whodeawhodat Posted January 8, 2018 Share Posted January 8, 2018 1 minute ago, Ovechkin8 said: They used the exclusive tag the last 2 years and that can be used 1 more year at a prohibitive 34 million. they can transition him indefinitely if they like starting this year at 28 million and that would increase 20% every year going forward. transition tag means he can negotiate with other teams and sign a contract with them but the skins would have a chance to match and keep him 2 minutes ago, flgreen said: They can franchise him one more time at 34M The likely approach will be to put the 29.4 M Transition tag on him and if they dont/cant match the transition tag, the skins get a draft pic(s)? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sonny Werblin Posted January 8, 2018 Share Posted January 8, 2018 3 minutes ago, Philc1 said: We did the same thing with Abe in 2006 franchise tag just to use as trade bait um yeah They'd be fools to let him walk for nothing without a replacement on the roster. Unless they plan to go with Colt McCoy. They should advertise their intent to tag him and see if they can get Denver to part with their #1 pick if Denver is able to meet with Cousin's agent and hammer out a contract. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
whodeawhodat Posted January 8, 2018 Share Posted January 8, 2018 3 minutes ago, Sonny Werblin said: LOL ... so he is balls out a GREAT QB and his teammates, the fans, and even the meddling owner LOVE him, yet they can't seem to sign him.... solely because the GM is in the way. Sounds fishy. PS. I get a kick out of your screen name in a debate over whether a player is a winner. you shush or at least be nice until this whole cousins thing is resolved. I am hoping he signs here and all he costs the jets is $$$$$$ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
#27TheDominator Posted January 8, 2018 Share Posted January 8, 2018 27 minutes ago, Ovechkin8 said: Another way to look at it is that his agent, along with Mike Shanahan, Kyle Shanahan and Sean McVey KNEW how good he was all along. just listen to Mike Shanahan interviews before Kirk even was 5 games into his 1st season as a starter. Find them if you can. They are prophetic. https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/dc-sports-bog/wp/2015/10/09/mike-shanahan-cannot-stop-praising-kirk-cousins/?utm_term=.b2c23d8d35e6 I have read them all. I have been living in the DC Metro since his first camp. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ovechkin8 Posted January 8, 2018 Share Posted January 8, 2018 1 minute ago, Sonny Werblin said: LOL ... so he is balls out a GREAT QB and his teammates, the fans, and even the meddling owner LOVE him, yet they can't seem to sign him.... solely because the GM is in the way. Sounds fishy. PS. I get a kick out of your screen name in a debate over whether a player is a winner. It was actually Cousins who didn’t want to sign after the skins botched it. Drew Brees wasn’t a winner. Until he was. steve yzerman wasn’t a winner. Until he was. The fact is the story isn’t done yet. Cousins is still getting better and Shanahan has been spot on so far so I’ll buy what he’s selling Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ovechkin8 Posted January 8, 2018 Share Posted January 8, 2018 4 minutes ago, whodeawhodat said: and if they dont/cant match the transition tag, the skins get a draft pic(s)? No draft picks. They lose him for zilch. I think they get a compensatory 3rd rounder from the league but nothing from the other team Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
flgreen Posted January 8, 2018 Share Posted January 8, 2018 5 minutes ago, whodeawhodat said: and if they dont/cant match the transition tag, the skins get a draft pic(s)? NO Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Philc1 Posted January 8, 2018 Share Posted January 8, 2018 5 minutes ago, Sonny Werblin said: They'd be fools to let him walk for nothing without a replacement on the roster. Unless they plan to go with Colt McCoy. They should advertise their intent to tag him and see if they can get Denver to part with their #1 pick if Denver is able to meet with Cousin's agent and hammer out a contract. I could see that. I could also see Arizona trading their first for Cousins they are a win now team with Fitzgerald and David Johnson Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
whodeawhodat Posted January 8, 2018 Share Posted January 8, 2018 4 minutes ago, #27TheDominator said: I have read them all. I have been living in the DC Metro since his first camp. what do you think? maybe i missed your post in this 18 pager... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ovechkin8 Posted January 8, 2018 Share Posted January 8, 2018 1 minute ago, Philc1 said: I could see that. I could also see Arizona trading their first for Cousins they are a win now team with Fitzgerald and David Johnson The problem is the skins are in a bad spot. Other teams can just play the waiting game and the skins will lose him for nothing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Philc1 Posted January 8, 2018 Share Posted January 8, 2018 Just now, Ovechkin8 said: The problem is the skins are in a bad spot. Other teams can just play the waiting game and the skins will lose him for nothing. Too many teams need a qb they will get a legit offer Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
whodeawhodat Posted January 8, 2018 Share Posted January 8, 2018 1 minute ago, Philc1 said: I could see that. I could also see Arizona trading their first for Cousins they are a win now team with Fitzgerald and David Johnson IDK, I think the rules have changed with franchise tenders. Are they allowed to negotiate once they are tendered? $34M? Could AZ afford that cap hit? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FidelioJet Posted January 8, 2018 Share Posted January 8, 2018 51 minutes ago, Ovechkin8 said: How do you figure? The Skins have been about .500 the last 3 years while have a BOTTOM 3 defense!!! One thing Skins and Jets fan know well is how to strike out on 1st round QBs over the years. They are ALL shiny new and exciting before they get drafted! Shuler, Ramsey, Campbell, RGIII, Sanchez, Geno Smith etc etc For every Wentz there are 10 Ryan Leaf's. Exactly my point - you're okay with being .500 or even 10-6? Win a will card and out? I'm talking about winning a Super Bowl. He's not the kind of guy that's going to carry your team to a championship. I'm not saying there are a lot of guys that can - but I do know he isn't one of them. And yes, it's tough to find that guy - but I'm willing to roll the dice if that's what Mac decides. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ovechkin8 Posted January 8, 2018 Share Posted January 8, 2018 1 minute ago, whodeawhodat said: IDK, I think the rules have changed with franchise tenders. Are they allowed to negotiate once they are tendered? $34M? Could AZ afford that cap hit? 34 mil would be the exclusive tag so only the skins could negotiate unless they let him do so with another team (tag and trade) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
#27TheDominator Posted January 8, 2018 Share Posted January 8, 2018 4 minutes ago, whodeawhodat said: what do you think? maybe i missed your post in this 18 pager... Love to have him, even at what many think is a crazy price. OTOH, his price may be too crazy even for me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ovechkin8 Posted January 8, 2018 Share Posted January 8, 2018 1 minute ago, FidelioJet said: Exactly my point - you're okay with being .500 or even 10-6? Win a will card and out? I'm talking about winning a Super Bowl. He's not the kind of guy that's going to carry your team to a championship. I'm not saying there are a lot of guys that can - but I do know he isn't one of them. And yes, it's tough to find that guy - but I'm willing to roll the dice if that's what Mac decides. Give him an Average defense and he can. That’s what I’m saying. no QB could have overcome our horrific defense the last 3 years!! Teams were like 50% on 3rd and 7+ against us the year before last for example Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Philc1 Posted January 8, 2018 Share Posted January 8, 2018 2 minutes ago, whodeawhodat said: IDK, I think the rules have changed with franchise tenders. Are they allowed to negotiate once they are tendered? $34M? Could AZ afford that cap hit? AZ is $15 mil under the cap for next year Palmer retiring takes them to $29 mil, figure they need $5 mil to pay draft picks but they can cut or restructure other players Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FidelioJet Posted January 8, 2018 Share Posted January 8, 2018 2 minutes ago, Ovechkin8 said: Give him an Average defense and he can. That’s what I’m saying. no QB could have overcome our horrific defense the last 3 years!! Teams were like 50% on 3rd and 7+ against us the year before last for example Do you believe putting Cousins on the Jets as is are a legitimate SuperBowl contender? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Philc1 Posted January 8, 2018 Share Posted January 8, 2018 Just now, FidelioJet said: Do you believe putting Cousins on the Jets as is are a legitimate SuperBowl contender? Absolutely no way, add Cousins to this roster we probably don’t even go 8-8 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ovechkin8 Posted January 8, 2018 Share Posted January 8, 2018 Just now, FidelioJet said: Do you believe putting Cousins on the Jets as is are a legitimate SuperBowl contender? Honestly I don’t know enough about the Jets young players to give an answer. I know the D seems strong year in and year out. didnt you guys go to b2b AFC championship games with Mark Sanchez??? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Philc1 Posted January 8, 2018 Share Posted January 8, 2018 1 minute ago, Ovechkin8 said: Honestly I don’t know enough about the Jets young players to give an answer. I know the D seems strong year in and year out. didnt you guys go to b2b AFC championship games with Mark Sanchez??? We had a top 5 offensive line, playmakers at skill positions and a good defense Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
whodeawhodat Posted January 8, 2018 Share Posted January 8, 2018 6 minutes ago, #27TheDominator said: Love to have him, even at what many think is a crazy price. OTOH, his price may be too crazy even for me. I think Macs true currency is draft pics. If getting a guy you love and all it costs you is $$$ then it should be a no brainer. Front load the contract to keep himself liquid in future years is exactly what he has done since he has been here. If he has the option between trading a draft away for a QB or spending his stored away cap space I feel pretty strongly that he would open the check book first. Add to that bowles and his love for vets. I know what I am hoping for. Bring on the gifs!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FidelioJet Posted January 8, 2018 Share Posted January 8, 2018 6 minutes ago, Ovechkin8 said: Honestly I don’t know enough about the Jets young players to give an answer. I know the D seems strong year in and year out. didnt you guys go to b2b AFC championship games with Mark Sanchez??? That's still two wins away from a championship and it was with a very good defense and great offensive line and very good running game. I think Cousins with that defense and offensive line would have a shot at a Super Bowl championship. Which is why I'm okay with taking him - but you better build a defense around him though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
whodeawhodat Posted January 8, 2018 Share Posted January 8, 2018 7 minutes ago, Philc1 said: Absolutely no way, add Cousins to this roster we probably don’t even go 8-8 plus how many draft pics would we save by not moving up? plus how much money to spend on upgrading the roster around him? Not saying right away but not saying its impossible. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
#27TheDominator Posted January 8, 2018 Share Posted January 8, 2018 3 minutes ago, whodeawhodat said: I think Macs true currency is draft pics. If getting a guy you love and all it costs you is $$$ then it should be a no brainer. Front load the contract to keep himself liquid in future years is exactly what he has done since he has been here. If he has the option between trading a draft away for a QB or spending his stored away cap space I feel pretty strongly that he would open the check book first. Add to that bowles and his love for vets. I know what I am hoping for. Bring on the gifs!!! I think the idea that Maccagnan deals to "keep himself liquid in future years" is way overstated around here. He paid a ton of dead money. The only reason we are out from under it is because he started with a ton of cap space. We basically wrote off the 2017 season to get out from under his idiotic contracts and moves and several will still hang over our heads next year. Moving sh*t around to accommodate that idiotic Fitzpatrick deal caused him to push Wilkerson, Skrine and I believe Gilchrist into what would/will be dead money. I think he is locked in at $7M for Winters sub-par play at G. Ugh. 3 minutes ago, FidelioJet said: That's still two wins away from a championship and it was with a very good defense and great offensive line and very good running game. I think Cousins with that defense and offensive line would have a shot at a Super Bowl championship. Which is why I'm okay with taking him - but you better build a defense around him though. A shot? Like Sanchez is on the same planet? Every winning team needs a running game and defense. 1 minute ago, whodeawhodat said: plus how many draft pics would we save by not moving up? plus how much money to spend on upgrading the roster around him? Not saying right away but not saying its impossible. Sign him and then move down when Mayfield is available at 6. Don't draft some "can't bust" OG or C prospect. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
whodeawhodat Posted January 8, 2018 Share Posted January 8, 2018 9 minutes ago, #27TheDominator said: I think the idea that Maccagnan deals to "keep himself liquid in future years" is way overstated around here. He paid a ton of dead money. The only reason we are out from under it is because he started with a ton of cap space. We basically wrote off the 2017 season to get out from under his idiotic contracts and moves and several will still hang over our heads next year. Moving sh*t around to accommodate that idiotic Fitzpatrick deal caused him to push Wilkerson, Skrine and I believe Gilchrist into what would/will be dead money. I think he is locked in at $7M for Winters sub-par play at G. Ugh. A shot? Like Sanchez is on the same planet? Every winning team needs a running game and defense. Sign him and then move down when Mayfield is available at 6. Don't draft some "can't bust" OG or C prospect. He paid a lot of dead money? what is a lot? we have $100M in cap space. the dead money was the cost of doing business in taking a shot 2 years ago when he spent, what half($50M???), of what he has this offseason? The $$$$ side, I trust him with. It isnt blind luck that we have all this cap space, it is because he had the foresight to see that if these guys he paid to perform, didnt do exactly that, we could change things up and not be handcuffed to a bunch of stiffs that got paid, see mo wilk. Yeah, there is dead money but mo will be gone, see yah, get the **** out of here and guess what???? we still have $100M to fill a roster through FAs. Dont bother to research how much we have in dead money, as i have said, sunk cost. we have $100M so $$$ isnt an issue. My $0.02 if it is even worth that much Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sonny Werblin Posted January 8, 2018 Share Posted January 8, 2018 1 hour ago, Ovechkin8 said: Another way to look at it is that his agent, along with Mike Shanahan, Kyle Shanahan and Sean McVey KNEW how good he was all along. just listen to Mike Shanahan interviews before Kirk even was 5 games into his 1st season as a starter. Find them if you can. They are prophetic. https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/dc-sports-bog/wp/2015/10/09/mike-shanahan-cannot-stop-praising-kirk-cousins/?utm_term=.b2c23d8d35e6 Yes, even the interviewer viewed it as serious minded praise over saying nice things about a guy you used to coach... Quote To review: in the span of about 3 months, Kirk Cousins has improved from definite starter, to Top 10 league quarterback, to perennial Pro Bowler to a likely Super Bowl winner in Mike Shanahan’s eyes. No pressure or anything playing in front of the former coach, who’ll be in the building with his grandkids when the Redskins play the Falcons on Sunday. Tune in next week, when Shanahan is introducing Cousins before his Hall of Fame induction speech. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
To review: in the span of about 3 months, Kirk Cousins has improved from definite starter, to Top 10 league quarterback, to perennial Pro Bowler to a likely Super Bowl winner in Mike Shanahan’s eyes. No pressure or anything playing in front of the former coach, who’ll be in the building with his grandkids when the Redskins play the Falcons on Sunday. Tune in next week, when Shanahan is introducing Cousins before his Hall of Fame induction speech.
Sonny Werblin Posted January 8, 2018 Share Posted January 8, 2018 47 minutes ago, FidelioJet said: Do you believe putting Cousins on the Jets as is are a legitimate SuperBowl contender? redskins had a better roster and they're not in the playoffs. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
#27TheDominator Posted January 8, 2018 Share Posted January 8, 2018 23 minutes ago, whodeawhodat said: He paid a lot of dead money? what is a lot? we have $100M in cap space. the dead money was the cost of doing business in taking a shot 2 years ago when he spent, what half($50M???), of what he has this offseason? The $$$$ side, I trust him with. It isnt blind luck that we have all this cap space, it is because he had the foresight to see that if these guys he paid to perform, didnt do exactly that, we could change things up and not be handcuffed to a bunch of stiffs that got paid, see mo wilk. Yeah, there is dead money but mo will be gone, see yah, get the **** out of here and guess what???? we still have $100M to fill a roster through FAs. Dont bother to research how much we have in dead money, as i have said, sunk cost. we have $100M so $$$ isnt an issue. My $0.02 if it is even worth that much You do realize that you are celebrating the fact that the guy can cut his high priced signing, don't you? It's not even 18 months since we signed the guy and we are happy that we will only have to pay him $10M to NOT play for us in 2018? Maccagnan hasn't been horrible with money, but who has he signed that you are happy about? Carpenter was his one good signing and he seems spent 3 years in. Spending $100M on crap doesn't make you much better than spending $50M on it. The issue isn't how much money we have, it is who he will spend it on. He is the one that sunk those costs. This is a Cousins thread, so I will move on to the fact that I think getting him at a Stafford sized contract would probably be a good thing. That is a ton of scratch though Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sonny Werblin Posted January 8, 2018 Share Posted January 8, 2018 Love the passion of the Cousinites (or Kirkologist) but where there is passion, there is often blindspots. While Kirk would be an upgrade at QB, the price is too steep for a 30 year old without winning pedigree. I'd rather continue with the rebuild plan and give the coaching staff a young buck to groom. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sonny Werblin Posted January 8, 2018 Share Posted January 8, 2018 Love the passion of the Cousinites (or Kirkologist) but where there is passion, there is often blindspots. While Kirk would be an upgrade at QB, the price is too steep for a 30 year old without winning pedigree. I'd rather continue with the rebuild plan and give the coaching staff a young buck to groom. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
flgreen Posted January 8, 2018 Share Posted January 8, 2018 31 minutes ago, Sonny Werblin said: redskins had a better roster and they're not in the playoffs. What makes you think the Skins had better roster? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SenorGato Posted January 8, 2018 Share Posted January 8, 2018 4 minutes ago, Sonny Werblin said: Love the passion of the Cousinites (or Kirkologist) but where there is passion, there is often blindspots. While Kirk would be an upgrade at QB, the price is too steep for a 30 year old without winning pedigree. I'd rather continue with the rebuild plan and give the coaching staff a young buck to groom. What about more real things like his pedigree as a college passer who passes the basics (3 year starter, 60+% completion rate, wins) turned draft picked turned backup turned starter with two top 7 passer seasons out of three under his belt? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
#27TheDominator Posted January 8, 2018 Share Posted January 8, 2018 12 minutes ago, Sonny Werblin said: Love the passion of the Cousinites (or Kirkologist) but where there is passion, there is often blindspots. While Kirk would be an upgrade at QB, the price is too steep for a 30 year old without winning pedigree. I'd rather continue with the rebuild plan and give the coaching staff a young buck to groom. How long does this rebuilding plan last? We are going into year 4. It takes 3 years to completely overhaul an NFL roster Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FidelioJet Posted January 8, 2018 Share Posted January 8, 2018 1 hour ago, #27TheDominator said: A shot? Like Sanchez is on the same planet? Every winning team needs a running game and defense. Pats have no running game - and they let up 28 points in the SuperBowl. That teams wins because Tom Brady is the best QB in the league - quite possibly the best to ever play the game. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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