JetNation Posted March 10, 2018 Share Posted March 10, 2018 The bad news for the New York Jets and GM Mike Maccagnan is that a pair of division rivals, the Miami Dolphins and Buffalo Bills, appear to be stockpiling draft picks to make a run at or near the top of the draft, possibly leapfrogging the Jets to snag a franchise quarterback. The good news however, is that one could make the case that Gang Green still holds more chips than both division rivals in terms of draft capital. Even after the Dolphins moved wide receiver Jarvis Landry to the Browns, which is where the Bills also sent starting quarterback Tyrod Taylor in exchange for additional picks, it appears the Jets are still in a good position to move up to the top three or four picks, and here’s why. While the famed NFL draft value chart is far from scientific, universal or iron-clad, a look at the version provided by profootballtalk shows the Jets as still having more value in their top four picks than the Dolphins have with their entire class, or than the Bills have with their top six picks. Per the provided chart, with selections 6, 37, 49 and 72, the Jets picks carry a total value of 2,683 points. That total is more than all of Miami’s picks combined with numbers 11, 42, 73, 123, 131, 183, 223 and 229 totalling 2,066. As far as the Bills, the Jets top four picks are just about on par with Buffalo’s top six picks, no’s 21, 22, 53, 56, 65 and 96, which total 2,671 points. So the question that remains is this, of the three teams, which is willing to include additional premium picks or players in coming years? Is it worth it for either franchise to send multiple first or second-round picks to the Browns, Giants, Colts or…yes, the Browns again, who pick 1st, 2nd, 3rd and 4th respectively? It’s a question Maccagnan is going to have to spend a lot of time asking himself. Because if he’s not aggressive enough, and allows a division rival to acquire a franchise quarterback that they covet as well, it could very well cost Maccagnan his job should the Jets fail to sign Kirk Cousins. The Cousins end of the equation will resolve itself in the coming days, and if he goes to Minnesota as expected, it’ll be time for Mac to get work the phones and do whatever it takes to get in top three or four picks. If he’s able to swing a deal, it will be due largely in part to having pick number six, which could allow a team in the top 3 to trade down multiple times and pick up additional premium picks. This is easily the most critical time in Mike Maccagnan’s tenure and he can’t afford to get outdone. If he does, there’s a good chance it’s the last time it will happen to him in his current post. Click here to read the full story... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bla bla bla Posted March 10, 2018 Share Posted March 10, 2018 Don't get cold feet, make moves in FA and then throw the farm at a team to move up. QB or bust. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pcola Posted March 10, 2018 Share Posted March 10, 2018 We also need to consider that our 2019 1st rounder is almost guaranteed to be in the top 10 where both Buffalo (if they get a QB) and Miami (if their’s stays healthy) will be picking much lower. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bla bla bla Posted March 10, 2018 Share Posted March 10, 2018 1 minute ago, Pcola said: We also need to consider that our 2019 1st rounder is almost guaranteed to be in the top 10 where both Buffalo (if they get a QB) and Miami (if their’s stays healthy) will be picking much lower. Yea I agree, our 2019 1st is likely seen as a more desirable pick. It's not going to be cheap but it would be a complete failure to allow these teams jump us. Get our guy while also blocking a division rival from potentially getting a franchise QB, well worth the picks IMO. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pcola Posted March 10, 2018 Share Posted March 10, 2018 6 minutes ago, bla bla bla said: Yea I agree, our 2019 1st is likely seen as a more desirable pick. It's not going to be cheap but it would be a complete failure to allow these teams jump us. Get our guy while also blocking a division rival from potentially getting a franchise QB, well worth the picks IMO. Nobody in Houston is complaining that they don’t have a pic until the third round this year. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bla bla bla Posted March 10, 2018 Share Posted March 10, 2018 1 minute ago, Pcola said: Nobody in Houston is complaining that they don’t have a pic until the third round this year. Yea throw the kitchen sink to get as high as you need. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
32EBoozer Posted March 10, 2018 Share Posted March 10, 2018 7 minutes ago, Pcola said: Nobody in Houston is complaining that they don’t have a pic until the third round this year. If Watson turns into a star.... no, they won’t mind. If he turns into a middling Tyrod/ Dalton type player, that may change Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Warfish Posted March 10, 2018 Share Posted March 10, 2018 Macc missing on Cousins and then being leapfrogged in the draft by both Miami and Buffalo? Least surprising thing I could imagine tbqh. Macc has shown he's simply not up to this job. I've told you folks, we're either looking at Bridgewater/Jackson/Hack or McCown/Falk/Hack in 2018 and beyond. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Augustiniak Posted March 10, 2018 Share Posted March 10, 2018 3 minutes ago, Warfish said: Macc missing on Cousins and then being leapfrogged in the draft by both Miami and Buffalo? Least surprising thing I could imagine tbqh. Macc has shown he's simply not up to this job. I've told you folks, we're either looking at Bridgewater/Jackson/Hack or McCown/Falk/Hack in 2018 and beyond. That would be the final nail in his coffin. The irony is that if he had taken his shots in prior years and actually drafted a real qb he could use this draft to fill a lot of holes. Say we had Watson or mahomes. We could go BAP with those top 4 picks. You may even get Chubb at 6. Take 2 offensive weapons in the 2nd. It would really improve the team. And he may do this anyway, but rely on bridgewater as qb. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Warfish Posted March 10, 2018 Share Posted March 10, 2018 1 minute ago, Augustiniak said: That would be the final nail in his coffin. So a bunch of fans say. The OWNER is who counts, and he's out of the loop the next few years. We have no idea what his stand-in brother thinks, apart from the extension he handed these two losers. I know fans think they got a GM fired.....they didn't. Fans have no power of any kind. 1 minute ago, Augustiniak said: The irony is that if he had taken his shots in prior years and actually drafted a real qb he could use this draft to fill a lot of holes. Say we had Watson or mahomes. We could go BAP with those top 4 picks. You may even get Chubb at 6. Take 2 offensive weapons in the 2nd. It would really improve the team. And he may do this anyway, but rely on bridgewater as qb. Won't hear any disagreement from me. If I were the Jets GM our QB's would be Watson/Connor Cook/Anyone but Hack! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
XavierSnooze Posted March 10, 2018 Share Posted March 10, 2018 Mac needs to sac up and get creative. What do Dave Gettlemam and the giants want more than anything? Cap space, so he can rebuild the o-line. Call the Giants this week before free agency starts and offer the 6th pick, the 49th pick, and take on 10-15 mil in poor contracts. This gives the giants cap flexibility to address their needs while only dropping down four spots, instead of to the 20’s if they trade with the bills. 15 mil in contracts (possibly dead money if we waive the players) is not a large price to pay to secure our qb of the future. It would be nice if we could trade up without giving away future picks, and the only way is through the Giants (colts and browns already have enough cap space). Sent from my iPhone using JetNation.com mobile app Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TopCop Posted March 10, 2018 Share Posted March 10, 2018 Jets are in a tough spot, but this is a rare opportunity to get a franchise QB. At first I was hoping we would get Cousins so we can keep our draft picks or even get more by trading down, but at this point Im all in for trading up to 2 or 3 even if it means giving up a 2nd, 3rd, and a 1 next year and taking one of Darnold or Rosen. If we do not move up in the top 3, I have an uneasy feeling that either the Bills, Phins, or the Broncos will jump up taking the QB we want. It’s do or die Macc, go all in!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Augustiniak Posted March 10, 2018 Share Posted March 10, 2018 4 minutes ago, TopCop said: Jets are in a tough spot, but this is a rare opportunity to get a franchise QB. At first I was hoping we would get Cousins so we can keep our draft picks or even get more by trading down, but at this point Im all in for trading up to 2 or 3 even if it means giving up a 2nd, 3rd, and a 1 next year and taking one of Darnold or Rosen. If we do not move up in the top 3, I have an uneasy feeling that either the Bills, Phins, or the Broncos will jump up taking the QB we want. It’s do or die Macc, go all in!!! I think the browns are gearing up to take barkley first, then see if the giants take a qb or trade out. Let's say the bills go balls out and trade up to 2 and take Rosen. Then i expect the browns to make a trade with Indy to grab darnold. It's an easy swap for Indy, they know Cleveland wants a qb so they still get Chubb at 4. So let's say Indy is at 4 now. In my mind the huge question is, is Indy willing to move out of the top 6? If not, that means the jets get one of the 4 qbs, though they may not want allen. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pcola Posted March 10, 2018 Share Posted March 10, 2018 28 minutes ago, 32EBoozer said: If Watson turns into a star.... no, they won’t mind. If he turns into a middling Tyrod/ Dalton type player, that may change Houston is a perfect example of a team that went several seasons with no real answer at QB. Eventually, you have to go all in on your guy. They got away with not having a QB for so long due to being in a terrible division. We have rallied behind trash to go up against Brady for basically his whole career. Now the other two teams in our division sense the timing is perfect to get their QBs as Brady only has so much left. So we can either get our guy or continue to be the AFC East b!tch while Josh Rosen (Bills) and Mayfield (Dolphins) prevent us from being relevant for another 10-15 years. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pcola Posted March 10, 2018 Share Posted March 10, 2018 2 minutes ago, Augustiniak said: I think the browns are gearing up to take barkley first, then see if the giants take a qb or trade out. Let's say the bills go balls out and trade up to 2 and take Rosen. Then i expect the browns to make a trade with Indy to grab darnold. It's an easy swap for Indy, they know Cleveland wants a qb so they still get Chubb at 4. So let's say Indy is at 4 now. In my mind the huge question is, is Indy willing to move out of the top 6? If not, that means the jets get one of the 4 qbs, though they may not want allen. I’m still not sold on Cleveland taking Barkley. Their biggest hole on the team outside of QB is corner. Now they probably made those trades yesterday to show potential free agents they were serious, but I think they want to come away with Darnold and either Fitzpatrick or Denzel Ward. I love Barkley but how much of a drop off would there be if Cle got Guice at the top of the 2nd. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Augustiniak Posted March 10, 2018 Share Posted March 10, 2018 1 minute ago, Pcola said: I’m still not sold on Cleveland taking Barkley. Their biggest hole on the team outside of QB is corner. Now they probably made those trades yesterday to show potential free agents they were serious, but I think they want to come away with Darnold and either Fitzpatrick or Denzel Ward. I love Barkley but how much of a drop off would there be if Cle got Guice at the top of the 2nd. They may as well come away with superstars. They can have their cake and eat it too. I think they go barkley and then swing a trade with Indy. It makes too much sense for both teams. The giants can take a qb or trade the pick but either way just 1 qb is off the board. So Cleveland can say, we'll take either Rosen or darnold, whichever one the giants or bills don't take. Then Indy can get 'free' picks and sit at 4 and take offers for whoever wants to overpay for mayfield or allen. cleveland clearly understands, unlike mccags, that offfense is more important than defense. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pcola Posted March 10, 2018 Share Posted March 10, 2018 35 minutes ago, Warfish said: Macc missing on Cousins and then being leapfrogged in the draft by both Miami and Buffalo? Least surprising thing I could imagine tbqh. Macc has shown he's simply not up to this job. I've told you folks, we're either looking at Bridgewater/Jackson/Hack or McCown/Falk/Hack in 2018 and beyond. With “and beyond” meaning the 2018 season. If we walk out of this off-season with a QB not named Cousins, Darnold, Rosen, or Mayfield, Macc and Bowles won’t survive the season. The team is probably not going to be very good anyway, but without the appeal of a legitimate QB, the stadium will be empty all season. Then our new HC and GM can start this process all over again. Only this time, with probably little to no cap space and a weaker class of QBs in the draft. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lith Posted March 10, 2018 Share Posted March 10, 2018 We still have enough draft capital to outbid either Miami or Buffalo. These are the picks and values each team has (Miami is before the Landry trade): Bills Jets Dolphins Pick Points Pick Points Pick Points 21 800 6 1600 11 1250 22 780 37 530 42 480 53 370 49 410 73 225 55 350 72 230 130 42 65 265 107 80 198 11.8 96 116 157 28.2 223 2 121 52 179 19.4 229 1 158 27.8 235 1 166 24.6 2785.4 2898.6 2011.8 Reports are that Miami got two picks for Landry 18 & 19 picks between 3 & 7. Cleveland traded their 3 to Buffalo, so the best Miami could have added in 2018 is a 4, worth 96 points, still leaving them well behind both us and Buffalo in draft capital. We still have enough to hold off either team. As long as Macc is aggressive, and that is the piece that scares me more than either Mia or Buf. Macc has the capital to outbid either team, but will he be aggressive enough to do it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Augustiniak Posted March 10, 2018 Share Posted March 10, 2018 2 minutes ago, Pcola said: With “and beyond” meaning the 2018 season. If we walk out of this off-season with a QB not named Cousins, Darnold, Rosen, or Mayfield, Macc and Bowles won’t survive the season. The team is probably not going to be very good anyway, but without the appeal of a legitimate QB, the stadium will be empty all season. Then our new HC and GM can start this process all over again. Only this time, with probably little to no cap space and a weaker class of QBs in the draft. The owners have already expressed concern about the empty stadium. If the best that mccags can do is bridgewater, Chubb and some random offensive player in round 2, then yes, he's gone. Nobody is going to want to come to MetLife and watch Rosen on the bills, mayfield on the broncos or watch highlights on the screen of cousins on the Vikings. We don't want to be sold on how Rudolph is nothing like petty, or how falk is just as good as darnold. If fans were pissed last year, just wait if we have no clear qb of the future this year. I hope mccags understands how close he is to losing his job. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CTM Posted March 10, 2018 Share Posted March 10, 2018 Who needs a second round pick when we got those oh so valuable win #'s 4 and 5 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nico002 Posted March 10, 2018 Share Posted March 10, 2018 The Bills don’t have the ammo to move into the top 5 unless they give up their whole draft Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pcola Posted March 10, 2018 Share Posted March 10, 2018 4 minutes ago, Augustiniak said: They may as well come away with superstars. They can have their cake and eat it too. I think they go barkley and then swing a trade with Indy. It makes too much sense for both teams. The giants can take a qb or trade the pick but either way just 1 qb is off the board. So Cleveland can say, we'll take either Rosen or darnold, whichever one the giants or bills don't take. Then Indy can get 'free' picks and sit at 4 and take offers for whoever wants to overpay for mayfield or allen. cleveland clearly understands, unlike mccags, that offfense is more important than defense. I don’t think Cleveland is a threat to take Rosen. First, Cleveland (for the most part) is poor blue collar fans that are the polar opposite of everything Rosen is. Second, Dorsey was interviewed last October, before he was the Cle GM, and said he would not touch Rosen in the draft. That said, Dorsey is a veteran GM and knows how important it is to get the right QB. What happens if the NYG take Darnold and the Broncos trade with Indy and grab Mayfield? Perfectly conceivable because Indy knows Cle has to take a QB and they (Indy) can still get Chubb at 5. Then Cleveland is stuck with a QB with the greatest bust potential of any QB drafted in the top 10 in the past 11 years or go with a QB that will never be popular with their fans. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Adoni Beast Posted March 10, 2018 Share Posted March 10, 2018 Mac is done if we dont get Cousins or a fkrst round QB. Its simple. We have better ammo than Miami and Buffalo. Use it, or its time to go. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Augustiniak Posted March 10, 2018 Share Posted March 10, 2018 6 minutes ago, Pcola said: I don’t think Cleveland is a threat to take Rosen. First, Cleveland (for the most part) is poor blue collar fans that are the polar opposite of everything Rosen is. Second, Dorsey was interviewed last October, before he was the Cle GM, and said he would not touch Rosen in the draft. That said, Dorsey is a veteran GM and knows how important it is to get the right QB. What happens if the NYG take Darnold and the Broncos trade with Indy and grab Mayfield? Perfectly conceivable because Indy knows Cle has to take a QB and they (Indy) can still get Chubb at 5. Then Cleveland is stuck with a QB with the greatest bust potential of any QB drafted in the top 10 in the past 11 years or go with a QB that will never be popular with their fans. I think Cleveland takes barkley, then trades with Indy after buffalo trades its draft for Rosen. So the giants get to retool with a bunch of picks, then Cleveland moves up with Indy and takes darnold. Or, if the giants take darnold, Cleveland can move up and take allen. I think what may save mccagnan and us, is that Indy will not want to move out of the top 6, believing they can get Chubb if barkley and the qbs go to round out the top 6. So Indy can move back with Denver or the jets and still get Chubb. I think that rules out Indy trading with miami or buffalo, for the most part. 'At the end of the day', the two huge questions for us are 1) how much does mccagnan love Rosen to trade up with Indy to 3, and 2) how much does he love mayfield to move ahead of Denver and to prevent teams like miami from getting him. If it turns out that mccags really doesn't love mayfield then we're deluding ourselves now and we really could be looking at a bridgewater year. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pcola Posted March 10, 2018 Share Posted March 10, 2018 10 minutes ago, Lith said: We still have enough draft capital to outbid either Miami or Buffalo. These are the picks and values each team has (Miami is before the Landry trade): Bills Jets Dolphins Pick Points Pick Points Pick Points 21 800 6 1600 11 1250 22 780 37 530 42 480 53 370 49 410 73 225 55 350 72 230 130 42 65 265 107 80 198 11.8 96 116 157 28.2 223 2 121 52 179 19.4 229 1 158 27.8 235 1 166 24.6 2785.4 2898.6 2011.8 Reports are that Miami got two picks for Landry 18 & 19 picks between 3 & 7. Cleveland traded their 3 to Buffalo, so the best Miami could have added in 2018 is a 4, worth 96 points, still leaving them well behind both us and Buffalo in draft capital. We still have enough to hold off either team. As long as Macc is aggressive, and that is the piece that scares me more than either Mia or Buf. Macc has the capital to outbid either team, but will he be aggressive enough to do it. I said this elsewhere but you also have to take into consideration that our 2019 and 2020 1st round picks are considerably more value than those of Miami and Buffalo. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Obrien2Toon Posted March 10, 2018 Share Posted March 10, 2018 5 minutes ago, Pcola said: I said this elsewhere but you also have to take into consideration that our 2019 and 2020 1st round picks are considerably more value than those of Miami and Buffalo. Why Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
20andOut Posted March 10, 2018 Share Posted March 10, 2018 1-Cousins going to Vikings would be worst spot for us, at least if he goes to Denver it takes a team below us out of QB competition. 2- Have to hope enough of the 5 teams below us value the non- QBs (Chubb, Batkley, Nelson, Fitzpatrick) high enough that they will not trade out. 3- Lastly if does become a bidding war to trade up, regardless of value chart, the 6th pick still gets a team an elite player which Miami's 11th and Buffalo's picks in the 20's can not. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scott Dierking Posted March 10, 2018 Share Posted March 10, 2018 It all depends. How do you view the top 5 qbs? Do you have one that stands out head and shoulders above the others? Or, are your grades fairly similar? You don't jump for the sake of jumping, or fear. You only jump if you have a darling in this race. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bla bla bla Posted March 10, 2018 Share Posted March 10, 2018 1 minute ago, Obrien2Toon said: Why I think our roster with a rookie QB is seen as less desirable than Miami or Buffalo with a rookie QB. Especially if Tannehill acts as the bridge and wins some games. It's totally subjective but I think we have the fire power to get a deal done, big question is if Macc will pull the trigger. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FidelioJet Posted March 10, 2018 Share Posted March 10, 2018 7 minutes ago, Pcola said: I said this elsewhere but you also have to take into consideration that our 2019 and 2020 1st round picks are considerably more value than those of Miami and Buffalo. This is geting old. Buffalo and Miami are NOT powerhouses - the Jets have been a much more succesful franchise over the past decade. Neither of those teams have had a legitimate franchise QB since Marino/Kelly... But all of sudden they know best. Come on - let's just have a little bit of clarity. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bla bla bla Posted March 10, 2018 Share Posted March 10, 2018 1 minute ago, FidelioJet said: This is geting old. Buffalo and Miami are NOT powerhouses - the Jets have been a much more succesful franchise over the past decade. Neither of those teams have had a legitimate franchise QB since Marino/Kelly... But all of sudden they know best. Come on - let's just have a little bit of clarity. I think he's right, I think our 2019 1st will be more attractive than either other teams pick. That mixed with a top 6 pick might be enough to swing a trade. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scott Dierking Posted March 10, 2018 Share Posted March 10, 2018 1 hour ago, Pcola said: Nobody in Houston is complaining that they don’t have a pic until the third round this year. I am sure that there is a poster on TexansNation, probably goes by B0bCrane, who just vilifies every move, and is enamored with his own repertoire. Some in every crowd. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sonny Werblin Posted March 10, 2018 Share Posted March 10, 2018 This draft is really shaping up to be very compelling TV. Lots and lots of moving parts and possibilities. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pcola Posted March 10, 2018 Share Posted March 10, 2018 8 minutes ago, Augustiniak said: I think Cleveland takes barkley, then trades with Indy after buffalo trades its draft for Rosen. So the giants get to retool with a bunch of picks, then Cleveland moves up with Indy and takes darnold. Or, if the giants take darnold, Cleveland can move up and take allen. I think what may save mccagnan and us, is that Indy will not want to move out of the top 6, believing they can get Chubb if barkley and the qbs go to round out the top 6. So Indy can move back with Denver or the jets and still get Chubb. I think that rules out Indy trading with miami or buffalo, for the most part. 'At the end of the day', the two huge questions for us are 1) how much does mccagnan love Rosen to trade up with Indy to 3, and 2) how much does he love mayfield to move ahead of Denver and to prevent teams like miami from getting him. If it turns out that mccags really doesn't love mayfield then we're deluding ourselves now and we really could be looking at a bridgewater year. The only viable options are Cousins, Darnold, Rosen, or Mayfield. The Tony Pauline rumors of McCown and Bridgewater at QB will get the building where Macc’s office is, burned to the ground. The ONLY reason people bothered to follow this garbage team last year was the hope that the terrible season would bring a FQB once and for all. If that doesn’t come to fruition, they aren’t going to fool their fans again. I been following this team for 40 years and it’s always the same plot. We do everything possible to be occasionally mediocre where the teams around us go for broke. We are not relevant in the eyes of the NFL, we are not relevant in terms of our division, and we certainly aren’t relevant in our own city. Macc and Todd Bowles have been here now for 4 off seasons. If they don’t plan on at least trying to be relevant, then they can pack their offices up and get the hell out. Fans are tired of being patient. Tired of being fed bull crap about how the team is improving and we need to be patient. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Adoni Beast Posted March 10, 2018 Share Posted March 10, 2018 12 minutes ago, Obrien2Toon said: Why Cause we suck Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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