JustInFudge Posted February 13, 2018 Share Posted February 13, 2018 5 hours ago, JiF said: There is absolutely nothing special about Baker Mayfield. Nothing. Average measurable, average athlete, average arm. He's super accurate throwing to wide open receivers. The only thing "special" about him is that he's a fierce competitor. All these other guys at least something special that wows you or that you can focus on and be excited about: Rosen - size, polish and arm strength. Allen - size, athleticism and arm strength Darnold - size, arm and a flare for the dramatics in the big moments Jackson - size, arm, athleticism, speed, rare combination Rudolph - size, arm, polish If you draft Baker Mayfield, it better be the perfect system, with an outstanding OL and weapons galore because he is not the type of player to elevate an average offense with his skillz. All those other dudes, at least have that in them. Whether they can do it or not at the next level is yet to be determined but at least there is something there to get you excited outside of competitive spirit. Since this has been a popular post. I decided to do a quick looksie at some other break downs. Notice what NFL.com highlights as his strengths? Notice how the rest talks about stats? Stats at Oklahoma. Stats in the Big 12. Stats stats stats...but he's fiery competitor. lmfao DOUG FLUTIE AT #6!!!!! JET UP BITCHES!!!! http://www.nfl.com/draft/2018/profiles/baker-mayfield?id=2560063 ANALYSIS STRENGTHS Tough and competitive. Plays with fiery demeanor and massive chip on his shoulder. Teammates rally around him on and off field. In complete command of his offense and has improved with each season. Light on his feet with quick setup in pocket. Has good pre-snap plan. Eyeballs and eliminates safeties to isolate man coverage on his receiver. Quick processor from read to read. Responds suddenly to what is there. Pitch and catch accurate if you allow it. Underrated arm talent. Expedite from off-platform with tight release and zip. Drives with lower body for added velocity. Accurate on all three levels. Completed 53 percent of his throws of 21-plus yards over last two years. Drops touch throws over top of linebackers trailing in coverage. Has improv talent. Uses mobility to buy time to make plays. Effective when he breaks contain and will probe for explosive play. Completed 67 percent when on the move. Rises to the occasion. Posted elite production and efficiency as passer in the red-zone. WEAKNESSES Falls short of size marks for traditional early-round quarterback. Short with drop-down release makes him more susceptible to batted passes. Benefited from spread scheme that created huge passing windows to throw to. Will see increased importance on post-snap reads. Needs to improve full-field scanning. Can be thrown off rhythm by delayed blitz packages and disguised coverages. Footwork is erratic. Creeps up in pocket towards pressure. Ball placement wanes when he tries to gun it. Deep balls hang on him. Can't afford any delay in deep release to beat safety over the top. Needs to eliminate his back foot throws. Desire to make plays will lead to unnecessary sacks. Has to prove he can reign in and control on-field edge and cockiness. DRAFT PROJECTION Round 1 NFL COMPARISON Doug Flutie BOTTOM LINE Spread quarterbacks have had limited success as have small quarterbacks. Mayfield falls into both categories and has to prove he can transcend those perceived deficiencies on the next level. Having complete command of the Oklahoma offense isn't an automatic precursor for NFL success, but Mayfield's ability to process, extend plays and throw with accuracy give him a good shot. He'll be somewhat scheme-dependent so whoever takes him will need to be willing to build their offense around his strengths. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
STRENGTHS Tough and competitive. Plays with fiery demeanor and massive chip on his shoulder. Teammates rally around him on and off field. In complete command of his offense and has improved with each season. Light on his feet with quick setup in pocket. Has good pre-snap plan. Eyeballs and eliminates safeties to isolate man coverage on his receiver. Quick processor from read to read. Responds suddenly to what is there. Pitch and catch accurate if you allow it. Underrated arm talent. Expedite from off-platform with tight release and zip. Drives with lower body for added velocity. Accurate on all three levels. Completed 53 percent of his throws of 21-plus yards over last two years. Drops touch throws over top of linebackers trailing in coverage. Has improv talent. Uses mobility to buy time to make plays. Effective when he breaks contain and will probe for explosive play. Completed 67 percent when on the move. Rises to the occasion. Posted elite production and efficiency as passer in the red-zone.
WEAKNESSES Falls short of size marks for traditional early-round quarterback. Short with drop-down release makes him more susceptible to batted passes. Benefited from spread scheme that created huge passing windows to throw to. Will see increased importance on post-snap reads. Needs to improve full-field scanning. Can be thrown off rhythm by delayed blitz packages and disguised coverages. Footwork is erratic. Creeps up in pocket towards pressure. Ball placement wanes when he tries to gun it. Deep balls hang on him. Can't afford any delay in deep release to beat safety over the top. Needs to eliminate his back foot throws. Desire to make plays will lead to unnecessary sacks. Has to prove he can reign in and control on-field edge and cockiness.
BOTTOM LINE Spread quarterbacks have had limited success as have small quarterbacks. Mayfield falls into both categories and has to prove he can transcend those perceived deficiencies on the next level. Having complete command of the Oklahoma offense isn't an automatic precursor for NFL success, but Mayfield's ability to process, extend plays and throw with accuracy give him a good shot. He'll be somewhat scheme-dependent so whoever takes him will need to be willing to build their offense around his strengths.
JohnnyLV Posted February 13, 2018 Share Posted February 13, 2018 3 hours ago, JiF said: JiF this time last year - Draft Watson. He has it all. All the measurables, all the tools, he can throw and run, he's accurate, big time production, special blend of character and athleticism and saves his best moments for the big stage...all the while doing it vs. the best D's in the nation. The board - you're an idiot, he's a 3rd round prospect at best, he sucks, he throws INT's, run first, spread! and my very favorite 49 MPH!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! JiF this year - Not sure about Mayfield. He doesnt have it all. There is nothing really special about his game. He doesnt have the measurables, doesnt really have the tools. He's not a superior athlete, not a big arm, a little wind up. He has big time production in a terrible conference that doesnt play D. Plays a gimmicky system. He has a questionable character. Not sure he's a leader in the NFL. I'd probably take him because the Jets are desperate but I'm scared at #6 and terrified of trading up for him. I certainly dont think he's the #1 overall pick. The board - you're an idiot. He's the best QB in the draft. You dont know anything, dumbass. I <3 you JN. Kap looked like God after 6 games as well, Watson may turn out great or he could regress when the NFL figures him out. He was super impressive though. I really like Mayfield. I see an elite QB when I watch, I was not impressed with Watson. Still shocked we didn't pick QB at 6. We picked a safety. A safety. You could make a solid argument not never ever drat safety in first round Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jetscrazey Posted February 13, 2018 Share Posted February 13, 2018 Maybe, just maybe not everything can be explained by PFF analytics. No human in their right mind would call Mayfield the #1 overall QB in the draft. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jetscrazey Posted February 13, 2018 Share Posted February 13, 2018 6 minutes ago, johnnysd said: Kap looked like God after 6 games as well, Watson may turn out great or he could regress when the NFL figures him out. Watson is much more of a natural pocket passer than Kap, though. Kap is naturally a run first guy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sourceworx Posted February 13, 2018 Share Posted February 13, 2018 44 minutes ago, Lupz27 said: Now imagine the reality of Mayfield throwing pick 6 after pick 6 in foxboro. I have, but for some reason he always looks like Sam Darnold in that scenario. I can't seem to figure out why that is. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lupz27 Posted February 13, 2018 Share Posted February 13, 2018 7 minutes ago, sourceworx said: I have, but for some reason he always looks like Sam Darnold in that scenario. I can't seem to figure out why that is. That’s because your another person who thinks CFB stats is the be all end all for NFL translation. I feel sad for you people who are tricked by highlights, stats, and media hub bub. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bla bla bla Posted February 13, 2018 Share Posted February 13, 2018 43 minutes ago, Lupz27 said: Seriously do you watch the games? 90% of Mayfield’s so called “pressures throws” are because he held the ball for 10 seconds running around waiting to make a big play while nobody was near him because he had the best Oline in college football, and then finally after his stupid scrambling when a defender finally got near him he would throw the ball to the guy who finally shook free that he was starring at, and that goes into the pressured column very stupid evaluation for college QB’s who run the type of offense Mayfield ran, AND had such great talent at OL, AND everywhere else on offense. Again it's not the system I'm worried about with Jackson, it's his size and the amount of hits he'll take. Mayfield doesn't expose himself to those kind of hits regularly. I was in no way saying that Mayfields pressures meant more than anyone. JiF said he wanted to see what pressure stats look like and according to that stats website that's what they are. I did not adjust or imply anything other than present the information. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lupz27 Posted February 13, 2018 Share Posted February 13, 2018 17 minutes ago, jetscrazey said: Maybe, just maybe not everything can be explained by PFF analytics. No human in their right mind would call Mayfield the #1 overall QB in the draft. I agree, but there are A LOT of humans on this board not in their right mind. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lupz27 Posted February 13, 2018 Share Posted February 13, 2018 Just now, bla bla bla said: Again it's not the system I'm worried about with Jackson, it's his size and the amount of hits he'll take. Mayfield doesn't expose himself to those kind of hits regularly. I was in no way saying that Mayfields pressures meant more than anyone. JiF said he wanted to see what pressure stats look like and according to that stats website that's what they are. I did not adjust or imply anything other than present the information. Can you show me proof where Jackson takes unnecessary hits like RGIII did? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lupz27 Posted February 13, 2018 Share Posted February 13, 2018 1 minute ago, bla bla bla said: Again it's not the system I'm worried about with Jackson, it's his size and the amount of hits he'll take. Mayfield doesn't expose himself to those kind of hits regularly. I was in no way saying that Mayfields pressures meant more than anyone. JiF said he wanted to see what pressure stats look like and according to that stats website that's what they are. I did not adjust or imply anything other than present the information. And his size? Dude is 6’3”, 2” taller then Vick is, and is every bit the same talent. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JoJoTownsell1 Posted February 13, 2018 Share Posted February 13, 2018 24 minutes ago, JiF said: Since this has been a popular post. I decided to do a quick looksie at some other break downs. Notice what NFL.com highlights as his strengths? Notice how the rest talks about stats? Stats at Oklahoma. Stats in the Big 12. Stats stats stats...but he's fiery competitor. lmfao DOUG FLUTIE AT #6!!!!! JET UP BITCHES!!!! http://www.nfl.com/draft/2018/profiles/baker-mayfield?id=2560063 ANALYSIS STRENGTHS Tough and competitive. Plays with fiery demeanor and massive chip on his shoulder. Teammates rally around him on and off field. In complete command of his offense and has improved with each season. Light on his feet with quick setup in pocket. Has good pre-snap plan. Eyeballs and eliminates safeties to isolate man coverage on his receiver. Quick processor from read to read. Responds suddenly to what is there. Pitch and catch accurate if you allow it. Underrated arm talent. Expedite from off-platform with tight release and zip. Drives with lower body for added velocity. Accurate on all three levels. Completed 53 percent of his throws of 21-plus yards over last two years. Drops touch throws over top of linebackers trailing in coverage. Has improv talent. Uses mobility to buy time to make plays. Effective when he breaks contain and will probe for explosive play. Completed 67 percent when on the move. Rises to the occasion. Posted elite production and efficiency as passer in the red-zone. WEAKNESSES Falls short of size marks for traditional early-round quarterback. Short with drop-down release makes him more susceptible to batted passes. Benefited from spread scheme that created huge passing windows to throw to. Will see increased importance on post-snap reads. Needs to improve full-field scanning. Can be thrown off rhythm by delayed blitz packages and disguised coverages. Footwork is erratic. Creeps up in pocket towards pressure. Ball placement wanes when he tries to gun it. Deep balls hang on him. Can't afford any delay in deep release to beat safety over the top. Needs to eliminate his back foot throws. Desire to make plays will lead to unnecessary sacks. Has to prove he can reign in and control on-field edge and cockiness. DRAFT PROJECTION Round 1 NFL COMPARISON Doug Flutie BOTTOM LINE Spread quarterbacks have had limited success as have small quarterbacks. Mayfield falls into both categories and has to prove he can transcend those perceived deficiencies on the next level. Having complete command of the Oklahoma offense isn't an automatic precursor for NFL success, but Mayfield's ability to process, extend plays and throw with accuracy give him a good shot. He'll be somewhat scheme-dependent so whoever takes him will need to be willing to build their offense around his strengths. Mayfield- Short and played in cupcake conference Allen- Played for small school and has accuracy issues Rosen- Injury/concussion issues and personality issues. Darnold- Too many INTs, not the strongest arm Unless you are talking about Andrew Luck/Peyton Manning/Elway, it's usually pretty easy to find holes in a players game. I am not even a big Mayfield guy, but we are picking 6. If we can't get Cousins/Darnold/Rosen/Allen what are our options? A run first QB in Jackson a Bridgewater type QB in Free Agency? Sure Mayfield could be a bust, pretty much any QB can be a bust. If I am picking 1, Mayfield is not my guy. Darnold is. But we aren't picking 1 and likely can't move up higher than 3. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
STRENGTHS Tough and competitive. Plays with fiery demeanor and massive chip on his shoulder. Teammates rally around him on and off field. In complete command of his offense and has improved with each season. Light on his feet with quick setup in pocket. Has good pre-snap plan. Eyeballs and eliminates safeties to isolate man coverage on his receiver. Quick processor from read to read. Responds suddenly to what is there. Pitch and catch accurate if you allow it. Underrated arm talent. Expedite from off-platform with tight release and zip. Drives with lower body for added velocity. Accurate on all three levels. Completed 53 percent of his throws of 21-plus yards over last two years. Drops touch throws over top of linebackers trailing in coverage. Has improv talent. Uses mobility to buy time to make plays. Effective when he breaks contain and will probe for explosive play. Completed 67 percent when on the move. Rises to the occasion. Posted elite production and efficiency as passer in the red-zone.
WEAKNESSES Falls short of size marks for traditional early-round quarterback. Short with drop-down release makes him more susceptible to batted passes. Benefited from spread scheme that created huge passing windows to throw to. Will see increased importance on post-snap reads. Needs to improve full-field scanning. Can be thrown off rhythm by delayed blitz packages and disguised coverages. Footwork is erratic. Creeps up in pocket towards pressure. Ball placement wanes when he tries to gun it. Deep balls hang on him. Can't afford any delay in deep release to beat safety over the top. Needs to eliminate his back foot throws. Desire to make plays will lead to unnecessary sacks. Has to prove he can reign in and control on-field edge and cockiness.
BOTTOM LINE Spread quarterbacks have had limited success as have small quarterbacks. Mayfield falls into both categories and has to prove he can transcend those perceived deficiencies on the next level. Having complete command of the Oklahoma offense isn't an automatic precursor for NFL success, but Mayfield's ability to process, extend plays and throw with accuracy give him a good shot. He'll be somewhat scheme-dependent so whoever takes him will need to be willing to build their offense around his strengths.
JustInFudge Posted February 13, 2018 Share Posted February 13, 2018 5 minutes ago, johnnysd said: Kap looked like God after 6 games as well, Watson may turn out great or he could regress when the NFL figures him out. He was super impressive though. I really like Mayfield. I see an elite QB when I watch, I was not impressed with Watson. Still shocked we didn't pick QB at 6. We picked a safety. A safety. You could make a solid argument not never ever drat safety in first round This is what I find fascinating about the draft process. I dont know how anyone on earth could see "elite" in Mayfield and in the same breath, say they werent impressed with Watson. That's mind blowing. Watson IMO had a much more impressive college career and is 10x the athlete hence the better prospect. As bad as I wanted Watson, I knew they werent going QB. They took Hack the year before and they had a plan for him. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JustInFudge Posted February 13, 2018 Share Posted February 13, 2018 2 minutes ago, JoJoTownsell1 said: Mayfield- Short and played in cupcake conference Allen- Played for small school and has accuracy issues Rosen- Injury/concussion issues and personality issues. Darnold- Too many INTs, not the strongest arm Unless you are talking about Andrew Luck/Peyton Manning/Elway, it's usually pretty easy to find holes in a players game. I am not even a big Mayfield guy, but we are picking 6. If we can't get Cousins/Darnold/Rosen/Allen what are our options? A run first QB in Jackson a Bridgewater type QB in Free Agency? Sure Mayfield could be a bust, pretty much any QB can be a bust. If I am picking 1, Mayfield is not my guy. Darnold is. But we aren't picking 1 and likely can't move up higher than 3. I agree. There is no perfect prospect. I'm not saying there is. They all have flaws but most of them have something special to point at and I just dont see anything special about Mayfield. I used that particular breakdown because it highlights my point. NFL.com breaks him down and the first 4 things they point out are none Football characteristics...tough, competitive, plays with a chip on his shoulder, teammates love him. That's great. Same sh*t was said about Manziel. You need the skill set and I'm not confident Mayfield has it. In comparison, NFL.com describes the other QB's very different, referencing their actual skills first and most of them are pretty special. Click on the links, read their initial strengths. It's all right there. They talk about Footwork, arm, size, play making, pocket presence, etc. etc. etc. Not Baker. Baker they talk about his competitive spirit and the chip on his shoulder. Rosen - http://www.nfl.com/draft/2018/profiles/josh-rosen?id=2560059 Daronld - http://www.nfl.com/draft/2018/profiles/sam-darnold?id=2560057 Allen - http://www.nfl.com/draft/2018/profiles/josh-allen?id=2560029 Rudolph - http://www.nfl.com/draft/2018/profiles/mason-rudolph?id=2559942 Jackson - http://www.nfl.com/draft/2018/profiles/lamar-jackson?id=2560053 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bla bla bla Posted February 13, 2018 Share Posted February 13, 2018 5 minutes ago, Lupz27 said: And his size? Dude is 6’3”, 2” taller then Vick is, and is every bit the same talent. Would you take Vick to lead your team knowing how his career turned out? He was a highlight real and a ton of fun to watch but he was constantly injured and his career really only lasted until 31. I like Jackson a lot but historically guys that run that much tend to open themselves up to more shots in the NFL. I do think Jackson is a better version of Vick, I want him to go to the Cardinals so he's in the NFC and we won't have to face him. If he learns to slide and run out of bounds to protect his body then I think he can have a long career. He just runs so much more than anyone we've ever really seen, including Vick, and the increased amount of hits as a result of that play style will bring up durability concerns. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sourceworx Posted February 13, 2018 Share Posted February 13, 2018 32 minutes ago, Lupz27 said: That’s because your another person who thinks CFB stats is the be all end all for NFL translation. I feel sad for you people who are tricked by highlights, stats, and media hub bub. Right. Because a guy who throws a lot of picks in college will magically stop throwing them against significantly better competition. Your judgement is as clouded as those who defended Hackenberg (fwiw I admit that I was one of those people). You fell in love with Darnold's Rose Bowl appearance the same way Hack supporters fell in love with his freshman year. And because of that you're blind to what your eyes saw this season. So now as a result, you continually make excuses for his poor play. Also just an FYI - Jackson is my favorite QB in this draft. Not Mayfield. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
freestater Posted February 13, 2018 Share Posted February 13, 2018 1 hour ago, JiF said: What does the 25% represent? Does this mean Mayfield saw pressure 25% of his drop backs? If that's the case, I question it's accuracy or what they're defining as "pressure"...I watched a ton of Mayfield this year unfortunately and he maybe saw actual pressure once or twice a game. I'll play, ? Here's what I like about Mayfield: well above 60% comp, low turnover rate. He does the little things right after the snap you like to see at the college level, he pump fakes after handoffs, looks off safeties, reaclimates to the field after play action. He finds throwing lanes, doesn't have an inordinate amount of passes batted sown for a short guy. He go through his reads, seen him get to 3rd and 4th reads very often, lots of check downs. That's pretty rare for college guys, many lock on to 1st targets. As the pass comes out, he brings the ball to his earhole, it comes off quick. He has excellent velocity and placement. Most of his receivers get the ball in front of them, able to continue in stride instead of adjusting to the ball. When flushed out of the Pocket, he keeps his eyes downfield despite an ability to use his legs. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
UntouchableCrew Posted February 13, 2018 Share Posted February 13, 2018 There's no more important quality for an NFL quarterback that mental makeup, IMO. Ultra-competitive smart guys who love football, always try to get better and lead their teammates. It's funny this often gets dismissed as an important "trait" when it's one of the most commonly recurring characteristics in great quarterbacks... While rocket armed stiffs and selfish jerks bust constantly. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RESNewYork Posted February 13, 2018 Share Posted February 13, 2018 50 minutes ago, JiF said: I agree. There is no perfect prospect. I'm not saying there is. They all have flaws but most of them have something special to point at and I just dont see anything special about Mayfield. I used that particular breakdown because it highlights my point. NFL.com breaks him down and the first 4 things they point out are none Football characteristics...tough, competitive, plays with a chip on his shoulder, teammates love him. That's great. Same sh*t was said about Manziel. You need the skill set and I'm not confident Mayfield has it. In comparison, NFL.com describes the other QB's very different, referencing their actual skills first and most of them are pretty special. Click on the links, read their initial strengths. It's all right there. They talk about Footwork, arm, size, play making, pocket presence, etc. etc. etc. Not Baker. Baker they talk about his competitive spirit and the chip on his shoulder. Rosen - http://www.nfl.com/draft/2018/profiles/josh-rosen?id=2560059 Daronld - http://www.nfl.com/draft/2018/profiles/sam-darnold?id=2560057 Allen - http://www.nfl.com/draft/2018/profiles/josh-allen?id=2560029 Rudolph - http://www.nfl.com/draft/2018/profiles/mason-rudolph?id=2559942 Jackson - http://www.nfl.com/draft/2018/profiles/lamar-jackson?id=2560053 Bolded is what really stands out for me for Jackson. The NYJ roster is devoid of playmakers and a spotty offensive line. It's difficult for young QBs to sustain long drives and put up points without playmakers and strong O line play. Drafting Jackson gives us a legit playmaker at the most important position. Elite playmaker with rare ability to hit home runs with his arm or legs. However, he has rare speed and athleticism and can single-handedly win games. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mogglez Posted February 13, 2018 Share Posted February 13, 2018 6 hours ago, T0mShane said: ftfy Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RESNewYork Posted February 13, 2018 Share Posted February 13, 2018 51 minutes ago, bla bla bla said: Would you take Vick to lead your team knowing how his career turned out? He was a highlight real and a ton of fun to watch but he was constantly injured and his career really only lasted until 31. I like Jackson a lot but historically guys that run that much tend to open themselves up to more shots in the NFL. I do think Jackson is a better version of Vick, I want him to go to the Cardinals so he's in the NFC and we won't have to face him. If he learns to slide and run out of bounds to protect his body then I think he can have a long career. He just runs so much more than anyone we've ever really seen, including Vick, and the increased amount of hits as a result of that play style will bring up durability concerns. Here is a hypothetical. Jets draft Mayfield and the Bills draft Jackson. As a Jet fan, would you be worried about passing on Jackson and having him in the division or happy because we have Mayfield on the Jet roster? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JustInFudge Posted February 13, 2018 Share Posted February 13, 2018 27 minutes ago, freestater said: I'll play, ? Here's what I like about Mayfield: well above 60% comp, low turnover rate. He does the little things right after the snap you like to see at the college level, he pump fakes after handoffs, looks off safeties, reaclimates to the field after play action. He finds throwing lanes, doesn't have an inordinate amount of passes batted sown for a short guy. He go through his reads, seen him get to 3rd and 4th reads very often, lots of check downs. That's pretty rare for college guys, many lock on to 1st targets. As the pass comes out, he brings the ball to his earhole, it comes off quick. He has excellent velocity and placement. Most of his receivers get the ball in front of them, able to continue in stride instead of adjusting to the ball. When flushed out of the Pocket, he keeps his eyes downfield despite an ability to use his legs. Disagree with some of this from what I've seen. Specifically, the progressions, after snap and throwing motion. The ball typically goes to his first read unless he's trying to extend and make a play. Lots of screens and throws to the RB in the flats. After the snap stuff I dont love. He has bad footwork at times and does some very unorthodox movement in the pocket, sometimes turning his back to the LOS unnecessarily. Dont love his motion, he has a wind up. Brings it from his hip just enough to concern me for a small guy. I dont see "excellent" velocity, more adequate. The other stuff are definitely things to like...moving the safeties, pump fakes, keeping his eyes down field, the placement etc. which are very important in the pro game. I'm not 100% locked in on anyone like I was this time last year with Watson. And while I'm scared of him at #6, I'm warming up more and more to Mayfield. I'm just not buying he's the best prospect in this draft like this article is stating. I'd probably take 4 QB's before him. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SMC Posted February 13, 2018 Share Posted February 13, 2018 5 hours ago, JiF said: JiF this time last year - Draft Watson. He has it all. All the measurables, all the tools, he can throw and run, he's accurate, big time production, special blend of character and athleticism and saves his best moments for the big stage...all the while doing it vs. the best D's in the nation. The board - you're an idiot, he's a 3rd round prospect at best, he sucks, he throws INT's, run first, spread! and my very favorite 49 MPH!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! JiF this year - Not sure about Mayfield. He doesnt have it all. There is nothing really special about his game. He doesnt have the measurables, doesnt really have the tools. He's not a superior athlete, not a big arm, a little wind up. He has big time production in a terrible conference that doesnt play D. Plays a gimmicky system. He has a questionable character. Not sure he's a leader in the NFL. I'd probably take him because the Jets are desperate but I'm scared at #6 and terrified of trading up for him. I certainly dont think he's the #1 overall pick. The board - you're an idiot. He's the best QB in the draft. You dont know anything, dumbass. I <3 you JN. I can vouch for JiF on this. Him, Rutgers, Ape & myself were the only ones I recall who were consistently touting Watson as the right choice at 6. It's comical for anyone to try to equate Mayfield with Watson. Watson is bigger, stronger, has better resume and intangibles than Mayfield. Mayfield scares me because short, week armed QBs with attitude problems don't get drafted in the 1st round. People try to bring up Brees and Wilson, but both were not 1st rounders AND had better arm talent than Mayfield. Heck, Brees blew out his arm as a pro and still has better arm talent than Mayfield. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JustInFudge Posted February 13, 2018 Share Posted February 13, 2018 17 minutes ago, RESNewYork said: Bolded is what really stands out for me for Jackson. The NYJ roster is devoid of playmakers and a spotty offensive line. It's difficult for young QBs to sustain long drives and put up points without playmakers and strong O line play. Drafting Jackson gives us a legit playmaker at the most important position. Elite playmaker with rare ability to hit home runs with his arm or legs. However, he has rare speed and athleticism and can single-handedly win games. Problem is, he can also single-handedly lose games too...see bowl game this year. He was atrocious. Jackson is appealing but he's attempting to do something no QB like him has ever done....transition from a run first QB to an NFL QB. It's hard to do and I'm not sure Jackson is the guy to break that trend. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SMC Posted February 13, 2018 Share Posted February 13, 2018 5 hours ago, IndianaJet said: A glimmer of hope? Now that Manziel claims he's clean & sober, his suppliers are going to have Mayfield on speed dial. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bla bla bla Posted February 13, 2018 Share Posted February 13, 2018 30 minutes ago, RESNewYork said: Here is a hypothetical. Jets draft Mayfield and the Bills draft Jackson. As a Jet fan, would you be worried about passing on Jackson and having him in the division or happy because we have Mayfield on the Jet roster? Yes I would, I think that probably is a concern for me for any of these QBs though. No matter who we take, if he is not as good as the QB who went behind him we will question it. I do want Jackson in the NFC though because I'd like to root for him. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
freestater Posted February 13, 2018 Share Posted February 13, 2018 1 hour ago, JiF said: Disagree with some of this from what I've seen. Specifically, the progressions, after snap and throwing motion. The ball typically goes to his first read unless he's trying to extend and make a play. Lots of screens and throws to the RB in the flats. After the snap stuff I dont love. He has bad footwork at times and does some very unorthodox movement in the pocket, sometimes turning his back to the LOS unnecessarily. Dont love his motion, he has a wind up. Brings it from his hip just enough to concern me for a small guy. I dont see "excellent" velocity, more adequate. The other stuff are definitely things to like...moving the safeties, pump fakes, keeping his eyes down field, the placement etc. which are very important in the pro game. I'm not 100% locked in on anyone like I was this time last year with Watson. And while I'm scared of him at #6, I'm warming up more and more to Mayfield. I'm just not buying he's the best prospect in this draft like this article is stating. I'd probably take 4 QB's before him. He runs out of the Pocket too much for me, instead of stepping up into it. His footwork is sloppy. I'm not saying the kid is the total package, all polished and pro-capable. I answered the question of what I like. ? I do think he's the guy I'd most like to gamble on (assuming Rosen is long gone when we pick). I don't think he's as impressive as Watson, no. I was all about Watson last year, him or Fournette would have made me ecstatic. We got a safety. Lol. Got a good feeling about this kid. I see a lot of Favre in him, tbh. Can't imagine what we're seeing so differently about the throwing. I like the mechanics, the velocity and placement Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matt39 Posted February 13, 2018 Share Posted February 13, 2018 Just draft a QB in the first round and if he isnt good draft another one next year. Do this until you find one. As far as Mayfield goes he seems like constant drama that the twitter woke mafia loves to defend, which I think would spell disaster in NY...but at this point the Jets have no choice. They have to draft a QB until they find one that can play. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jetsplayer21 Posted February 13, 2018 Share Posted February 13, 2018 10 minutes ago, Matt39 said: Just draft a QB in the first round and if he isnt good draft another one next year. Do this until you find one. As far as Mayfield goes he seems like constant drama that the twitter woke mafia loves to defend, which I think would spell disaster in NY...but at this point the Jets have no choice. They have to draft a QB until they find one that can play. That’s pretty much what jets have been doing. All defense and only taking shots at qb. That is why team is so bad past few yrs. we have ignored the Oline and drafting O play makers. If we had used valuable picks on the OL to protect the qb, it really wouldn’t matter who we had out there. Eagles just made Nick Foles look superhuman. Qbs are playing a lot longer now, and there is no shortage of them coming out of college every yr. There is plenty looking for jobs. If you don’t have a young strong line, your qb is going to have a tough time and likely go down with injury Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hitman Harris Posted February 14, 2018 Share Posted February 14, 2018 29 minutes ago, Jetsplayer21 said: That’s pretty much what jets have been doing. All defense and only taking shots at qb. That is why team is so bad past few yrs. we have ignored the Oline and drafting O play makers. If we had used valuable picks on the OL to protect the qb, it really wouldn’t matter who we had out there. Eagles just made Nick Foles look superhuman. Qbs are playing a lot longer now, and there is no shortage of them coming out of college every yr. There is plenty looking for jobs. If you don’t have a young strong line, your qb is going to have a tough time and likely go down with injury I must have missed the part where the Jets were drafting QB in round 1 every year.. lol Sanchez was the last.... and that was quite some time ago. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
T0mShane Posted February 14, 2018 Share Posted February 14, 2018 1 hour ago, Matt39 said: Just draft a QB in the first round and if he isnt good draft another one next year. Do this until you find one. As far as Mayfield goes he seems like constant drama that the twitter woke mafia loves to defend, which I think would spell disaster in NY...but at this point the Jets have no choice. They have to draft a QB until they find one that can play. Here’s what I’m leaning on as far as preferring Mayfield to the Jets: he seems to be the one QB prospect that won’t completely lose their sh*t after a bad early New York news cycle. I can see it being too much for a golden boy like Darnold, and I think Rosen will be super-confrontational with the likes of Manish, and Manish will eat it up, especially if Rosen struggles at all. Allen, forget about it. Mayfield seems to have that underdog personality that enjoys being sh*t on. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HessStation Posted February 14, 2018 Share Posted February 14, 2018 4 hours ago, JiF said: I agree. There is no perfect prospect. I'm not saying there is. They all have flaws but most of them have something special to point at and I just dont see anything special about Mayfield. I used that particular breakdown because it highlights my point. NFL.com breaks him down and the first 4 things they point out are none Football characteristics...tough, competitive, plays with a chip on his shoulder, teammates love him. That's great. Same sh*t was said about Manziel. You need the skill set and I'm not confident Mayfield has it. In comparison, NFL.com describes the other QB's very different, referencing their actual skills first and most of them are pretty special. Click on the links, read their initial strengths. It's all right there. They talk about Footwork, arm, size, play making, pocket presence, etc. etc. etc. Not Baker. Baker they talk about his competitive spirit and the chip on his shoulder. Rosen - http://www.nfl.com/draft/2018/profiles/josh-rosen?id=2560059 Daronld - http://www.nfl.com/draft/2018/profiles/sam-darnold?id=2560057 Allen - http://www.nfl.com/draft/2018/profiles/josh-allen?id=2560029 Rudolph - http://www.nfl.com/draft/2018/profiles/mason-rudolph?id=2559942 Jackson - http://www.nfl.com/draft/2018/profiles/lamar-jackson?id=2560053 Wondering if you were to rank the top 6 QBs on arm strength and accuracy how would that look. Arm Strength: 1. Allen 2. Rosen 3. Jackson 4. Mayfield 5. Darnold 6. Rudolph Accuracy: 1. Darnold 2. Mayfield 3. Rosen 4. Rudolph 5. Jackson 6. Allen ? ...keeping in mind they all play different schemes so not relying on comp% alone. ...and w the understanding there are many other factors Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Walrus Posted February 14, 2018 Share Posted February 14, 2018 14 hours ago, sourceworx said: Imagine Mayfield as a Jet playing the Pats in Foxboro, grabbing his crotch and yelling "f*ck you" at Brady, and then planting a Jets flag in middle of the field after leading us to victory. He'd be a god around here. And not just around here. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Be_a_Jet Posted February 14, 2018 Share Posted February 14, 2018 I was all in on Deshaun Watson last year. Less confident with Mayfield but he's starting to grow on me more. For me its Rosen at the tip top and Darnold/Mayfield battling for the number 2. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jgb Posted February 14, 2018 Share Posted February 14, 2018 Macc stopped reading at " Falls short of size marks for traditional early-round quarterback. Short with drop-down release makes him more susceptible to batted passes." Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
UntouchableCrew Posted February 14, 2018 Share Posted February 14, 2018 If we're now begging for brownie points for wanting the Jets to draft Watson last year, I guess I'll point out that I too wanted him at 6. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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