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Loving Josh Rosen (merged)


Grandy

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1 minute ago, MDL_JET said:

How nerve wrecking is it gonna be when Rosen and Allen are on the board and goodell announces “New York jets select JOSH....” he should hold it for a few seconds. 

No how great will it be when Goodell says “Minkah Fitzpatrick” after

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9 minutes ago, artemusclyde said:

He's not wrong. Allen is more physically gifted then Wentz. Allen is the type of qb you design in a lab, he's the ideal qb in terms of physical stats. Allen's talent is insane, he's been clocked throwing the ball at 66 mph. That's absolutely nuts, his talent is extremely rare, this is once in a lifetime stuff. Whether or not he develops is another question, but considering his work ethic and how praised Bates is, (along with his improvements since the senior bowl) I have faith that we can develop him, and if he develops, he is a top 5 qb.

We're not in laboratory making a bionic QB. Nothing in your post relates to being a successful NFL QB.

He knows he has some work to do. On the positive side, ----- has elite arm talent and athletic ability. What he needs to work on is that he's never been in a huddle, never been under center, and never done a five-step drop let alone a seven-step drop." -- Mike Mayock

Who is Mayock talking about? Sound familiar? Paxton Lynch, the 6'7" athletically gifted QB taken by the Broncos in the 2016 draft and who has been a giant bust. His profile is a carbon copy of Allen.

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2 minutes ago, Mackman55 said:

We're not in laboratory making a bionic QB. Nothing in your post relates to being a successful NFL QB.

He knows he has some work to do. On the positive side, ----- has elite arm talent and athletic ability. What he needs to work on is that he's never been in a huddle, never been under center, and never done a five-step drop let alone a seven-step drop." -- Mike Mayock

Who is Mayock talking about? Sound familiar? Paxton Lynch, the 6'7" athletically gifted QB taken by the Broncos in the 2016 draft and who has been a giant bust. His profile is a carbon copy of Allen.

What? Allen played in a pro style offense lol. He has some of the best footwork in this class cause he actually played under center. Not to mention that Lynch never had Allen's arm talent. The difference is that Allen goes top 5 in a strong qb class, while Lynch almost fell to the 2nd in a relatively weak class, besides Goff and Wentz of course.

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2 minutes ago, artemusclyde said:

What? Allen played in a pro style offense lol. He has some of the best footwork in this class cause he actually played under center. Not to mention that Lynch never had Allen's arm talent. The difference is that Allen goes top 5 in a strong qb class, while Lynch almost fell to the 2nd in a relatively weak class, besides Goff and Wentz of course.

Comparing Allen to Lynch is laughable.  If anything Baker Mayfield is the mini-me version of Paxton Lynch

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9 minutes ago, Mackman55 said:

We're not in laboratory making a bionic QB. Nothing in your post relates to being a successful NFL QB.

He knows he has some work to do. On the positive side, ----- has elite arm talent and athletic ability. What he needs to work on is that he's never been in a huddle, never been under center, and never done a five-step drop let alone a seven-step drop." -- Mike Mayock

Who is Mayock talking about? Sound familiar? Paxton Lynch, the 6'7" athletically gifted QB taken by the Broncos in the 2016 draft and who has been a giant bust. His profile is a carbon copy of Allen.

Allen played under center in college and did 5-step drops.  Try again

 

Baker Mayfield is a 6 foot version of Paxton Lynch

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Josh Rosen is not only the best quarterback in this draft, but on the short list of best qb prospects to come out in a long time.

His mechanics are flawless. The ball comes out perfectly, with strength, touch, and accuracy.

I thought he was a better prospect than Darnold even last season during “Samania,” when Darnold was being touted as Montana/Elway/Brady/Manning/Unitas into one big ginger ball. 

 

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I don't think our GM cares who is available at 3, as long as one of Allen, Rosen, Darnold is there. 

You take any one of these guys and run with it.  The only complication is if two are there and Mac actually has to decide, say Allen or Rosen. 

the trade up shows that he is fine with any one of these QBs, even the one that goes third out of the three.

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4 hours ago, bitonti said:

At 235 he also has better speed than both Mayfield and Rosen. He's got no injuries unlike Rosen, who is always banged up. He doesn't come from the gimmicky Mayfield system surrounded by 5 star preps. 

I love these "I don't know why but Allen is a bust" threads

 

"OK EXCEPT FOR HIS HEIGHT, WEIGHT, SPEED, AGILITY, ARM STRENGTH and his own table at the CRACKER BARRELL what else does he HAVE? HUH?! I HATE HIM SO MUCH"

 

I'd guess it's because he won't be able to complete 45% of his passes as a rookie (if he started) at the NFL level?

Think that consistent criticism of him carries any weight, or no?

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17 minutes ago, artemusclyde said:

What? Allen played in a pro style offense lol. He has some of the best footwork in this class cause he actually played under center. Not to mention that Lynch never had Allen's arm talent. The difference is that Allen goes top 5 in a strong qb class, while Lynch almost fell to the 2nd in a relatively weak class, besides Goff and Wentz of course.

Sorry my bad wasn't paying attention. My point is that shills like Mayock over hype prospects like Lynch and Allen then they wind up being over drafted when they are really 2-3 year projects.

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47 minutes ago, Mackman55 said:

I understand your point. The fact is some QB's are inherently less accurate regardless of the type of throw. I try to evaluate a prospect's entire body of work with whatever statistics are available to help eliminate slight differences in completion percentages, etc due to the factors you stated. 

Check this out.

  

 

Interesting....and scary.  "Day 3"..."fringe starter."

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17 minutes ago, jetstream23 said:

Interesting....and scary.  "Day 3"..."fringe starter."

If Allen becomes a good pro, everything this guy espouses from that point on can be thrown in the trash, lol. Montana was a 3rd rounder too, someone was way off.

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39 minutes ago, Patriot Killa said:

And the crazy part is that I answered in more than one way on more than one occasion.??‍♂️ It’s whatever though. I’m really done with this one. This debate has ran its course. We will find out in 6 weeks.

Crazy part just might be that you think you did.  Telling me because his footwork is inconsistent doesn't say a thing about what makes you come to the conclusion that he's inaccurate.  I've said what I think goes into being considered accurate or not and you ignore it.  

So leave the conversation , you obviously can't discuss without pouting.  That's fine, I wasn't even talking to you about it, you're too invested in Mayfield to even discuss someone else 

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1 minute ago, Jet Nut said:

Crazy part just might be that you think you did.  Telling me because his footwork is inconsistent doesn't say a thing.  So leave it, you obviously can't discuss without pouting

So I didn’t cover his decision making or his field vision?

OH 

lmao ok. Just be quiet now. You are stinking up the joint.

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1 hour ago, Jet Nut said:

Why would you think that 2 extra pass completions can't be because of reasons other than he's inaccurate?  

 

1 hour ago, SenorGato said:

If it's soooo easy to cover that gap like you want to pretend it is - why couldn't Allen cover that gap against college players? Why would things get better as a pro? 

 

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Just now, Patriot Killa said:

So I didn’t cover his decision making or his field vision?

OH 

lmao ok. Just be quiet now. You are stinking up the joint.

One more time.  WTF does that have to do with how you've decided that he inaccurate?  You know what his field of vision is?  How do you know what Mayfields is when he dumps all those wheel routes?  You seriously don't know what you're talking about. You're projecting what you think he does and then are saying therefore he inaccurate.  And you're wrong.  So yes, quit now.  When you can't even explain how he's inaccurate you shouldn't discuss.   

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2 minutes ago, SenorGato said:

 

 

Because their 2 situations aren't exactly the same?  Because the difference is negligible?  Could be the product of shltty WRs.  Game situations?  Comp?  

Completed passes are more than just the QB. And 2 extra completions doesn't tell a thing to stat readers like all of us are. 

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5 minutes ago, Jet Nut said:

One more time.  WTF does that have to do with how you've decided that he inaccurate?  You know what his field of vision is?  How do you know what Mayfields is when he dumps all those wheel routes?  You seriously don't know what you're talking about. You're projecting what you think he does and then are saying therefore he inaccurate.  And you're wrong.  So yes, quit now.  When you can't even explain how he's inaccurate you shouldn't discuss.   

His decision making and field vision leads to inaccuracy, homie. You have a thick skull.

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7 minutes ago, Jet Nut said:

Because their 2 situations aren't exactly the same?  Because the difference is negligible?  Could be the product of shltty WRs.  Game situations?  Comp?  

Completed passes are more than just the QB. And 2 extra completions doesn't tell a thing to stat readers like all of us are. 

If any of this mattered and/or were true, particularly the bold, then the champions of the sub-60% QBs over the past twenty years wouldn't be Jay Cutler and Matt Stafford. 

 

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18 minutes ago, Patriot Killa said:

His decision making and field vision leads to inaccuracy, homie. You have a thick skull.

And you still haven't defined it.  I get it, you're either incapable of making a point or just can't understand a simple concept.  Either way enough.   I'm too dense to deal with your nonsense 

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17 minutes ago, SenorGato said:

If any of this mattered and/or were true, particularly the bold, then the champions of the sub-60% QBs over the past twenty years wouldn't be Jay Cutler and Matt Stafford. 

 

And the above 70%'s wouldn't be Geno and Tebows of the world.  Again, point is a couple of %points isn't how accuracy is determined.  Nothing more.  But everyone seems stuck on it or not to understand.  Whatever, 

 

 

 

 

 

 

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7 minutes ago, Jet Nut said:

And the above 70%'s wouldn't be Geno and Tebows of the world.  Again, point is a couple of %points isn't how accuracy is determined.  Nothing more.  But everyone seems stuck on it or not to understand.  Whatever

I don't think either of us have any idea what the relevance of this is for Josh Allen or pretty much anyone. Tebow and Smith were bad prospects for other reasons, Allen is a bad prospct for because he couldn't accomplish the simple task of completing 60% of his passes in college.

It's not that no one understands your point so much as history is not with a prospect with a sub-60% completion rate like Allen. 

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17 minutes ago, SenorGato said:

I don't think either of us have any idea what the relevance of this is for Josh Allen or pretty much anyone. Tebow and Smith were bad prospects for other reasons, Allen is a bad prospct for because he couldn't accomplish the simple task of completing 60% of his passes in college.

It's not that no one understands your point so much as history is not with a prospect with a sub-60% completion rate like Allen. 

I'm not even attempting to make a point of what it means.  Saying the opposite, that it takes so little to go from 57 to 63 percent over 35 attempts that I don't think it's as relevant as some make it.  Nothing more. 

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8 minutes ago, Jet Nut said:

I'm not even attempting to make a point of what it means.  Saying the opposite, that it takes so little to go from 57 to 63 percent over 35 attempts that I don't think it's as relevant as some make it.  Nothing more. 

This is still a really bad argument. If it's not such a big deal and not hard to accomplish, again I ask, why didn't he just do it?

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Just now, SenorGato said:

This is still a really bad argument. If it's not such a big deal and not hard to accomplish, again I ask, why didn't he just do it? 

One more time, it's two passes over 35 attempts.  And it's a function of the O, the comp., The game and the WRs.  

If you don't agree fine. 

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8 minutes ago, Jet Nut said:

One more time, it's two passes over 35 attempts.  And it's a function of the O, the comp., The game and the WRs.  

I really try to be nice but you're being dumb for dumb's sake at this point. 

What about completing those two passes that would have legitimized him as a prospect became so difficult that he straight up could not do it? You keep going back to competition as an excuse - he's playing against a bunch of future non-NFL players and couldn't pull off something so basic every starter in the league, especially the good ones, has done it.

 

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5 hours ago, SenorGato said:

I really try to be nice but you're being dumb for dumb's sake at this point. 

What about completing those two passes that would have legitimized him as a prospect became so difficult that he straight up could not do it? You keep going back to competition as an excuse - he's playing against a bunch of future non-NFL players and couldn't pull off something so basic every starter in the league, especially the good ones, has done it.

 

Do me and yourself a favor, don't call anyone dumb.  How many ******* times can you say the same pointless thing over and over again missing the point?  It's insignificant.  You're too thick to get that.  If that makes me dumb, fine.  But that's not enough for you, it has to be posted to death as if you're actually making a point. WTF the matter with you.  

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