Jets have work to do!

[Jetster]

This offseason is a referendum on both Macc & Bowles.

Regarding Cousins, when the time comes IF the Jets are actually in negotiations Macc has to be precise, and clear with him & his agent. He needs to be ready to offer him a blockbuster deal & make it really clear the NY Jets can not be involved in drawn out negotiations that could hinder their ability to sign other free agents they have targeted. 

If they love Cousins they can't try to figure out ways to convince him the Jets are great organization but let him know he's just one more part of this 2nd year of this rebuild. The Jets have work to do & floundering around for weeks with Cousins agent could be damaging in a small time period between the start of free agency & the draft. 

Offer him your BEST huge deal & give a time frame because it's best for both sides. Pull the offer if his agent plays any games. He's good, he's not THE BEST. Don't let the tail wag the dog, that's what has hurt this team for years.

 

[T0mShane]

Yeah, but it’s not really feasible to think they can undo three years of bad signings and low-impact draft picks in one offseason by giving a slightly-above-average QB $150 mil. 

[JetsFanatic]

3 minutes ago, T0mShane said:

Yeah, but it’s not really feasible to think they can undo three years of bad signings and low-impact draft picks in one offseason by giving a slightly-above-average QB $150 mil. 

That would be true if what you wrote were factual.

[T0mShane]

1 minute ago, JetsFanatic said:

That would be true if what you wrote were factual.

Como se que

[JetsFanatic]

6 minutes ago, T0mShane said:

Como se que

The Jets improved last year even though their record was the same.  They beat 3 playoff teams and came within a hair of beating 3 others (NE, Atlanta & Carolina), in 2016 they couldn't beat a playoff team if you spotted them 20 points. They had a solid, not sexy, draft last season.  Both Adams and Maye are players.  Hanson showed signs when he got a shot late in the year and McGuire will be a nice change of pace back. That said, Mac can't screw up the QB position this year.  He has been here 4 years now, he has to get us a real QB not a stop gap. I like Cousins, he only turns 30 next season.  

[bla bla bla]

47 minutes ago, Jetster said:

This offseason is a referendum on both Macc & Bowles.

Regarding Cousins, when the time comes IF the Jets are actually in negotiations Macc has to be precise, and clear with him & his agent. He needs to be ready to offer him a blockbuster deal & make it really clear the NY Jets can not be involved in drawn out negotiations that could hinder their ability to sign other free agents they have targeted. 

If they love Cousins they can't try to figure out ways to convince him the Jets are great organization but let him know he's just one more part of this 2nd year of this rebuild. The Jets have work to do & floundering around for weeks with Cousins agent could be damaging in a small time period between the start of free agency & the draft. 

Offer him your BEST huge deal & give a time frame because it's best for both sides. Pull the offer if his agent plays any games. He's good, he's not THE BEST. Don't let the tail wag the dog, that's what has hurt this team for years.

 

I don't think Cousins signs until the rosters are more complete. He'll make his rounds in FA and see how the Browns/Jets/Broncos/Vikings/Bills use their cap space before signing. That likely means the 2nd tier of QBs will either wait til after Cousins signs or teams will remove themselves from the Cousins sweepstakes so they don't miss out on the 2nd tier QBs. I don't negotiating with Cousins will prevent us from going after Landry and Jensen unless they want to see where he goes first, in which case it doesn't really matter. I see our QB options as Cousins or McCown + Rookie so we wouldn't really miss out on someone IMO.

[T0mShane]

2 minutes ago, JetsFanatic said:

The Jets improved last year even though their record was the same.  They beat 3 playoff teams and came within a hair of beating 3 others (NE, Atlanta & Carolina), in 2016 they couldn't beat a playoff team if you spotted them 20 points. They had a solid, not sexy, draft last season.  Both Adams and Maye are players.  Hanson showed signs when he got a shot late in the year and McGuire will be a nice change of pace back. That said, Mac can't screw up the QB position this year.  He has been here 4 years now, he has to get us a real QB not a stop gap. I like Cousins, he only turns 30 next season.  

The team is not good, and citing guys like Hanson and McGuire as evidence of the roster being anything less than terrible is evidence of that. Literally every team has players in their bottom third that are as good or better than those guys; they only get attention here because it’s surprising that a Macc draft pick actually sees the field. Adams and Maye showed you what they were, and were in college, and will be for the extent of their careers. Adams cannot play the pass and is an undersized, spotty tackler with averahs athleticism. Maye is a good hitter and is, overall, a better player than Adams, but Adams is a massive self-promoter so he gets the ink. 

Yes, the Jets squeezed out a few more wins than people thought they would, but they’re not one Kirk Cousins away from being taken seriously.

[JetsFanatic]

4 minutes ago, T0mShane said:

The team is not good, and citing guys like Hanson and McGuire as evidence of the roster being anything less than terrible is evidence of that. Literally every team has players in their bottom third that are as good or better than those guys; they only get attention here because it’s surprising that a Macc draft pick actually sees the field. Adams and Maye showed you what they were, and were in college, and will be for the extent of their careers. Adams cannot play the pass and is an undersized, spotty tackler with averahs athleticism. Maye is a good hitter and is, overall, a better player than Adams, but Adams is a massive self-promoter so he gets the ink. 

Yes, the Jets squeezed out a few more wins than people thought they would, but they’re not one Kirk Cousins away from being taken seriously.

I don't agree with your assessment.  With 3 pick in the top 49 and $100M in cap space they have an opportunity to add a great deal of talent. I thought they were a much better team last year than 2 years ago. We'll see.

[T0mShane]

1 minute ago, JetsFanatic said:

I don't agree with your assessment.  With 3 pick in the top 49 and $100M in cap space they have an opportunity to add a great deal of talent. I thought they were a much better team last year than 2 years ago. We'll see.

I mean, we hope so. The best case scenario is this, right:

1. Sign Cousins, perhaps the Ravens center, and a corner.

2. At six, draft Minkah Fitzpatrick(?) and in Round Two an OL and an edge rusher.

 

I suppose you could get to eight, nine wins that way.

 

[JetFaninMI]

29 minutes ago, T0mShane said:

I mean, we hope so. The best case scenario is this, right:

1. Sign Cousins, perhaps the Ravens center, and a corner.

2. At six, draft Minkah Fitzpatrick(?) and in Round Two an OL and an edge rusher.

 

I suppose you could get to eight, nine wins that way.

 

Its a decent start but unless they get some better skill players in here it will all be for naught. The WR corps are riddled with question marks. Anderson is a headcase who cannot be counted on. Enunwa is a huge question mark and may not be healthy. Kearse is a good player but not a #1 and the rest are unproven and highly suspect. They will also need to add at least one more RB and still will be short. McGuire is still unproven and Powell is not an every down guy. Not to mention the TE position. ASJ is unsigned and is going to want starters money and while he has improved is he worth the money he will want? These are the cold hard facts. You can say sign this guy and draft this guy but that is easier said than done. There will be competition out there and you can have all the cap space in the world but if your franchise is not attractive to FA's they will not sign here. You already saw this with Bell and while I don't think he will even become a FA you have to take what he said into account. That is going to leave you with the Buster Skrine's of the world and we all saw how that has worked out. Until the Jets are taken seriously as a franchise the draft will most likely be the way to go. Sucks but its where we are at.

[varjet]

1 hour ago, T0mShane said:

I mean, we hope so. The best case scenario is this, right:

1. Sign Cousins, perhaps the Ravens center, and a corner.

2. At six, draft Minkah Fitzpatrick(?) and in Round Two an OL and an edge rusher.

 

I suppose you could get to eight, nine wins that way.

 

Where does Minkah play on the Jets?  Can he play CB 1 or 2?

i think if the Jets sign Cousins they draft Nelson and cut Carpenter.

[long suffering jets fan]

1 hour ago, T0mShane said:

The team is not good, and citing guys like Hanson and McGuire as evidence of the roster being anything less than terrible is evidence of that. Literally every team has players in their bottom third that are as good or better than those guys; they only get attention here because it’s surprising that a Macc draft pick actually sees the field. Adams and Maye showed you what they were, and were in college, and will be for the extent of their careers. Adams cannot play the pass and is an undersized, spotty tackler with averahs athleticism. Maye is a good hitter and is, overall, a better player than Adams, but Adams is a massive self-promoter so he gets the ink. 

Yes, the Jets squeezed out a few more wins than people thought they would, but they’re not one Kirk Cousins away from being taken seriously.

Wow, talk about a glass half empty response.  I agree the Jets are not one Cousins away from the playoffs, but $70M and 9 Draft picks can be a significant gap filler.  Even if we resign McCown and draft a rookie we can fill some major gaps and be a much improved team next year.

[long suffering jets fan]

1 hour ago, T0mShane said:

I mean, we hope so. The best case scenario is this, right:

1. Sign Cousins, perhaps the Ravens center, and a corner.

2. At six, draft Minkah Fitzpatrick(?) and in Round Two an OL and an edge rusher.

 

I suppose you could get to eight, nine wins that way.

 

I think we can do more than just a Center and Corner with the cap space we have left after signing Cousins.

[Jetster]

1 hour ago, T0mShane said:

Yeah, but it’s not really feasible to think they can undo three years of bad signings and low-impact draft picks in one offseason by giving a slightly-above-average QB $150 mil. 

My point with this thread is Macc can't be used as some barometer for Cousins agent. Figure what you want to pay (Obviously it will be a new record for QB pay) make your best "Take it or leave it" offer, and move on from it after you've given what you believe is your best offer, large enough that it obviously screams, YOUR THE QB WE WANT CONTRACT!

I will reiterate that I want Cousins, but do not allow them to USE THE ORGANIZATION for their benefit with Denver or Minny. We still have the 6th pick in the draft & there is a lot of potential in some of these young QBs. I'd rather Cousins but it could be one of those situations that sometime NOT getting what you want is a stroke of luck.

[slats]

1 hour ago, varjet said:

Where does Minkah play on the Jets?  Can he play CB 1 or 2?

i think if the Jets sign Cousins they draft Nelson and cut Carpenter.

It would just be so mother-****ing Jets to draft a guard #6 overall the year after they drafted a mother-****ing safety #6 overall. 

[rangerous]

1 hour ago, long suffering jets fan said:

I think we can do more than just a Center and Corner with the cap space we have left after signing Cousins.

maybe on the cap space but i think these guys are in addition to re-signing the jets own fa's like davis, asj, claiborne, enunwa and so on.  they're all going to eat into the cap to varying degrees and before we know it the cap space is gone.  but if they do get a qb, center, and corner via free agency and draft well they will have upgraded maybe 25% of the starters on the team.  that could make for a really nice season.

[The Crusher]

4 hours ago, T0mShane said:

Yeah, but it’s not really feasible to think they can undo three years of bad signings and low-impact draft picks in one offseason by giving a slightly-above-average QB $150 mil. 

Well the goal is 6-7 wins this year so I think that gives them a punchers chance. 

[Mackman55]

1 hour ago, long suffering jets fan said:

Wow, talk about a glass half empty response.  I agree the Jets are not one Cousins away from the playoffs, but $70M and 9 Draft picks can be a significant gap filler.  Even if we resign McCown and draft a rookie we can fill some major gaps and be a much improved team next year.

Hey, I'm no "Debbie Downer" but the fact is the Jets are not a good team and most importantly lack talent at the key positions which lead to winning and championships. OL, QB, edge rushers and cover corners are also the positions which you can't fill through free agency unless you overpay(See Cousins). That's why it's so important to build talent at these positions through the draft, which the Jets have failed miserably to do over the last few years. The Jets currently have no NFL caliber QB on the roster, a poor offensive line featuring the worst center in football, no NFL starting caliber CB's (Claiborne is a FA) and no edge rusher that an opponent has to game plan for. You can't fill these holes through FA, 2 or 3 maybe, but the long term preponderance of your talent core must come through the draft. Based on MAC's recent record I have no confidence in him utilizing those 9 draft picks wisely. Last year's draft was a disaster from which the Jets will suffer from for a long time, passing on talented QB's in round 1 and numerous gifted skill position players  in round 2 for two box safeties with mediocre cover skills. Signing Cousins is a short term band aid which will extend coaching and GM jobs but will hamstring the Jets cap wise in future years and thus endanger long term championship aspirations. 

 

 

 

 

[long suffering jets fan]

16 minutes ago, Mackman55 said:

Hey, I'm no "Debbie Downer" but the fact is the Jets are not a good team and most importantly lack talent at the key positions which lead to winning and championships. OL, QB, edge rushers and cover corners are also the positions which you can't fill through free agency unless you overpay(See Cousins). That's why it's so important to build talent at these positions through the draft, which the Jets have failed miserably to do over the last few years. The Jets currently have no NFL caliber QB on the roster, a poor offensive line featuring the worst center in football, no NFL starting caliber CB's (Claiborne is a FA) and no edge rusher that an opponent has to game plan for. You can't fill these holes through FA, 2 or 3 maybe, but the long term preponderance of your talent core must come through the draft. Based on MAC's recent record I have no confidence in him utilizing those 9 draft picks wisely. Last year's draft was a disaster from which the Jets will suffer from for a long time, passing on talented QB's in round 1 and numerous gifted skill position players  in round 2 for two box safeties with mediocre cover skills. Signing Cousins is a short term band aid which will extend coaching and GM jobs but will hamstring the Jets cap wise in future years and thus endanger long term championship aspirations. 

 

 

 

 

Bottom line is you have no confidence in Macc.  I get it.

[Mackman55]

9 minutes ago, long suffering jets fan said:

Bottom line is you have no confidence in Macc.  I get it.

No I would not agree that is the bottom line. The Jets have so many holes to fill at high value positions it's dumb to handcuff yourself cap wise with Cousins when you have no realistic chance to compete for a championship anytime soon. To enter cap hell with a depleted roster is the road to long term mediocrity.

I will still give MAC a chance but he has not yet demonstrated the ability to grasp how to build an NFL contender. In his defense, I don't think he has full control on days 1&2 of the draft.......

[Patriot Killa]

They have had work to do for the last 50 years man....lol I’m just saying. 

[Jetsplayer21]

10 hours ago, bla bla bla said:

I don't think Cousins signs until the rosters are more complete. He'll make his rounds in FA and see how the Browns/Jets/Broncos/Vikings/Bills use their cap space before signing. That likely means the 2nd tier of QBs will either wait til after Cousins signs or teams will remove themselves from the Cousins sweepstakes so they don't miss out on the 2nd tier QBs. I don't negotiating with Cousins will prevent us from going after Landry and Jensen unless they want to see where he goes first, in which case it doesn't really matter. I see our QB options as Cousins or McCown + Rookie so we wouldn't really miss out on someone IMO.

Qbs do not care about complete roster. They care about the offense condition. They first want to know they have a strong line who will protect them. Time to throw is crucial for a qb, and they want a long healthy career. The jets have very bad qb protection. They also want good receivers to throw to. Again a big no. If Mac can convince cousins agent “ look I made a big mistake listening to my HC and going all D, whenever he asks. We are now committed to building around the O and qb. “ I doubt Mac is man enough to say that. Mac is betting he can just outbid other teams by a lot and that will be enough. 

[NoBowles]

Could you imagine how conservative Bowles would have been with a backup Foles?