peebag Posted March 27, 2018 Share Posted March 27, 2018 49 minutes ago, Warfish said: Serious answer: Because live-fire games are not practice. One can excel in one, and not the other. Because the crucible of live fire can change a player, and allow him a means of development practice reps as the #3 QB do not. Because even in failure, that failure would have been more enjoyable and more productive than watching a 38 year old journeyman win 5 games. Because as a 2nd round pick, you have to at least give the kid a shot. Especially if the alternatives were what they were. We didn't. Yes, I'd agree with that. In our case, it's warranted. Our Head Coach and GM have simply not shown themselves to be the best evaluators of talent, have they? They picked Hack after all, so they do not get credit for sitting him because he's "bad" AND trust of the fanbase to pick the next QB because they can evaluate talent, can they? The investment put into him, yes. A sin for which Macc should have been fired, frankly. Not rewarded with the ability to pick the QB of our next half-decade. We simply do not know that today. We know he sucks in practice, and wasn't better than McCown in that area and didn't "give the Jets the best chance to win" as Bowles sees it. That's the extent of what we know for sure. Respectfully agree to disagree. McCown can't play either. Never has been able to. A career long loser. One of the worst starting QB's in recent NFL history. We KNOW he sure as hell "can't play", he has a resume long than my arm proving it. We gained absolutely nothing playing this (by all accounts) nice guy. So you're going to have a hard time using "sucks" as an excuse to not play Hack, when the starter we have is amongst the worst to ever start as many games as he has. A 38 year old JAG journeyman of no material special talent. And we not only wasted a whole year playing that 38 year old, we've now doubled down and invested 10 million, vastly more than any other team would have, to have this 29 year old man as our QB again in 2019, barring the rise of Teddy Bridgewater. So forgive me if I question Macc and Bowles judgement at the QB position. It's is well document at this point to be rather sh*t. So no, I don't trust them to make a call on Hack without seeing for myself in live-fire than Hack does, in fact, suck. I have no doubt the odds favor hack sucking. Make no mistake. But I wanted to see it, in a game that counts. THIS is why not playing Hack as the last two seasons wound down was such a colossal failing by our Head Coach. Hack has had a chance to prove himself and he hasn't. He was a mistake as a draft pick and it's a mistake to retain him. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Maxman Posted March 27, 2018 Share Posted March 27, 2018 49 minutes ago, JiF said: ie: didnt know how to get him on the field so it was better for him to sign somewhere else. wtf? You are tiring me out. He wouldn't have started here over either of the safeties. The Jets know how they would have used him. He wants something different. You can spin this all you want, but Bowles didn't say what you said he said. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Warfish Posted March 27, 2018 Share Posted March 27, 2018 3 minutes ago, UntouchableCrew said: So basically your attitude is "I, Warfish, didn't see it with my own two eyes so it isn't valid." Can't really do much with that. Given the track record of this GM and Head Coach? God damn right that my position, and it should be the position of ANY person of moderate intelligence who can look at this era of failure and poor decision making and say "it's clearly not good enough". Tell me my friend, what was GAINED by playing Josh McClown last year? What good did it do this franchise and it's future? What would we have LOST had we played hack from day one of 2017 instead? A few whiny players whining? What else? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bitonti Posted March 27, 2018 Share Posted March 27, 2018 25 minutes ago, afjetsfan said: Not sure if anyone actually thinks Todd is a good head coach, but if anyone reading this actually does think he is good, please if you could refute my concerns with his coaching I'd greatly appreciate it. Maybe I'm just missing something. 1. Todd has failed to get the team ready week in and week out, some weeks they look hot, some weeks they look completely unprepared. 2. He still doesn't know when to be aggressive and when to be conservative during the game or how to make in-game adjustments or manage the game clock/time outs. Pretty much anything a head coach is supposed to do during the game, he sucks at. 3. He is a poor communicator, part of the reason he hates talking to the media. 4. Oh and the small fact that we don't win many games with him at the helm. If he can't fix these problems, why should we continue to support him? Todd Bowles got 5 wins out of a 0 win roster, that's how depleted last year's depth chart was on most teams the only guys that would have started are the 2 safeties and Leonard Williams. Maybe Beachum, ASJ or Claiborne. But it wasn't pretty. This roster is significantly better even before the draft He's a legit branch of the Parcells coaching tree and if we are being completely honest no one you or I has ever heard of wants this job Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Warfish Posted March 27, 2018 Share Posted March 27, 2018 I am literally stunned how many people who are white knighting Bowles and Macc after they spent a 2nd Round pick on a QB, then utterly failed to develop him, then refused to ever play him, and now (seemingly) will cut him without ever having played a single snap.....and think of all that that not playing him makes all this somehow a sign a good sound team management. There are no words. Defense of the utterly indefensible. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bugg Posted March 27, 2018 Share Posted March 27, 2018 1 minute ago, UntouchableCrew said: So basically your attitude is "I, Warfish, didn't see it with my own two eyes so it isn't valid." Can't really do much with that. No, simply there was no point to playing McCown last season and lots of reasons to find out if Hackenberg or Petty could play at all. That's objectively unvarnished truth. May be they would have sucked, we barely know about Petty, we know nothing about Hackenberg. Do those 5 wins give you great comfort? Basically we "gained' the right to have to trade up when we could have been at 3 or better without the trade with a better idea if either may be part of the future here. Further Bowles was ear to ear last draft about safeties, Adams over Mahomes or Watson. In part it's Woody Johnson's fault; every HC spare Mangini(different issues) has been a defense first fake tough guy pretending he can win NFL games 10-6. The rules beg you to pass and pretty much mean defense is going to fail several times each game. And the jets keep hiringThat Guy who bucks the industry trend and fails. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
UntouchableCrew Posted March 27, 2018 Share Posted March 27, 2018 Just now, Warfish said: Given the track record of this GM and Head Coach? God damn right that my position, and it should be the position of ANY person of moderate intelligence who can look at this era of failure and poor decision making and say "it's clearly not good enough". Tell me my friend, what was GAINED by playing Josh McClown last year? What good did it do this franchise and it's future? What would we have LOST had we played hack from day one of 2017 instead? A few whiny players whining? What else? Hard to know because most of what was gained or would have been lost is intangible. But I think your attitude of "who cares if the players revolt, trot the guy who simply cannot play out there every week" is preposterously naive. You may think the culture and attitude of the players is irrelevant but that's clearly not the case among most people who work in the NFL. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bugg Posted March 27, 2018 Share Posted March 27, 2018 3 minutes ago, bitonti said: Todd Bowles got 5 wins out of a 0 win roster, that's how depleted last year's depth chart was on most teams the only guys that would have started are the 2 safeties and Leonard Williams. Maybe Beachum, ASJ or Claiborne. But it wasn't pretty. This roster is significantly better even before the draft He's a legit branch of the Parcells coaching tree and if we are being completely honest no one you or I has ever heard of wants this job Disagree with everything but the bolded. And that has to do with the owner. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
UntouchableCrew Posted March 27, 2018 Share Posted March 27, 2018 1 minute ago, Bugg said: No, simply there was no point to playing McCown last season and lots of reasons to find out if Hackenberg or Petty could play at all. That's objectively unvarnished truth. May be they would have sucked, we barely know about Petty, we know nothing about Hackenberg. See, I just don't think this is true. This is not a scenario where we simply don't know. We do know. Bryce Petty sucks and will never be an NFL starter. Christian Hackenberg sucks and will never be an NFL QB. We wasted draft picks on both of them. We didn't sign McCown hoping he'd be the starter. We signed him hoping we wouldn't have to play him because Christian Hackenberg would take a huge leap forward and give the team ANY reason to play him. McCown literally sat out of the entire preseason after the opening possession to give these two scrubs every chance to prove themselves. They failed because they suck and aren't NFL caliber talents. If your argument is purely that we should have deliberately started awful players in an effort to tank (and doing so would have saved us three 2nd round picks) I think there's some merit to that argument even if it may have had debilitating effects on the locker room. But this argument that "we don't know for sure" what we have in Hackenberg is lunacy. We do know what we have -- a total bust and complete failure who will never start an NFL game. Anybody who is unsure of that at this point is delusional. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Warfish Posted March 27, 2018 Share Posted March 27, 2018 9 minutes ago, UntouchableCrew said: Hard to know because most of what was gained or would have been lost is intangible. But I think your attitude of "who cares if the players revolt, trot the guy who simply cannot play out there every week" is preposterously naive. You may think the culture and attitude of the players is irrelevant but that's clearly not the case among most people who work in the NFL. The culture and attitude of the players IS irrelevant. If the players here are truly driving depth chart decisions, we are the worst run franchise in the NFL. If we refused to play a 2nd round draft pick QB because of fear the players would "revolt", we are the worst run franchise in the NFL. Teams play young QB's all the time, sink or swim. But not us. Because something something "players revolt". We can instead start a 38 year old nobody, one of teh worst starting QB's to play the game in the last few decades, and THAT.....that is ok. Commendable even. Give ol' Coach Bowles a pat on the back for starting the old nobody and winning 5 whole games! The Herm Edwards BBQ Era was long a joke in Jetsfansland, but it seems now with Bowles it's infected even the fans......players happiness first, the good of the franchise and it's future drop dead last now, eh? Oh, and pass the Ribs. Yum! McClown and all his "intangible" benefits? **** me sideways that's such a laughable concept. Intangibled us to 5 wins. Woo hoo! There are days I think this fanbase deserves the smelly old sh*t sandwich we get served every year. Some of you so eagerly eat it up at every opportunity.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JetFaninMI Posted March 27, 2018 Share Posted March 27, 2018 Dont know if this was posted but here's some more from Todd Bowles via Cimini: Jets coach Todd Bowles praises Baker Mayfield ahead of draft play 11:58 AM ET Rich CiminiESPN Staff Writer k nt Incumbent Josh McCown will go into training camp as the New York Jets' No. 1 quarterback, coach Todd Bowles confirmed Tuesday. The real drama surrounds the identity of his heir apparent. Holding the third pick in the draft, the Jets are expected to select a quarterback. One of the options is the polarizing Baker Mayfield, whom Bowles praised at the NFL meetings in Orlando, Florida. "You see the player, and you see the play," Bowles told reporters. "You know the guy can play football, and he's a competitor." The Jets' top decision makers gave the Heisman Trophy winner a private workout last Saturday in Oklahoma, two days after working out UCLA's Josh Rosen. They're headed to Wyoming next week for a private session with Josh Allen. All four top quarterbacks, including USC's Sam Darnold, are expected to make a pre-draft visit to the Jets' facility. The Jets, who obtained the third pick in a blockbuster trade with the Indianapolis Colts on St. Patrick's Day, are on the verge of a franchise-altering decision. Bowles said he gets suggestions from fans every time he goes out in public. "I've heard bring Joe Namath back," he said. Bowles is known as a disciplinarian, yet he didn't seem to be bothered by Mayfield's flag-planting, crotch-grabbing antics in college. "It's college football," he said. "He's an emotional guy. I've seen T.O. [Terrell Owens] do a lot of things. I've seen worse than that. Players get excited when they play." Bowles laughed when asked if teams sometimes have to help players such as Mayfield mature in the NFL. "Have you seen our touchdown dances from the league?" he asked. "People bowling people over? Really? It's kind of right up his alley, isn't it?" Mayfield measured a shade under 6-foot-1 at the scouting combine, but that doesn't seem to concern Bowles. He mentioned Russell Wilson and Fran Tarkenton as undersized quarterbacks who succeeded in the league. Bowles also said the team will perform due diligence on Mayfield's arrest last year for public intoxication, disorderly conduct and fleeing a police officer. The Jets have six or seven players they're considering with the third pick, according to Bowles, who said they will narrow it down as the draft gets closer. At quarterback, they also have Teddy Bridgewater, Christian Hackenberg and Bryce Petty. Bridgewater, who recently signed a one-year, $6 million contract, is a question mark because he's attempting to return from a devastating knee injury that robbed him of almost two full seasons. Hackenberg, a former second-round pick, once was considered a possible heir apparent. Not anymore. Bowles issued a cool assessment of Hackenberg, who has yet to play in the regular season. Asked where Hackenberg stands in the pecking order, Bowles said, "He's a quarterback on our team. Everybody is subject to competition, earning a job or not earning a job." Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
UntouchableCrew Posted March 27, 2018 Share Posted March 27, 2018 1 minute ago, Warfish said: The culture and attitude of the players IS irrelevant. Spoken like someone who's never played or followed team sports... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Charlie Brown Posted March 27, 2018 Share Posted March 27, 2018 2 hours ago, MDL_JET said: And then there's Hue Jackson...just thought this was funny. I'm not saying that we should be taking Mayfield; but one thing I do know is that Mayfield is a winner and he knows how to get the Millennials to follow him; which is going to bigger and bigger, in my mind for teams going forward. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Charlie Brown Posted March 27, 2018 Share Posted March 27, 2018 1 hour ago, C Mart said: Rich Cimini @RichCimini Bowles on the Honey Badger: "You can never have enough good football players. I know how I would’ve used him, but ... he has a chance to go start. We just got two young safeties the year before, so that would’ve been tough for him to come here." #Jets Thank you!! It is as if people keep posting the opposite of what was said and the truth somehow that will make it so..... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pointman Posted March 27, 2018 Share Posted March 27, 2018 25 minutes ago, Warfish said: I am literally stunned how many people who are white knighting Bowles and Macc after they spent a 2nd Round pick on a QB, then utterly failed to develop him, then refused to ever play him, and now (seemingly) will cut him without ever having played a single snap.....and think of all that that not playing him makes all this somehow a sign a good sound team management. There are no words. Defense of the utterly indefensible. People defending that? I have heard him get killed about it to the point where it makes me dry heave and thats with me agreeing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ZachEY Posted March 27, 2018 Share Posted March 27, 2018 17 minutes ago, Warfish said: Stories abound of players who were meh in practice and solid in games. But like anything, they're mostly stories, not verifiable (since none of us are in any sports or teams practices). McCown was a tank. I don't see the difference you're making between playing one of the worst starting QB's in NFL history and a 2nd Round Pick QB you need to see in live-fire. Oh **** off with that, seriously. McCown can play, holy hell, have our acceptance of dogsh*t suck this far? He was horrible last year, like every year he's ever played near abouts, yet all I've heard is how "good" he was. Bullsh*t. He was horrid. Winning what, 10% of his starts along the way? Yep, sure can play! Because Bowles loves old veteran QB's he can start, because they suit his all-Defense, no-risk-on-Offense, win 6-3 coaching style. Then I can't take you seriously, it's been one mistake after another since they day the two arrived. Well, once they're gone from here, we'll see if either ever get equivalent work again. I don't think they will. Don't be sorry for me. Be sorry for the Head Coach and GM you appear to be white knighting for not bothering to even actually play their 2nd Round Draft Pick QB. Meh is different than incompetence. We've yet to see Meh from Hackenberg. What we've seen is complete incompetence. You can curse me off all you like, only makes you look childish... The fact is, not just Mac and Bowles, but multiple GM coach combinations have turned to McCown. They all know less about football than you? McCown continues to be given starts because at the fundamental level, he knows what he's doing. His record is terrible in large part because he's an option for teams that don't have a chance at winning, but also don't currently have anyone competent on the roster. Don't take me seriously if you don't want to. But, that doesn't do anything to change the fact that Bowles, as I stated, has played the only QBs who merit being on the roster. Mac has failed at this position from day 1, I've stated that numerous times, but you can't blame Bowles for the fact that he's been given crap at the position. The only scenario in which you'd be right here is if Hackenberg magically became a decent QB, despite not being able to complete passes under less challenging circumstances than live bullets. It's fantasy. Huff and puff and curse and whine as you've done above, but in the end, your solution is little more than anger and fantasy. None of that makes Todd Bowles a good coach, but that's never been the point of my comments. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Warfish Posted March 27, 2018 Share Posted March 27, 2018 11 minutes ago, UntouchableCrew said: Spoken like someone who's never played or followed team sports... Anytime you want to compare our respective team sports careers my friend, I'm happy to do so. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pointman Posted March 27, 2018 Share Posted March 27, 2018 It would have been funny if we brought in the Honey Badger, and after all of Jamal's lobbying for it, if Jamal had to come off the bench for dime packages while Badger took his spot. haha Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ZachEY Posted March 27, 2018 Share Posted March 27, 2018 59 minutes ago, afjetsfan said: Not sure if anyone actually thinks Todd is a good head coach, but if anyone reading this actually does think he is good, please if you could refute my concerns with his coaching I'd greatly appreciate it. Maybe I'm just missing something. 1. Todd has failed to get the team ready week in and week out, some weeks they look hot, some weeks they look completely unprepared. 2. He still doesn't know when to be aggressive and when to be conservative during the game or how to make in-game adjustments or manage the game clock/time outs. Pretty much anything a head coach is supposed to do during the game, he sucks at. 3. He is a poor communicator, part of the reason he hates talking to the media. 4. Oh and the small fact that we don't win many games with him at the helm. If he can't fix these problems, why should we continue to support him? Todd Bowles can be BOTH not a good head coach AND improperly blamed for the current situation of the team. 1. This is nonsense narrative that Jets fans love. Jets fans love to describe any losses as "coming out flat," an egocentric viewpoint wherein the Jets either win, or they were not prepared. What that means is that the Jets never actually get beaten. Teams aren't ever really better. There's just wins or poor prep. The truth is, the Jets lost a lot of football games this year because a lot of teams were far more talented than them. 2. This is a meaningful and realistic criticism. Some people think when the team is bad, you have to be more aggressive. Todd's approach seems to be that because the team is bad, lets try to keep it close and sneak it out. It's really not that crazy. 3. You really don't know this. Is Bill Belichick a "poor communicator?" Because his interviews are worse. And, before anyone says anything about Belichick's track record, we're purely talking about communication skills based on what we see in the media. 4. Agreed, but how many wins would you have projected the 2017 Jets for with Belichick as coach. Would we have won 10 games with the same roster? Again, none of these mean Bowles is a good coach, they just mean that the criticism of him is overblown. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Warfish Posted March 27, 2018 Share Posted March 27, 2018 10 minutes ago, TeddEY said: Meh is different than incompetence. We've yet to see Meh from Hackenberg. What we've seen is complete incompetence. We've not seen anything besides a few preseason snaps. Again, I don;t disagree that the outcome was heavily favored to be "wow, he sucks". The argument is the respective gain of playing an old, JAG like McCown vs. a 2nd Round Draft Pick Investment. And no, McCown is not as good a QB as you paint him to be. Not even close, he is, without question, one of the worst starting QB's on the past 20 years. The numbers in this case simply do not lie. He's a loser. And last year's pathetic 5-win season was by far his best effort in recent years, if not his entire career. And it got us....5 wins. Quote The fact is, not just Mac and Bowles, but multiple GM coach combinations have turned to McCown. And how many games, divisons and titles did they win for those decisions? Quote They all know less about football than you? McCown continues to be given starts because at the fundamental level, he knows what he's doing. His record is terrible in large part because he's an option for teams that don't have a chance at winning, but also don't currently have anyone competent on the roster. Don't take me seriously if you don't want to. Why would anyone take seriously a guy who thinks starting McCown is a brilliant decision that couldn't have been bested via any other choice? Quote But, that doesn't do anything to change the fact that Bowles, as I stated, has played the only QBs who merit being on the roster. Mac has failed at this position from day 1, I've stated that numerous times, but you can't blame Bowles for the fact that he's been given crap at the position. I can and I do. I blame Macc for drafting him, and Bowles for failing to develop or do anything with him. Of course, I'm on record that I'd have fired both men this offseason, so....yeah. I don't trust that they can or should be picking the next QB, given their record picking QB previously. But you seem to support the idea, because of how smart they were to not play Hack after they spent a #2 pick on him I guess.... Quote The only scenario in which you'd be right here is if Hackenberg magically became a decent QB, despite not being able to complete passes under less challenging circumstances than live bullets. It's fantasy. Almost assuredly is, I agree. Quote Huff and puff and curse and whine as you've done above, but in the end, your solution is little more than anger and fantasy. My solution is to play the QB you draft with a 2nd round pick, and not sign and start a worthless veteran journeyman who struggles to win anything at all, and whose presense serves no purpose for the future of this franchise whatsoever. No rocket science really. Give an ultra conservative defensive-minded head coach an excuse, and he'll happily play the conservative, under performing but lower turnover potential old man journeyman, and screw the kid. Because it's better for him, personally, as he sees it. Quote None of that makes Todd Bowles a good coach, but that's never been the point of my comments. Todd Bowles is not a good coach. But you certainly seem to be white knighting him awful hard, so maybe you in fact do think he's a good head coach. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ZachEY Posted March 27, 2018 Share Posted March 27, 2018 18 minutes ago, Warfish said: We've not seen anything besides a few preseason snaps. Again, I don;t disagree that the outcome was heavily favored to be "wow, he sucks". The argument is the respective gain of playing an old, JAG like McCown vs. a 2nd Round Draft Pick Investment. And no, McCown is not as good a QB as you paint him to be. Not even close, he is, without question, one of the worst starting QB's on the past 20 years. Funny, I've never used to word "good" to describe McCown. I've used the word competent. If you deny he's at least competent, that's on you, because again, multiple teams over multiple years disagree. Competent does not equal good. 18 minutes ago, Warfish said: And how many games, divisons and titles did they win for those decisions? None. As stated, no team in the position to win division titles or anything meaningful has had to start McCown. They turn to him when they have no viable option, to avoid having a guy that can't go out there at all. 18 minutes ago, Warfish said: Why would anyone take seriously a guy who thinks starting McCown is a brilliant decision that couldn't have been bested via any other choice? When did I say brilliant decision? Use control-F if you like, should be easy to find. This is simply a reducio ad absurdism argument you've completely invented. 18 minutes ago, Warfish said: I can and I do. I blame Macc for drafting him, and Bowles for failing to develop or do anything with him. of course, I'm on record that I'd have fired both men this offseason, so....yeah. I mean, of course you can. You can do anything. Doesn't mean it follows any real logic. You can't develop crap. Guys can play or they can't. Coaching can make them a little better, but ultimately, the reason Hackenberg isn't a good QB is because he was never a good QB and was never going to be a good QB. I'd have fired them both last year, so this isn't exactly some ahead of the curve heroic viewpoint you've taken. But, you know, pat yourself on the back all you like. 18 minutes ago, Warfish said: My solution is to play the QB you draft with a 2nd round pick, and not sign and start a worthless veteran journeyman who struggles to win anything at all, and whose presense serves no purpose for the future of this franchise whatsoever. No rocket science really. Give an ultra conservative defensive-minded head coach an excuse, and he'll happily play the conservative, under performing but lower turnover potential old man journeyman, and screw the kid. Because it's better for him, personally, as he sees it. We know. We've heard you. In fact, that was the plan, as they gave him the lion share of the preseason reps. The problem is, when they did, he was complete garbage. Not just bad, but completely incapable. He was a wasted 2nd round pick, and again, the only reason to play him is because he exists. Bowles isn't a complete moron, despite the narrative, he and everyone else knows that the best thing for the Jets, and everyone else, would be for Hackenberg to go out there, and even if he struggled, show some promise at all. That would have given them something to sell to the fans and ownership as far as hope. Your argument would have to be that Bowles thought that 4-6 wins with McCown was better for his career than 2-4 wins with Hackenberg, but some upside. That's imaginary nonsense to support an already determined conclusion. 18 minutes ago, Warfish said: Todd Bowles is not a good coach. But you certainly seem to be white knighting him awful hard, so maybe you in fact do think he's a good head coach. It's just that I'm capable of critical thinking. Bowles has not done a good job, but the mountains of blame he's gotten for the fact that he's been given one of the least talented rosters in the NFL is silly. Here's a novel concept that doesn't require any magical thinking at all. The Jets are a bad football team because they are filled largely of bad players who would not be starting or on the roster of most other NFL teams. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ASH1962 Posted March 27, 2018 Share Posted March 27, 2018 6 hours ago, LIJetsFan said: Since we seem to be committed to MacBowles for the next couple of years I've been praying to the football gods that both of them learn and grow into their jobs. Go Jets! Well you can pray in one hand and crap in the other and see which gets filled first. No shot with this idiot as HC and, I wonder if we can ever really groom a real l legit QB with this moron in charge. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Warfish Posted March 27, 2018 Share Posted March 27, 2018 13 minutes ago, TeddEY said: Here's a novel concept that doesn't require any magical thinking at all. The Jets are a bad football team because they are filled largely of bad players who would not be starting or on the roster of most other NFL teams. The Jets are a bad football team because they are poorly managed from the front office (personnel), and poorly coached by an inept and generationally misplaced head coach (on field). But lets agree to disagree, because I don't want to waste another second debating a guy who seems to think Josh McCown is a legit NFL starting QB and that it's ok to draft a QB in the 2nd then never give that QB a single regular season snap over multiple years. You're entitled to those view, I'm entitled to think your views are foolish (and vice versa). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jack48 Posted March 27, 2018 Share Posted March 27, 2018 1 hour ago, afjetsfan said: Exactly. I've never watched the Jets and thought to myself "we are playing a better team, but Todd will find a way for us to win." I feel that way bout teams we are equal with, 1 hour ago, afjetsfan said: Ultimately, Todd's true test will be when he gets another chance with another team. First, will a team be willing to give him that chance, and will he be able to learn from his mistakes with the Jets? My hunch is no team will give him a Head Coach position after he is off the Jets. He'll probably just go back and be a DC and do ok. I agree. No reason to give him another shot. He aspires to be ordinary and fails to accomplish even that Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jet Nut Posted March 27, 2018 Share Posted March 27, 2018 7 hours ago, Warfish said: **** his teammates if they're "insulted". They're paid professionals ffs. I'm tired of the "we have to manage the franchise and it's future to the most base expectations of the whiniest players" mentality of this Bowles Era. Fact not in evidence. Once again, Bowles and his QB staff have simply not earned the trust their evaluation is a quality one. Prove it with game film, with live-fire film. You cannot do so. Hence the problem. No one, not us, not Bowles, not Macc, know what Hack would or could have done in a game that counted. We all think he would have sucked. I agree. But that's not proof he did suck. So white knight for Bowles all you like, but while doing so, explain why Hack couldn't have been played after Petty got hurt late in a long lost season? So all the coaches watch Hack in practice, every day and in the preseason, see that he sucks and is incapable of leading a team and your answer is you don't care, he needs to put him into a real game so that you'll know if all the coaches were right. LOL. And screw how players, on any team, would look at a staff that plays the shlttiest QB on the roster, it's just a Bowles-Jets era, whiney Jets issue? Is this a real post? Who writes this, believes this? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
afjetsfan Posted March 27, 2018 Share Posted March 27, 2018 2 hours ago, TeddEY said: Todd Bowles can be BOTH not a good head coach AND improperly blamed for the current situation of the team. 1. This is nonsense narrative that Jets fans love. Jets fans love to describe any losses as "coming out flat," an egocentric viewpoint wherein the Jets either win, or they were not prepared. What that means is that the Jets never actually get beaten. Teams aren't ever really better. There's just wins or poor prep. The truth is, the Jets lost a lot of football games this year because a lot of teams were far more talented than them. 2. This is a meaningful and realistic criticism. Some people think when the team is bad, you have to be more aggressive. Todd's approach seems to be that because the team is bad, lets try to keep it close and sneak it out. It's really not that crazy. 3. You really don't know this. Is Bill Belichick a "poor communicator?" Because his interviews are worse. And, before anyone says anything about Belichick's track record, we're purely talking about communication skills based on what we see in the media. 4. Agreed, but how many wins would you have projected the 2017 Jets for with Belichick as coach. Would we have won 10 games with the same roster? Again, none of these mean Bowles is a good coach, they just mean that the criticism of him is overblown. TeddEY, 1. I do think that there is truth to not being prepared. When you're entire team comes out flat and not sure what to do, that is coaching. Maybe it was poor positional coaching, but Todd has to know if his team is prepared during practice. 2. Ironically enough this is the one area fans can observe Todd and it is not pretty. 3. Belichick isn't a poor communicator, he's just a Dick. Todd is not a Dick 4. Look, the roster sucked, but how many wins can we contribute to anything Todd did? Todd has said that he needs to get a whole lot better. The fact that Todd knows this is the thing I do like about him. Now he just needs to, well, get better. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JohnnyLV Posted March 27, 2018 Share Posted March 27, 2018 Getting back to the original topic, does Bowles comments not scare the living crap out of anyone?. He meant what he said, which means that he is lobbying for 3 or 4 players OTHER than QB. If I had to guess Bowles personal board looks something like this: 1. Chubb 2. Ward 3. Edwards 4. Fitzpatrick 5. Barkley 6. Trade back I think we do pick Mayfield or Rosen, but only because I think the Johnsons want that. But I bet you almost anything Bowles is trying to convince people to take Chubb if he "falls" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Larz Posted March 27, 2018 Share Posted March 27, 2018 Observe the Jets fan in its native habitat, triggered and bitching Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Augustiniak Posted March 27, 2018 Share Posted March 27, 2018 5 minutes ago, Larz said: Observe the Jets fan in its native habitat, triggered and bitching And falling for everything published by every beat writer. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
afjetsfan Posted March 27, 2018 Share Posted March 27, 2018 8 minutes ago, Larz said: Observe the Jets fan in its native habitat, triggered and bitching Could you imagine if we actually became a good team or even a marque franchise like the Patriots? Holy sh*t, we'd have nothing to bitch about. Thank God we suck! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jetscrazey Posted March 28, 2018 Share Posted March 28, 2018 Jordan Leggett? Seriously Todd? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JoJoTownsell1 Posted March 28, 2018 Share Posted March 28, 2018 5 hours ago, johnnysd said: Getting back to the original topic, does Bowles comments not scare the living crap out of anyone?. He meant what he said, which means that he is lobbying for 3 or 4 players OTHER than QB. If I had to guess Bowles personal board looks something like this: 1. Chubb 2. Ward 3. Edwards 4. Fitzpatrick 5. Barkley 6. Trade back I think we do pick Mayfield or Rosen, but only because I think the Johnsons want that. But I bet you almost anything Bowles is trying to convince people to take Chubb if he "falls" LMAO at some of you SOJFs already at defcon 3 levels 30 days before the draft. There was nothing at all in what he said to indicate that Bowles is lobbying against a QB. In fact, he hinted that a rookie QB could start from day 1... if they are ready to do so. Not sure I buy that, but at least he said it. Have you ever paid attention to the pre-draft process before? Coaches/GMs/Owners all lie. Bowles said they traded up with 6-7 players in mind. You do realize that if they liked 6-7 players equally they would just sit tight at 6. They traded up for a QB. Plain and simple. Bowles is just thowing up smokescreens. The last thing he wants to do is give away that the Jets are all in on 2 or 3 players We just traded up and gave away a ton of draft picks. Even Bowles isn't dumb enough to think that was done to get the BPA on defense. It was done to get a QB. Stop being paranoid. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Untouchable Posted March 28, 2018 Share Posted March 28, 2018 19 minutes ago, JoJoTownsell1 said: LMAO at some of you SOJFs already at defcon 3 levels 30 days before the draft. There was nothing at all in what he said to indicate that Bowles is lobbying against a QB. In fact, he hinted that a rookie QB could start from day 1... if they are ready to do so. Not sure I buy that, but at least he said it. Have you ever paid attention to the pre-draft process before? Coaches/GMs/Owners all lie. Bowles said they traded up with 6-7 players in mind. You do realize that if they liked 6-7 players equally they would just sit tight at 6. They traded up for a QB. Plain and simple. Bowles is just thowing up smokescreens. The last thing he wants to do is give away that the Jets are all in on 2 or 3 players We just traded up and gave away a ton of draft picks. Even Bowles isn't dumb enough to think that was done to get the BPA on defense. It was done to get a QB. Stop being paranoid. This Hell, Chris f*cking Johnson himself has already stated that Plan A was Cousins and Plan B was to draft one of the top QB’s. Well, the Jets didn’t land Cousins, and then just 2-3 days after he officially signed in Minnesota they proceeded to trade 3 2nd round picks to move up to #3...doesn’t take a rocket scientist to figure out what they’re virtually guaranteed to do with the pick. They’re taking a QB, period. The only debate here is which one they end up with. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Untouchable Posted March 28, 2018 Share Posted March 28, 2018 “We’ve been talking about moving up in the draft since the end of the season. It was a discussion that went into high gear as it became apparent we were not going to go with plan A.” - Chris Johnson How do Jets fans get this directly from the acting owners mouth yet still entertain the thought for a single second that we’re going anywhere other than QB at #3? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JoJoTownsell1 Posted March 28, 2018 Share Posted March 28, 2018 6 minutes ago, Untouchable said: “We’ve been talking about moving up in the draft since the end of the season. It was a discussion that went into high gear as it became apparent we were not going to go with plan A.” - Chris Johnson How do Jets fans get this directly from the acting owners mouth yet still entertain the thought for a single second that we’re going anywhere other than QB at #3? It's mind-blowing that there are still jets fans that think bowles will somehow convince Mac to take a safety or dl at 3. The Jets have given away their hand by over paying to move up. You only do that for a QB. Now the only question is which QB. As for what bowles said, it was a lie. Just like when John Mara said today that Odell WAS NOT ON THE BLOCK and then later said they are listening to offers. Doesn't take a rocket scientist to figure out that the Giants want to trade Odell. Just like it doesn't take a rocket scientist to realize the Jets are drafting a QB. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Archived
This topic is now archived and is closed to further replies.