k-met57 Posted March 22, 2018 Author Share Posted March 22, 2018 serious question...do people think that college QB's come out a finished product? i mean seriously...they all have flaws....and they all have to work at it. I know we are all butt-hurt over Hack, but Jamarcus Rusell completed about 70% of his passes in college so did Geno...its about what they do once they are in the league....thats what matters. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Saul Goodman Posted March 22, 2018 Share Posted March 22, 2018 He is talented. As in has skills and potential. But he’s not the guy for us. We’re not in a situation to let him sit on the bench for 1-2 years while we wait to see if he develops. I don’t like Mayfield either but he’s someone who could at least start day 1 and learn on the job. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jetsplayer21 Posted March 22, 2018 Share Posted March 22, 2018 8 minutes ago, FidelioJet said: foot work - that's all...no big deal. do that and he'll never miss. Yes, I hear hackenberg is still working on his dance lessons too and will be ready to go in 2022 ? lol Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Adoni Beast Posted March 22, 2018 Share Posted March 22, 2018 26 minutes ago, UnitedWhofans said: Wasn't Watson's accuracy a problem in his draft? Yup, that and arm strength. Look how that worked out. Its a crap shoot. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MaxAF Posted March 22, 2018 Share Posted March 22, 2018 I realize the stats on Allen aren’t that great but I would challenge anybody on here to take a few minutes and watch some film on this guy. He will amaze you. He has all the tangibles to be a great NFL QB. Size, check. Arm Strength, check. Pocket presence, check. Throws well on the run, check. Can run the ball, check. Accuracy, check. Has a nice touch on the ball. I can see why a lot of former QBs, football analysts and others are on his bandwagon. He’s no Hackenberg. Looks a lot like Big Ben but more mobile. Whoever gets this guy won’t be sorry. Naysayers, do your homework and check him out. Don’t just be a stat checker. Just my opinion. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
k-met57 Posted March 22, 2018 Author Share Posted March 22, 2018 Just now, Saul Goodman said: He is talented. As in has skills and potential. But he’s not the guy for us. We’re not in a situation to let him sit on the bench for 1-2 years while we wait to see if he develops. I don’t like Mayfield either but he’s someone who could at least start day 1 and learn on the job. i think thats a fair point. Allen may be the most talented, but if his learning curve is 2 years...i dont think this FO has that time to give him. with this fan base esp, kid will have to play at some point soon. It's frustrating to let that kind of thing force your hand, but it is what it is. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
k-met57 Posted March 22, 2018 Author Share Posted March 22, 2018 2 minutes ago, Adoni Beast said: Yup, that and arm strength. Look how that worked out. Its a crap shoot. i watched Watson play in college and he consistently under and over threw guys within 15 yards. i know he killed it last year, but i would be interested to see him play in big games...i am still not sure he is accurate enough to make the big throw consistently. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JustInFudge Posted March 22, 2018 Share Posted March 22, 2018 39 minutes ago, MDL_JET said: Nah, Palmer was there at Darnolds pro day leading the whole thing. Well then, that makes the comment more interesting... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
j4jets Posted March 22, 2018 Share Posted March 22, 2018 44 minutes ago, HessStation said: "When asked specifically if Hackenberg had been properly developed at Penn State — or not — Palmer pointed to former Oregon State star Sean Mannion as the most NFL-ready QB he had ever trained." That just means he’s just a sh*tty coach that hasn’t produced an nfl ready QB. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JustInFudge Posted March 22, 2018 Share Posted March 22, 2018 32 minutes ago, UnitedWhofans said: Wasn't Watson's accuracy a problem in his draft? Only by idiots. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
varjet Posted March 22, 2018 Share Posted March 22, 2018 Josh Allen has the potential to be a cross between Hack and Mike Mamula, particularly with the Jets. I think his ceiling is Blake Bortles, which is not horrible. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stark Posted March 22, 2018 Share Posted March 22, 2018 51 minutes ago, UnitedWhofans said: Just a question. Has anybody Palmer trained actually been successful? no 48 minutes ago, k-met57 said: not sure it matters (i guess i can look up who he worked with), guy clearly knows Quarterbacking. yes, it does, you can be a crappy QB trainer and not be able to see the flaws in your "paying" clients 45 minutes ago, CanadaSteve said: Right from his web-page: The quarterback rooms I’ve been in have been filled with names such as Jason Campbell, Jay Cutler, Blaine Gabbert, Chad Henne, Carson Palmer, EJ Manuel, Josh Mccown, Jimmy Clausen and many others. uh and he is Hackenberg's QB coach/trainer. Nothing he has done or produced seems to be at a level of a top 10 QB level. Darnold would be his first 1 if my memory serves me correctly. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Adoni Beast Posted March 22, 2018 Share Posted March 22, 2018 2 minutes ago, k-met57 said: i watched Watson play in college and he consistently under and over threw guys within 15 yards. i know he killed it last year, but i would be interested to see him play in big games...i am still not sure he is accurate enough to make the big throw consistently. I saw the same thing and wanted nothing to do with him. Just goes to show the crap shoot that is the draft. I think the biggest thing for a drafted player is going to a team that will coach to your strengths, while workinf on your deficiencies progressively. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
k-met57 Posted March 22, 2018 Author Share Posted March 22, 2018 20 minutes ago, FidelioJet said: oh...I think he was just F-in around with those guy. I think it's highly, highly unlikely he uses the word ICY for real. ok but if it does....i think we need to take him off the board Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Untouchable Posted March 22, 2018 Share Posted March 22, 2018 2 minutes ago, varjet said: Josh Allen has the potential to be a cross between Hack and Mike Mamula, particularly with the Jets. I think his ceiling is Blake Bortles, which is not horrible. His ceiling is Roethlisberger 2.0 He has far and away the most upside of any of these guys. Which is exactly why I take him over Mayfield if both Darnold and Rosen are off the board. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scoop24 Posted March 22, 2018 Share Posted March 22, 2018 43 minutes ago, Patriot Killa said: Jesus man..this sh*t is getting unbearable. Allen thread after Allen thread. They are trying to brain wash you folks dont fall for it. Yes cause scouts and nfl people need to lie .. Palmer saying this puts more pressure on his own brand as a QB guru. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stark Posted March 22, 2018 Share Posted March 22, 2018 7 minutes ago, MaxAF said: I realize the stats on Allen aren’t that great but I would challenge anybody on here to take a few minutes and watch some film on this guy. He will amaze you. He has all the tangibles to be a great NFL QB. Size, check. Arm Strength, check. Pocket presence, check. Throws well on the run, check. Can run the ball, check. Accuracy, check. Has a nice touch on the ball. I can see why a lot of former QBs, football analysts and others are on his bandwagon. He’s no Hackenberg. Looks a lot like Big Ben but more mobile. Whoever gets this guy won’t be sorry. Naysayers, do your homework and check him out. Don’t just be a stat checker. Just my opinion. entire post disproved with 2 bolded statements... nice try. Big Ben, maybe, but a less successful big ben. a less successful "_____________" pick a comp.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
k-met57 Posted March 22, 2018 Author Share Posted March 22, 2018 Just now, Untouchable said: His ceiling is Roethlisberger 2.0 He has far and away the most upside of any of these guys. Which is exactly why I take him over Mayfield if both Darnold and Rosen are off the board. this is my board as well: Darnold - checks too many boxes, best combination of mobility, throwing, arm, etc... Rosen - Eli clone, some personality concern...but potential 12-15 year starter with high upside Allen - Elite upside, low end production, low end floor...too much of a stud to pass on if Darnold and Rosen are gone Mayfield - does not profile as a prototypical NFL QB, probably a high floor guy but the ceiling is lower then the other 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
derp Posted March 22, 2018 Share Posted March 22, 2018 7 minutes ago, Saul Goodman said: He is talented. As in has skills and potential. But he’s not the guy for us. We’re not in a situation to let him sit on the bench for 1-2 years while we wait to see if he develops. I don’t like Mayfield either but he’s someone who could at least start day 1 and learn on the job. I think Maccagnan is absolutely trying to create the sit on the bench situation though. Which makes me think Allen is the guy. Or at least a guy. And fans will flip. And I think this thread is kind of a non-story. Allen is the best athlete with the best arm in this class. Someone saying he’s the most talented isn’t exactly groundbreaking. The questions are the accuracy, ability to handle pressure, etc. Stuff that’s considered fixable but really...eh. My favorite thing about Allen is that you either hit or you don’t. He’s not going to string you along as an okay QB for a while. Either he’s absolutely elite or you need to try again with new leadership in the organization. That’s also not a reason to draft him but a reason I’ll be at peace with it if they do. That and I’ll watch highlights. Dude makes some throws I’m pretty sure nobody else can. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RESNewYork Posted March 22, 2018 Share Posted March 22, 2018 22 minutes ago, Ruby2 said: The most talented dude doesnt complete 56% passes playing in the mountain west conference Is it a stretch to think that Wyoming or the mountain west conference does not have the best coaches to develop a Josh Allen. What if NFL coaches can tap into and develop his raw skills. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RESNewYork Posted March 22, 2018 Share Posted March 22, 2018 22 minutes ago, Ruby2 said: The most talented dude doesnt complete 56% passes playing in the mountain west conference Is it a stretch to think that Wyoming or the mountain west conference does not have the best coaches to develop a Josh Allen. What if NFL coaches can tap into and develop his raw skills. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Villain The Foe Posted March 22, 2018 Share Posted March 22, 2018 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stark Posted March 22, 2018 Share Posted March 22, 2018 .... todd marinovich most talented QB Palmer has seen... lol. These are his clients of course he is going to embellish and talk them up. It just so happens that this year Allen has the strongest arm, so yeah talk him up as the greatest QB you have seen while you await, your next check, and then the next greatest .... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Untouchable Posted March 22, 2018 Share Posted March 22, 2018 18 minutes ago, Saul Goodman said: He is talented. As in has skills and potential. But he’s not the guy for us. We’re not in a situation to let him sit on the bench for 1-2 years while we wait to see if he develops. I don’t like Mayfield either but he’s someone who could at least start day 1 and learn on the job. By re-signing McCown and bringing in Bridgewater, I absolutely think that the Jets are in position to let Allen sit for a year. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MaxAF Posted March 22, 2018 Share Posted March 22, 2018 5 minutes ago, Stark said: entire post disproved with 2 bolded statements... nice try. Big Ben, maybe, but a less successful big ben. a less successful "_____________" pick a comp.. This kid is coming out of college. They all have inconsistencies and a lot to learn transitioning into the pro’s. But he has potential and a high ceiling. I’m going on record right here Starkie. He’s not gonna be a bust. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stark Posted March 22, 2018 Share Posted March 22, 2018 9 minutes ago, Untouchable said: His ceiling is Roethlisberger 2.0 He has far and away the most upside of any of these guys. Which is exactly why I take him over Mayfield if both Darnold and Rosen are off the board. Just now, Untouchable said: By re-signing McCown and bringing in Bridgewater, I absolutely think that the Jets are in position to let Allen sit for a year. and then a 2nd.. come on with this... what has change that makes you confident that the JETS can get this kid to break bad habits in real game actions and reach all this high end potential. and furthermore how often in the league history does it actually happen..... NOT MUCH. hope in one hand and piss in the other, tell me which one fills up first.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jetsplayer21 Posted March 22, 2018 Share Posted March 22, 2018 29 minutes ago, Long Island Leprechaun said: Thus my distinction between accuracy and consistency. Comments like this mean you haven't watched any of his games or looked at the tape. This is not the issue. I have. He jumps out of the pocket instead of stepping up too often. He doesn’t anticipate receivers breaking away, he uses his arm strength to just hit the open receiver. He has no touch throws, only the gun. That 1 trick pony show won’t work as well in NFL. He needs to develop. We traded up for a major project who may transform ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stark Posted March 22, 2018 Share Posted March 22, 2018 1 minute ago, MaxAF said: This kid is coming out of college. They all have inconsistencies and a lot to learn transitioning into the pro’s. But he has potential and a high ceiling. I’m going on record right here Starkie. He’s not gonna be a bust. ok, so not a bust but what 10 year starter, 3 year starter then a #2... he's going to be closer to Jay Cutler than he will be a top QB. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
k-met57 Posted March 22, 2018 Author Share Posted March 22, 2018 1 minute ago, Stark said: and then a 2nd.. come on with this... what has change that makes you confident that the JETS can get this kid to break bad habits in real game actions and reach all this high end potential. and furthermore how often in the league history does it actually happen..... NOT MUCH. hope in one hand and piss in the other, tell me which one fills up first.. i mean to be fair it happens all the time, just because you dont think QB's have bad habbits or its not in the media doesnt mean it doesnt happen. every college QB has bad habbits and flaws that get fixed while they are in the pros. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Untouchable Posted March 22, 2018 Share Posted March 22, 2018 1 minute ago, Stark said: and then a 2nd.. come on with this... what has change that makes you confident that the JETS can get this kid to break bad habits in real game actions and reach all this high end potential. and furthermore how often in the league history does it actually happen..... NOT MUCH. hope in one hand and piss in the other, tell me which one fills up first.. What the hell makes anyone think that the Jets can transition Mayfield from the simplistic, ragtag bullsh*t he ran at Texas Tech and Oklahoma to a complex WCO? What makes anyone think that the Jets can keep Mayfield from getting into dumb sh*t away from the field in NYC? This can go both ways. At the end of the day, I’m willing to gamble on Allen’s ridiculous upside over Mayfield’s “fire” or “moxie” or whatever the hell you want to call it. I don’t see what’s so outlandish about that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stark Posted March 22, 2018 Share Posted March 22, 2018 1 minute ago, k-met57 said: i mean to be fair it happens all the time, just because you dont think QB's have bad habbits or its not in the media doesnt mean it doesnt happen. every college QB has bad habbits and flaws that get fixed while they are in the pros. oh do tell, i am ready for you to show me proof of qb's with bad footwork, accuracy, and inability to throw with anticipation changing those things to a level in which you could say was a drastically positive change. IN REAL GAMES. also let alone moving up essentially 2 levels of competition, allen couldn't handle crappy defenses in college so now he is just going to be a can't miss franchise QB, does he still have the deer in headlights look when things get tough? or does that change too.. or does he start carrying a team on his back yet? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MaxAF Posted March 22, 2018 Share Posted March 22, 2018 3 minutes ago, Stark said: ok, so not a bust but what 10 year starter, 3 year starter then a #2... he's going to be closer to Jay Cutler than he will be a top QB. I only saw one Wyoming game last year but check out some highlight film on him. He’s got a high ceiling brother. Whoever gets him won’t be sorry. And when we take little Baker we’ll be cursed once again by the QB Gods. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stark Posted March 22, 2018 Share Posted March 22, 2018 2 minutes ago, Untouchable said: What the hell makes anyone think that the Jets can transition Mayfield from the simplistic, ragtag bullsh*t he ran at Texas Tech and Oklahoma to a complex WCO? What makes anyone think that the Jets can keep Mayfield from getting into dumb sh*t away from the field in NYC? This can go both ways. At the end of the day, I’m willing to gamble on Allen’s ridiculous upside over Mayfield’s “fire” or “moxie” or whatever the hell you want to call it. I don’t see what’s so outlandish about that. where did I say Mayfield you are putting words in my mouth there. good try though. okay, thats fine. I wouldn't draft allen at 3 if Rosen and Darnold are gone, and i wouldn't draft mayfield at 3... not my choices. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stark Posted March 22, 2018 Share Posted March 22, 2018 Just now, MaxAF said: I only saw one Wyoming game last year but check out some highlight film on him. He’s got a high ceiling brother. Whoever gets him won’t be sorry. And when we take little Baker we’ll be cursed once again by the QB Gods. dude, you can't seriously start out with " i only saw 1 game, go check out his highlights" thats the problem with allen ... you get the highlight play every once in a while.. then you get a bunch of WTF. Do you go to the draft forum, if you don't maybe you should. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Warfish Posted March 22, 2018 Share Posted March 22, 2018 1 hour ago, Patriot Killa said: dont fall for it. I'd almost prefer a GM who doesn;t go to the combine, doesn't go to pro days, and at most only interviews QB prospects. What matters is their tape. Game tape. Where it counts. Combine #'s and Pro Days should only be excluders.....not causes for rising. I don;t want workout warriors in shorts, I want guys who did it and show they can do it at the next level, in pads, in games. Game tape. IMO of course. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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