Are we done in FA??

[maury77]

3 minutes ago, Warfish said:

Agreed.

Apparently not, if this thread is any indication.

Cap Space unspent does not win football games.

And frankly, the "oh, just wait till 2016, 2017, 2018, 2019 and THEN we'll be great because :cap space: and :reasons: is getting tired at this stage.

I don't see a failure to act or succeed as a GM as something to applaud.  Staying the top-cap-available team two years in a row, not something to applaud.  This isn't a balance sheet competition, it's football.

JMO, clearly not one held by the majority right now.  We'll see how folks feel after the upcoming season I guess. If Teddy B. shocks the world, my criticism may be moot.  Who knows.

3

That's the point, they did spend cap space this year and preserved the future.  Not spending money at all is what Idzik did and it ultimately led to his demise. 

[Thai Jet]

2 hours ago, Philc1 said:

The problem with the Bridgewater signing is he literally is a waste of space.  He takes up a roster spot when we should be drafting two qbs

And if he is totally rehabbed and can function to the level he was prior to his injury is it a waste of space ? He's still only 25.

[maury77]

5 minutes ago, Thai Jet said:

And if he is totally rehabbed and can function to the level he was prior to his injury is it a waste of space ? He's still only 25.

Honestly? That is my dream scenario. If Teddy comes back to what he was, we tag him and get a first rounder in a trade. Then, heading into 2019, we have the most cap space, 2 first rounders and a young franchise QB. 

[BornJetsFan1983]

2 hours ago, Warfish said:

Agreed.

Apparently not, if this thread is any indication.

Cap Space unspent does not win football games.

And frankly, the "oh, just wait till 2016, 2017, 2018, 2019 and THEN we'll be great because :cap space: and :reasons: is getting tired at this stage.

I don't see a failure to act or succeed as a GM as something to applaud.  Staying the top-cap-available team two years in a row, not something to applaud.  This isn't a balance sheet competition, it's football.

JMO, clearly not one held by the majority right now.  We'll see how folks feel after the upcoming season I guess. If Teddy B. shocks the world, my criticism may be moot.  Who knows.

I kind of like that we getting younger. Seems like the positions are upgrades, not just CB.

[Long Island Leprechaun]

3 hours ago, Warfish said:

Doesn't matter who I might name, it'll just get the same exact response as any talk of our failure to land Cousins:  i.e. "oh, he didn't want to come here anyway, Macc had no chance, why are you complaining, you're so stupid! 

Apparently Macc did literally the perfect job so far.  He got every FA he "could", none he "couldn't", we got lots of "upgrades", despite all the evidence to the contrary, and any desire for more or better is just stupid SOJ'ism.

So yeah, great.  /shrug.

As I suspected, you have no alternate scenario to offer, but you hate the current one. Always easy to be the nay-sayer and gadfly. We have enough of those on this site already to require mosquito netting. Nowhere have I said, or most others, that we did great in FA. I'm frankly not sure that was possible this year. And yeah it's true that some of the top flight FA's had no interest in the Jets and were already slated for other teams. That's reality.

[Thai Jet]

1 hour ago, maury77 said:

Honestly? That is my dream scenario. If Teddy comes back to what he was, we tag him and get a first rounder in a trade. Then, heading into 2019, we have the most cap space, 2 first rounders and a young franchise QB. 

That WOULD be a sweet scenario.

[Warfish]

3 hours ago, Long Island Leprechaun said:

As I suspected, you have no alternate scenario to offer, but you hate the current one. Always easy to be the nay-sayer and gadfly. We have enough of those on this site already to require mosquito netting. Nowhere have I said, or most others, that we did great in FA. I'm frankly not sure that was possible this year. And yeah it's true that some of the top flight FA's had no interest in the Jets and were already slated for other teams. That's reality.

Like I said, damned if I do, damned if I don't on this.  I give you a name, you give me the usual bullsh*t excuses, a la "hge was never coming here!" already stated.

I don't, you claim (wrongly I'd add) that I have no "alternatives", a laughable proposition.  I choose not to get into the weeds here, now.  Doesn't mean I can't mate.  But you knew that, you're smart.  Well, till you say "it's not possible to do great in FA" this year, lol.....

It's ok, you're happy?  Be happy.

We'll talk again after the season is over. 

[Jetscreen]

I see nothing to indicate this team is any better than 5-11. Most all of the players Mac added are either very mild improvements or pushes. The RB group is no better than last season. The OL will still stink. They improved at Center, but that move alone does not equate into a much improved OL. It merely means they are still very suspect, just a little less than 2017. They improved in the secondary, but they got far worse on the DL and the linebacker corp is a push at best. Given how poor the coaching is, the defense will again rank somewhere in the 20's in total defense. The run defense has suffered severely.

Now granted this is before the draft, but as of right now, they are no better than 5-11.

[Long Island Leprechaun]

LOL. Mate, is it? Isn't that the same as FU in Australian? Looks like this went down the same rabbit hole as Kimmel and Hannity.

Catch you later, Bwana.

[Warfish]

7 minutes ago, Long Island Leprechaun said:

LOL. Mate, is it? Isn't that the same as FU in Australian?

Uh...no. 

It's like saying "Pal" or "Buddy" or "Friend" in proper British/Scottish informal parlance.

LIL, we go back a ways.  If I want to say FU, trust me, I'll just say FU.....mate.

Quote

Looks like this went down the same rabbit hole as Kimmel and Hannity.

Catch you later, Bwana.

I'm no boss.

[Jethead]

Eeyore!

[Warfish]

2 minutes ago, Jethead said:

Eeyore!

Nothing left to do but smile, smile, smile....

[Long Island Leprechaun]

1 hour ago, Warfish said:

Uh...no. 

It's like saying "Pal" or "Buddy" or "Friend" in proper British/Scottish informal parlance.

LIL, we go back a ways.  If I want to say FU, trust me, I'll just say FU.....mate.

I'm no boss.

It's all good. although I do remember somewhere on one of these boards someone calling someone else mate repeatedly and the other guy saying, if you call me "mate" one more time I'm gonna kill you." The good old days...

[Jetscreen]

10 hours ago, Warfish said:

Agreed.

Apparently not, if this thread is any indication.

Cap Space unspent does not win football games.

And frankly, the "oh, just wait till 2016, 2017, 2018, 2019 and THEN we'll be great because :cap space: and :reasons: is getting tired at this stage.

I don't see a failure to act or succeed as a GM as something to applaud.  Staying the top-cap-available team two years in a row, not something to applaud.  This isn't a balance sheet competition, it's football.

JMO, clearly not one held by the majority right now.  We'll see how folks feel after the upcoming season I guess. If Teddy B. shocks the world, my criticism may be moot.  Who knows.

This is good stuff Warfish. It's also very logical. Although, whether you agree with it or not, Woody pushed the reset button after the 2016 season. So THIS rebuild only started in January of last year. So the constant claims of we'll be really good in 2019, or 2020 you're just going to have to endure longer. And if ultimately Mac ends up being like every other GM this organization has ever had, you'll be dealing with ridiculous claims of future greatness for much longer.

With that said, I agree with you. How anyone can say the Jets did great in FA is beyond me? Besides corner, I think he maintained a 5-11 team. This is not something I will try to spin like so many on this site do.

[Jetster]

10 hours ago, Jetscreen said:

This is good stuff Warfish. It's also very logical. Although, whether you agree with it or not, Woody pushed the reset button after the 2016 season. So THIS rebuild only started in January of last year. So the constant claims of we'll be really good in 2019, or 2020 you're just going to have to endure longer. And if ultimately Mac ends up being like every other GM this organization has ever had, you'll be dealing with ridiculous claims of future greatness for much longer.

With that said, I agree with you. How anyone can say the Jets did great in FA is beyond me? Besides corner, I think he maintained a 5-11 team. This is not something I will try to spin like so many on this site do.

There isn't one fan in this thread that has stated the Jets did "great" in free agency. The funny thing about free agency is some Jet fans believe that just because they have the most money, every big name free agent will sign with us. I was all in on Cousins because we had the money, have been needing a franchise QB for years & having a capable QB makes it easier to recruit offensive free agents.

But, I also was all in on moving up in the draft if we missed out on him. I even mentioned that sometimes not getting what you want can be a brilliant stroke of luck. Until we find a QB the Jets will be spinning their wheels for years and we're not the only team in this Groundhog Day nightmare in our division. The Fins & Bills have been on this same treadmill. 

The only thing I'm praying for now is that the Giants don't trade back with the Bills. I'm liking the idea of having a choice between Rosen & Mayfield. I don't want Allen in Buffalo either as I feel that guy is going to be very good 2/3 years from now. If we make a mistake at QB, I don't want any of QBs we missed on playing for our division rivals and watching another 10-15 years of ineptitude. 

[nyjunc]

22 hours ago, Jetster said:

There isn't one fan in this thread that has stated the Jets did "great" in free agency. The funny thing about free agency is some Jet fans believe that just because they have the most money, every big name free agent will sign with us. I was all in on Cousins because we had the money, have been needing a franchise QB for years & having a capable QB makes it easier to recruit offensive free agents.

But, I also was all in on moving up in the draft if we missed out on him. I even mentioned that sometimes not getting what you want can be a brilliant stroke of luck. Until we find a QB the Jets will be spinning their wheels for years and we're not the only team in this Groundhog Day nightmare in our division. The Fins & Bills have been on this same treadmill. 

The only thing I'm praying for now is that the Giants don't trade back with the Bills. I'm liking the idea of having a choice between Rosen & Mayfield. I don't want Allen in Buffalo either as I feel that guy is going to be very good 2/3 years from now. If we make a mistake at QB, I don't want any of QBs we missed on playing for our division rivals and watching another 10-15 years of ineptitude. 

fans and the media judge FA by how much a team spends and how many big name players they acquire.  The Rams are being praised for doing such a great job and maybe it works out but based on history the chances are much greater they fail this year than take that next step and become a SB contender.  The Jets have had a very good offseason, it will be meaningless w/o a good draft and w/o a very good FA and draft next year but since the end of the 2016 season we have made mostly the right moves.  Remember the panic when we cut all those big names last year and basically none of them contributed to their new teams?  This draft is huge, if we come out w/our franchise QB it will be a success no matter what we do the rest of the draft. 

How Jet fans are still miserable w/ the moves being made just proves what a miserable fanbase we have.  This regime was given the keys to a team that had to spend year 1. they had unexpected success and tried to do again in 2016 but it didn't work and they started over w/ a total rebuild after 2016.  That total rebuild is going very well so far.  There is a ton of work left but we are on the right path to long term success.

[thebuzzardman]

Having cap space doesn't help a team win games, but not having it can really screw a team over and really hurt at that moment when the right player is available yet the team has no money because it decided to spend it all or give contracts that are too long for "ok" players. 

I'd say outside CB, the Jets got mostly "ok" players, but it's always a big plus not compromising the future. Maybe not THE big plus of an offseason, but I'd put it up there in the top 3.

[Warfish]

2 minutes ago, thebuzzardman said:

Having cap space doesn't help a team win games, but not having it can really screw a team over and really hurt at that moment when the right player is available yet the team has no money because it decided to spend it all or give contracts that are too long for "ok" players. 

I'd say outside CB, the Jets got mostly "ok" players, but it's always a big plus not compromising the future. Maybe not THE big plus of an offseason, but I'd put it up there in the top 3.

Honest question: when was the last time the NY Jets were one “right player” away, and weren’t able to get that player due specifically to the cap?

[thebuzzardman]

14 hours ago, Warfish said:

Honest question: when was the last time the NY Jets were one “right player” away, and weren’t able to get that player due specifically to the cap?

Forever? 

Anyway, it's not just one player. It's about maintaining flexibility in general. I think they could have spent a little bit more this year, but it's not like the team was going to be that good anyway. Hopefully a few of these signings pan out and then the fact they still have ample cap space is a good thing. Long story short, in leagues where the cap is a thing, it's good most of the time to continue to have it, especially when the team isn't a contender, and the Jets seem like they are at least another season away. Probably 2. 

[Warfish]

1 hour ago, thebuzzardman said:

I think they could have spent a little bit more this year, but it's not like the team was going to be that good anyway.

God, this is depressing.  What's worse is how many years someone here says exactly this.....

[thebuzzardman]

7 hours ago, Warfish said:

God, this is depressing.  What's worse is how many years someone here says exactly this.....

I never said it was great. You know what's worse? The sentence "The team is just a little bit better but has no or very little cap room next year too"

[Jetscreen]

7 hours ago, Warfish said:

God, this is depressing.  What's worse is how many years someone here says exactly this.....

Your attitude sucks Warfish. Stop being such a Debbie Downer.

[GreenFish]

How many teams in the past decade have gone from 5 or less wins to 10 wins buying lots of free agents without a franchise QB? 

I can only think of Jacksonville, Jets, Cardinals.

Jax did it last year so we will have to see how that goes in the next couple of years. But if the Jets and Cards are any indication, teams that win free agency even if they have success fall quickly if they don't have a franchise QB. 

We wont be a 10+ win team. Not sure anyone has those expectations. The goal should be to plug holes and stay flexable until we get our franchise QB. Hopefully we get that guy at 3. Then build around our franchise QB.

[Warfish]

2 hours ago, Jetscreen said:

Your attitude sucks Warfish. Stop being such a Debbie Downer.

If I ever made you believe I care what you or anyone else thinks about my "attitude", please, forgive me.  I don't. 

As I've said all along in this thread, if YOU are happy and "up" about the Jets FA 2018 decisions and players, why would the fact that I'm underwhelmed and a "downer" bother YOU?  Surely your :feels: doesn't depend on me, does it?

By all means, post positive thoughts and optimism to your hearts content, I'd be the last one to stop you (or try and tell you what you can and can't post.....)  

[Warfish]

2 hours ago, thebuzzardman said:

I never said it was great. You know what's worse? The sentence "The team is just a little bit better but has no or very little cap room next year too"

-We stood pat with only minor or immaterial "upgrades", but hey, look at all the money our Owner didn't have to spend!  Profit!

-We signed a bunch of guys, but now our GM will actually be held to account for those signings and be expected to you know, have a team that wins games.....

Decisions, decisions, lol.

If we're in a spot where we spend our massive cap space, and "only got a little bit better and have no cap room next year" well, I think we'd have a solid case for termination and replacement of the General Manager, wouldn't you?

In this thread I've heard literally every excuse for why our GM basically didn't improve the overall team talent via FA despite having the most cap space to spend.  I've heard everyone, just about, be pissed at ME for being a "downer" out one side of their collective mouths, while out the other being sure to tell us all they're "not saying FA was good/great, nope, no way....".

So far, with FA's core early period basically over now, we've made one meaningful improvement, at CB.  Every other move is either  a side-grade or at the most optimistic a minor non-material upgrade of production/talent.  I'm sorry (I'm not really), but I expected and (as a fan) demand better than that when we're sitting in the catbird seat with most cap space available.  Not crazy signings, best BAP FA signings at positions of need.  Like getting the BAP FA Linemen to protect our future young QB, for example, not placeholder JAG's.

And I don't think signings where the most "positive" comment is "thank god, what a great contract, we can get out of it after the first season!" is a sign of positivity or confidence in these signings.

We were last year one of the least talented teams in the NFL.  That should have changed, and it frankly hasn't.  For that, I am disappointed.  I am amazed I'm on something of an island in this view frankly.

[UnitedWhofans]

1 hour ago, Warfish said:

If I ever made you believe I care what you or anyone else thinks about my "attitude", please, forgive me.  I don't. 

As I've said all along in this thread, if YOU are happy and "up" about the Jets FA 2018 decisions and players, why would the fact that I'm underwhelmed and a "downer" bother YOU?  Surely your :feels: doesn't depend on me, does it?

By all means, post positive thoughts and optimism to your hearts content, I'd be the last one to stop you (or try and tell you what you can and can't post.....)  

The problem I have is that most people's pessimism to this offseason is not based in this offseason. It's based in the past.