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Combine throwing velocity true measure of arm strength.

Jetsbb

By Jetsbb
in NY Jets Forum

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Jetsbb

Jetsbb

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2018

http://www.ourlads.com/story/default/Quarterback-Ball-Velocity-at-2018-NFL-Combine/10241/dh/

2008-2017

http://blogs.ourlads.com/2017/03/16/quarterback-ball-velocity-at-nfl-combine-2008-2015/

Josh Allen broke the record with 62 previously no QB threw better than 60 since they started recording in 2008. Big takeaway is Rosen and Mayfield have excellent upper tier arm strength. Intelligence and proven accuracy is a much bigger asset than having a little better velocity. Mac should not take Allen over Rosen or Mayfield just because of arm strength and size. Rosen and Mayfield actually have rare arm talent themselves.

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Villain The Foe

Villain The Foe

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Good thread. Surprised this got buried. A 62 for Allen is sick. Just unreal. 

Probably surprising to many, Mayfield's 60 is 2nd highest this combine and would have been tops in last years combine which featured Mahomes and 2016 which had Paxton Lynch.  

Mayfield also scored great on the modernized wonderlic as well, putting up the 2nd highest score ever by a qb. 

Over 60 qb's have taken this version since 2012. I would post the article but im on my phone. 

https://www.google.de/amp/s/www.sbnation.com/platform/amp/nfl/2018/3/24/17159640/baker-mayfield-wonderlic-test-draft

I wouldnt be surprised if he's actually drafted 1st overall. 

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Mackman55

Mackman55

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17 minutes ago, Villain The Foe said:

Good thread. Surprised this got buried. A 62 for Allen is sick. Just unreal. 

Probably surprising to many, Mayfield's 60 is 2nd highest this combine and would have been tops in last years combine which featured Mahomes and 2016 which had Paxton Lynch.  

Mayfield also scored great on the modernized wonderlic as well, putting up the 2nd highest score ever by a qb. 

Over 60 qb's have taken this version since 2012. I would post the article but im on my phone. 

https://www.google.de/amp/s/www.sbnation.com/platform/amp/nfl/2018/3/24/17159640/baker-mayfield-wonderlic-test-draft

I wouldnt be surprised if he's actually drafted 1st overall. 

All the metrics clearly point to Mayfield as the best QB in this draft. If he was 6' 4" he wold be the consensus overall number 1 pick without much debate.

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Drums

Drums

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11 minutes ago, JetFaninMI said:

With the 3rd pick in the NFL Draft the New York Jets select Quarterback and Heisman Trophy Winner from the University of Oklahoma, Baker Mayfield. Thats what I'm hoping come draft day.

We should all start accepting this. If it’s not Rosen or Darnold, Mayfield is the guy. He works hard and he’ll be exciting. He will be pissing off fans from other teams for years!

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SayNoToDMC

SayNoToDMC

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24 minutes ago, JetFaninMI said:

With the 3rd pick in the NFL Draft the New York Jets select Quarterback and Heisman Trophy Winner from the University of Oklahoma, Baker Mayfield. Thats what I'm hoping come draft day.

I'm with this. I'm looking at the Joe Namath custom painting on my wall right now. We need a cocky **** with a chip on his shoulder. I'll be sad with anybody else, but supportive.

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jetsons

jetsons

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26 minutes ago, JetFaninMI said:

With the 3rd pick in the NFL Draft the New York Jets select Quarterback and Heisman Trophy Winner from the University of Oklahoma, Baker Mayfield. Thats what I'm hoping come draft day.

Me TOO!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

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jetsons

jetsons

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2 minutes ago, Jetsbb said:

It should be Mayfield or Rosen. We have a bad GM who has proven to be incompetent in evaluating QB's so expect Josh Allen.

I agree... which is SO SAD....  we have a GM who Can't judge talent & a HC who Can't coach it up...  I feel like 1 of the toys on misfit island.  :/

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56mehl56

56mehl56

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1 hour ago, SayNoToDMC said:

The Raiders took Russel cause he could throw through the uprights from his knees 50 yards out. It doesn't matter how big or strong your arm is if you can't throw it into an NFL sized window. Josh Allen is going to be a disaster. 

A natural disaster that takes the NFL by storm. 

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jetsons

jetsons

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Combine throwing velocity true measure of arm strength...

They should actually make that part of the combine... not just throwing the heck out the ball without caring where it goes but throwing hard AND as accurate as you can... would be pretty interesting.

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SenorGato

SenorGato

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1 hour ago, Jetsbb said:

It should be Mayfield or Rosen. We have a bad GM who has proven to be incompetent in evaluating QB's so expect Josh Allen.

Top 20 seasons by DVOA and/or DYAR from a Jets QB in 3 years under McGM : 2

Top 20 seasons from a Jets QB in the previous 15 seasons: 1

Top 10 passing offenses under McGM in 3 seasons: 1

Top 10 passing offenses the previous 15 years: 1

Obviously this is a pretty low standard, but I see progress for a franchise that has consistently ranked in the bottom ten of QB play the past two decades. Getting a QB more than a decade younger than the guys they've fielded, and with a top 3 pick in a 3 QB draft it's most likely coming, will go a long way towards fixing what actually ails this franchise.  I don't particularly like or recognize McGM and friends yet, but I'm pretty optimistic the Jets' setup by the time the Cubs are down winning another WS in late October will be a good one. 

Suuuuure would be nice to find a good RB to go with this QB they haven't drafted yet. I'm liking Royce Freeman. Need someone to carry the offense this year since I don't expect a rookie QB to do all that without some luck. 

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detectivekimble

detectivekimble

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3 hours ago, Villain The Foe said:

Good thread. Surprised this got buried. A 62 for Allen is sick. Just unreal. 

Probably surprising to many, Mayfield's 60 is 2nd highest this combine and would have been tops in last years combine which featured Mahomes and 2016 which had Paxton Lynch.  

Mayfield also scored great on the modernized wonderlic as well, putting up the 2nd highest score ever by a qb. 

Over 60 qb's have taken this version since 2012. I would post the article but im on my phone. 

https://www.google.de/amp/s/www.sbnation.com/platform/amp/nfl/2018/3/24/17159640/baker-mayfield-wonderlic-test-draft

I wouldnt be surprised if he's actually drafted 1st overall. 

I have no idea how good he'll be, but there is absolutely no reason to pass on this guy (assuming Darnold is gone).  He's got a strong arm, he's accurate, and smart.  Why would you not take your chances on a guy with those three things?

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win4ever

win4ever

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I'll have an article on Mayfield next week or so, but he really impressed at the combine.  I expected a weak arm guy with great accuracy but he threw it better than Rosen in terms of accuracy and touch.  I wouldn't mind it one bit if he's the pick at 3.  

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Villain The Foe

Villain The Foe

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2 hours ago, kelticwizard said:

It's interesting that Russel Wilson threw the ball at 55 while Andy Dalton the previous year threw it at 56.  Yet Dalton is known as having a soft arm and Wilson's arm is considered average-to-good.

I think that some folks are just not really good test takers. Two guys who stand out to me is this year in Lamar Jackson and a few years back in Mike Glennon. Both scored a 49 in the velocity test yet both can throw the ball down field with ease. In the case with Lamar, his arm is even bigger. This is a guy who flicks with his wrists. Imagine putting his entire body behind a throw. 

The 49 score for Lamar was an absolute surprise to me. I would have thought that of all of the other QB's behind Allen it would have been Lamar with the 2nd biggest arm. I thought that it would have been Allen, Lamar, Mayfield. 

Lamar's arm on the field is legit, that 49 is basically a bad test. Sometimes that happens. 

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Villain The Foe

Villain The Foe

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15 hours ago, Mackman55 said:

All the metrics clearly point to Mayfield as the best QB in this draft. If he was 6' 4" he wold be the consensus overall number 1 pick without much debate.

This is a good point. Folks who are making his height "a thing" is totally missing the QB that is Baker. This is not just a guy who's doing well during pro days, combines and wonderlic's. Many continue to forget that he's been the best QB by far statistically. The freaky thing about it is, he's gotten better every year. So not only is he also showing that he's the better performer on the field, but his year-to-year performance is pointing upwards. 

Baker set an NCAA record for efficiency in 2016, he comes back the next season and breaks his own record, and he's doing this in an offense that's designed to throw the ball all over the place. For a guy who is considered a gun slinger and a risk taker, the guy rarely turns the ball over (just 5 INT's). And this kinda rubs in the face the critics that talk about all of these screen passes when the breakdowns show that Mayfield threw screens 23% of the time but he threw passes that had 10 yards or more of air under it from the LOS 42% of the time. He's throwing for a 1st down almost half the time. His over 11+ yards per attempt supports that fact actually 

 

If Baker was 3 inches taller and folks liked his version of confidence people would be talking about him being the best prospect since Andrew Luck. The "translating to the NFL" is a bit tiresome. The head coaches in this league are getting younger and more and more of the college concepts are being introduced to the NFL level in order to make the transition much smoother for their QB's. Shotgun is being ran about 70% of the time.

The NFL has been changing for years, and it's just not at the RB or LB spots now, but QB's are asked these days to do the impossible in order to compensate for deficiencies in the offense. Russell Wilson has been in the league for years and they've not only refused to fix that offensive line but they've traded away the best Olinemen they've had...ironically to teams like the Saints where for years Drew Brees was essentially going through the same thing before they began addressing the Offensive line more consistently in order to provide him with a rushing attack (Something that Wilson doesn't have). 

Mayfield is more Drew Brees than he's ever been Johnny Football. Manziel came from an A&M squad that had a very solid offensive line and Manziel was throwing to Mike Evans. I've heard folks last year talk about how Mayfield had a complete NFL cast supporting him (primarily because of Joe Mixon). Well, the highest draft spot of that Sooners draft class was Mixon who went in the 2nd round. Dede Westbrook wasn't a top 15 pick like Mike Evans but he was a 3rd round pick instead, and he was Mayfield's top target. That reminds me a lot of Drew Brees, a guy who has five 5,000+ yard seasons and not one of his WR's have ever been pro bowlers. This current season with all of Mayfield's "NFL Caliber supporting cast" now playing in the pros, Mayfield found a way not to just take his team further, and win more games during the season, but he became an even more efficient passer breaking his own NCAA record, threw less INT's and did this with a bunch of underclassmen and a suspect offensive line in comparison to Texas A&M during the Manziel years. This year we hear a lot about Mayfield's size or not being the top QB, but one thing that we dont hear anymore of is how he did all of this with a bunch of NFL caliber players. That entire OU offense was built on underclassmen this past season. 

There's so much to like about this kid as a QB its an embarrassment that he's being overlooked because of his height and his confidence in himself...a confidence that he backed up every step of the way. Some point to that Georgia linebacker telling Baker to "humble himself" but what folks missed about that is that that Linebacker was a starter on a defense that allowed only 16ppg scored against them on the season. Baker Mayfield put up 48 points and it took 2OT's for Georgia to beat the kid. When does the "he's short and cocky" excuses stop and the performance start kicking into play here?  

 

He's a bad ass and if he's there at 3 it's a no brainer. 

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JetFaninMI

JetFaninMI

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Not to throw water on this thread because I want the Jets to take Mayfield but remember when Deshaun Watson's velocity was questioned? His velocity measured out at 45 and a lot of guys cited that as a reason not to draft him. Well he proved he could sling it pretty well before he was injured and showed that while it maybe an important test it could be misleading. I wanted the Jets to draft Watson last year as much as I want them to draft Mayfield this year so I'm not saying the test is irrelevant but it should not be the measuring stick for success at the Pro level.

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FidelioJet

FidelioJet

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12 hours ago, SayNoToDMC said:

The Raiders took Russel cause he could throw through the uprights from his knees 50 yards out. It doesn't matter how big or strong your arm is if you can't throw it into an NFL sized window. Josh Allen is going to be a disaster. 

Josh Allen can thrown into an NFL sized window - and he does it ALL the time - in fact he had to much more than the others because his recievers weren't open. 

He's inconsistent and misses throwns on occasion- which he needs to clean up and is working on - but if you watch him and what makes him such an interesting prospect is that he does hit very tight spots all the time and fires the ball in to these tight windows - which is EXACTLY what the NFL game requires...

you have a short period of time when a receiver is barely open - and that's when you need a QB who can fire the ball into that spot.  He can and does just that...

He just needs to get a bit more consistent.  If he cleans up some of those simple mistakes he's going to be an amazing pro...

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JustInFudge

JustInFudge

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OMG!!!!!! ENOUGH ALREADY WITH OURLADS SCOUTING!!!!!!!!!!!!

This isnt a real thing.  Nothing about this data is valid.   This isnt an event at the combine.  No QB is trying to throw their fast ball.  These are bloggers sitting the stands with a radar gun trying to clock velocity from a hundred yards away.  The QB's are not worried about their fast ball. They're focused on footwork, mechanics, timing and ball placement.  They're not out their trying to impress Ourlads Scouting Services with their fast ball.  Nobody cares about this.  It isnt a thing, it isnt real.  This isnt a controlled environment.  It's not pitching where the distance never changes and the target doesnt move.

We went over this last year with Watson and now we're still giving these ****ers the time of day? It's not real.  Stop. 

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Gangrene

Gangrene

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Athletic Intelligence Quotient 

How come Baker Mayfield is the only qb in this years draft that has his AIQ number leaked ? Did his people put it out their given how high he scored ?  If I am belonging to the number 1 rated AIQ qb in the draft I would probably release  mine  since it is rated higher than Mayfield's.

The obvious guess is Rosen might be the highest AIQ but who knows ?

In past years the Wonderlics always managed to leak to the press, it would be nice to know where the other qbs in the draft measure up on the AIQ scale.

As we all know high intelligence scores do not guarantee success (cough,FitzMagic..cough) but on the law of averages it appears that if a qb has sufficent athletic gifts combined with high intelligence to be more right than wrong as an indicator.

In 2016 Wentz scored 40, Goff scored 36... they only two qbs of that draft class to currently have a starting gig in the NFL.

Intelligence Score of the other starting qb's in the NFL

Matt Ryan  32

Andrew Luck 37

Eli Manning 39

Tom Brady 33

Philip Rivers 30

Alex Smith 40

Sam Bradford 36

Aaron Rogers 35

Dak Prescott 25

Russell Wilson 28

Jamis Winston 27

Ryan Tannehill 34

Blake Bortles 28

Matthew Stafford 38

Josh McCown 30

Andy Dalton 29

Cam Newton 21

Tyrod Taylor 15

Derek Carr 20

Joe Flacco 27

Marcus Mariota 33

Kirk Cousins 33

Mitchell Trubisky  25

Case Keenum N/A

Jimmy Garrapolo 29

 

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FidelioJet

FidelioJet

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54 minutes ago, JiF said:

OMG!!!!!! ENOUGH ALREADY WITH OURLADS SCOUTING!!!!!!!!!!!!

This isnt a real thing.  Nothing about this data is valid.   This isnt an event at the combine.  No QB is trying to throw their fast ball.  These are bloggers sitting the stands with a radar gun trying to clock velocity from a hundred yards away.  The QB's are not worried about their fast ball. They're focused on footwork, mechanics, timing and ball placement.  They're not out their trying to impress Ourlads Scouting Services with their fast ball.  Nobody cares about this.  It isnt a thing, it isnt real.  This isnt a controlled environment.  It's not pitching where the distance never changes and the target doesnt move.

We went over this last year with Watson and now we're still giving these ****ers the time of day? It's not real.  Stop. 

I would be interested to really get a sense of Mayfield's arm though - there seems to be this persistent theme that he has a very average arm - could be ignorance or could be real.

When I first read the ourlads report a week ago (when I thought it was a real thing from the combine) I thought Mayfield was a no brainer to draft.  At 6 feet, if you have a cannon like that ourlads article indicated him being a bit short almost wouldn't matter.

But if his arm is average - his size becomes even a bigger issue.  

Not saying you know - but how do the scouts judge arm strength?...I mean they measure everything else - it is surprising they don't put these guys on a radar gun. Or do they?

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Untouchable

Untouchable

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1 hour ago, JiF said:

OMG!!!!!! ENOUGH ALREADY WITH OURLADS SCOUTING!!!!!!!!!!!!

This isnt a real thing.  Nothing about this data is valid.   This isnt an event at the combine.  No QB is trying to throw their fast ball.  These are bloggers sitting the stands with a radar gun trying to clock velocity from a hundred yards away.  The QB's are not worried about their fast ball. They're focused on footwork, mechanics, timing and ball placement.  They're not out their trying to impress Ourlads Scouting Services with their fast ball.  Nobody cares about this.  It isnt a thing, it isnt real.  This isnt a controlled environment.  It's not pitching where the distance never changes and the target doesnt move.

We went over this last year with Watson and now we're still giving these ****ers the time of day? It's not real.  Stop. 

Thank you

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