Would u be pissed?

[Jetster]

If MaccBowles signed Cousins/Jensen or Richburg & Norwell in free agency and then drafted Nelson at #6? Haven't we spent enough money on defense?

The Jets have only done well in their entire history when they had a solid Oline. They had solid olines with Parcells & Rex, but both times didn't have a QB as good as Cousins.

Honestly I wouldn't be mad if they even used their high 2nd rounder if they think a LT is there to groom behind Beachum. Give this new Oline coach, Beachum, Shell, Winters, Carpenter, Jensen or Richburg, Norwell & Nelson! Let him figure it out. Jets can cut Winters after next season with zero cap hit. Same with Carpenter, he's a free agent after 2018.

Forte is only 1 million cap hit cutting him. I mean we paid Forte 5 million in 2017 (complete waste), I'd rather build the trenches, draft a RB in the 3rd. I know people might think it's crazy to draft a guard at #6 overall, it's not crazy if you watch on Sunday a trio of Beachum-Nelson-Jensen-Norwell- Shell. With a capable QB like Cousins, if you give him time & a good running game, I believe we already have enough weapons with Enunwa hopefully coming back. Going this direction with a front loaded Cousins contract & Jensen/Norwell as your 2 other free agent acquisitions, you would still have enough money for a FA corner. I see the Jets cutting Mo, Forte & maybe Skrine but I see Bowles keeping him to slide into the 3/4 CB role so he can't be as targeted as he was last year. Cousins will enhance any talent Hanson or Stewart, the TE role will be more involved, and RBs will be a huge part of the running game using the short WCO passes out of the backfield. 

A great Oline can take over games in the 4th quarter. The Jags could have won in Gillette with better blocking, similar to what the Jets did in Gillette in 2010. The Jets Oline SHUT THE DOOR clearing the way for Shonn Green to punch them right in the mouth at the end of that game. If you look at Detroit, Green Bay, and most teams in this league, most QBs get injured because of the bad play of the Oline.

Its not sexy, but it is so important. I know people laugh when I say this is year 2 of our rebuild with MaccBowles but that's how I look at it. Get a QB (Cousins), start putting a nasty Oline in front of him & let's find out what these youngsters, Hanson and Stewart can do, plus a stud 3rd round RB along with Powell & McGuire. My god, McGuire was getting hit while taking the handoff last year. Most NFL people would put Kirk Cousins in the top 10 QB grouping, some as high as 8. Kearse, Anderson (if still here), Enunwa (if Healthy), ASJ maybe Trey Burton in free agency, all of these players are going to be more focused when the know the ball could be coming & VERY ACCURATELY! 

I know it sounds so boring but name me a GREAT defense left in the AFC other than the Jags? We could be an offense that leads you to bleed to death by a thousand cuts or by a huge 1 strike TD to Anderson or Enunwa. At least we'd have identity, right now we have zero identity.

[bla bla bla]

Cousins + Jensen + Nelson is what I'd want. I think we could get more valuable players in FA than Norwell. I'm fine with rolling with a healthy Winters as opposed to overkilling the guards.

[Untouchable]

There’s no way that Carpenter is on the roster in this scenario.

But no, I wouldn’t be pissed. Signing Cousins and Jensen/Richburg and then drafting Nelson? That would be amazing.

[Augustiniak]

Just now, bla bla bla said:

Cousins + Jensen + Nelson is what I'd want. I think we could get more valuable players in FA than Norwell. I'm fine with rolling with a healthy Winters as opposed to overkilling the guards.

if all that happened and enumwa comes back healthy the jets have transformed the offense into a tough unit.  then you draft a rb to replace forte and the team is poised for a playoff run.  i'd still want mayfield over this though.

[bla bla bla]

Just now, Augustiniak said:

if all that happened and enumwa comes back healthy the jets have transformed the offense into a tough unit.  then you draft a rb to replace forte and the team is poised for a playoff run.  i'd still want mayfield over this though.

I love the idea of Mayfield but if we can get Cousins that is the smarter move, he's proven it and is plenty young to make multiple SB runs. It really allows you to load up the team with young talent where trading up would leaving us in the opposite.

[Augustiniak]

Just now, bla bla bla said:

I love the idea of Mayfield but if we can get Cousins that is the smarter move, he's proven it and is plenty young to make multiple SB runs. It really allows you to load up the team with young talent where trading up would leaving us in the opposite.

i get all this, but i still love the idea of drafting a qb and the excitement that comes with it.  beyond that, this plan could transform the offense, then draft ronald jones in round 2 and you really have some nice talent.

[varjet]

1 minute ago, bla bla bla said:

I love the idea of Mayfield but if we can get Cousins that is the smarter move, he's proven it and is plenty young to make multiple SB runs. It really allows you to load up the team with young talent where trading up would leaving us in the opposite.

The dream will be that we can sit at 6 and pick Mayfield, but I don't know whether that is guaranteed.

[BurnleyJet]

22 minutes ago, varjet said:

The dream will be that we can sit at 6 and pick Mayfield, but I don't know whether that is guaranteed.

It's not happening, Baker is the third of the three Franchise QB's in the Draft he's not there at 6.

He never was going to be, Especially now that Allen's been exposed at the senior bowl.

[SenorGato]

37 minutes ago, Jetster said:

If MaccBowles signed Cousins/Jensen or Richburg & Norwell in free agency and then drafted Nelson at #6? 

If Chubb/top PR, Barkley, Fitzpatrick/top CB, or unknown freak OT are still available then yes. 

I’m against defense in FA outside of a starting corner (Gaines!), but not draft talent at big money spots if/when Cousins is signed.

[JiFtheOracle]

Depends on who you are passing on at 6...

[HessStation]

If they got Cousins, Norwell, Jensen id be targeting Barkley and Chubb at 6. 

[Jetster]

1 minute ago, HessStation said:

If they got Cousins, Norwell, Jensen id be targeting Barkley and Chubb at 6. 

I could see that but I don't see Chubb getting by the Colts.

[UnitedWhofans]

1 hour ago, Jetster said:

If MaccBowles signed Cousins/Jensen or Richburg & Norwell in free agency and then drafted Nelson at #6? Haven't we spent enough money on defense.

.

If Chubb is not on the board, and they cant trade back, draft him

[slats]

A guard at #6? That's as dumb as a safety at #6. Yes, I'd be pissed. 

If they were to sign Cousins, and a guard was the top of their draft board there, they'd have to do everything they could to trade down. 

[UnitedWhofans]

Just now, slats said:

A guard at #6? That's as dumb as a safety at #6. Yes, I'd be pissed. 

If they were to sign Cousins, and a guard was the top of their draft board there, they'd have to do everything they could to trade down. 

Two to tango

[slats]

1 minute ago, UnitedWhofans said:

Two to tango

Then reach for a position of value. Safeties and guards in the top ten don't build championship teams. Hell, take the top QB even and dangle him in a trade right then and there. 

[HessStation]

9 minutes ago, Jetster said:

I could see that but I don't see Chubb getting by the Colts.

If Colts wanted Chubb there might be room to trade up for Barkley seeing he might be Browns target at 4, then With the thought Browns went edge last year and Broncos going qb....you can at least see that path forward 

[UnitedWhofans]

1 minute ago, slats said:

Then reach for a position of value. Safeties and guards in the top ten don't build championship teams. Hell, take the top QB even and dangle him in a trade right then and there. 

You can't reach in the top ten.

[slats]

Just now, UnitedWhofans said:

You can't reach in the top ten.

I can't take a guard in the top ten. Who's the other pass rusher? Key? I'd take the second pass rusher before the first guard in the top ten 99/100 times. 

[Kleckineau]

Like the Cousins idea hate the guard idea.

There will most likely be teams ready to deal for the #6 pick.

[UnitedWhofans]

2 minutes ago, slats said:

I can't take a guard in the top ten. Who's the other pass rusher? Key? I'd take the second pass rusher before the first guard in the top ten 99/100 times. 

What about Orlando Brown? Tackle

[Kleckineau]

9 minutes ago, UnitedWhofans said:

What about Orlando Brown? Tackle

What did BP think of that question?

(Orlando Pace)

[HessStation]

5 minutes ago, Kleckineau said:

Like the Cousins idea hate the guard idea.

There will most likely be teams ready to deal for the #6 pick.

I don't love the Cousins idea but fine, if they did, and if they didn't land Norwell, then I'm 100% on board with Nelson at 6

carpenter is done and needs to be replaced 

[slats]

1 minute ago, UnitedWhofans said:

What about Orlando Brown? Tackle

A dominant left tackle is much different than a guard. One thing Maccagnan has demonstrated is a failure to incorporate positional value into his BAP grades. A pass rusher is infinitely more valuable than a guard. Key >>> Nelson. Jamal Adams is a nice player who won't likely ever be considered a bust, but a safety that high is ludicrous. Follow that up with a ****ing guard in the same spot? Idiocy. But, sadly, it would fit the Mac mold. 

[HessStation]

20 minutes ago, slats said:

A dominant left tackle is much different than a guard. One thing Maccagnan has demonstrated is a failure to incorporate positional value into his BAP grades. A pass rusher is infinitely more valuable than a guard. Key >>> Nelson. Jamal Adams is a nice player who won't likely ever be considered a bust, but a safety that high is ludicrous. Follow that up with a ****ing guard in the same spot? Idiocy. But, sadly, it would fit the Mac mold. 

I would rather a dominant LT than LG but I'm not so sure margin of value is "that" signicant today....if the LG is ALOT more of a sure fire dominant prospect pick vs the less sure fire LT. It would depend on the margin between the two in your internal organizational ranking

add to that your need is more significant at LG

[slats]

1 minute ago, HessStation said:

I would rather a dominant LT than LG but I'm not so sure margin of value is "that" signicant today....if the LG is ALOT more of a sure fire dominant prospect pick vs the less sure fire LT. I would depend on the margin between the two in your internal organizational ranking

We consistently disagree here. I remember debating Warmack and Cooper a few years ago, and I'm glad the Jets passed. Or Scherff, same. I'm just not taking a guard that high. It's a position that can be developed or bought in free agency for a relatively fair price - unlike QB or pass rusher or wide receiver or cornerback or left tackle, etc. I'll go for positional value at #6, and be more than willing to hit the interior of the OL twice in the second round if that's where the value finds itself. But #6 overall? Just no. 

[HessStation]

17 minutes ago, slats said:

We consistently disagree here. I remember debating Warmack and Cooper a few years ago, and I'm glad the Jets passed. Or Scherff, same. I'm just not taking a guard that high. It's a position that can be developed or bought in free agency for a relatively fair price - unlike QB or pass rusher or wide receiver or cornerback or left tackle, etc. I'll go for positional value at #6, and be more than willing to hit the interior of the OL twice in the second round if that's where the value finds itself. But #6 overall? Just no. 

Norwell's asking price is the same as Bell's right now. 

I was wrong on Warmack but that convo was strictly on him and not Cooper fwiw. Cooper was a reach. Warmack a bit of an anomaly as OG/OC who usually go in the first tend to be much safer than OT.... De Castro, Mankins, Martin, Frederick and Mangold at C etc 

[Jetster]

If Nelson becomes a 15 year all pro as good & comes close to a John Hannah type career, you'll do cartwheels. Didn't we move up to 5 for Mark Sanchez? Pick Gholston at #6? 

[HessStation]

1 minute ago, Jetster said:

If Nelson becomes a 15 year all pro as good & comes close to a John Hannah type career, you'll do cartwheels. Didn't we move up to 5 for Mark Sanchez? Pick Gholston at #6? 

I'd agree if they sign Cousins, which I don't love but I get it

[SenorGato]

It doesn’t help Nelson’s case at 6 that Hernandez showed up at the Senior Bowl while he sat out. Several college OTs like Tyrell Crosby and Isaiah Wynn seem like they can make excellent pro guards. Ragnow the C weighed in like a guard too at 6’5.”

Meh, pay Norwell and get some depth going. It wouldn’t be crazy for this team to field four new starters but either way their 3-4 reserves in 2016-2017  suuuucked.

[HessStation]

The jist is if you don't draft a premier position top 10 the guy needs to become an all pro, at least pro bowl, or you failed. I think Nelson would be worth the risk. I did think Warmack at 9 too, but also thought Decastro in the Coples draft too.

[SenorGato]

5 minutes ago, HessStation said:

The jist is if you don't draft a premier position top 10 the guy needs to become an all pro, at least pro bowl, or you failed. I think Nelson would be worth the risk. I did think Warmack at 9 too, but also thought Decastro in the Coples draft too.

Decastro took a year or two and the Jets were picking a dozen spots lower.

[HessStation]

11 minutes ago, SenorGato said:

Decastro took a year or two and the Jets were picking a dozen spots lower.

 my point was I would have picked Decastro at 16. He went 24.

 

On Warmack he may still develop too. I've kept up on him, during Tenn he was starting and at times flashed dominance but was too inconsistent, the reasonings I've read he was too dumb to pick up the offense. This year he's at least sat behind the best OL in football. Still hope for him. 

 

 

 

[SenorGato]

2 minutes ago, HessStation said:

 my point was I would have picked Decastro at 16. He went 24.

16’s still 10 spots lower than 6! A guard at 6 is a hard no, a guard at 16 is a little easier to go with. 

[Untouchable]

Just now, SenorGato said:

16’s still 10 spots lower than 6! A guard at 6 is a hard no, a guard at 16 is a little easier to go with. 

As I said before, many of you guys are getting too caught up in “draft position”.

If Nelson turns into an 8x all-pro and is the lynchpin of our OL for the next 10+ years...is anyone going to give a flying rats assh0le where we drafted him at?

Now, me wanting Nelson is all contingent upon us signing Cousins...but if we bring in Cousins, a legit starting center and a true #1 CB in FA and guys like Barkley and Chubb are off the board at #6...you guys would rather have a CB/S hybrid like Fitzpatrick or a tossup passrusher like Davenport/Key over a guy who has dominant OL written all over him? Just because they’re deemed to play a more “premium” position?

I wouldn't

And guards are becoming a much more “premium” position than they were even just 5 years ago.

David DeCastro made $18 million last season. Guys like Zeitler, Osemele and Trai Turner are going to make around $12 million in 2018.

If OG is such an easy position to fill, then why the hell are so many of these guys suddenly being drafted in the Top 15 and being paid damn near franchise LT money on the open market?