Signing Cousins screams of selfishness and impatience

[JetsFanatic]

3 hours ago, Greensleeves said:

Sorry, but signing Cousins to me screams of the coach and GM being more worried about saving their jobs by going 9-7 or 10-6 rather than putting the franchise first, and the fans being impatient for not seeing this rebuild through. I think there is a lower ceiling with signing Cousins, but a quicker return to a mediocre to decent season. Drafting one of the top QBs (trade up) would give us the opportunity to build the team properly and continue putting the pieces in place. We are not a win now team. Yes, we can have a decent season, but I'm more concerned with sustained success and a Super Bowl win than being competitive for five years and busting our cap for a QB that will most likely be good, not great. If we do sign Cousins, we're suddenly a win now team before our pieces are in place. Makes no sense to me. Can't we have the guts to take a chance like the Eagles and Rams. Those teams look like they are going to be good for a long time. Cousins screams cop out to me. And yes, Bates, I believe, can develop a young talented QB. It won't be Bowles developing him, FWIW.

How often does a top notch NFL QB become an unfettered FA in his prime? For a franchise that has been in need of a QB since Namath retired, they would be idiots if they didn't try to sign Cousins.  Other than a career year by Vinnie in 1998 and a great first 11 games by Farve in 2008 prior to his shoulder injury, they have been below average at that position since Namath retired! Cousins is young enough for sustained success.

[BigO]

2 hours ago, UnitedWhofans said:

The difference between signing Favre and this would be that Cousins is more of a long term solution than a quick fix, because of his age.

The difference is Greensleeves post made the utmost sense. Yours makes no sense whatsoever. 

[Jetsplayer21]

2 hours ago, TheNuuFaaolaExperience said:

I think you have it backwards. Signing Cousins has been planned since last year. They would have selected another QB in 2017 if they weren't planning to drop a boat load of money on Cousins. 

So they knew he wouldn’t be tagged or re-sign with wash to avoid tag, since last yr? Did they also know he was going to win this yrs Super Bowl last yr ? 

[Greensleeves]

46 minutes ago, Untouchable said:

It screams of the Jets finally solving the QB situation for the next 5-7 years and keeping all of their draft picks.

Disagree - we would not be building it the right way. The draft has several QBs that many people believe have a higher ceiling than Cousins. Why don't you want it all instead of settling. It's like asking out the girl you know will say yes instead of going for the really hot girl that is sitting home because no-one has the guts to ask her out.

[BigO]

51 minutes ago, Integrity28 said:

Fans clamor did the fairy tale of “real ultimately rebuild” over an enjoyable, winning season. 

Whats that term where the victim in an abusive relationship enables the abuser?

You get what you ask for 

[Greensleeves]

52 minutes ago, Integrity28 said:

Fans clamor did the fairy tale of “real ultimately rebuild” over an enjoyable, winning season. 

Whats that term where the victim in an abusive relationship enables the abuser?

I'm not interested in a winning season here or there. I want us to expect a winning season that could turn into a Super Bowl because we created sustainable success by building a young, talented team.

[TuscanyTile2]

2 hours ago, Greensleeves said:

Sorry, but signing Cousins to me screams of the coach and GM being more worried about saving their jobs by going 9-7 or 10-6 rather than putting the franchise first, and the fans being impatient for not seeing this rebuild through. I think there is a lower ceiling with signing Cousins, but a quicker return to a mediocre to decent season. Drafting one of the top QBs (trade up) would give us the opportunity to build the team properly and continue putting the pieces in place. We are not a win now team. Yes, we can have a decent season, but I'm more concerned with sustained success and a Super Bowl win than being competitive for five years and busting our cap for a QB that will most likely be good, not great. If we do sign Cousins, we're suddenly a win now team before our pieces are in place. Makes no sense to me. Can't we have the guts to take a chance like the Eagles and Rams. Those teams look like they are going to be good for a long time. Cousins screams cop out to me. And yes, Bates, I believe, can develop a young talented QB. It won't be Bowles developing him, FWIW.

Fully agree!

[dbatesman]

2 hours ago, UnitedWhofans said:

That's fair, but there will be growing pains. And I dont know if this market can handle growing pains

Just FYI everyone, if Macc drafts a QB and he sucks just like the other QBs Macc has drafted, its actually the fans fault

[HighPitch]

1 hour ago, slats said:

Sorry, but I think that's a terrible idea and one the team will never pursue. If (when?) the Jets sign Cousins, they have to be all in with Cousins, and that means not using their big chip in the draft to draft his backup. I could, however, see them spending one of their second rounders on one of the leftover QBs. Maybe. 

To each their own....

is my suggestion typical? No, but we should be thinking outside the box. Enough following...

if cousins gives us 2 or 3 solid years, hand the reigns to #6 if the guy is tearing it up in camp and move on into the future. Cousins decline will start sometime anyways. And dont tell me about money.....cousins deal will be front loaded and we can cut him year 3. 

If cousins sucks, you have a great back up plan.

its not ever day you get to pick six in a qb filled draft. Passing on a qb this year would be sooooooooooooooo jetsy. I can see this class having a a few stars, while we post what could have been after cousins stinks it up or blows out his knee

 

 

hope im wrong

[BigO]

2 minutes ago, Greensleeves said:

Disagree - we would not be building it the right way. The draft has several QBs that many people believe have a higher ceiling than Cousins. Why don't you want it all instead of settling. It's like asking out the girl you know will say yes instead of going for the really hot girl that is sitting home because no-one has the guts to ask her out.

You’ve inspired me. Next time I see that blonde in the elevator i’m asking her out. I myself am on match.com, tinder, harmony, Zoosk, plentyoffish, ok Cupid. And oh yea JetNation! 

[Larz]

It's a very unusual situation. Brees and manning had serious injury problems when they became available 

Cousins is healthy and in his prime 

Young QBs are cap friendly for 4 years. 

In a perfect world you draft a QB and build around him with more cap room , but picking 6th really changes things 

Signing cousins allows you more flexibility in the draft to even trade down and get another starter 

The only thing I wouldn't want the Jets to do is to trade for cousins then give him a trillion dollars, you almost guarantee mediocrity that way. 

[TheNuuFaaolaExperience]

1 hour ago, UnitedWhofans said:

I will say this. MAcc's track record of bringing in QBs in FA is MUCH better than his track record of drafting QBs.

Can we wait until we have a big enough sample size before giving a GM a track record on drafting QBs? He has had a grand total of THREE drafts. 

Belichick drafted Brady, Garappolo, Cassel, and Brissett. He only drafted the greatest modern QB, possibly the greatest QB ever, and another QB who is primed to another top QB in the league. Want to know who else Belichick drafted? Rohan Davey, Kliff Kingsbury, Kevin O'Connell, Zac Robinson, and Ryan Mallett. Belichick has picked more bad QBs than good, so I guess his track record is bad when it comes to picking a QB.

No, I am not comparing Macc to Belichick, but I am pointing out how ridiculous it is to judge a GM's ability to find a QB after three drafts. If drafting a QB was easy, the Browns would have had a franchise QB by now. 

[TheNuuFaaolaExperience]

2 minutes ago, dbatesman said:

Just FYI everyone, if Macc drafts a QB and he sucks just like the other QBs Macc has drafted, its actually the fans fault

All two of the QBs he drafted.

[HighPitch]

If its between cousins an NO qb taken in rounds 1 or 2, id 100% pass on cousins and draft a guy.

the op is correct. Its a desperate move to save jobs and keep the 9-7 machine rolling for as long as they can

[Greensleeves]

2 hours ago, HighPitch said:

The OP is correct. Even though id like to see cousins here, i know its not in the best interest of the franchise long term.

as i have said all along, best case scenario is sign cousins, draft a qb at 6 and cut petty and hack. Adress oline and or o weapons in round 2

 

thats just me

That would be the best of both worlds, but I can see Cousins getting pretty annoyed if that were to happen, and Bowles would be clamoring for another defensive first round guy - that would be every year since 2009, and the team would get blasted by the press. To think that Bowles would want D again in the first round when our D isn't even that great after all of those drafts, and our offense is pretty crappy.

[bla bla bla]

I don't think the Jets see Cousins as a short term solution. I think it is more of a probability vs probability.

 

The likelihood that Cousins continues to play well after having success under constant changes in Washington is pretty high. Given his health it is also relatively high that he'll be able to sustain this level of play well into his late 30s (beyond the contract we offer him). Where as the alternative could be us needing to trade up (6, 37, 2019 1st to beat buffalo) to take a QB who historical has roughly a 50% chance of busting that's not even taking into account that he likely wouldn't be the consensus best QB available. Of the 50% of QBs who don't bust we would then need to hope that he can surpass the level of play that Cousins has performed at which again is relatively low probability. If money is your concern with Cousins then that drafted QB would need to win a Super Bowl while still on his rookie deal before he will need to be paid more than what Cousins would get.

I just think the guarantee of top 12 QB play is more than enough to win a Super Bowl with even if you consider his ceiling lower than a rookies, it also comes with a far higher floor. The rookie QB would have a far lower floor but potentially a higher ceiling, the "potential" part of that being the reason why Cousins will be so sought after.

[Ohio State NY Jets fan]

1 hour ago, Untouchable said:

It screams of the Jets finally solving the QB situation for the next 5-7 years and keeping all of their draft picks.

Yes, the selfishness and impatience of Jets fans to want their team to be in playoff contention every year for the next 7-10 years because they have a competent QB, oh the horror... 

and let's not forget that hack could be ready by the time Cousins retires  this is not a short term move

drafting the 4th or 5th best QB prospect could be a much shorter term move IMHO - (edit - unless Mayfield drops)

[Greensleeves]

Just now, Ohio State NY Jets fan said:

Yes, the selfishness and impatience of Jets fans to want their team to be playoff contention every year for the next 7-10 years because they have a competent QB, oh the horror... 

and let's not forget that hack could be ready by the time Cousins retires, this is not a short term move

drafting the 4th or 5th best QB prospect could be a much shorter term move IMHO

I would move up to #3 and grab either the 2nd or 3rd best, depending on how the draft goes. Get ready for a whole bunch of 9-7 and 10-6 years. Would you rather have Cousins or Wentz? These QBs are more highly regarded than Wentz. Playing it safe is the wrong way to go IMO. It's not the best long term. I would be shocked if at least 3 of these QBs doesn't have a higher ceiling than Cousins, and I think it could be as many as 6. IMO, foolish to ignore the fact that it's a really talented group of QBs just to play it safe.

[Greensleeves]

But if we do sign Cousins, we should be all in for Barkley. We have seen the stats where most draft picks don't pan out. Move up for the sure thing and we would finally have a really exciting player on offense again. Remember when we had Toon, Walker, McNeil, Schuler on the same team? That's what drafting offense every once in a while can do for you. 

[Integrity28]

21 minutes ago, Greensleeves said:

I'm not interested in a winning season here or there. I want us to expect a winning season that could turn into a Super Bowl because we created sustainable success by building a young, talented team.

Looks at the Falcons.

More fairy tales. I’m not against taking a QB early. I’m against the notion that it takes umpteen million years to rebuild a team, in a league notorious for 1-year turnarounds, and not notorious for long, sustained success outside of one franchise whose owner put the Commish into place.

[Ohio State NY Jets fan]

12 minutes ago, Greensleeves said:

I would move up to #3 and grab either the 2nd or 3rd best, depending on how the draft goes. Get ready for a whole bunch of 9-7 and 10-6 years. Would you rather have Cousins or Wentz? These QBs are more highly regarded than Wentz. Playing it safe is the wrong way to go IMO. It's not the best long term. I would be shocked if at least 3 of these QBs doesn't have a higher ceiling than Cousins, and I think it could be as many as 6. IMO, foolish to ignore the fact that it's a really talented group of QBs just to play it safe.

I would rather have Wentz, and would be fine with Mayfield, might even agree on the higher ceiling - but what is the cost to move to #3 and how does that compare to the cost for Cousins? 

[BigO]

9 minutes ago, Integrity28 said:

Looks at the Falcons.

More fairy tales. I’m not against taking a QB early. I’m against the notion that it takes umpteen million years to rebuild a team, in a league notorious for 1-year turnarounds, and not notorious for long, sustained success outside of one franchise whose owner put the Commish into place.

Yes look at the Falcons. They should have won the SB last year. And they made a good run this year and should again next year. And this 1 year turn around is nothing more than a myth. Name one team that’s won a Super Bowl adopting this mentality? Sure there have been teams that have drastically improved but they fall short and return to mediocrity. Build it and it will succeed.

[Villain The Foe]

2 hours ago, Greensleeves said:

Sorry, but signing Cousins to me screams of the coach and GM being more worried about saving their jobs by going 9-7 or 10-6 rather than putting the franchise first, and the fans being impatient for not seeing this rebuild through. I think there is a lower ceiling with signing Cousins, but a quicker return to a mediocre to decent season. Drafting one of the top QBs (trade up) would give us the opportunity to build the team properly and continue putting the pieces in place. We are not a win now team. Yes, we can have a decent season, but I'm more concerned with sustained success and a Super Bowl win than being competitive for five years and busting our cap for a QB that will most likely be good, not great. If we do sign Cousins, we're suddenly a win now team before our pieces are in place. Makes no sense to me. Can't we have the guts to take a chance like the Eagles and Rams. Those teams look like they are going to be good for a long time. Cousins screams cop out to me. And yes, Bates, I believe, can develop a young talented QB. It won't be Bowles developing him, FWIW.

It's hard to agree with this. What do you expect the coaching staff and GM to do, not try and save their jobs? How many more years of 5-10 seasons do you expect they have? They've been here for 3 seasons and have produced nothing worth noting. 

Sure they're going to worry about saving their jobs, especially if they feel like signing a guy in his prime can help that cause. Think about it, saving their job means that they've turned things around with this franchise (which is what would pretty much save their job) so isnt that what Jets fans want anyway? 

Look, im not a huge fan of the alleged contract offers surrounding Cousins (30 million +) but I would be highly supportive of signing Cousins and I think he'd be an immediate upgrade at the most important position on this team without a doubt. GM'ers and coaches saving their jobs have nothing to do with the fact that Cousins would indeed make this team better. 

We are not a "win now" team to many fans, but when you're going into your 4th year as a GM/coach this IS a win now year. This is their 4th year and 2nd rebuild. It is a win now situation, and the bottomline is drafting a QB this year may not save their job if we have another bad season because of the lack of experience at the QB position given QB development. 

I wouldnt be willing to sign Cousins to 30+ million, but between 23-25 I'd be on board...AND we could still draft a developmental QB further down in the draft as well as trading down in the draft to pick up more pieces. 

 

 

[TheNuuFaaolaExperience]

46 minutes ago, Jetsplayer21 said:

So they knew he wouldn’t be tagged or re-sign with wash to avoid tag, since last yr? Did they also know he was going to win this yrs Super Bowl last yr ? 

They had good reason to believe that a guy due $34 million was not going to be franchised. 

[Pac]

2 hours ago, Warfish said:

Kirk Cousins has been, as a starter, what you would want any drafted QB to develop into.  But most draft picks don't.

A Top 10 4,000 Yard a year passer.

If we draft say, Darnold, would we be angry if he threw for 67%, 4,900 Yards and 27/12 TD/INT Ratio?

I think we'd all sh*t ourselves if that happened, we'd all be so happy.

Well, that IS Kirk Cousins right now.  No waiting required.

Kirk will be 30 by the start of the 2018 season.  He has, barring injury as always, at least 4-7 more years to play QB in the modern rule-set of the NFL.

We may quibble over his cost, but there really shouldn't be any concern about either his ability/production (he's far more likely to be good than any draft pick) or how long he may last (at 30 he has years ahead of him still).

I too want (in my preference) to draft an "our guy" QB who plays his whole career with us.  

We're not in position to do so without great cost in draft picks.

And this is, IMO, very much NOT the draft to try.  Darnold and Rosen are mediocre prospects at best.  They are not Dan Marino and John Elway.  And the 2nd tier guys, even the one I really like, are all VERY risky picks.

A pursuit of Cousins may help this regime in the short term, but it is also the clearest way to vastly improve this franchise at it's most vital position.  And it's an opportunity that near on never occurs, a legit franchise QB performer available as a FA.

Kirk is a very good option for us.  His signing, should it happen, should not right off the bat be turned into so faux Bowles/Macc CYA move.  It IS the best move this team can make at QB......even if the cost in dollars (which is better than picks we must admit) will be stratospherically high.

Looks like you've finally joined the right side of the fight on this one.  Nice.

[Pac]

47 minutes ago, HighPitch said:

If cousins sucks, you have a great back up plan.

If Cousins comes here and suddenly sucks then every coach should be fired at the end of the year.  He's proven he most certainly does not suck and done it with less than what he'd have here.

[Jets Voice of Reason]

Uh, i'm pretty sure if this coaching staff cared about doing what's best for the franchise, they wouldn't have been trying to squeeze this orange for every last drop of 5 wins and would have played the kids instead of veterans who have no long term future here. 

[SpartanJet]

I'd agree with the OP if the Jets were drafting 1-3, but they screwed up the tank and just had to win 5 games for reasons.  If they can trade up by some miracle and grab Rosen, Darnold, or Allen then that is the best bet moving forward.  If not I'd rather have Cousins than the rest of the QBs available after the top 3.

[Pac]

4 minutes ago, Jets Voice of Reason said:

Uh, i'm pretty sure if this coaching staff cared about doing what's best for the franchise, they wouldn't have been trying to squeeze this orange for every last drop of 5 wins and would have played the kids instead of veterans who have no long term future here. 

yikes.. such an awful take.

in case you missed it one of the kid QB's played plenty to end the season.  how'd that go?

[slats]

47 minutes ago, HighPitch said:

To each their own....

is my suggestion typical? No, but we should be thinking outside the box. Enough following...

if cousins gives us 2 or 3 solid years, hand the reigns to #6 if the guy is tearing it up in camp and move on into the future. Cousins decline will start sometime anyways. And dont tell me about money.....cousins deal will be front loaded and we can cut him year 3. 

If cousins sucks, you have a great back up plan.

its not ever day you get to pick six in a qb filled draft. Passing on a qb this year would be sooooooooooooooo jetsy. I can see this class having a a few stars, while we post what could have been after cousins stinks it up or blows out his knee

 

 

hope im wrong

You're giving Cousins $30M/year because you've seen him play at a high level in the NFL and you expect him to continue that for another solid five seasons. Once you make that move, the next one is to build a team around him with the goal of winning a Super Bowl. The next move is not securing his successor. I'd be fine with a QB taken anywhere from the second to fourth rounds, a developmental guy who fits the prototype and developing him. You can't use the #6 overall on a player who you intend to be your backup QB for the next three years, minimum. That pick is too valuable. It has to be a piece of the potential championship puzzle. 

If you're not sure that Cousins can be your high-level starter for the next five years, you don't give him $60-100M guaranteed in the first place. You sign a lower priced vet and put yourself in a position to draft your favorite prospect in the first round. 

 

[Warfish]

23 minutes ago, Pac said:

Looks like you've finally joined the right side of the fight on this one.  Nice.

Wanted Kirk in 2015.

”Finally”.

My concerns as to his cost is unchanged.

My view of him as a player, also unchanged.

[HawkeyeJet]

I keep reading one of the main reasons Cousins would pick the Broncos is because they have better weapons.  Is that really the case?  Sanders and Thomas are both going to turn 31 this year(Sanders before the season starts) and are far from the elite players at the position at this point in their career.  Compare Robbie Anderson's year this year to those guys numbers over the last few years.  It's not as far off as you might expect.

I'm not trying to imply the Jets offensive weapons are great, or even necessarily good, but I think it's overblown how good the offensive weapons are in Denver.

[Warfish]

By the way Slats....you’ve been knocking it out of the park of late, post/opinion wise. Nice work.

[bla bla bla]

1 hour ago, Jetsplayer21 said:

So they knew he wouldn’t be tagged or re-sign with wash to avoid tag, since last yr? Did they also know he was going to win this yrs Super Bowl last yr ? 

I'd argue the whole league knew Cousins would not be a Redskin since last March when Kirk asked for a trade.

[slats]

14 minutes ago, Warfish said:

By the way Slats....you’ve been knocking it out of the park of late, post/opinion wise. Nice work.

Thank you.