Notice how Jets laying lack of ingame adjust skills at Mortons feet?

[SouthernJet]

Last I knew season is 16 games and every call OC makes goes through Head Coaches headset. he can stop the direction a OC is taking, change a call, at halftime say NO, you are wrong we are doing it this way, or after half a year if unhappy swotch play call duties to Bates or someone else. I am not saying Morton great but appears Jets using him ALSO as Bowles "fall guy".

[bla bla bla]

The HC isn't going to override many calls IMO, I don't believe Bowles even has a play sheet to adjust it. I think the only way he would change a call is on the goal line or 3rd/4th and short. Other than that an OC usually has a plan that is developed over a course of 4 plays to get it in so you likely let it play out.

Judging by our weak 2nd and 4th quarters it would lead me to believe we were really good at the set of 15-20 plays we scripted and once we got away from that we faltered, which I think could be seen as Morton's fault.

[SouthernJet]

Just now, bla bla bla said:

The HC isn't going to override many calls IMO, I don't believe Bowles even has a play sheet to adjust it. I think the only way he would change a call is on the goal line or 3rd/4th and short. Other than that an OC usually has a plan that is developed over a course of 4 plays to get it in so you likely let it play out.

Judging by our weak 2nd and 4th quarters it would lead me to believe we were really good at the set of 15-20 plays we scripted and once we got away from that we faltered, which I think could be seen as Morton's fault.

16 game season..point B

[bla bla bla]

4 minutes ago, SouthernJet said:

16 game season..point B

I don't understand what you are implying

[HessStation]

This is so eerily similar to Rex but without the early success, it's frightening.

and the ownership is so weak they don't know when to make their own moves.

 

[varjet]

This is like watching the train hit the school bus.  

The situation will reinforce itself because free agents will avoid the sinking ship like they did last year.  That will make it even harder for MacBowles to save themselves.

Unless they hit it out of the park in the draft, it will be tough for them to survive.  When the business side of the Jets has to lower prices again, that will get the attention of the Johnsons.  The only thing that truly motivated the Johnsons to make the team competitive was the need to sell PSLs, and in some ways the Jets are still recovering from that binge (although the binge was fun while it lasted).

Belichick/McDaniels/Patricia are coaching against Peterson/Reich/Schwartz in the Super Bowl.  All 4 coordinators were either HCs before or HC candidates, or both.  It is questionable whether Bowles is a real HC.

[Sarge4Tide]

Isn't there already a thread to bitch about how horrible the Jets are for firing the great John Morton?

[section314]

6 minutes ago, Sarge4Tide said:

Isn't there already a thread to bitch about how horrible the Jets are for firing the great John Morton?

When the boss tells the employee numerous times, it appears, to slightly alter the way you approach your job, and you refuse to do so, shouldn't the boss fire said employee?  Pretty simple stuff, even for many on this site.

[jetspenguin]

#readsignature

[Bugg]

1 hour ago, SouthernJet said:

Last I knew season is 16 games and every call OC makes goes through Head Coaches headset. he can stop the direction a OC is taking, change a call, at halftime say NO, you are wrong we are doing it this way, or after half a year if unhappy swotch play call duties to Bates or someone else. I am not saying Morton great but appears Jets using him ALSO as Bowles "fall guy".

Bowles stood there game after game hearing the calls of every offensive play with that dumb blank look on his face, appearing to say nothing. He's the head coach. If he wanted to run the ball close to the goal line, he has a microphone attached to the headset. Not saying Morton was a genius, but that he did anything in a vacuum and Bowles was powerless to stop it is an indictment of Bowles. 

[Bugg]

1 hour ago, varjet said:

This is like watching the train hit the school bus.  

The situation will reinforce itself because free agents will avoid the sinking ship like they did last year.  That will make it even harder for MacBowles to save themselves.

Unless they hit it out of the park in the draft, it will be tough for them to survive.  When the business side of the Jets has to lower prices again, that will get the attention of the Johnsons.  The only thing that truly motivated the Johnsons to make the team competitive was the need to sell PSLs, and in some ways the Jets are still recovering from that binge (although the binge was fun while it lasted).

Belichick/McDaniels/Patricia are coaching against Peterson/Reich/Schwartz in the Super Bowl.  All 4 coordinators were either HCs before or HC candidates, or both.  It is questionable whether Bowles is a real HC.

It's not questionable; he's an overpromoted Peter Principle incompetent. 

[Bleedin Green]

I don't blame anyone if they don't like the move, but some of the conspiracy theories behind it is a bit much.  If Bowles really wanted to use Morton as a fall man, there is literally no worse time to fire him.  He waited until after the season was over, after he got a freakin' extension, but before there was any new crap to dump on him.  There's nothing about this move that will help make anyone look any better (unless of course Bates ends up looking like an upgrade next season).

Now keep in mind, that doesn't necessarily make it a good move, but this hardly endorses the melodrama some are trying to connect to it.  In reality, if there is any selfish reasoning behind it that you want to attribute to Bowles at all, it's much more likely that he didn't trust Morton to help him keep his job next year.

[RESNewYork]

 

1 hour ago, SouthernJet said:

Last I knew season is 16 games and every call OC makes goes through Head Coaches headset. he can stop the direction a OC is taking, change a call, at halftime say NO, you are wrong we are doing it this way, or after half a year if unhappy swotch play call duties to Bates or someone else. I am not saying Morton great but appears Jets using him ALSO as Bowles "fall guy".

So after Bowles gets a 2 year extension he decides he needs a fall guy. So that's the reason he fires Morton? Bowles could have stayed status quo, keep Morton, and no one would be talking about this. Could it be because he felt hiring Bates makes the team better? I guess not because that is probably the simplest explanation but for some reason fans on here want to create some far fetched narrative 

[Beerfish]

1 hour ago, SouthernJet said:

Last I knew season is 16 games and every call OC makes goes through Head Coaches headset. he can stop the direction a OC is taking, change a call, at halftime say NO, you are wrong we are doing it this way, or after half a year if unhappy swotch play call duties to Bates or someone else. I am not saying Morton great but appears Jets using him ALSO as Bowles "fall guy".

The times I honestly think Bowls affect Morton is when he told him just to hand off into the line and give up in games.  No proof of this of course its just a feeling.

[ScarletKnight89]

1 hour ago, varjet said:

This is like watching the train hit the school bus.  

The situation will reinforce itself because free agents will avoid the sinking ship like they did last year.  That will make it even harder for MacBowles to save themselves.

Unless they hit it out of the park in the draft, it will be tough for them to survive.  When the business side of the Jets has to lower prices again, that will get the attention of the Johnsons.  The only thing that truly motivated the Johnsons to make the team competitive was the need to sell PSLs, and in some ways the Jets are still recovering from that binge (although the binge was fun while it lasted).

Belichick/McDaniels/Patricia are coaching against Peterson/Reich/Schwartz in the Super Bowl.  All 4 coordinators were either HCs before or HC candidates, or both.  It is questionable whether Bowles is a real HC.

We shall find that out soon enough. The Jets are going to have $100 million to spend in FA. I highly doubt players are going to avoid coming here. Just my opinion though.

[SMC]

[UnitedWhofans]

2 hours ago, SouthernJet said:

Last I knew season is 16 games and every call OC makes goes through Head Coaches headset. he can stop the direction a OC is taking, change a call, at halftime say NO, you are wrong we are doing it this way, or after half a year if unhappy swotch play call duties to Bates or someone else. I am not saying Morton great but appears Jets using him ALSO as Bowles "fall guy".

Why would i want a guy who knows little about offense making adjustments on offense?

[ZachEY]

29 minutes ago, Bleedin Green said:

I don't blame anyone if they don't like the move, but some of the conspiracy theories behind it is a bit much.  If Bowles really wanted to use Morton as a fall man, there is literally no worse time to fire him.  He waited until after the season was over, after he got a freakin' extension, but before there was any new crap to dump on him.  There's nothing about this move that will help make anyone look any better (unless of course Bates ends up looking like an upgrade next season).

Now keep in mind, that doesn't necessarily make it a good move, but this hardly endorses the melodrama some are trying to connect to it.  In reality, if there is any selfish reasoning behind it that you want to attribute to Bowles at all, it's much more likely that he didn't trust Morton to help him keep his job next year.

Yeah - This.

With all the talk about Morton going to Oakland, I think the evidence exists to suggest that the real reasoning for this decision (which may not have been one-sided) is behind the scenes stuff, more than on field performance and/or scapegoating.

[UnitedWhofans]

The general impression is that the offense is credited to McCown rather than Morton. Because once he went down, the offense went in the sh*tter.

The defense, for the most part, save a few games, played ok.

[Sperm Edwards]

1 hour ago, RESNewYork said:

 

So after Bowles gets a 2 year extension he decides he needs a fall guy. So that's the reason he fires Morton? Bowles could have stayed status quo, keep Morton, and no one would be talking about this. Could it be because he felt hiring Bates makes the team better? I guess not because that is probably the simplest explanation but for some reason fans on here want to create some far fetched narrative 

Yeah I think Bowles is just uncomfortable passing nearly as much as running (never mind passing more than running). That is, unless they had - as they apparently put it themselves in-house - Drew Brees.

My guess is he still wouldn't like it much, and might even cite the Saints' 3 consecutive years of 7-9 records as being caused by passing too much. But in absence of 4000+ passing yards (let alone 5000+ passing yards), he can't accept that even really good/great QBs misfire about 1/3 of the time and when they do the clock stops 100% of the time.

 

Stats like this I'm sure stick out for Bowles: On 3rd & short/shorter (3rd & 1-4), the Jets ran 54 such plays (not counting penalties).

• Rushing, they attempted 20 of 54 times. Though it was only a 2.6 ypa average, it resulted in 3 TDs and 11 1st downs. Total success = 14/20
• Passing, they attempted 33 of 54 times. Despite a nearly double ypa of 5.1, it resulted in 2 TDs and 13 1st downs. Total success = 15/33

(Anyone who wants to hunt for the other 3rd & short play, that was neither passing nor rushing, go ahead and tell me what it was lol.)

Anyway, despite Bowles not being a good enough HC, the truth is it is a pretty damning statistic on paper. I don't know that you can remove all causation from the equation, though, and simplistically expect the same results. If they ran it so much more often, teams kinda pick up on that and it's likely the success rate when running would drop (especially with the Jets so weak up the gut with Johnson at center). What often creates running room is the realistic threat of a pass, not the old Hackett "I'll have Pennington lollipop it way deep once every 75 plays to 'stretch out' the defense" or something.

[SenorGato]

2 hours ago, SouthernJet said:

Last I knew season is 16 games and every call OC makes goes through Head Coaches headset. he can stop the direction a OC is taking, change a call, at halftime say NO, you are wrong we are doing it this way, or after half a year if unhappy swotch play call duties to Bates or someone else. I am not saying Morton great but appears Jets using him ALSO as Bowles "fall guy".

Me thinks you just created a new fact. I expect to see this in every thread restated as the Jah honest truth. 

OTOH Bowles is an incredibly stupid man, incredibly stupid. If he can figure out a way to work the headset then for sure he was doing this, ESPECIALLY if he heard the playcall or asjustment come from Morton’s Good Playbook. 

Don’t even get me started on Bowles’ rage when Morton called a pass! Especially one of Morton’s designed to work, nothing made Bowels more rage.

[Sperm Edwards]

11 minutes ago, UnitedWhofans said:

Why would i want a guy who knows little about offense making adjustments on offense?

Crap. It made a good point. 

[HessStation]

11 minutes ago, Sperm Edwards said:

Crap. It made a good point. 

Max is smart. The program he built into the forum's system has firewalls and is expected to note logic every 150 posts to keep us all off balance. Good job Max. 

[SouthernJet]

1 hour ago, RESNewYork said:

 

So after Bowles gets a 2 year extension he decides he needs a fall guy. So that's the reason he fires Morton? Bowles could have stayed status quo, keep Morton, and no one would be talking about this. Could it be because he felt hiring Bates makes the team better? I guess not because that is probably the simplest explanation but for some reason fans on here want to create some far fetched narrative 

LOL, if he had stines he would have handed play calling to Bates mid season like other great coaches w/balls in past have done.

[SouthernJet]

29 minutes ago, Sperm Edwards said:

Crap. It made a good point. 

implied he switched to Golden Boty Bates mid season if they were unhappy w/play calling, agree Bowles doesnt deserve to be anywere near a offensive person in building

[SouthernJet]

31 minutes ago, Sperm Edwards said:

Yeah I think Bowles is just uncomfortable passing nearly as much as running (never mind passing more than running). That is, unless they had - as they apparently put it themselves in-house - Drew Brees.

My guess is he still wouldn't like it much, and might even cite the Saints' 3 consecutive years of 7-9 records as being caused by passing too much. But in absence of 4000+ passing yards (let alone 5000+ passing yards), he can't accept that even really good/great QBs misfire about 1/3 of the time and when they do the clock stops 100% of the time.

Stats like this I'm sure stick out for him: On 3rd & short/shorter (3rd & 1-4), the Jets ran 54 such plays (not counting penalties).

• Rushing, they attempted 20 of 54 times. Though it was only a 2.6 ypa average, it resulted in 3 TDs and 11 1st downs. Total success = 14/20
• Passing, they attempted 33 of 54 times. Despite a nearly double ypa of 5.1, it resulted in 2 TDs and 13 1st downs. Total success = 15/33

(Anyone who wants to hunt for the other 3rd & short play, that was neither passing nor rushing, go ahead and tell me what it was lol.)

Anyway, despite Bowles not being a good enough HC, the truth is it is a pretty damning statistic on paper. I don't know that you can remove all causation from the equation, though. If they ran it so much more often, teams kinda pick up on that and it's likely the success rate when running would drop (especially with the Jets so weak up the gut with Johnson at center). What often creates running room is the realistic threat of a pass, not the old Hackett "have Pennington lollipop it way deep once every 75 plays to 'stretch out' the defense" or something.

agree, history in NFL shows most HCs who were DCs hand on to run game philosophy as long a sthey can as they are used to letting their Defense win game and rungame eats the clock and rests the Defense (in theory LOL)

[UnitedWhofans]

2 minutes ago, SouthernJet said:

implied he switched to Golden Boty Bates mid season if they were unhappy w/play calling, agree Bowles doesnt deserve to be anywere near a offensive person in building

Usually play calling doesn't go between OC and QBs coach. It usually goes between OC and HC.

So I don't think that would have been a possibility

[SouthernJet]

2 minutes ago, UnitedWhofans said:

Usually play calling doesn't go between OC and QBs coach. It usually goes between OC and HC.

So I don't think that would have been a possibility

sure it does if HC is a defensive guy. if they hated Morton all year and eyed bates already as OC material, it woyuld have been the smart ballsy move. Morton could put game plan togetehr (Jet simplied he was good at that, just couldnt coach once whistle blows). So yuou keep Morton OC and Bowles/Mac could have easily said Bates will call plays (would hav ebeen backpage material for Morron on Hot seat etc, but it appears Jets by midseason already knew Morton was horrid ingame)

[UnitedWhofans]

3 minutes ago, SouthernJet said:

sure it does if HC is a defensive guy. if they hated Morton all year and eyed bates already as OC material, it woyuld have been the smart ballsy move. Morton could put game plan togetehr (Jet simplied he was good at that, just couldnt coach once whistle blows). So yuou keep Morton OC and Bowles/Mac could have easily said Bates will call plays (would hav ebeen backpage material for Morron on Hot seat etc, but it appears Jets by midseason already knew Morton was horrid ingame)

The other problem with that is that Morton, after being fired, would probably go to the press and announce that, which would make the Jets nuclear waste for anyone possibly interested in coming here.

To lose your playcalling rights to a subordinate is not something that would sit well

[SouthernJet]

Just now, UnitedWhofans said:

The other problem with that is that Morton, after being fired, would probably go to the press and announce that, which would make the Jets nuclear waste for anyone

LOL, news flash, who cares and we already are. Need HC/GMs to mak eballsy mid season moves if needed. The great HCs of past have done midseason play call switches before. Soulds like they didnt like him and didnt act on it during year. Bowles didnt want to disrupt folks, just keep having horrid ingame adjustments LOL

[SenorGato]

1 hour ago, RESNewYork said:

 

So after Bowles gets a 2 year extension he decides he needs a fall guy. So that's the reason he fires Morton? Bowles could have stayed status quo, keep Morton, and no one would be talking about this. Could it be because he felt hiring Bates makes the team better? I guess not because that is probably the simplest explanation but for some reason fans on here want to create some far fetched narrative 

Ugh, this place is loading up with true homers. What’re you - GAY for Bowels? Bowels fired Morton because he could not handle being next to such a budding genius. He hired Bates because Bowels fnds it funny to make puns out of his name but the only one Bowels isn’t too stupid to miss is Master.  Anyway no way this was intended to make the team better so stop with the homersexuality for Bowels.

[UnitedWhofans]

2 minutes ago, SouthernJet said:

LOL, news flash, who cares and we already are. Need HC/GMs to mak eballsy mid season moves if needed. The great HCs of past have done midseason play call switches before. Soulds like they didnt like him and didnt act on it during year. Bowles didnt want to disrupt folks, just keep having horrid ingame adjustments LOL

I dont know of any team that has done it that way.

[RESNewYork]

57 minutes ago, SouthernJet said:

LOL, if he had stines he would have handed play calling to Bates mid season like other great coaches w/balls in past have done.

Who said stinks. Maybe they felt Bates was better going forward. I don't know but that would tend to make the most sense. So when you type LOL are you really laughing out loud at that moment?

[Jetsplayer21]

3 hours ago, SouthernJet said:

Last I knew season is 16 games and every call OC makes goes through Head Coaches headset. he can stop the direction a OC is taking, change a call, at halftime say NO, you are wrong we are doing it this way, or after half a year if unhappy swotch play call duties to Bates or someone else. I am not saying Morton great but appears Jets using him ALSO as Bowles "fall guy".

Bellicheck is the master for halftime adjusts. Other HCs get a lot of credit for doing the same. Only the jets is it the O coordinators fault ha. I wonder what responsibilities Todd Bowles actual have ? Just to disipline the bad boys who are late class ?  Ha

[RESNewYork]

45 minutes ago, SenorGato said:

Ugh, this place is loading up with true homers. What’re you - GAY for Bowels? Bowels fired Morton because he could not handle being next to such a budding genius. He hired Bates because Bowels fnds it funny to make puns out of his name but the only one Bowels isn’t too stupid to miss is Master.  Anyway no way this was intended to make the team better so stop with the homersexuality for Bowels.

This is the intelligent response I would expect. Its so grounded and well thought out.

Sure Bowles made the move because he wants the team to regress which leads to him getting fired. Try putting some concrete thoughts together.

But I understand why considering your homophobic response, I assume its from all the mushroom stamps on your forehead. You got gay in the brain.