electric and can be deadly with his legs but do you want him to be running that much?  I don't think so. He's not built like Cam or Wilson for that matter and both were considerably better passers than Jackson in college.

And honestly, that scrambling non-stop to make a big play isn't sustainable.  Look how inconsistent Seattle is from week to week.  Now, I think that's more product of a terrible OLine but still, I think Seattle would prefer to have Russell in a clean pocket driving the ball down field rather than running for his life all the time.

 

i look at it like this.  it's unlikely that any running qb is going to be more elusive than michael vick, he was the best we may ever see.  and yet, he was erratic as a pocket passer and overall was only ok, though his highlights were amazing and his arm was unreal.  so when i look at jackson and compare him to vick, i see someone who isn't as athletically talented as vick, and has the same inherent accuracy issues.  as a gm, i would rather stake my reputation to a guy like mayfield, who is much more of a pure pocket passer and already has the reputation of being a film junkie.  

[BigO]

22 minutes ago, FidelioJet said:

If he has RGIII's skill set - Would be more than happy with him - just has to be smart enough to slide.

Wishful thinking. This ain’t baseball. Since when do guys like this slide?

[Augustiniak]

1 minute ago, BigO said:

Wishful thinking. This ain’t baseball. Since when do guys like this slide?

wentz tore his acl diving.  it's just not how they think.

[RESNewYork]

14 minutes ago, JiF said:

I've belabored this in the Watson vs. Jackson thread but no, I wouldn't touch Jackson.  He's attempting to do something no college QB has successfully done.  Transition from a run first QB with accuracy issues into a successful NFL QB.  That said, I totally understand the appeal to a player like Jackson.  He's exciting and electric and plenty of coaches are going to want to try and work with that type of talent.  I'm just really big on historical data when it comes to the draft because it's such a crap shoot that you have to have some baseline standards and some of the historical data is undefeated.   Jackson coming to the league with more rush attempts than completions and a career comp% of 57.4 are stats that no college QB has ever overcome at the next level.

 

Aren't the numbers skewed though? The Louisville games I watched, the play calling were designed runs for Jackson. You have to assume it's because Petrino felt that was the best way to move the ball and score. I don't believe any of his receivers are looked at as premium draft picks. Add to that, he is so dynamic with the running part of his game. 

Jackson is also a true Junior. I believe he became a starter in the middle of his freshman season, won the heisman his sophomore year and was 3rd in voting his junior season. He completed 54% 56% 60% of his passes. Completed 241 passes and attempted 208 rushes his junior year. That arrow is pointing up for a 20 year old.

I'm not going to pretend I know anything about scouting QBs but from what I can see, his game translates to what the Jets could really use going forward. We lack dynamic playmakers and chunk plays. Jackson can supply that, wether it's designed runs or plays that he can extend finding receivers down the field. Score enough points with hopefully a developing defense. Jackson would be a huge weapon in 4 minute drives to end games. As the Jets pick up more offensive playmakers, Jackson continues to develops as a passer. 

You can't fill all your holes with one off season. But hopefully Jackson can be dynamic enough offensively while the line is fixed, and playmakers are added and hopefully coupled with a developed defense, and for me you have a recipe for success going forward.

[The Crusher]

24 minutes ago, JiF said:

I know.  You were all aboard the Suck for Sam train and I just kept saying...anyone remember this dude named Mark Sanchez and his magical one season at USC and Rose Bowl performance?  

Sam backed it up this season but I think he'd still be better served to stay in school another year.

Biggest knock on Sanchez was he was immature and didn't have the testicular fortitude for the NFl game.  I would be straight up shocked if Sam doesn't have a longer and better career than Sanchez. Maybe not who knows?   In a perfect world maybe he should stay in school but hard to do if you are likely going #1/#2 overall.

[JetFaninMI]

4 hours ago, section314 said:

I really like the Northwestern kid Thorsen, but I bet he will stay in school.

I heard he is staying. I like him too but feel he will be back with Northwestern next season.

[Pac]

1 hour ago, JiF said:

I've belabored this in the Watson vs. Jackson thread but no, I wouldn't touch Jackson.  He's attempting to do something no college QB has successfully done.  Transition from a run first QB with accuracy issues into a successful NFL QB.  That said, I totally understand the appeal to a player like Jackson.  He's exciting and electric and plenty of coaches are going to want to try and work with that type of talent.  I'm just really big on historical data when it comes to the draft because it's such a crap shoot that you have to have some baseline standards and some of the historical data is undefeated.   Jackson coming to the league with more rush attempts than completions and a career comp% of 57.4 are stats that no college QB has ever overcome at the next level.

 

well you know more about college qb's then I do so I can't really debate it but if that's the case what's your ideal plan?

not take a QB in round 1?

sign Cousins?

Don't say that dumb crap that Macc will re-sign McCown to start and not draft a QB.  You know that's not happening..  If anything I got a hunch that McCown has played his last game in the NFL..  think he might call it quits.

 

[TJ]

Jarrett Stidham....... Lupz picked this guy- I think he might be right. 

[#27TheDominator]

6 hours ago, Ex-Rex said:

The Jets are not Seattle or Carolina and our OL is not very good, so Jackson will be running a lot and holding is inevitable.

Um... Seattle's offensive line is fairly horrific.  Like bottom of the NFL bad.  Aboushi started for them, and now his injury replacement.

[#27TheDominator]

5 minutes ago, TJ said:

Jarrett Stidham....... Lupz picked this guy- I think he might be right. 

Is he coming out? I know a ton of guys were on the bandwagon after Alabama, but I think taking a closer look at the Georgia and Clemson games will temper some enthusiasm.  I sure don't see him as a top 10 pick this year.

[RutgersJetFan]

3 hours ago, Pac said:

I'd say there's a 95% chance we're drafting a QB with the 1st pick and the other 5% is a Cousins signing.

Oh, now he likes math.