Mentor-bridging a rookie QB

[Integrity28]

Does it ever actually make a difference? I cannot think of a single instance where the guy behind the guy became the guy because of mentoring. These guys are either going to dunk or swim. Steve Young was always going to be Steve Young, etc.

Time and reps I can buy as a reason not to start right away, but the notion of a 4-month mentor for guys that have been playing for years seems artificial.

[pointman]

I'm with you. I am sure little tips and such are great, but the whole idea of a player mentor is ridiculous to me. Coaches are there to coach. Mentors work for 11 yr old inner city kids needing some guidance, not for grown men playing a game that they've played all their lives.

[Patriot Killa]

Meh.

Probably not much of a noticeable difference. May pick up a few things early on that they would of had to learn on their own at some point, but most likely nothing that affects on-field play that much. Can’t hurt though. As long as he starts this year, I think he’ll benefit from that more than anything a mentor can provide.

[Integrity28]

How much can you learn from a 40-year old career loser? I guess it’s a lot of lessons in what not to do?

[RutgersJetFan]

No. It’s not a thing. It’s a made up concept by people who want to justify young football players that can’t play football. You can either play or you can’t at the pro level. With respect to coaching, that’s why we have football coaches, because they coach football players. 

 

[Larz]

This was before today's trade, 

The ideal bridge quarterback, McCown is essentially a player-coach at this stage of his career. A red-flag injury risk entering his age-39 season, McCown is perhaps most valuable as a wet nurse for a talented but raw young stallion. 

UPDATE: Josh McCown is re-signing with the Jets on a one-year, $10 million deal, per Garafolo.

[CrazyCarl40]

If the plan B all along was to move up and aim at a “franchise QB” then the signing of two vets made even less sense. The new QB needs to get as many reps as possible and needs to be thrown into the fire as soon as possible. I have severe doubts Todd Bowles will ever let that happen. 

[slats]

It probably gets overstated, but having a veteran presence (or two) in the QB room is probably a good thing for a rookie. Just as sitting for a month or so absorbing the game from the sidelines and clipboarding into meetings during games can be instructive. Eli had that kind of benefit. Brady sat for a year. Rogers, would he have been the same guy if he was thrown right into it? 

Put it this way: I’d much rather have our new rookie be working with McCown an Bridgewater than Petty and Hack. Any new job, it’s good to have helpful, experienced people showing you the ropes. 

[Jet9]

For me its more about not having an a$$hole in a position of leadership. I'm assuming the OP has McCown in mind here. I'm fine with that signing. 

[Jet9]

2 minutes ago, CrazyCarl40 said:

If the plan B all along was to move up and aim at a “franchise QB” then the signing of two vets made even less sense. The new QB needs to get as many reps as possible and needs to be thrown into the fire as soon as possible. I have severe doubts Todd Bowles will ever let that happen. 

What do you do for a living? Would just jumping right in have worked for you as well? 

[Patriot Killa]

8 minutes ago, Integrity28 said:

How much can you learn from a 40-year old career loser? I guess it’s a lot of lessons in what not to do?

More like just tidbits regular seasoned veterans know and that’s where the line is drawn tbh. Can’t learn much else from others.

It’s about what you learn on your own. It resonates better with you and sticks in the mind.

[Integrity28]

3 minutes ago, slats said:

It probably gets overstated, but having a veteran presence (or two) in the QB room is probably a good thing for a rookie. Just as sitting for a month or so absorbing the game from the sidelines and clipboarding into meetings during games can be instructive. Eli had that kind of benefit. Brady sat for a year. Rogers, would he have been the same guy if he was thrown right into it? 

Put it this way: I’d much rather have our new rookie be working with McCown an Bridgewater than Petty and Hack. Any new job, it’s good to have helpful, experienced people showing you the ropes. 

This, I get. From the standpoint of acclimating to the league, but here guys talk about mentoring QB as though it makes guys not bust. I think that’s farce.

[CrazyCarl40]

Just now, Jet9 said:

What do you do for a living? Would just jumping right in have worked for you as well? 

I just took a new job in Washington DC and was thrown right into what was needed for the day. And it went great. You either can do your job or you can’t. He’ll have an entire training camp and preseason to figure it out. There is zero benefit to having McCown start any game this season. Just as there was no benefits to him starting last season. 

[CrazyCarl40]

5 minutes ago, slats said:

It probably gets overstated, but having a veteran presence (or two) in the QB room is probably a good thing for a rookie. Just as sitting for a month or so absorbing the game from the sidelines and clipboarding into meetings during games can be instructive. Eli had that kind of benefit. Brady sat for a year. Rogers, would he have been the same guy if he was thrown right into it? 

Put it this way: I’d much rather have our new rookie be working with McCown an Bridgewater than Petty and Hack. Any new job, it’s good to have helpful, experienced people showing you the ropes. 

Isn’t that exactly why coaches get paid?

[Integrity28]

1 minute ago, Patriot Killa said:

More like just tidbits regular seasoned veterans know and that’s where the line is drawn tbh. Can’t learn much else from others.

It’s about what you learn on your own. It resonates better with you and sticks in the mind.

Experience is the greatest teacher.

[JoJoTownsell1]

15 minutes ago, Integrity28 said:

Does it ever actually make a difference? I cannot think of a single instance where the guy behind the guy became the guy because of mentoring. These guys are either going to dunk or swim. Steve Young was always going to be Steve Young, etc.

Time and reps I can buy as a reason not to start right away, but the notion of a 4-month mentor for guys that have been playing for years seems artificial.

It's not needed but it can't hurt.

Mccown is basically a glorified QB coach that will need very limited reps in camp to be ready so he won't get in the way of the rookie's development. 

[Augustiniak]

5 minutes ago, slats said:

It probably gets overstated, but having a veteran presence (or two) in the QB room is probably a good thing for a rookie. Just as sitting for a month or so absorbing the game from the sidelines and clipboarding into meetings during games can be instructive. Eli had that kind of benefit. Brady sat for a year. Rogers, would he have been the same guy if he was thrown right into it? 

Put it this way: I’d much rather have our new rookie be working with McCown an Bridgewater than Petty and Hack. Any new job, it’s good to have helpful, experienced people showing you the ropes. 

I wonder if bridgewater would have taken another offer, assuming he had one, if he knew the jets were going to do this.  This all but assures he will not see the field.

[Patriot Killa]

Just now, Integrity28 said:

Experience is the greatest teacher.

Right. Nothing prepares you for the game more than the game.

[NoBowles]

Eli always gave a lot of credit to Kurt Warner

[Patriot Killa]

8 minutes ago, slats said:

It probably gets overstated, but having a veteran presence (or two) in the QB room is probably a good thing for a rookie. Just as sitting for a month or so absorbing the game from the sidelines and clipboarding into meetings during games can be instructive. Eli had that kind of benefit. Brady sat for a year. Rogers, would he have been the same guy if he was thrown right into it? 

Put it this way: I’d much rather have our new rookie be working with McCown an Bridgewater than Petty and Hack. Any new job, it’s good to have helpful, experienced people showing you the ropes. 

Agree to an extent. I just don’t want Bowles to get too comfortable with someone other than our #3 pick starting lmao.

[FidelioJet]

Most overated thing in all of football - QB as Mentor.

As many have stated - that's why they have QB coaches.

[JoJoTownsell1]

1 minute ago, CrazyCarl40 said:

Isn’t that exactly why coaches get paid?

100% but you're acting as if a smart veteran QB won't be even more beneficial. 

Mccown and even Bridgewater are both known for being smart QBs. Surrounding a kid in that environment can only help his development. But you're right, it's not necessary. 

[ZachEY]

15 minutes ago, Integrity28 said:

How much can you learn from a 40-year old career loser? I guess it’s a lot of lessons in what not to do?

Couldn't you make that argument about any coach who wasn't a successful player then?

I actually had a conversation with a pretty well known national sports reporter who said that the mentor thing was nonsense, except for Josh McCown, who does actually teach guys.

Doesn't mean he's going to make someone bad, suddenly good.  But, how much does coaching do that either, as you said, Steve Young was always going to be Steve Young?

[slats]

3 minutes ago, Integrity28 said:

This, I get. From the standpoint of acclimating to the league, but here guys talk about mentoring QB as though it makes guys not bust. I think that’s farce.

I understand. Like I said, I think it’s overstated. 

2 minutes ago, CrazyCarl40 said:

Isn’t that exactly why coaches get paid?

Bosses provide one function, genuinely helpful co-workers provide another. It doesn’t have to be either/or. 

1 minute ago, Augustiniak said:

I wonder if bridgewater would have taken another offer, assuming he had one, if he knew the jets were going to do this.  This all but assures he will not see the field.

Bridgewater had to know the strong possibility that the Jets would take a QB at #6, not a lot has changed for him. His goal is still to beat McCown out to be the opening day starter. 

[JoJoTownsell1]

3 minutes ago, Augustiniak said:

I wonder if bridgewater would have taken another offer, assuming he had one, if he knew the jets were going to do this.  This all but assures he will not see the field.

Bridgewater got a 1 year deal. He knew the Jets weren't locked into him long term and I'm guessing they told him mccown was the starter. I think both sides will hope he looks great in camp and a team will suffer an injury and offer us a 2nd for him. 

Bridgewater still has a chance to start this year if he out plays mccown or mccown gets hurt.

[MDL_JET]

5 minutes ago, JoJoTownsell1 said:

100% but you're acting as if a smart veteran QB won't be even more beneficial. 

Mccown and even Bridgewater are both known for being smart QBs. Surrounding a kid in that environment can only help his development. But you're right, it's not necessary. 

Exactly. I’d rather surround him with teddy and McCown then petty and hack. Cmon now. This is easy. 

 

[Jetmech]

I just took a new job in Washington DC and was thrown right into what was needed for the day. And it went great. You either can do your job or you can’t. He’ll have an entire training camp and preseason to figure it out. There is zero benefit to having McCown start any game this season. Just as there was no benefits to him starting last season. 

That's assuming either would beat out MCcown which unfortunately didn't happen.

I still believe the Jets thought MCcown would either suck or not make it through the entire season but be their as a sound board for Petty and Hack.

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[Jet9]

21 minutes ago, CrazyCarl40 said:

I just took a new job in Washington DC and was thrown right into what was needed for the day. And it went great. You either can do your job or you can’t. He’ll have an entire training camp and preseason to figure it out. There is zero benefit to having McCown start any game this season. Just as there was no benefits to him starting last season. 

OK, since you're choosing to not argue in good faith, I'll rephrase it.

 

When you were 18 years old would you have been able to just jump right in and do the job you're currently doing? 

[CrazyCarl40]

3 minutes ago, Jet9 said:

OK, since you're choosing to not argue in good faith, I'll rephrase it.

 

When you were 18 years old would you have been able to just jump right in and do the job you're currently doing? 

I’m arguing based on your question. It’s not my fault we’re dealing your logical flaws. 

To answer this mindblowingly terrible example: Did I spend 4 years of high school training with highly paid coaches and staffs in a technical school? Have I been practicing this craft week in and week out for the majority of my formative years? Will I have months and months of time to learn in a training camp and then 4 practice trial runs before “jumping right in”?

[Freemanm]

The real question is, what if Bridgewater actually returns to form and becomes the franchise QB that he was on his way to becoming before that serious knee injury? Bowles doesn't even know what he's doing with a veteran QB, so how would he even manage that scenario if we draft Rosen/Allen/Darnold and Bridgewater becomes THE guy? 

[Jet9]

5 minutes ago, CrazyCarl40 said:

I’m arguing based on your question. It’s not my fault we’re dealing your logical flaws. 

To answer this mindblowingly terrible example: Did I spend 4 years of high school training with highly paid coaches and staffs in a technical school? Have I been practicing this craft week in and week out for the majority of my formative years? Will I have months and months of time to learn in a training camp and then 4 practice trial runs before “jumping right in”?

So a kid out of law school is the same as Johnny Cochrane. Got it. 

[MDL_JET]

51 minutes ago, CrazyCarl40 said:

If the plan B all along was to move up and aim at a “franchise QB” then the signing of two vets made even less sense. The new QB needs to get as many reps as possible and needs to be thrown into the fire as soon as possible. I have severe doubts Todd Bowles will ever let that happen. 

Yeah. It really hurt Wentz when Bradford was named the starter and had to share reps with chase Daniels. 

[bealeb319]

Does it ever actually make a difference? I cannot think of a single instance where the guy behind the guy became the guy because of mentoring. These guys are either going to dunk or swim. Steve Young was always going to be Steve Young, etc.
Time and reps I can buy as a reason not to start right away, but the notion of a 4-month mentor for guys that have been playing for years seems artificial.

I bet Aaron Rodgers would give alot of credit to Brett Favre who knows if sitting behind him and developing helped or not. The more important thing from our franchises point of view should be that if teddy shows he can still play he could be next years Kirk cousins which could potentially land us a good comp pick. If they like what they see from teddy then it might be better to play our rookie in hopes we can sign teddy to a long term contract next season as a backup...not sure why we brought mccown back other than for him being a good for our locker room maybe.

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[Warfish]

58 minutes ago, slats said:

It probably gets overstated, but having a veteran presence (or two) in the QB room is probably a good thing for a rookie. Just as sitting for a month or so absorbing the game from the sidelines and clipboarding into meetings during games can be instructive. Eli had that kind of benefit. Brady sat for a year. Rogers, would he have been the same guy if he was thrown right into it? 

Put it this way: I’d much rather have our new rookie be working with McCown an Bridgewater than Petty and Hack. Any new job, it’s good to have helpful, experienced people showing you the ropes. 

As a coach? Yes.

As a #3 QB? Ok.

As a season-long started while giving the rookie the Hackshirt treatment? No.

[CrazyCarl40]

14 minutes ago, Jet9 said:

So a kid out of law school is the same as Johnny Cochrane. Got it. 

Hey. It was your argument. Sorry you lost. Enjoy the offseason. 

4 minutes ago, MDL_JET said:

Yeah. It really hurt Wentz when Bradford was named the starter and had to share reps with chase Daniels. 

I don’t know enough about the Eagles situation, but it seems like what really helped Wentz was a coaching change. The QB the Jets takes at 3 shouldn’t have to be handled with kid gloves.