Where we at?

[SenorGato]

25 minutes ago, Paradis said:

I'm talking business. 

You’ve displayed zero acumen for it. 

19 minutes ago, gEYno said:

There's definitely more to it than money in this case, because it's an absurd amount of money either way.  So, there's room to make choices that are in the best interest of him and his family as far as where he lives, what team he plays for, etc.  It's not like we're talking the difference between a 125K and 45K.  We're talking about the difference (maybe) of a few percentage points.  He's going to get a 9 figure deal in all likelihood either way.  Do you really think that if he looks at a deal for 120M from the Team A and 116M from Team B, he's taking Team A automatically?

I do not believe $4 million is chump change for anyone not an owner. From there teams that can offer those sums without killing their ability to keep homegrown studs (Minn has at least Barr, Hunter, and Diggs coming up and current talent is their big selling point) are down to the Browns and Jets. Sure that’s because they lack talent, but this is the ultimate turnover league and both teams have that beautiful combo of picks and cash to move fast. 

I also see zero indication in actual actions that this guy believes any of these scumbag teams deserves a discount. 

[BrickTamland]

2 minutes ago, Paradis said:

exactly. thank you. Even w/no SB appearances, you making the same point -- and being much more less of an a$$ than I am. Gato simply is not willing to acknowledge that narrative.

I'm sorry.. Stressed about this situation and life. 

I love you all. 

i get it. but i just don't see that the differences are necessarily that big of a deal such that they'd impact value

[Pac]

15 minutes ago, gEYno said:

Kirk Cousins was born in Barrington, IL and went to Holland Christian High School.  He participated in sports ministry.  Are we sure he loves NYC and Broadway?  Because, I'm not sure that Dear Evan Hansen is the selling point here.

You're wrong.  I can't find the original article where he and his wife are extolling the virtues of NYC but there is THIS LINK.....

“I don’t know all the words, but I’m a big Broadway fan,” Cousins said. “I love musical theater – my mom kind of raised me on that. When the Super Bowl was in New York City a couple of years ago, I went to a Broadway show and just was blown away"

[SenorGato]

11 minutes ago, BrickTamland said:

Perhaps these numbers are completely totally off. 

It’s mostly that they’re completely made up. 

[Pac]

34 minutes ago, T0mShane said:

 

I put a mini-wig I made out of cat hair and lipstick on mine.

[Paradis]

6 minutes ago, BrickTamland said:

i get it. but i just don't see that the differences are necessarily that big of a deal such that they'd impact value

I do. He loses significant negotiating power, and the ability to leverage against top dollar. Also, i think you're being optimistic about his production here, which i appreciate. 

[Paradis]

12 minutes ago, SenorGato said:

You’ve displayed zero acumen for it. 

Yes, and you've been beating me over the head with your bizz-academic prowess thus far. It's clear from your posts you're an entrepreneur who's known as both ruthless and savvy in the market. Unless that market isn't NY and your customer isn't Cousins. 

[BrickTamland]

2 minutes ago, SenorGato said:

It’s mostly that they’re completely made up. 

no sht. your point? every evaluation process revolves around a projection of performance.

[dcJet]

46 minutes ago, SenorGato said:

It gets better and better. Wife and newborn child live across the country for half the year...Dreams coming true yo 

Well...after all... the most confusing day in the NFL is Father''s day.

[dcJet]

15 minutes ago, BrickTamland said:

i get it. but i just don't see that the differences are necessarily that big of a deal such that they'd impact value

I'm agreeing here.  I can't see him going to Min instead of NY to maximize his value three years from now.  Who thinks like that?   

[redlichtie]

2 hours ago, JoJoTownsell1 said:

I was arguing with everyone that thought the Broncos would get Cousins over us. I thought we were the frontrunners until the Vikings entered the picture. Now I am pretty sure we have no chance and he is only using us to jack up the price from the Vikings. 

It’s the other way round, why do you think all this “Minny is the front runner “ stuff is making it into the public domain? They are just trying to squeeze the biggest possible offer out of the Jets. At this stage if I was hearing that the Jets are frontrunners I’d be more inclined to think he’s going elsewhere 

[Jets Voice of Reason]

2 hours ago, Pac said:

who wouldn't want to join the Vikings dynasty.

since 2013 they've gone:

5-10

7-9

11-5

8-8

13-3 

The 2 playoff appearances were a 1 and done and should have been a 1 and done if not for a mental collapse by the Saints.

They're basically the Patriots of the NFC.

...and that's why he'll sign with the  one winning season in the last seven years Jets. 

[Paradis]

25 minutes ago, dcJet said:

I'm agreeing here.  I can't see him going to Min instead of NY to maximize his value three years from now.  Who thinks like that?   

Agents. Players. People who's career are lucky to last 10-15 years? 

[dcJet]

11 minutes ago, Paradis said:

Agents. Players. People who's career are lucky to last 10-15 years? 

Nah.  Future contracts are not a big issue.  He played for sh*tty Was and is going to be the highest paid QB.  If he played on a good team, it might hurt him with people thinking he was carried a la Sanchez.

And 3 years is like an eternity in the NFL.  Why go someplace you don't wanna be just to improve offers on a future contract?  you might be out of the league in 3 years.  I dont buy it. 

[SenorGato]

1 hour ago, BrickTamland said:

no sht. your point? every evaluation process revolves around a projection of performance.

Making up things is not how projections are done. 

[Paradis]

26 minutes ago, SenorGato said:

Making up things is not how projections are done. 

lol, the definition of projection is to make things up.

[ZachEY]

1 hour ago, SenorGato said:

I do not believe $4 million is chump change for anyone not an owner. From there teams that can offer those sums without killing their ability to keep homegrown studs (Minn has at least Barr, Hunter, and Diggs coming up and current talent is their big selling point) are down to the Browns and Jets. Sure that’s because they lack talent, but this is the ultimate turnover league and both teams have that beautiful combo of picks and cash to move fast. 

I also see zero indication in actual actions that this guy believes any of these scumbag teams deserves a discount. 

I would not move to a less preferable destination for work for a 4% raise.  That's what 4M is re: Kirk Cousin's contract.  Cousin's could make a half a million by sitting in the mall of america for 6 hours signing his name on things if the difference matters.

[Dr Evil]

7 minutes ago, gEYno said:

I would not move to a less preferable destination for work for a 4% raise.  That's what 4M is re: Kirk Cousin's contract.  Cousin's could make a half a million by sitting in the mall of america for 6 hours signing his name on things if the difference matters.

So you think Kirk can make the same amount of money outside of his contract in Minnesota as he would in New York???

 

 

[SenorGato]

15 minutes ago, gEYno said:

I would not move to a less preferable destination for work for a 4% raise.  That's what 4M is re: Kirk Cousin's contract.  Cousin's could make a half a million by sitting in the mall of america for 6 hours signing his name on things if the difference matters.

What about when that 4% is worth $4 million? That’s so much money. He can also make more autograph money sitting anywhere less depressing than a mall (so anywhere without dead bodies) in this part of the country. 

Plus again I can’t emphasize enough that a who’s who of studs on the Vikings are hitting FA in 2019 and 2020. Next year it’s their top two pass rushers and a top two pass catcher, the year after is their top pass catcher in Rudolph....Their window is tight and works as much against as it does for. 

[SenorGato]

45 minutes ago, Paradis said:

lol, the definition of projection is to make things up.

I really wonder what’s happened this offseason to push you off the deep end. It’s clear you really believe this stuff. That is not the definition of a projection. 

Worse is that, despite not making a drop of sense once out of the safe zone of “he’ll pick the better current roster,” you’ll feel fully correct and vindicated if he signs with Minnesota. 

 

[RESNewYork]

earth

[SenorGato]

Just now, RESNewYork said:

earth

[BrickTamland]

23 minutes ago, SenorGato said:

I really wonder what’s happened this offseason to push you off the deep end. It’s clear you really believe this stuff. That is not the definition of a projection. 

Worse is that, despite not making a drop of sense once out of the safe zone of “he’ll pick the better current roster,” you’ll feel fully correct and vindicated if he signs with Minnesota. 

 

Yes it is. Its an ‘estimation’ with some basis in history, mixed with some rational thinking about how it will be in the future.

My estimations re Kirk’s next 3 years, which are based on his 4K pace and his approximate 25td/year pace, taking into account dome and better weapons, are projections. They are also made up.

if you think my projections suck, thats cool and i love those discussions, but dont think that Mayock’s projection for dallas goedert to get drafted by tennessee is any less of a made up guess based on some rational thinking. (I dont like that particular projection)

 

[Paradis]

34 minutes ago, SenorGato said:

I really wonder what’s happened this offseason to push you off the deep end. It’s clear you really believe this stuff. That is not the definition of a projection. 

Worse is that, despite not making a drop of sense once out of the safe zone of “he’ll pick the better current roster,” you’ll feel fully correct and vindicated if he signs with Minnesota. 

 

now now, some of this for fun. I do think you're being dense here, but we've established that difference of opinion. I realize more goes into projections than that. You set me up Iceman. I had to deliver. 

Honest to god; I just can't deal with the ongoing level of incompetence of our GMs regarding the draft -- past and present. It's getting worse... When you draft well, everything else follows. Everything... Talent management, roster integrity, locker room culture, perception of the franchise etc etc.. (and even some Ws in the standings).

It's leaving me more and more unpleasant to talk to. That's on me though. 

[nycdan]

1 hour ago, Paradis said:

lol, the definition of projection is to make things up.

Sorry but no....it's really not.  Projection is making educated guesses about the future based on events of the past and present.  You are taking the pattern of data and 'projecting' it forward.  

 

EDIT: I posted before your last response.

[legler82]

7 hours ago, SenorGato said:

double

jeopardy

[SenorGato]

8 minutes ago, BrickTamland said:

Yes it is. Its an ‘estimation’ with some basis in history, mixed with some rational thinking about how it will be in the future.

My estimations re Kirk’s next 3 years, which are based on his 4K pace and his approximate 25td/year pace, taking into account dome and better weapons, are projections. They are also made up.

if you think my projections suck, thats cool and i love those discussions, but dont think that Mayock’s projection for dallas goedert to get drafted by tennessee is any less of a made up guess based on some rational thinking. (I dont like that particular projection)

 

I honestly did not even notice the yardage and TDs. The playoffs and SB stuff is when I noped out. 

[ZachEY]

3 hours ago, SenorGato said:

What about when that 4% is worth $4 million? That’s so much money. He can also make more autograph money sitting anywhere less depressing than a mall (so anywhere without dead bodies) in this part of the country. 

Plus again I can’t emphasize enough that a who’s who of studs on the Vikings are hitting FA in 2019 and 2020. Next year it’s their top two pass rushers and a top two pass catcher, the year after is their top pass catcher in Rudolph....Their window is tight and works as much against as it does for. 

When that 4% is worth 4M, he can also make that kind of money in a year by putting his money at index.  As someone who knows quite a few people worth north of 100M, I promise you, they're not making life decisions they don't want, just because of 4M.

As for where the better destination is, I think it's the Vikings based on football, but I'm not super invested there.  My only contention with your take is that Cousins will make the best decision for his family if money isn't totally lopsided.

[ZachEY]

3 hours ago, Dr Evil said:

So you think Kirk can make the same amount of money outside of his contract in Minnesota as he would in New York???

 

 

Small media markets have really slowed down Peyton Manning and Lebron James.

[ZachEY]

5 hours ago, Pac said:

You're wrong.  I can't find the original article where he and his wife are extolling the virtues of NYC but there is THIS LINK.....

“I don’t know all the words, but I’m a big Broadway fan,” Cousins said. “I love musical theater – my mom kind of raised me on that. When the Super Bowl was in New York City a couple of years ago, I went to a Broadway show and just was blown away"

Sounds like a tourist.

He may, he may not value that when making the move for his family.  You're the one trying to play real estate agent here.  I'm pretty sure I know nothing about what Cousins will decide.  But, I do think at the money he's going to get, it will be about well more than the money.

[Pac]

40 minutes ago, gEYno said:

He may, he may not value that when making the move for his family.  You're the one trying to play real estate agent here.  I'm pretty sure I know nothing about what Cousins will decide.  But, I do think at the money he's going to get, it will be about well more than the money.

That's the point I've been trying to make for weeks. 

Pointing out he and his wifes words is not playing real estate agent - whatever that means.  It's trying to show that there are reasons, other than the money, that make the Jets an attractive destination for him.

[ZachEY]

1 minute ago, Pac said:

That's the point I've been trying to make for weeks. 

Pointing out he and his wifes words is not playing real estate agent - whatever that means.  It's trying to show that there are reasons, other than the money, that make the Jets an attractive destination for him.

My problem with the Jets, if I'm Cousins, is pretty simple.

https://www.footballoutsiders.com/index.php?q=stats/ol

Would also scare me about Denver.

[SenorGato]

58 minutes ago, gEYno said:

When that 4% is worth 4M, he can also make that kind of money in a year by putting his money at index. 

Anything and everything he can do without that difference he can do better with that money. 

I don't think we are so far apart. I definitely agree all sides will claim money isn't the top priority and was sayng the Vikings are the real threat since the Broncos were the latest and greatest. They have a strong win now roster with the main issue being that they have to win immediately unless a bunch of badass players are planning on giving discounts. I just don't see any actions or words by Cousins that indicates a discount kind of guy, and honestly the NFLPA should be on top of (as much as possible) any significant prime aged FA that even hints they might be during this 3 year window. 

[jetsons]

Where we at?

Definitely Not in English class.  

[Dr Evil]

17 hours ago, gEYno said:

Small media markets have really slowed down Peyton Manning and Lebron James.

I think Kirk is a pretty great QB and all but you're going to compare him to Peyton Manning and LeBron James? You do realize that Peyton was a Top 2 QB for almost a decade and LeBron has been the best athlete in the NBA for over 10 years?